Lawn Tractor - Battery Powered

[FMC1959]

Greenworks especially, they have a commercial line where models start around $12,000 USD and go up to $23,000 USD. They show 9 different models, even if they are based on 2-3 base models, still quite a selection. Up to 24KW. This is serious stuff, not just a one off experiment model (let's see if it sells); from what I know they have had these models for a few years...someone is buying them.

Commercial Zero Turn Mowers | Greenworks Commercial

Our zero turn stand on and ride-on mowers were designed for landscaping professionals. Explore our collection and find the right solution for your next job!

commercial.greenworkstools.com

The consumer models are less expensive but at least you know they have some good experience and R&D to have this extensive of a lineup. Who know, they may already have a moderately decent parts department. I don't see them dropping everything in a year or 2 and come out with totally different stuff. If they service the commercial industry, I am guessing they are in it for the long haul.

 

[FMC1959]

I understand experience with Ryobi battery tools doesn't translate directly to a riding mower, but I'll never ever buy anything with the Ryobi name on it again.

jack vines

To me, at the moment, Ryobi seems like the most new or entry level of the "Big 3". They only came out with their 40v line in the last few years, probably in an attempt to catch up to Ego, which was having great success with their OPE. With what Ryobi was able to do with their 40v line, I am quite sure this had in part, a bit of the decision for HD to drop (or whatever happened) Ego. With HD's backing, who knows, in 5 years Ryobi could be a really big fish.

 

[FMC1959]

Last spring I ran into a guy who had purchased a battery powered push mower. He lived over an hour away from the store where I met him. He was there to purchase a gas powered unit as his battery powered one would no longer mow his yard without stopping to charge the battery. He lives in the city he claimed and didn't have a big yard. He said for the first year the mower was great and had just enough battery capacity to finish his whole yard. He also stated that he could buy a gas powered mower where we were at for less than a new battery for his one year old mower. Not sure what brand, but that seems sad to me. He seemed like he was relatively knowledgeable and had done his research on what he wanted. He even bought extra blades, air filters, spark plugs while he was there so he wouldn't have to travel back to get them if he ever needed them. Personally, I'm just not sold on battery powered mowers yet. Chainsaws, weed eaters, blowers, ok maybe. But not a mower. For the cost of some of the batteries, which may last up to 5 years I just don't see it. By the time you need the batteries, they'll change them and yours will be obsolete and cost even more if you can find them.
Joel

This happens. I don't care if it is JD, Apple of the most reliable company in the world, there are always going to be these kind of stories.

 

[FMC1959]

I have seen over the last 50 years multiple various level of autonomous and alternatively powered tractors. The Deere shown above is just the latest in a string as an experiment. I was interesting to see it shown at CES vs the routine ag outlets. When they have one that will be the talk of Big Iron or the Louisville Farm show it will be a serious product. If you look at my icon that is one of our littler tractors at the current time. The measured pull at the drawbar is multiple hundreds of hp running 12 hour or more days. We check to see how much more HP we generate after our modifications to them.

Now as for lawns the GE rider worked in the 70s since it used very common batteries that were easily and cheaply replaceable and was not a bad idea for the time. The GE did not seem to have the it would mow a lawn and next year a half of a lawn issue. We did go to an electric push mower for the youngest daughter and her husband. Their yard is two postage stamps in the front and about the size of 20 in the back yard. They got a set up that could mow the yard 5 times before the battery would not do it. This was based on advice of others who had gone electric, allow plenty of reserve time. They budgeted a 5 year life span for it. So how it will work is based on your lawn size. We have very little electric in the way of electric vehicles in my area. We do not have turn off your AC, car chargers, grain dryers, or irrigators to save power issues yet.

GE dropped the product due to sales volume. I also have spent over 50 years standing at the Deere parts counter and hearing for many low volume products that part is no longer available. It is worse for the consumer lines than the ag lines. It happens more times for ag products with Deere now vs other lines.

This kind of thinking, at least PARTIALLY, is believing that things can't change. If you remember Motorola flip phone. When digital phones were starting, with the tinny, echoing sound, Motorola flip phones had something like 80% of the market. Their CEO stated that "this digital" stuff won't make it. Sony, Nokia, and less well known (at the time) MFR's pushed on and digital took over, analog basically died and the CEO of Motorola was canned. Motorola is just barely getting back small pieces of the market...wayyyy behind Samsung, LG, Apple and all the other players.

