HelisandHarleys
Well-known member
Anyone have LED fixtures instead of fluorescents or incandescent? Talk to me!
LED garage lighting
- Thread starter HelisandHarleys
- Start date
i don't know what is considered "bright enough" or not... but I converted to LED T8 tubes for my garage. here's a shot of the garage from outside in the dark and a shot where you can see the LED tubes in the light fixtures. pictures were taken when I put in the flooring, so it's a bit messy.
EDIT: sorry, for whatever reason GJ site won't allow me to upload the other picture...
EDIT: sorry, for whatever reason GJ site won't allow me to upload the other picture...
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92GreenYJ
Well-known member
I'm planning to go all LED thru the whole house, but as they are still pricey I am doing it a bit at a time. So far I got a good 40 some odd feet of the thin LED strip lighting in cool white for my workbench overhead lighting. Attached the stuff to the bottom of my gladiator cabinets. Have one section to do still but loving it so far even though the bench isn't done yet enough to actually do any work on it yet.
BTW, the LED T8 bulbs I used cost me $42 each, so a bit pricey, but for me worth it. The good news is that they have a newer brighter version for $36.50 now!
here's a link: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004BLH714/?tag=atomicindus08-20
here's a link: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004BLH714/?tag=atomicindus08-20
OP
HelisandHarleys
Well-known member
Thanks! They have packs of 4 for $133!
OP
HelisandHarleys
Well-known member
Me too, but garage is getting remodeled so I'd like to upgrade now. The rest of the house can wait. Garage is a priority anyway
BoostAddiction
Well-known member
I looked at the Amazon lights and they lack the key data one needs to understand before choosing them, namely the amount of lumens they create, and the color temperature.
When basic data isn't listed, I click right through listings like that.
When basic data isn't listed, I click right through listings like that.
if you're talking about the ones I linked to, the lumens output data is available on the manufacturer website. like you, that was the key data for my purchasing decision. I wasn't going to pay that price if I didn't know if the light output would be sufficient.
Scrambler82
Active member
My house has almost all LED Lamps but this garage and the new one in California will not.
Why... Because the cost vs life time of service does not equate to an overall lower price and my existing T12s hav been in there for almost a10 years.
Why pay $75 per lamp. How many Fluor. lamps can you buy for just one LED Tube.
Also, my use factor is low, again so the gains are minimum at best..
Anyone switching with the prices at a high, needs to be running the lights all day and most of the night to achieve an electricity savings.
Why... Because the cost vs life time of service does not equate to an overall lower price and my existing T12s hav been in there for almost a10 years.
Why pay $75 per lamp. How many Fluor. lamps can you buy for just one LED Tube.
Also, my use factor is low, again so the gains are minimum at best..
Anyone switching with the prices at a high, needs to be running the lights all day and most of the night to achieve an electricity savings.
Replaced all my exterior landscape lighting and security lighting with LED and even built a few custom down lights using the Cree chips. Been a big wattage saver...
In the shop I like the Cree rolls that has a self stick backing and I just attach a length to an aluminum angle or C channel, then power it with a old wall wart. Been saving wall warts for decades so have box fulls. Many of the Cree chips handle a range of 12-36vac/dc (has built in regulator). Most people throw those wall warts away because whatever they were powering failed, also even when it fails it often still puts out 12vac.
I also keep an eye out at the box stores for closeout LED spots at bargain prices and use old yard light fixtures and mount them up in my trusses for extra down lighting.
Still too pricey for me to replace florescent completely but they are improving every year and prices getting better.
BoostAddiction
Well-known member
Thanks- they are rated at 2100 lumens, against the ones I have now which are supposed to be 2500.
But like HP numbers, I am skeptical of manufacturer-supplied data. I have LED bulbs in my can lights in the office and had to replace one a year or so ago. The new one- supposedly identical to the older ones- is noticeably brighter. I assume the old ones are losing their brightness over time.
numbers aside, I have them in my garage and they provide enough light for me to work in the garage at night. maybe it isn't as bright as some other lights, but it works for me. have zero regrets and love them! I wouldn't go back to fluorescent even if you gave me T8 tubes for free.
What do you think about this in comparison to what y'all was saying http://www.usa.lighting.philips.com...duraLED_T8_Specifier_Series_for_End_Users.pdf
2ManyProjects
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I find them "interesting"; but I don't think they're really competitive yet, save perhaps for commercial applications which run (nearly) 24/7 or have a significant "political correctness factor" to influence the decision-making process.
The big issue is, while they claim (in a footnote on Page 8) equivalent ft.-cd. as a 28W T8 "Energy-Saver" fluorescent, the actual light output (in Lumens) is barely half as much. In order to get that "equivalent ft.-cd." result, they'd have to focus the light pretty tightly on the test surface. Whether they do that with an internal reflector within the bulb/tube, or rely on an external reflector, is not made clear in that brochure. But either way, you wind up needing more of them to evenly distribute light throughout the space -- and there goes your operating-cost "savings".
