let's see your craftsman block grinders

[william.m.hamilton2]

All- you guys have some great restored grinders. What colors and makes of paint are you using?

 

[torqueman2002]

WELLLL.... Lets see it!

OK, you asked for it.

I'm like ! And looking for things to polish.

I also got a buffing kit from TP Tools.

 

[drivesitfar]

TM:that is too cool. I've owned a few of these and never a brand new one. all those compounds and extras too. OMG I'm jealous.

by the way what is your address so we can send you stuff to practice on if you can't find something?

that is great rinder **** even if on the wrong thread.

thanks for sharing.

 

[torqueman2002]

TM:that is too cool. I've owned a few of these and never a brand new one. all those compounds and extras too. OMG I'm jealous.

by the way what is your address so we can send you stuff to practice on if you can't find something?

that is great rinder **** even if on the wrong thread.

thanks for sharing.

Thanks. You're looking at my retirement program.

 

[drivesitfar]

TM: at least you have a plan. very nice and please post some of the shiny items either here or make a new thread for TM's projects. also describe the process and the compounds for those of us that always want to improve our methods.

 

[torqueman2002]

TM: at least you have a plan. very nice and please post some of the shiny items either here or make a new thread for TM's projects. also describe the process and the compounds for those of us that always want to improve our methods.

That's a lot of pressure.
I'm a newbie, so hang on for a bumpy ride.

 

[drivesitfar]

you'll do just fine. also don't think that we aren't here to help you too so just ask if you have any questions.

94 has a long thread with a lot of cool stuff and i'm sure he made a mistake now and then or needed help once in a while.

garage journal at its best is to let us try and help if we run into a wall. remember there are probably guys on here that can design a broom to fly to the moon with a few spare parts.

 

[Trey T]

Anybody with CM block grinder convert it to buffing for light duty work? If so, did you have to convert the arbor to something longer?

 

[WeAreNotAlone]

My replies are in Blue.

Originally Posted by WeAreNotAlone View Post
... Curious, what is the MODEL Number, Size of wheels, HP /voltage rating of your vent-less commercial? Post #1 in the following link has a table of CM Block/pre-Block grinders. All are vent-less and single phase. http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=245593

Single or 3 phase?
.

Appreciate the link. So if I'm reading it right NONE of the Block grinders where outfitted with "cooling" vents... and it is imperative that the grinder have the "rubber" feet on it, or other wise be spaced up instead of being bolted flat to a mounting surface so it doesn't overheat.

Correct?
***********************

Regarding "VENTING" a grinder. PRO's and CON's

I'm not looking directly at the 397 1/2hp Block grinder I have right now but what are the PRO'S and CON's to adding VENTING... and does anyone have any thoughts on venting placement?

Additionally, anyone have any thoughts on how to create venting?
(I would think the best type of vents to use would be the type that is punched out and the "hood" is positioned so debris is channeled away from the vent.)

Venting
PRO"S =
RUNS COOLER, Reduction in temps=lasts longer.

NOTE: As machines "age" additional cooling is even more important.

CON's
Depending on venting placement allows for debris to enter housing.

Probably not too much a issue, but too much cooling could allow the unit to cool off too fast (In electronics such as computers and the like heat cycling will break solders, as a general rule you don't want rapid changes in temp)


PS: To all, Sorry for asking "questions" within this thread . While seeing pics is nice of someone else's latest "score".... To me it seems the best place for tech tips and a discussion about sources of PARTS for Craftsman branded Block grinders should be here instead of being scattered around.
(Before some says to "search", it's hard to search for something when you don't know the proper search terms to use.)


Searched around on Google for a while on the process I could use to re-coat the start windings on the 397 I have which while appear to be "working" look like they were overheated at one point without much luck.



.

 

[WeAreNotAlone]

Anybody with CM block grinder convert it to buffing for light duty work? If so, did you have to convert the arbor to something longer?

I see only 6 people in the poll voted :-(

Grinder Arbor/Shaft Extenders/Adapters > Buffer (POLL)

~snip~
Kevin54 has offered to do a run of adapters, but first needs to know the quantity before a price can be given.

I'll act as the order & distribution point; IF this is a go project.

I will run the poll until Friday, May 02 at 9:00 PM Eastern DST. (2014)

I will let Kevin know the results.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=245593

 

[organ]

I can see the reasoning behind having no vents (No entry of debris into grinder), maybe I was thinking about another piece of equipment.

Curious, what is the MODEL Number, Size of wheels, HP /voltage rating of your vent-less commercial?

Single or 3 phase?

.