 

[zendriver]

Right now, I would say the guys that specialize in this are Ego, Ryobi and Greenworks; JD, not sure they have a lot of experience like the others

they already have a line of rock solid ZTR mowers, so Redesigning them with batteries and electric motors, should not really be a huge deal.

They're developing batteries, fuel cells etc. for their larger equipment, as well, so it does not seem hard to believe they will jump ahead in technology quickly.

 

[FMC1959]

i could buy a new engine for my craftsman LT1000 for less than the price of batteries for some elec mowers.
Let that sink in.

I could buy a king size Snap On roller box, or buy a whole garage full of equipment for the same price.

 

[FMC1959]

they already have a line of rock solid ZTR mowers, so Redesigning them with batteries and electric motors, should not really be a huge deal.

They're developing batteries, fuel cells etc. for their larger equipment, as well, so it does not seem hard to believe they will jump ahead in technology quickly.

This is will depend a lot on the brain trust that steers the ship.

You can draw analogies with the carmakers. Some have gone deep and quickly into EV's, others are taking it a bit easy. The Motor week show I saw recently had the Nissan Ariya. They stated that Nissan was one of the pioneers with the Leaf, but till now, haven't done much, only recently releasing the Ariya.

So, we'll have to see if the decision makers decide at JD. Battery will never take off as it has in the auto market, or do they believe it is the not so distant future and invest major R&D to make sure they are always ready to release as many battery models as the market is asking for. And any big company can make a lot of anything (even garbage), what I mean is a lot of models that have latest technology and people will look at them as leaders in the industry...not "JD was great with their gas and diesel equipment, but run the other way when it comes to electric"

 

[FMC1959]

Where I live now, suburbs of TN, my subdivision has relatively large lots: 0.4-0.6 acres. But all of the new subdivisions built in the last 20 years near me are ~0.3 acre lots with a huge vinyl coated box house on them. They can mow their lawn with an electric mower in 15 minutes, max. So the vast majority of new mower sales will be battery powered very soon. They will, just based on lawn size. And even if the batteries only last 5 years, and it averages out at $2 per mow, whatever, vs 30 cents for gasoline, that's a fair swap considering that your trimmer, mower, blower will run after the winter.

My ex-GFs parents have a ~0.4 acre lot. They've had a Kobalt battery push mower for ~4 years and love it. They can't mow their entire lawn with it on one battery because they only have one battery, and they're ~73 years old. They can't even use the slowest speed on the self-propelled because they can't keep up with it LOL. So they mow in two days, which is plenty in the heat here.

Again, their will always be the bad, along with the good. Of course the last part about Kobalt, some would say it's Lowes...nuff said. I knwo their are many stories of problems starting with year 2 and on. But although I do not know many, they 5-6 people I know with the OPE from Ego, they love it and batteries last 7-10 years.

I am trying to see what the big picture is...more good, or more bad.

 

[FMC1959]

We're right in the initial cycle of battery powered tractors and I'm not convinced it's time to jump in yet. The power train engineering is pretty impressive; big dc motors being controlled with a high level of refinement. Ryobi, ego, etc. obviously did their homework with the system design and they work well. But since the components and especially the batteries are expensive everything else is built as cheaply as possible. I don't trust them to hold up in an abusive environment like lawn mowing with the heat and vibration and jostling. It's going to take years of refinement before those systems are reliable in the long term. And when motor windings start breaking down or controllers short out it's going to be expensive to replace, assuming they're even available. Electric is definitely the way of the future, especially when the next generation of battery tech proliferates, but I'm not buying in yet.

You could be right. My guess is the auto industry has already invested a lot of time and money into it. Perhaps, the tractor companies can borrow from what the cars guys learned and not take years of research. Or maybe not?

That is what I would like to determine.

 

[FMC1959]

Wow, there's a lot of FUD flying around in here.

Electric mowers are simpler than gas mowers.

Anyone claiming manufacturers took the time to design and build a shittier chassis rather than just using the one they already had are deluding themselves.

The biggest thing to worry about is if there's any kind of DRM built into the electronics. If there isn't anything keeping you from using off the shelf parts, you'll be fine.