They're also still quite pricey. A quick Google search seems to imply about $65-75 each.
I am hopeful that by the time I get some other projects out of the way and can start my own garage re-do in earnest, the cost-per-lumen of LED will be much improved over where it is today, because I'd really like to avoid fluorescents (and the RF noise and switching/dimming hassles they inevitably impose) if reasonably feasible. But from what I've seen thus far, we just aren't there yet.
Highbeam
Well-known member
I don't know what you're talking about. I have been relamping can lights with LED 65 watt equivalent bulbs from home depot for just over 10$ each. Ecosmart BR30 bulbs. 650 lumens of soft white for 9 watts. They are instant on and dimmable.
No, they're not tube lights but the br30 light is far superior to CFL with their stupid slow warm up times.
I also bought a single edison base LED at home depot for 6$ and it is a 60 watt equivalnet. I don't have the specs but it is a Cree bulb and I was happy to toss out a perfectly good CFL in this outdoor fixture. CFLs don't handle cold well.
I have standard t8s in the shop and am happy with them for base lighting but for task lighting, I will likely apply a fixture that can utilize the BR30 bulb. Great light.
No, they're not tube lights but the br30 light is far superior to CFL with their stupid slow warm up times.
I also bought a single edison base LED at home depot for 6$ and it is a 60 watt equivalnet. I don't have the specs but it is a Cree bulb and I was happy to toss out a perfectly good CFL in this outdoor fixture. CFLs don't handle cold well.
I have standard t8s in the shop and am happy with them for base lighting but for task lighting, I will likely apply a fixture that can utilize the BR30 bulb. Great light.
bczygan
Well-known member
Been picking up LED floods and bulbs from a resale shop for $6 each. Have them in fixtures all over the house and garage.
Ive had LED's in the outside fixtures on my garage for about 7 months now and like them well enough. The light in the winter was much better than CFL's that would go dim, though one of them seems not to like the heat as much as the other two, I swear that ive caught it cycling between dimmer and brighter.
The wife don't care for the two I have in the bathroom and im waiting for some brighter ones so i can replace the bulbs in my kitchen with 9 ft. ceilings.
The wife don't care for the two I have in the bathroom and im waiting for some brighter ones so i can replace the bulbs in my kitchen with 9 ft. ceilings.
that's kind of what I'm saying... see the pic I posted. I think they are plenty bright and I have no complaints after using them for about a year now. funny story... I had my LED lights on with the garage door open one night. and I guess my neighbor 2 doors down noticed the section of the street in front of my house was brightly lit and thought maybe some police cars were there with their spot lights and he came over to check if I was okay... only to find out it was just my garage lights. lol numbers aside, and I'm not saying which is brighter or not, I'm saying they are practically bright enough and I really like the whiter light it outputs.
2ManyProjects
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In the context of those particular "LED tubes", yes -- at least as Philips tested them. But they didn't give enough information to know if that directionality is a property of the devices themselves, or of whatever fixture they used during the testing process.
That's the point they were trying to make with that footnote. But again, it really depends on information they didn't supply, AND how they will be installed in any given application.
LEDs themselves are essentially point-sources. A typical "LED bulb" uses an array of LEDs to distribute the light output in whatever direction(s) may be desired. For example:
or
vs.
or
Without knowing exactly how those Philips tubes are constructed, it is next to impossible to say how well they might work in a specific application.
you guys are getting waaaay too deep here. the pictures of those tubes pretty much show how the grid of LEDs are arranged. and i can tell you as someone who has 8 of these they are pretty much as pictured; a grid of LEDs on one side that point down (provided you orient it correctly when you install them)
it's $35 bucks each now... shoot, at $50 when I got them I didn't hesitate. if anyone is seriously interested, just buy one and try it out. it's not something so outrageously expensive that we have to do this much analysis and write PhD thesis on...
shoot, if you're local to me, you're welcome to come check them out in my garage before you decide to or not buy them.
2ManyProjects
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Really? Where? Not to doubt your word; but I went through the document linked-to by Articul8 (cf. http://www.usa.lighting.philips.com...duraLED_T8_Specifier_Series_for_End_Users.pdf) again, and still all I see are photographs of the outer glass envelope, which is essentially indistinguishable from a standard fluorescent tube. No hint on the number, size, layout or orientation of the individual LEDs which are presumably inside.that tube. There was one photo of someone installing a troffer-type fixture into a dropped ceiling; and that fixture appeared to have a pretty serious reflector built into it. But if all the LEDs really are pointing straight down, that reflector would be a near-total waste. So...?!?
For the four-footers? Best price I've seen so far is $40 ea. (or $360 for a ten-pack) from EarthLED; but that is for the two-foot/10-watt version:
http://store.earthled.com/products/...a-11w-2-foot-60cm-led-t8-t12-replacement-tube
Here's 4 for $133, http://www.amazon.com/dp/B008YCFXS0/?tag=atomicindus08-20
So I'm coming up on doing all-new electrical in my 20x30 detached garage that only had a couple outlets and a single overhead light before. I want to install up to 12 4' fixtures. If I were to go for LED lighting, the cheapest solution seems to be these T8 bulbs from Amazon.