Model: 397.19440, 7 inch wheels, 1/2 HP, and 115 or 230 volts single phase

 

[drivesitfar]

TreyT: there has been a lot of posts lately about the extensions of the block's arbors because the only solution at present was to bolt some on which could damage the existing threads. the "Poll" Tourqueman was so gracious to start might not have gotten a lot of people interested at this time, but at one time or another unless you have a dedicated buffer you might want to turn your block into one. besides damaging the threads we discussed using a buffing wheel and taking off the guards, but there were a couple cons against doing that. one you can't easily get all the way around your piece you are working on and you also tend to throw a lot of stuff back into the grinder. Tourqueman and others including me thought it might work better on an extension to the existing arbors to have them with left and right threads machined into the extensions for a better fit and wouldn't damage your existing block's threads.

NotAlone: i'm not sure why you want to vent one. in my opinion these 40 to almost 70 year old block grinders work great and have for years if treated with a little care. if it ain't broke don't fix it is a pretty good motto and a lot of happy users on this thread that do use theirs. they aren't industrial quality like a Baldor to run 24/7 so you might need an upgrade to one like that if you are using yours all the time and still having heating issues with yours. any extra holes would allow not only air, but all the stuff in the air coming off your grinder. McB fixed his overheating issue with about $5 and a few minutes of his time. good luck

TM: i'm wondering if there is an idea of a price for the arbor extensions like first 6 for $30 a set, making 20 for $20 and 50 for $10 each then there might be more response. as you know i don't "need" them, but if not too expensive i'd definitely buy 2 sets and maybe another set or two for Block grinders to yet be determined. thanks again for doing this. also the $ figures are out of thin air so have no idea what they would cost and maybe Kevin can give a approximate # to them?

 

[McBrownie]

NotAlone: i'm not sure why you want to vent one. in my opinion these 40 to almost 70 year old block grinders work great and have for years if treated with a little care. if it ain't broke don't fix it is a pretty good motto and a lot of happy users on this thread that do use theirs. they aren't industrial quality like a Baldor to run 24/7 so you might need an upgrade to one like that if you are using yours all the time and still having heating issues with yours. any extra holes would allow not only air, but all the stuff in the air coming off your grinder. McB fixed his overheating issue with about $5 and a few minutes of his time. good luck

I agree. I not only had mine flat on the bench (which is the configuration it spent the first 30 years of its life, btw), I also had it on a rubber pad to keep it from slipping around since I hadn't mounted it to the bench yet. This effectively sealed the bottom. Putting rubber feet solved that issue. I would not vent the housing as you would let all sorts of junk get into your motor.

I worked in the power tool industry for a few years and one of the UL tests was the "dust test". Basically, you put a tool in a box with some sort of agitator, throw in a bunch of drywall dust, seal the top, and time how long it runs. IIRC, they don't run for long. Switches clog, bearing seizes, etc...

However, I have to admit that a "louvered" flat top would look pretty cool! Especially if it had flames painted on it.

 

[Outlawmws]

Searched around on Google for a while on the process I could use to re-coat the start windings on the 397 I have which while appear to be "working" look like they were overheated at one point without much luck.

.

http://www.kyocera-chemi.jp/english/prdct/list/cm/varnish.html

 

[Trey T]

Thanks guys. I think I'll leave the CM block grinder alone and convert my 1hp motor (1800rpm) that I have laying around instead. It's half the RPM people recommend but I'll get a quality buffer down the road.

 

[ecotec]

I found one at an estate sale this morning. It was $30. It does not have the quenching tray or a stand. The bearings are good.

View media item 40572
The date on it is 11/21/62.

 

[torqueman2002]

you'll do just fine. also don't think that we aren't here to help you too so just ask if you have any questions.

94 has a long thread with a lot of cool stuff and i'm sure he made a mistake now and then or needed help once in a while.

garage journal at its best is to let us try and help if we run into a wall. remember there are probably guys on here that can design a broom to fly to the moon with a few spare parts.

Thanks. I like the exchange of information and ideas.

BTW - '.... guys on here that can design a broom to fly to the moon with a few spare parts.'

 

[torqueman2002]

... TM: i'm wondering if there is an idea of a price for the arbor extensions like first 6 for $30 a set, making 20 for $20 and 50 for $10 each then there might be more response. as you know i don't "need" them, but if not too expensive i'd definitely buy 2 sets and maybe another set or two for Block grinders to yet be determined. thanks again for doing this. also the $ figures are out of thin air so have no idea what they would cost and maybe Kevin can give a approximate # to them?

Drivesit ...,

I think he will do that, very soon.

Sorry I dropped the ball.

Good thing is, he may still be open for additions to the count.