Excuse my ignorance, but what is FUD (sounds like you mean BS?). And what is DRM, not sure at all what you mean by this

 

[FMC1959]

Battery powered riding mowers are all pretty much in their infancy right now. Many will fail to sell so be discontinued making replacement parts difficult to source in the future. I'd not count on being able to keep one of today's running for twenty years.
Bespoke battery costs are high but the aftermarket has addressed rebuilding the OE packs.
Me? Gas mowers are noisy, dirty and require some maintenance (which a trained monkey can do) but are proven technology with a vast supply of inexpensive spare parts.

Every battery platform is using proprietary battery management and charging circuitry. And building Lithium ion battery packs is not a common DIY endeavor.

I think many forget or fail to realize that a major part of Europe and Japan have been tackling this for years, much more than we do in NA. How far ahead are they and how much have they accomplished, would be more a guess on my part, but believe they have made major strides versus what we see.

Rebuilding Lithium packs is not something I have done, and also heard can be complex because they can explode quite easily if you do not know what you are doing. By the same token, I know a few guys that DO rebuild alls kinds of Lithium packs...not in the business of doing so, but as tinkerers or DIYers.

 

[zendriver]

This is will depend a lot on the brain trust that steers the ship.

You can draw analogies with the carmakers. Some have gone deep and quickly into EV's, others are taking it a bit easy. The Motor week show I saw recently had the Nissan Ariya. They stated that Nissan was one of the pioneers with the Leaf, but till now, haven't done much, only recently releasing the Ariya.

So, we'll have to see if the decision makers decide at JD. Battery will never take off as it has in the auto market, or do they believe it is the not so distant future and invest major R&D to make sure they are always ready to release as many battery models as the market is asking for. And any big company can make a lot of anything (even garbage), what I mean is a lot of models that have latest technology and people will look at them as leaders in the industry...not "JD was great with their gas and diesel equipment, but run the other way when it comes to electric"

Guess my point was EGO, Ryobi etc. are developing mowers( mechanically and electrically) from the ground up, literally in the last few years.

JD has been making mowers for a very long time, so the battery powerplant their biggest hurdle. That power plant will likely be scalable among similar sized products.

Automakers are the prefect example. They already have the cars and trucks, just need whatever modifications to accommodate batteries and electric motors. As successful as the Lightening was, Ford now has the EV powerplant design to adaptable to other models.

As far a dragging their heels, they have all been waiting to see how the Tesla and the concept of EVs in general worked out, which it pretty much solidified actually owning and driving EVs.

Carbon Neutral Agriculture is not just fad JD will respond accordingly IMO.

 

[Steve_P]

"One of my neighbors has had his lawn mowed a few times recently by a guy...", by a guy, you mean a contractor?

If so, I have heard a couple of comments of contractors adopting electric, even mowers. Even if only a few, a contractors, feedback would be great. I do not know how long either a gasoline riding mower or ZT lasts for them, even line trimmers and blowers. I would be curious to see a cost comparison or just simple opinion on how how they battery stuff compared to gas, and last for them. Is the initial cost more but make it up over savings on gas, time & money on tune-ups, cost of replacing batteries; basically over a 3-5 year period, overall how do they compare.

Lastly, these battery products, they do not necessarily have to out power or be the same as gas, but at the end of the day, can they do the job or fall short.

From what I understand, just from what I saw:
The neighbor has a ZTR JD mower. It wouldn't start for whatever reason for the first mow of the season (grass was high for weeks). Ryobi guy mowed twice, or more. Ryobi guy delivered his running JD ZTR mower. So apparently the shop fixing the mower also will mow your lawn if they're waiting on parts, etc. Obviously for a cost. And this is what a lot of people miss with the "I can buy a gas engine...." argument. Yes, you can, but that's not the point. Probably 99% of Americans can't repair OPE, especially successfully rebuild a carburetor on a trimmer or blower. Yes, battery powered will cost more per mow than gasoline for an IC engine; no one will argue that. But you also don't have to go get gas for your OPE and transport it in your car, store it in your garage, worry about the chainsaw starting after not using it for even a year, etc. This has a huge value to the vast majority of homeowners with small lots.

If you look at what it cost my neighbor because of his JD issue, it was for sure over $400 including two mows at $50+ each; pick up and delivery of the mower- again, I'm sure $50+ each; and fixing the mower. That's at least two batteries.