However, I don't even have any light fixtures yet. The last thing I want to do is buy a bunch of T8 fixtures and throw away the ballast. Anybody know where to get fixtures without ballasts?
However, I don't even have any light fixtures yet. The last thing I want to do is buy a bunch of T8 fixtures and throw away the ballast. Anybody know where to get fixtures without ballasts?
2ManyProjects
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I got these:
http://www.sears.com/48-in-shop-light-tread-plate/p-03489033000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1
used the free SYWR points I get and some coupons and that came out to under $20 each. they were so cheap I didn't care about ripping out the new ballasts. the tread plate design also happens to go along with my gladiator stuff.
Here's another thing to consider with LED vs linear fluorescent: the LEDs might not actually be any better.
With CFL vs LED, the not-bargain-basement LEDs are now clearly better. They produce the same number of lumens, they produce the same range of CCTs, they produce as good or better CRI and they use less energy to do it. Their lumens per Watt are much better than CFL and, coupled with CRI, that's enough to make the LEDs the clear choice and they only cost a little more now.
However, with linear fluorescent vs LED, that's not NEARLY as clear. The LFs and LEDs have about the same range of CCTs. They have about the same range of CRIs. They have about the same amount efficiency (lumens/Watt) if you're talking about T8s. So they're pretty comparable technologically. However, T8s are MUCH, MUCH cheaper than LEDs, comparing equal products. So much cheaper, in fact, that you'll probably never replace the T8s enough times to make it cheaper in the long run to have gone with LEDs. Re-evaluate this in a year, though, LED prices are dropping like crazy.
So if your shop decision is CFL vs LED, go with LED. However, if your shop decision is linear fluorescent vs LED, you probably should still go with linear fluorescent. Of all 3 technologies to light a homeowner or small business shop right now, T8s are the clear winner on cost and perform as well as anything else on the market.
With CFL vs LED, the not-bargain-basement LEDs are now clearly better. They produce the same number of lumens, they produce the same range of CCTs, they produce as good or better CRI and they use less energy to do it. Their lumens per Watt are much better than CFL and, coupled with CRI, that's enough to make the LEDs the clear choice and they only cost a little more now.
However, with linear fluorescent vs LED, that's not NEARLY as clear. The LFs and LEDs have about the same range of CCTs. They have about the same range of CRIs. They have about the same amount efficiency (lumens/Watt) if you're talking about T8s. So they're pretty comparable technologically. However, T8s are MUCH, MUCH cheaper than LEDs, comparing equal products. So much cheaper, in fact, that you'll probably never replace the T8s enough times to make it cheaper in the long run to have gone with LEDs. Re-evaluate this in a year, though, LED prices are dropping like crazy.
So if your shop decision is CFL vs LED, go with LED. However, if your shop decision is linear fluorescent vs LED, you probably should still go with linear fluorescent. Of all 3 technologies to light a homeowner or small business shop right now, T8s are the clear winner on cost and perform as well as anything else on the market.
2ManyProjects
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While I largely agree with your analysis, there are two other factors which MAY tip the balance toward LED:
1. - Fluorescent lamps (be they linear or CFL) are notorious for spewing RF interference about. The source of this RFI is (at least usually) actually the cheap-*** ballast, not the tube; but that hardly matters in practice. You can add power-line filters at the inputs to the lamps to (at least partially) tame this; but that's an added expense and additional complication.
2. - Fluorescent lamps tend to not like very cold temperatures. In an unheated garage scenario, this usually plays out in the form of lamps either not starting at all, or taking several minutes to come up to full brightness and "correct" color temperature. You can get special-duty fluorescent lamps which are rated down to at least 0-degree C. (32-degree F.); but they cost a lot more than "standard" T8s and similar. And if I understand those "ratings" correctly, they only imply that the lamp will reliably start at those temperatures; you'll still have a significant "warm-up time" before they are putting out their full brightness and rated color of light.
It is for these reasons (among others) that, as I mentioned before, I'm really hoping that LED becomes much more cost-competitive by the time I need to pull the trigger (which is still at least a few months off, at the rate things are going).
Seen these on the amazon link, the ad
so this will work from 85v to 277v?
I don't know much about led
http://www.ledglobalsupply.com/t8-led-bulbs/4-foot-t8-3014-led-fluorescent-white-85-277v/
so this will work from 85v to 277v?
I don't know much about led
http://www.ledglobalsupply.com/t8-led-bulbs/4-foot-t8-3014-led-fluorescent-white-85-277v/
yes, indeed.
anthonyc12
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LED is the and always be the best choice, i have 4 LED bulbs in my garage, but 4 are enough to light it up well. although LED lamps are expensive but they consume less electricity and works for years so there are plenty of reasons for you to buy them.
gatchel
Well-known member
Good luck with those LED's...