LB concealed in a wall?

[Zoggan]

Hey everyone, first post woohoo I am running 4 - 6 ga. THHN cables between the house and shop. I'm using 1 1/4" pvc. My question, is it OK to install an LB in my 2X6 house wall to make the turn to my main breaker panel in the house? The LB would get covered with sheetrock? There will NOT be a junction/splice in the cables at that point, it would just make it much easier to pull the cable not having to make that 90 degree turn.

Thanks!

 

[rvcoaster]

from what i understand you have to have access to the LB. i could be wrong but this is what my electrician told me.

 

[PT Doc]

If there is no splice then does it matter? Will an inspector suddenly appear out of no where and guess that something is covered behind the drywall. Now, if this is going to be inspected per dry walling, then ask the inspector if it could be covered.

 

[Zoggan]

I figure if there's no splice it shouldn't matter, but I've been wrong about things like that before! Yes it will be inspected prior to sheetrocking and I'd rather not have to redo it if Inspector guy says no.

 

[walrus]

No concealed LBs in a wall, either use a 90 bend or make access for it

 

[Zoggan]

No concealed LBs in a wall, either use a 90 bend or make access for it

Yeah that's why I asked. I'll just pull the cables without gluing the 90 on,
then slide the rest of the piping over and glue it.

Thanks!

 

[Norcal]

A LB buried in the wall is bad whether a inspector sees it or not, & being inspected or not should have no bearing on how the job is done, BTW have pity on the next guy doing work, it's no fun coming back where some doofus buried a box in the wall & there is a problem.

 

[rvcoaster]

i am working on a similar setup, an LB right under a sub panel. i am going to leave an access plate for it but it will be covered by said plate.

i dont see why you couldnt do this stylistically with drywall, just make a nice stylish plate for it and leave it at that.

 

[VHF]

Yeah that's why I asked. I'll just pull the cables without gluing the 90 on,
then slide the rest of the piping over and glue it.

Thanks!

Technically that's also a no-no, although I've seen licensed electricians do it. It is possible that the PVC glue could damage the insulation on the wire.

Any conduit run is supposed to be complete; then you pull the wires through. At least that's the theorey!

 

[gatchel]

Doesn't anyone watch Holmes on Homes...No Hidden Junctions...

 

[Charles (in GA)]

While not a junction in this case, it is impossible to pull additional wires or replace existing wires in the conduit, as it would be impossible to access the LB, that is the reasoning, even though there is no wire splices, as already noted, you need a complete conduit system that you can pull thru, and this prevents you from doing that.

If you have room, use a long sweep 90 or as others noted, put an access plate in the wall.

Charles

 

[Charles (in GA)]

While not a junction in this case, it is impossible to pull additional wires or replace existing wires in the conduit, as it would be impossible to access the LB, that is the reasoning, even though there is no wire splices, as already noted, you need a complete conduit system that you can pull thru, and this prevents you from doing that.

If you have room, use a long sweep 90 or as others noted, put an access plate in the wall.

Charles

 

[caddymanwi]

If you're still not sure, call the inspector and ask. I've done this numerous times and each time they've been friendly and have actually been more helpful during inspections than critical because they recognize that I'm trying to follow the code. Just my two cents worth.

 

[Zoggan]

I actually ended up using a 90 degree sweep and it worked out perfect. Didn't need to glue after the fact either. Thanks to all for the input.

 

[Jawn]

Stupid question... what's an LB?

 

[The Motts]

Stupid question... what's an LB?

You use them where you need a pulling point, but don't need a junction box. They don't need to be supported like a junction box does.

 

[harvero]

Since a LB is not a junction box, and should not be used to contain splices, why can't it be installed inside a wall? I've seen this done on entry runs to load centers in the past.

A short Google and I got this code references to 314.29 from http://www.theelectricalguru.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1224446737

 

[kngelv]

Look at N.E.C. requirements 314.29 and 314.72 D. You must have access. This is a code violation and foolish. Take a picture of where you propose putting the LB and maybe someone can help you with a better option. If you do this you will regret it later.

James

Journeyman Electrician

 

[Zoggan]

Look at N.E.C. requirements 314.29 and 314.72 D. You must have access. This is a code violation and foolish. Take a picture of where you propose putting the LB and maybe someone can help you with a better option. If you do this you will regret it later.

James

Journeyman Electrician

James, my main reason for posting the question was to find out if it was against code. If is was OK with the NEC I would go ahead and do it. As I found out it was not an approved application, I went forward with my install and found that a 90 degree sweep worked out perfectly and the LB is now a moot point.

Thanks!

 

[Ray-CA]

May I ask a question?

What is an "LB?"

Thanks,

Ray

 

[paranoid56]

May I ask a question?

What is an "LB?"

Thanks,

Ray

4 posts up

 

[PRH44]

There ia another options when faced wth a tight turning raduis. Most conditions on the load side of the meter where concealed in the wall will allow a type SE = service entrance cable. This cable which looks like romex will allow for a tight bend as long as you do not exceed the minium bend raduis. Very common installation practice permitted by the NEC. http://www.cable.alcan.com/CablePublic/en-US/Products/STABILOY+Aluminum+Feeder+Cable/Residential+Service+Entrance+Cable/STABILOY+Service+Entrance+Cable+Type+SE+Style+R.htmHowever check local codes and/or local authority having jurisdiction. Some local codes may require conduit.