I've been pushing the same Lawn Boy mower since 1980, so I don't have a battery mower. But in a few years it will be the norm for people that live in a subdivision, because lots are shrinking. What new homeowner is going to buy gasoline OPE for a .3 acre lot? Considering they don't even change the oil in their car by themselves.

And as I said, even if you have to buy a new $200 battery every 5-8 years, this is worth it for 99.9...% of people because they spend more on coffee in 3 months, or eating out in a month, than a battery costs. And they don't have to worry about any of the other issues.

As far as John Deere, my buddy has a "real" JD riding mower that he bought from a dealer. He paid something crazy like $6k+ for it 10+ years ago. It has less than 100 hours on it as he only uses it for the rear portion of his tiny lot. In that time he's replaced two of the three mower blade spindle assemblies himself, and then just recently had a local shop replace the electric clutch, at a cost of $600+ for the clutch, pick up, and delivery. It's a true lemon. He's trying to sell it, but no one wants to buy it because they can get financing on something new vs pay even $3500 cash for his.

 

[Firebrick43]

From what I understand, just from what I saw:
The neighbor has a ZTR JD mower. It wouldn't start for whatever reason for the first mow of the season (grass was high for weeks). Ryobi guy mowed twice, or more. Ryobi guy delivered his running JD ZTR mower. So apparently the shop fixing the mower also will mow your lawn if they're waiting on parts, etc. Obviously for a cost. And this is what a lot of people miss with the "I can buy a gas engine...." argument. Yes, you can, but that's not the point. Probably 99% of Americans can't repair OPE, especially successfully rebuild a carburetor on a trimmer or blower. Yes, battery powered will cost more per mow than gasoline for an IC engine; no one will argue that. But you also don't have to go get gas for your OPE and transport it in your car, store it in your garage, worry about the chainsaw starting after not using it for even a year, etc. This has a huge value to the vast majority of homeowners with small lots.

If you look at what it cost my neighbor because of his JD issue, it was for sure over $400 including two mows at $50+ each; pick up and delivery of the mower- again, I'm sure $50+ each; and fixing the mower. That's at least two batteries.

I've been pushing the same Lawn Boy mower since 1980, so I don't have a battery mower. But in a few years it will be the norm for people that live in a subdivision, because lots are shrinking. What new homeowner is going to buy gasoline OPE for a .3 acre lot? Considering they don't even change the oil in their car by themselves.

And as I said, even if you have to buy a new $200 battery every 5-8 years, this is worth it for 99.9...% of people because they spend more on coffee in 3 months, or eating out in a month, than a battery costs. And they don't have to worry about any of the other issues.

As far as John Deere, my buddy has a "real" JD riding mower that he bought from a dealer. He paid something crazy like $6k+ for it 10+ years ago. It has less than 100 hours on it as he only uses it for the rear portion of his tiny lot. In that time he's replaced two of the three mower blade spindle assemblies himself, and then just recently had a local shop replace the electric clutch, at a cost of $600+ for the clutch, pick up, and delivery. It's a true lemon. He's trying to sell it, but no one wants to buy it because they can get financing on something new vs pay even $3500 cash for his.

a few blade spindle and an electric clutch makes it a lemon after 10 years?

Do you think that battery powered mowers will only have issues with batteries?

Most of the time the blade spindle on an electric mower is the electric motor itself. Hit a rock and bend the spindle(motor shaft) now your out a 300 dollar plus motor instead of just a deck spindle. Even if you don't bend the shaft there is no mower that I know of that over time doesn't need bearings in the deck spindles. Ryobi does offer spindle bearings, no idea if its possible, but from a ryobi dealer your going to replace both motors for 600 dollars in parts plus pick up and delivery.

Batteries on a ryobi rider are 200 a piece aftermarket and needs 4 of them for 800 dollars. You cant just change one of them. At least they are an AGM lead acid instead of lithium. 5-8 years is probably a reasonable lifespan.

Why did his electric clutch go out? Mice chew the wiring? 600 dollars in parts for the ryobi for harnesses.

Will the 1400 dollars in motor controllers hold up over time? I have had them go out on golf carts and they are really time tested.

Electric doesn't mean maintenance free.