If interested, any one can look at the sizes and I/M me.

Buffer Arbor Adapters
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=245593

 

[torqueman2002]

I found one at an estate sale this morning. It was $30. It does not have the quenching tray or a stand. The bearings are good.

View media item 40572
The date on it is 11/21/62.

Nice pre-Block Grinder. What's the HP & Model number (115.????)?

Did you buy the SS table also?

 

[torqueman2002]

So, recently more than 1 member has asked about an owners manual.

I've sent people over to OWWM's sister site: http://vintagemachinery.org

Yesterday, after hearing back from a member, I tried for >5 min. to find the re-prints. Ugh, good resource site, but it takes time to find stuff.

So, I copied the link to the page for Craftsman tools to make it easier. Use the pull-down menu to select 'Sanders/Grinders' to filter results.
Publication Re-prints
http://vintagemachinery.org/mfgindex/detail.aspx?id=222&tab=3

Mike

 

[torqueman2002]

Thanks guys. I think I'll leave the CM block grinder alone and convert my 1hp motor (1800rpm) that I have laying around instead. It's half the RPM people recommend but I'll get a quality buffer down the road.

TP Tools & Baldor Motors: "... recommend 1800 rpm for plastics and 3600 rpm for metals and non-ferrous metals."

1 HP sounds good!

Happy buffing.

 

[drivesitfar]

TM: as usual i love reading your posts. thanks for all the information.

 

[Trey T]

Thanks.

What's block and pre-block? Can you explain the time period?

Nice pre-Block Grinder. What's the HP & Model number (115.????)?

Did you buy the SS table also?

 

[torqueman2002]

Thanks.

What's block and pre-block? Can you explain the time period?

The Craftsman grinders that the thread is mainly focused on have model numbers with prefixes of 257. and 397.

The 'Block' grinder designation is from the overall shape of the motor housing.

257.191600

397.19670

Note: Not all CM Model 257.xxxxx grinders are the coveted 'Block' grinders. Some 'newer' CM grinders have plastic motor housings. See 257.190470 purchased new in July 1987.

257.190470

The CM grinders with prefix 115. pre-date the 'Block' motor CM grinders. Note the more rounded 'mail box' top.

115.7566 (Mfg. Date - 2 59)

For more information on manufacture's that supplied CM grinders, Mfg. Dates, Publication Re-prints, and much more; see the following links.

Link to: "Vintage Craftsman "Block Motor" bench grinder info -" Thread
http://tinyurl.com/CM-Block-motor-style-grinders

Link to: Vintage Machinery Home Page
http://vintagemachinery.org/home.aspx

Link to: Publication Re-prints
http://vintagemachinery.org/mfgindex/detail.aspx?id=222&tab=3

 

[bluebolt]

Thanks guys. I think I'll leave the CM block grinder alone and convert my 1hp motor (1800rpm) that I have laying around instead. It's half the RPM people recommend but I'll get a quality buffer down the road.

In reality its SFPS (Surface Feet per second) you need to pay attention to. Run a 1 HP motor with 10" or 12" wheels and your 1800 rpm will be about right.

http://www.schaffnermfg.com/engineers-speedchart.php

 

[torqueman2002]

In reality its SFPS (Surface Feet per second) you need to pay attention to. Run a 1 HP motor with 10" or 12" wheels and your 1800 rpm will be about right.

http://www.schaffnermfg.com/engineers-speedchart.php

Nice source for supplies, tips, and resources.

Thanks!

 

[bczygan]

Found another 1/2HP for $25

Plus there's one in Port Clinton, OH for $35

http://toledo.craigslist.org/tls/4455916630.html

 

[torqueman2002]

Found another 1/2HP for $25

Plus there's one in Port Clinton, OH for $35

http://toledo.craigslist.org/tls/4455916630.html

Just eMailed him for the 4th time in a week and 1/2.

Maybe I'll get a reply.

BTW - we need pics, or as you know -- it didn't happen!

 

[McBrownie]

Just eMailed him for the 4th time in a week and 1/2.

Maybe I'll get a reply.

BTW - we need pics, or as you know -- it didn't happen!

No reply for me either. That was one of 3 I struck out on yesterday on my drive to pick up my kid from college. Port Clinton, Dayton, and Cinci. Dayton was too much ($125) and Cinci sold before I even called. The Cinci one was a super clean 1/3HP 1960's with all of the attachments. With all of the dirty clothes my son had, I would have had to drive home with it in my lap.

 

[torqueman2002]

... With all of the dirty clothes my son had, I would have had to drive home with it in my lap.