 

[rabidsquirrel]

Since a LB is not a junction box, and should not be used to contain splices, why can't it be installed inside a wall? I've seen this done on entry runs to load centers in the past.

Not true, you can splice in an conduit body provided it contains enough volume.

 

[southpier]

you did include a pull string for the future, right?

 

[kngelv]

James, my main reason for posting the question was to find out if it was against code. If is was OK with the NEC I would go ahead and do it. As I found out it was not an approved application, I went forward with my install and found that a 90 degree sweep worked out perfectly and the LB is now a moot point.

Thanks!

Good news

James

 

[The Motts]

Not true, you can splice in an conduit body provided it contains enough volume.

The LB also needs to be labelled with the volume.

 

[Zoggan]

you did include a pull string for the future, right?

Haha, no I didn't. That's another one of those shoulda's Ive come across with this project. I've built a 28' X 32' shop from the concrete up with mostly the Internet for guidance. I've had some help from friends, but to say it's been a learning experience would be an understatement of vast proportions!

 

[rabidsquirrel]

The LB also needs to be labelled with the volume.

They're usually stamped on the inside with the volume and max amount of wires @ X size.

 

[Stuart in MN]

you did include a pull string for the future, right?

Once wires have been installed a pull string doesn't help much...99% of the time you'll have to temporarily pull out the wires out to add any more. When you pull them out, attach a pull string to those wires.

 

[darcyh]

You use them where you need a pulling point, but don't need a junction box. They don't need to be supported like a junction box does.

Okay, what exactly what word does 'LB' mean? Elbow?

Thanks,

Dave

 

[Motofixxer]

Most Home improvement stores have nice little access panels normally near the plumbing dept. Generally a couple different sizes. They are just a plastic trim ring and a panel that snaps inside of it. Cut your hole in the drywall and put the panel in. The plastic can be painted to match the wall color etc.

 

[oleguy]

Okay, what exactly what word does 'LB' mean? Elbow?

Thanks,

Dave

L=L as in shape, B as in back.look at metal cover.faceing cover,if fitting hole is in back,it is LB.outlet hole left is LL,outlet hole right is LR.

 

[malibu101]

Hold the conduit body like a handgun.
LB= cover on back
LR= cover on right
LL= cover on left

Easy way to remember.

 

[Naq]

...
I've built a 28' X 32' shop from the concrete up with mostly the Internet for guidance. I've had some help from friends, but to say it's been a learning experience would be an understatement of vast proportions!

New thread with pics or it didn't happen.

 

[pattenp]

L=L as in shape, B as in back.look at metal cover.faceing cover,if fitting hole is in back,it is LB.outlet hole left is LL,outlet hole right is LR.

Hold the conduit body like a handgun.
LB= cover on back
LR= cover on right
LL= cover on left

Easy way to remember.

Ok.. which is it, hole position or cover position. Right answer wins... wins what I don't know.

 

[oleguy]

either way.just go to lowes,hd or any supply house and ask to see one of each.look at post #30 motts post.that is a LB.

 

[malibu101]

Ok.. which is it, hole position or cover position. Right answer wins... wins what I don't know.

There both the same.
I was taught the gun method way but never heard of the cover versus hole side way until now.

 

[pattenp]

There both the same.
I was taught the gun method way but never heard of the cover versus hole side way until now.

Sorry you lose. I like oleguy's answer better.

 

[drps10]

Old thread, but maybe someone can assist.
considering doing something similar but with a wire trough. I have a flush mount main in the garage and need to install a wire trough that is running perpendicular to the panel just below it (similar to the picture from another member on here) It will be surface mounted. I need to run 8 THHN to sub panels for critical load panels (surface mount) right next to the main (solar/battery backup). I need to have the feeder wires in conduit at all time (and in the behind drywall). I just need to figure out a solution to come out of main panel into wire trough. I know the LB intent is for access to pull wire through, and with this setup there should be no issue to pull wire through or need access to the back plate to unscrew. I was also going to make an removable access panel between the panel and wire trough just so I can get under main panel if ever need be.

 

[PCustoms]

Old thread, but maybe someone can assist.
considering doing something similar but with a wire trough. I have a flush mount main in the garage and need to install a wire trough that is running perpendicular to the panel just below it (similar to the picture from another member on here) It will be surface mounted. I need to run 8 THHN to sub panels for critical load panels (surface mount) right next to the main (solar/battery backup). I need to have the feeder wires in conduit at all time (and in the behind drywall). I just need to figure out a solution to come out of main panel into wire trough. I know the LB intent is for access to pull wire through, and with this setup there should be no issue to pull wire through or need access to the back plate to unscrew. I was also going to make an removable access panel between the panel and wire trough just so I can get under main panel if ever need be.

Where is the trough?

You can't bury an LB. Period.

Looks like you are adding a sub panel below the panel. Use a ****** (and bushings) to connect the two, mount the lower one flush and repair your drywall. When you put the covers back on it will be a clean install.