 

[Rabid Badger]

Excuse my ignorance, but what is FUD (sounds like you mean BS?). And what is DRM, not sure at all what you mean by this

FUD is shorthand for fear, uncertainty, doubt.

DRM means digital rights management, but it has become shorthand for anything that limits your ability to use anything but parts from the original manufacturer. Unfortunately, most of the big name mower companies have jumped on the DRM bandwagon right away.

However, there are a couple mowers (that I know of) that are easy to work on and will let you use off the shelf batteries:

RYOBI 48-Volt Brushless 42 in. 100 Ah Battery Electric Riding Zero Turn Mower and Bagging Kit RY48ZTR100-1A - The Home Depot

Easily cut up to 3 acres on a single charge, this RYOBI 48-Volt Zero Turn Electric Riding Mower is the perfect green addition to your yard-work toolkit. Each mower features a durable 42 in. steel deck

www.homedepot.com

RYOBI 48V Brushless 54 in. 115 Ah Battery Electric Riding Zero Turn Mower with Mulch Kit RY48140-MK - The Home Depot

Make lawn work easier with this RYOBI 48V zero turn riding lawn mower. This low-maintenance machine works with 5 powerful brushless motors, and 115 Ah lead acid batteries provide 2 and half hours of run

www.homedepot.com

The downside with these is they come with lead-acid batteries that become useless after a season or two.

The upside to that downside is you can replace the lead acid batteries with off-the-shelf lithium iron phosphate modules that are designed to emulate the lead acid batteries exactly, with the notable exception that they will last for thousands of charge cycles.

 

[Rabid Badger]

Most of the time the blade spindle on an electric mower is the electric motor itself. Hit a rock and bend the spindle(motor shaft) now your out a 300 dollar plus motor instead of just a deck spindle. Even if you don't bend the shaft there is no mower that I know of that over time doesn't need bearings in the deck spindles. Ryobi does offer spindle bearings, no idea if its possible, but from a ryobi dealer your going to replace both motors for 600 dollars in parts plus pick up and delivery.

Pulling a lot of numbers out of thin air, aren't we?

Batteries on a ryobi rider are 200 a piece aftermarket and needs 4 of them for 800 dollars. You cant just change one of them. At least they are an AGM lead acid instead of lithium. 5-8 years is probably a reasonable lifespan.

Actually, it's about two years. But you can replace them with off-the-shelf lifepo4 replacements that will last for thousands of charge cycles.

Why did his electric clutch go out? Mice chew the wiring? 600 dollars in parts for the ryobi for harnesses.

Gas mowers don't have wires? Wires can't be repaired? Where'd you get that $600 number from?

Will the 1400 dollars in motor controllers hold up over time? I have had them go out on golf carts and they are really time tested.

If the entire motor controller gets fried and is beyond component repair I'd bet money you could find a 3rd party replacement for a fraction of the price.

Electric doesn't mean maintenance free.

Nobody said it did, but it's a HELL of a lot lower maintenance than gas.

 

[FMC1959]

Guess my point was EGO, Ryobi etc. are developing mowers( mechanically and electrically) from the ground up, literally in the last few years.

JD has been making mowers for a very long time, so the battery powerplant their biggest hurdle. That power plant will likely be scalable among similar sized products.

Automakers are the prefect example. They already have the cars and trucks, just need whatever modifications to accommodate batteries and electric motors. As successful as the Lightening was, Ford now has the EV powerplant design to adaptable to other models.

As far a dragging their heels, they have all been waiting to see how the Tesla and the concept of EVs in general worked out, which it pretty much solidified actually owning and driving EVs.

Carbon Neutral Agriculture is not just fad JD will respond accordingly IMO.

I hope they do react accordingly.

Making from the ground up in my mind can have a couple of disadvantages, but many more advantages. Taking what you have, and throwing an electric motor and batteries into it is a quick solution, but not a good one...more lazy than proper. From the ground up you take into account probably rule # 1 with battery/electric...weight and least amount of resistance. Then designing from the ground up you can properly find the most logical and effective way to situate the batteries and motors, versus shoe horning things into an established chassis.

Anyway, I know I am repeating my self, I am playing more devil's advocate than choosing a side and rooting for them. I as much as the next guy would like more info and clarity, then decide which way I will go.

 

[Firebrick43]

Pulling a lot of numbers out of thin air, aren't we?

No, all from ryobi parts, Do i need to put in part numbers for you?