How true, how true! LOL

 

[McBrownie]

Sorry, I can't post a picture right now, but someone needs to get to Charleston quick!

http://charleston.craigslist.org/tls/4449917742.html

 

[bczygan]

Don't know if he still has this one, but priced at $80, he probably still does.

http://detroit.craigslist.org/wyn/tls/4452710133.html

Another old ad:

http://detroit.craigslist.org/wyn/tls/4408546281.html

 

[tedsters]

just picked this up tuesday on my way home at an estate sale they wanted $55 i tried getting him lower then i paid at $45 and he wasn't buying he knew what it was this thing only has a few scratches on it original wheels its dated 10-5-73
i had one heck of a time getting the price sticker off and below switch where they had a piece of duct tape on it was dried on there i didn't want to use a heat gun because of the decal tag but got it off with some goo gone, nice clean grinder to match my 7in.
the first pic was just how i got it, oh yea the original rubber feet and washers are still on it

 

[torqueman2002]

My comments are in Blue.

Don't know if he still has this one, but priced at $80, he probably still does. Saw that ad, thought it was too $$ for condition.

http://detroit.craigslist.org/wyn/tls/4452710133.html

Another old ad:

http://detroit.craigslist.org/wyn/tls/4408546281.html

That's now at my shop, stripped waiting for paint.

That's for the posts.

 

[torqueman2002]

just picked this up tuesday on my way home at an estate sale they wanted $55 i tried getting him lower then i paid at $45 and he wasn't buying he knew what it was this thing only has a few scratches on it original wheels its dated 10-5-73
i had one heck of a time getting the price sticker off and below switch where they had a piece of duct tape on it was dried on there i didn't want to use a heat gun because of the decal tag but got it off with some goo gone, nice clean grinder to match my 7in.
the first pic was just how i got it, oh yea the original rubber feet and washers are still on it

Sweet grinder.

Looks like PO did some wood grinding on those stones.

 

[56rpm]

This grinder is one of my better buys. In December of 1988 I was looking thru the return and recon tools and spotted this never used grinder that had a cracked housing between the motor and wheel. They wanted $125 for it, but took my offer of $100. I believe retail back then was $199.






So I take it home, mount it to a bench and plug it in. Nothing. Take it back to see what Sears will do about it. They say it's under warranty and will look into it. About a week or so later they call me to pick it up. I ask them what was wrong with it. They said the end frame was bad and they replaced it. That was the broken part that caused the grinder to be discounted. Cool, so I get a new, never used, dropped once grinder for $100.

I used it on 115v until I pulled 230v from the main into the garage. This thing really flys when hooked up to 230v.

Bob

 

[tedsters]

Sweet grinder.

Looks like PO did some wood grinding on those stones.

thats the same way my 7in was when i got it saw dust every where, it is a nice grinder though all i did is blew the saw dust out of it and cleaned it up with some mean green the wheels do need to be cleaned up

 

[torqueman2002]

I've noticed there are different sizes as well as styles of eye shields; 2 sizes of the metal framed w/ 'glass' on the early Block grinders, and the 'plastic' style from later Block grinders. I don't know if there is more than 1 size.

I measured up 2 'plastic' eye shields from a 3/4 HP 397.19470 and a 1/2 HP 397.19591.

I'll up date this post with the metal framed styles, later.

Thanks for viewing.

 

[TMcCay]

How much is a 1/2 hp. block grinder worth? I found one but did not inspect it closely. Owner says it works, it is missing the side guards, and I thought I saw the light under the shelf that is stored on.
Also has anyone ever tried to make a new side guard for these? If so any tips?
Owner wants $30 for it but I did not know the value of these. I've been wanting one, but around here they are as rare as hens teeth.

 

[torqueman2002]

My comments are in Blue.

How much is a 1/2 hp. block grinder worth? That is very dependent upon supply, which as you noted, is dependent upon location. Also, condition and completeness is a factor when I am making an offer. I found one but did not inspect it closely. Owner says it works, it is missing the side guards, and I thought I saw the light under the shelf that is stored on.
Also has anyone ever tried to make a new side guard for these? See:
Link to: "Basic sheet-metal fabrication and forming tutorial!" {Make a sheet metal grinder wheel cover}
http://tinyurl.com/Grinder-Wheel-Covers
Link to: "Restoring an old Atlas Grinder" {Make a cast grinder wheel cover}
http://owwm.org/viewtopic.php?p=899544#p899544 If so any tips? I think it would take a fairly well equipped shop and good skills to do either of the above.
Owner wants $30 for it but I did not know the value of these. I have paid more and I have paid less. I've been wanting one, but around here they are as rare as hens teeth. Good luck.