Actually, it's about two years. But you can replace them with off-the-shelf lifepo4 replacements that will last for thousands of charge cycles.

My uncles neighbor has a Ryobi rider, little snapper style, its been 4 years now? Its a 1.5 acre lawn. I would depend on type of grass, frequency of cut, fertilizer added, ect. Sorry for giving the benifit to the electric mower. I would be happy to include those LIFEPO4 batteries however, it will skew it even more.

Gas mowers don't have wires? Wires can't be repaired? Where'd you get that $600 number from?

Again ryobi parts. Absolutely gas mowers have wires, that was the whole point and more than likely the cause of low hour failure (100) hour of the JD electric clutch that we were talking about, maybe read what I was replying to? But your electric mower is going to have a LOT more wires than a gas tractor.

If the entire motor controller gets fried and is beyond component repair I'd bet money you could find a 3rd party replacement for a fraction of the price.

Maybe somewhat cheaper, but decent controllers for golf cart motors are 500 dollars ish after market, dont see it being to far off. The little snapper type ryobi has three motor controllers, hence 1400$. The zero turns with three blades and two traction motors would have 5 controllers. Who I was talking to was hung up on OEM service of his neighbors john deere and the cost to/from the dealer. I was just quoting part prices and not labor. All of these things are not going to happen, just as an electric clutch going out in 100 hours is going to happen typically on a gas mower. But they can and do happen.

Nobody said it did, but it's a HELL of a lot lower maintenance than gas.

Maybe PM maintenance, but I don’t believe that for a minute that EV vehicles have a lower life cycle cost. I don t mind electric mowers, I recommend them to friends family when the situation warrants it. My BIL has no business with a gasoline engine, he really shouldn’t even mow his lawn but get along fine with his electric mower.

It just gets my goat when people say EV is no maintenance because in cars, golf carts, and electric mowers my observation they end up requiring as much or more in the end, it’s just delayed and expensive when it comes. Buy an EV based on its true advantages such as not handling fuel, fuel going bad over winter, or noise.

Just from deck bearings(which is going to be motor replacement on the electric mower) and batteries alone cost (by your admission) is going to cost more than I have spent on maintenance of my exmark mower over 15 years or Ferris mower over 10 years. A set of spindle bearings (150 dollars) a deck belt (45 dollars) and 15 oil changes, (225 dollars). 2 or 3 air filters (45 dollars) Blades would be comparable to either as would tires.

 

[Rabid Badger]

blah, blah, $300 motor, blah

$28

Pardon Our Interruption...

 

[Firebrick43]

$28

Pardon Our Interruption...

What are you trying to prove? We are talking about riding mowers, and you show a push mower motor? Did you even look at the pictures?

Do you think a servicing dealer, one that has pick up and delivery service as we were talking about is going to jerry rig a push mower motor onto riding mower, let alone a used one?

Would you buy used spindle bearings to put in a gas powered riding mower? How do you know the bearings are good?

48v ryobi riding mower deck motor ebay

Ryobi 48V 38" riding mower P/N 996260001 - DECK MOTOR | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Ryobi 48V 38" riding mower P/N 996260001 - DECK MOTOR at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

Guess what, even if you get the right one above, a dealer isn't going to install your used parts and then give you any guarantee on their work.

 

[Rabid Badger]

What are you trying to prove? We are talking about riding mowers, and you show a push mower motor? Did you even look at the pictures?

Do you think a servicing dealer, one that has pick up and delivery service as we were talking about is going to jerry rig a push mower motor onto riding mower, let alone a used one?

Would you buy used spindle bearings to put in a gas powered riding mower? How do you know the bearings are good?

48v ryobi riding mower deck motor ebay

Ryobi 48V 38" riding mower P/N 996260001 - DECK MOTOR | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Ryobi 48V 38" riding mower P/N 996260001 - DECK MOTOR at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

Guess what, even if you get the right one above, a dealer isn't going to install your used parts and then give you any guarantee on their work.

1) The riding mowers use the same blade motor.

2) Why would I pay someone else to turn a few bolts?

3) It's a bog-standard BLDC motor. There's no reason to pay $300 for one.

 

[Firebrick43]

1) The riding mowers use the same blade motor.

NO they don't, I even linked the correct one, they are not the same. THe riders are longer in the case

2) Why would I pay someone else to turn a few bolts?

Context, read the post I was responding to, I wouldn't pay anyone to work on my equipment but the post I was responding to(post 53) was using dealer pickup/delivery service. Its disingenuous to have a conversation and switch the context but you sure are trying.

3) It's a bog-standard BLDC motor. There's no reason to pay $300 for one.

Again context. Dealers are not going to order and install anything other than factory parts.

and what ever "bog standard" is well Its not. If I type 48v BLDC motor in there are none that come up with the same mounting scheme in pages with of google or duckduckgo except for alibaba and buy wholesale china that the minimum buy is 50 pieces nor in ebay. People generally are NOT going to make adapters and spacers to put new motors on when needed, they are going to go buy factory parts.

 

[jonesg]

Pulling a lot of numbers out of thin air, aren't we?



Actually, it's about two years. But you can replace them with off-the-shelf lifepo4 replacements that will last for thousands of charge cycles.



Gas mowers don't have wires? Wires can't be repaired? Where'd you get that $600 number from?



If the entire motor controller gets fried and is beyond component repair I'd bet money you could find a 3rd party replacement for a fraction of the price.



Nobody said it did, but it's a HELL of a lot lower maintenance than gas.

all I do is put gas in my tractor mower and beat the **** out of it.
I just broke the 95 inch drive belt again after hitting tree roots, $16 amazon.

This isn't the best place to try to make a case for elec power beating IC powered tractors.
It will be one day but that day has not arrived yet and the bleeding edge of technology can be expensive.

 

[zendriver]

I hope they do react accordingly.

Making from the ground up in my mind can have a couple of disadvantages, but many more advantages. Taking what you have, and throwing an electric motor and batteries into it is a quick solution, but not a good one...more lazy than proper. From the ground up you take into account probably rule # 1 with battery/electric...weight and least amount of resistance. Then designing from the ground up you can properly find the most logical and effective way to situate the batteries and motors, versus shoe horning things into an established chassis.

Anyway, I know I am repeating my self, I am playing more devil's advocate than choosing a side and rooting for them. I as much as the next guy would like more info and clarity, then decide which way I will go.

Good point.

Bobcat has developed an electric skid loader that has no hydraulics, therefore, it no related maintenance costs with that at all.

 

[danski0224]

My 22 year old Craftsman has done fine by me but the last 6-7 years, a lot of fixing, tuning and spending time and money on it.

That is probably near the expected lifespan of it.

If the chassis/driveline is good, I'd put a new engine in it.

Ouside of tiny city/suburban yards, I do not understand the appeal of battery powered lawn mowers, much less a riding lawn mower. I would bet that within a few years after spending big bucks on a battery riding mower, it will **** the bed and need major repairs or new batteries. Unless you want to be a beta tester.

 

[bwringer]

However, there are a couple mowers (that I know of) that are easy to work on and will let you use off the shelf batteries:

RYOBI 48-Volt Brushless 42 in. 100 Ah Battery Electric Riding Zero Turn Mower and Bagging Kit RY48ZTR100-1A - The Home Depot

Easily cut up to 3 acres on a single charge, this RYOBI 48-Volt Zero Turn Electric Riding Mower is the perfect green addition to your yard-work toolkit. Each mower features a durable 42 in. steel deck

www.homedepot.com

RYOBI 48V Brushless 54 in. 115 Ah Battery Electric Riding Zero Turn Mower with Mulch Kit RY48140-MK - The Home Depot

Make lawn work easier with this RYOBI 48V zero turn riding lawn mower. This low-maintenance machine works with 5 powerful brushless motors, and 115 Ah lead acid batteries provide 2 and half hours of run

www.homedepot.com

The downside with these is they come with lead-acid batteries that become useless after a season or two.

The upside to that downside is you can replace the lead acid batteries with off-the-shelf lithium iron phosphate modules that are designed to emulate the lead acid batteries exactly, with the notable exception that they will last for thousands of charge cycles.

The Ryobis with the lead-acid batteries are an unusual approach on Ryobi's part; the machines work great by all accounts, but more than one owner has not paid careful attention to the battery tech being used and been shocked by quickly the battery capacity falls off with charge cycles. It's a way to get a machine on the market quickly and at lower cost, with a clear upgrade path.

If I HAD to buy a new push mower right now (fixable gas mowers seem to keep popping up for free... I haven't paid for a mower in many years), I'd most likely go electric. But for a larger-capacity machine like this... maybe not yet, at least until the battery price/capacity ratio improves.

 

[Steve_P]

a few blade spindle and an electric clutch makes it a lemon after 10 years?

Do you think that battery powered mowers will only have issues with batteries?

Most of the time the blade spindle on an electric mower is the electric motor itself. Hit a rock and bend the spindle(motor shaft) now your out a 300 dollar plus motor instead of just a deck spindle. Even if you don't bend the shaft there is no mower that I know of that over time doesn't need bearings in the deck spindles. Ryobi does offer spindle bearings, no idea if its possible, but from a ryobi dealer your going to replace both motors for 600 dollars in parts plus pick up and delivery.

Batteries on a ryobi rider are 200 a piece aftermarket and needs 4 of them for 800 dollars. You cant just change one of them. At least they are an AGM lead acid instead of lithium. 5-8 years is probably a reasonable lifespan.

Why did his electric clutch go out? Mice chew the wiring? 600 dollars in parts for the ryobi for harnesses.

Will the 1400 dollars in motor controllers hold up over time? I have had them go out on golf carts and they are really time tested.

Electric doesn't mean maintenance free.

It has LESS THAN 100 hours on it. If you think that's acceptable, then ok. But IMO, and his, yes, it's a lemon. He spent over $6k on it.

No mice eating wiring, the clutch died. He stores it in his basement garage. The clutch itself died. Not the wiring. He looked at it prior to having it fixed.

If you don't like batteries, throw out your battery drills, etc. Oh, you won't do that, but somehow OPE is different. Yeah, it's not. But to you it is. And that is fine.

 

[Steve_P]

all I do is put gas in my tractor mower and beat the **** out of it.
I just broke the 95 inch drive belt again after hitting tree roots, $16 amazon.

This isn't the best place to try to make a case for elec power beating IC powered tractors.
It will be one day but that day has not arrived yet and the bleeding edge of technology can be expensive.

I don't think anyone here is claiming that a battery power riding mower is better than IC. It's definitely hard to justify battery at that size. For a small lot and a push mower, yes, it's not hard to justify battery at all. But for a rider, you can't really justify it other than look at the convenience and factor that in over lifespan.

What people here don't want to recognize is that 80% of homeowners don't even change their own oil in their car; and because of that they cannot fix even the most minor issue in a small engine. This has value and can help justify battery power.

I am not going to argue any further, the market will decide. And it is. Honda has already announced about a year ago it will stop making gas mowers this year. Why? Because it's a dying market.

 

[Firebrick43]

It has LESS THAN 100 hours on it. If you think that's acceptable, then ok. But IMO, and his, yes, it's a lemon. He spent over $6k on it.

No mice eating wiring, the clutch died. He stores it in his basement garage. The clutch itself died. Not the wiring. He looked at it prior to having it fixed.

If you don't like batteries, throw out your battery drills, etc. Oh, you won't do that, but somehow OPE is different. Yeah, it's not. But to you it is. And that is fine.

after 10 years? Time and setting can be just as hard as lots of hours.

And if it wasn't mice, is the irony that one of the few necessary electric components on a gas mower is the major one to fail, but some how an EV mower is going to fair better?

 

[Packard V8]

I am not going to argue any further, the market will decide. And it is. Honda has already announced about a year ago it will stop making gas mowers this year. Why? Because it's a dying market.

Honda's very well respected tractor line ranged from riding lawn mowers to four-wheel drive utility tractors.from the early 1980s until about 2000. Just has taken them another twenty years to get out of the push mower business.

Question - Would you say more people today or fewer people today do their own yard work?

jack vines

 

[jonesg]

honda is getting out of what they couldn't sell, so thats not a bad idea, they over engineer everything.

 

[FMC1959]

honda is getting out of what they couldn't sell, so thats not a bad idea, they over engineer everything.

In the small engine space, they have what is considered to be one of the best engines; able to work hard, for long periods and reliable, where lesser engines fail. I would not say they are over engineered.

In the 90's and early 2000's, and most likely still today, Honda manufactured more IC engines than any other MFR worldwide. (Remember, cars, motorbikes, boat and all of the small equipment)