"life" time warranty

[jim1987]

seems there is a lot of warranty threads popping up lately. some for things that are decades old. I get that the packaging may say lifetime warranty. some only say that only applies to the original buyer, and then only with p.o.p.

that part I don't understand. someone paid for the tool to begin with. the warranty should apply to anyone just as it would with the original buyer.

but my question is, what is a lifetime of reasonable use for a tool? I see people saying that under professional use, they have to get their dual 80s rebuilt yearly, or more.

then what about home users? how long should a tool last to get the lifetime of the tools use? obviously its going to vary by trade. but for all intensive purposes, lets stick with auto mechanics, not even 3/4 and up pickups, just "normal" everyday vehicles. (cars and 1/2 pickups)

so well say as a home diyer with weekend shade tree long should the following last, to get the lifetime of the tools use/value?

ratchets
1/4?
3/8?
1/2?

wrenches?
ratchet wrenches?
sockets? again in the three different sizes?
pliers?

how about all those things in a professional manner?


I understand that a lot of tools will hold up for a million years it seems if the right tool is used for the right job. but with modern cars and ever so shrinking engine bays, you may not be able to use the 25" 1/2 breaker bar for that stubborn bolt. so out comes the 10" 3/8 ratchet. but is that really abuse? there wasn't no other available option to use and the 3/8 ratchet was the only thing that could be used to get the job done.


personally myself, I think that its totally messed up that warranty often times seems to depend on the person you deal with. in a perfect world, it shouldn't be someone else discretion on whether or not something gets replaced. especially at lowes or home depot or the like. its not like the tool replacement is coming out of their pocket right? or is there some kind of track record where the employee will eventually get disciplined for warrantying out so many tools?

I don't know, maybe im making a mute thread that doesn't really matter. just curious what everyone else thought what a lifetime warranty meant.

for the record I have no idea. but I don't believe that 30+ year old tools should be warrantied out for new stuff. you've already got the use out of the tool. regardless of how you used it. maybe even 20 years is acceptable. im just saying there comes a point where the value of the tool vs. warranty is exceeded expotentionally. besides, if youre trying to warranty out a 30 year old ratchet, chances are they don't carry a rebuild kit for it. and have to send you out a new one. I say, pony up and buy a new one. newer and better technology. then, if you received the new ratchet under warranty, without the receipt, does that qualify for the warranty too? you didn't buy it, and theres no p.o.p? seems like a lot of trickery Imo.

anyways, that all ive got..

 

[Davefr]

IMHO tool owners are often under the false assumption that all tool companies have the same warranty as Craftsman. Craftsman truly stands out as the best warranty out there.

However if you read the warranty from most other tool manufacturers it usually says something like "lifetime warranty for defects or workmanship".

I see no reason why a tool company should rebuild a ratchet after a certain timeframe, or provide replacement for worn chrome, or where the tool was abused or rusty.

For example, someone here had some 30 year old SO screwdrivers and the plastic handles decomposed. This is clearly a defect in the material and should be replaced with no time limit.

However why should SO rebuild a 20 year old ratchet? These things simply wear out and this is not a defect.

 

[aka Larry]

Most warranties seem to be a carrot until you read the fine print. My wife and I were looking to a buy a used Sonata. We found one at the dealer, and since it only had about 40K on the clock (thus 60K left of the 100K factory warranty) we wanted to buy it. When I discovered that warranty was non-transferrable, that pissed me off. If they are luring you in with the 'our car is so good and we back it up with our warranty' bit, then what does it matter how many people have owned it?

Needless to say we didn't buy it, went down the street and bought a 50K mile Ford Fusion with a factory 100K CPO warranty...for less money to boot.

 

[Erampu]

Lifetime Warranty: If it breaks, they send someone to kill you.

 

[jim1987]

Lifetime Warranty: If it breaks, they send someone to kill you.

lol winner

 

[bcradio]

This topic has been discussed previously.

 

[Steinmetz]

The lifetime warranty is illusory. Therefore it is often used as a sales tactic, since the consumer generally entertains their own extensive idea of the measuring lifetime (the lifetime of the owner, the item for as long as they own it, etc.) It does not mean "perpetual", as some would believe.

The FTC has failed to define the meaning of "lifetime", but various states have. In this sphere, the "lifetime" warranty typically means that the item is warrantied for the reasonable life of the item; seven years, for example.

 

[abvw]

Sears have "satisfaction" guarantee. If you're not happy with their product they will exchange it for you.

Lifetime guarantee usually mean the product life cycle. Once they stop making it then the guarantee is over. It is the company's discretion whether to replace or exchange broken tools for a new or updated version.

How would you feel (say you're a store clerk or truck rep) if someone picked up/stolen a bucket full of rusty and broken tools, requested warranty without receipt, then turns around and sell it to the guy lining up behind him? That's why proof of purchase is required to deter the scammers.

 

[BDT/NWMN]

Yell at me if ya want:: But I would rather see a one, two three, five, seven, or ten year warranty with a proof of purchase required on all tools and shop equipment.

Why should a tool company replace a ratchet that Rufus bought at a yard sale and used a cheater bar on to destroy?

The tool companies don't owe anyone a freeloader ride....

Well, if the stuff is cheap **** to begin with, and they want to lure folks to the Harbor to suckerfeed on a lifetime warranty, that is their business plan. It may work for them; but Count me out.

Do We pay a higher price because the warranty expense is padded into the retail cost of quality tools.????

Nope;;; I would rather buy quality tools with a restrictive warranty and pay a lower price..

 

[methomas70]

Lifetime guarantee usually mean the product life cycle. Once they stop making it then the guarantee is over.

So let me see if I got this right.
I buy a tool on July 1, I even file away the receipt.
Tool is discontinued on July 2.

My lifetime guarantee is valid for only one day?
Are you sure about this?
Did a manufacturer inform you of this, or is it just a guess?

 

[KingCobra98]

I work at a parts store.. I love it when a customer ask "what is the warranty" Everyone thinks in the tool world or parts world this **** should be lifetime.. No matter if it is 40 years old or 3 years.

I get there should be a warranty, but come on, "yea this gearwrench only lasted a year until I put a 3 foot pipe on the f***ing thing" this should be covered.. Or my favorite "I have a blackhawk porto power that I bought In the 80s that just failed, I would like to warranty it"

For auto parts my favorite they buy cheap brake pads and only lasted a year or 2, but failed to tell me they pull a 30ft boat behind there durango.. (maybe you should of left that baby home, hey your *** end is pretty low.. you want to warranty those shocks too?")

 

[kythri]

There's a reason Sears started calling it the "Forever" warranty - to avoid this whole debacle.

Further, one of the reasons someone like Sears pushed the "Forever" warranty was because it built good will.

I would bet that I'm not the only one who started getting into tools on the cheap (buying used, etc.) and warrantying a couple bad pieces at Sears for new, then going on to spend a fair amount on new tool purchases.

That same warranty established me as a new customer and maintained my loyalty quite a bit.

Hell, even with all the Chinese stuff, I still shop at Sears now and then, because of the loyalty they built with that warranty.

Quite frankly, Sears isn't even the outlier in this whole game of leveraging the warranty for sales purposes - auto parts stores are selling lifetime warranties on brake pads, starters, alternators, etc.

I'm more incredulous that someone who works at a parts store is incredulous about customer expectations of lifetime warranties on tools and parts than I am incredulous about customer expectations of lifetime warranties on tools and parts.

Then again, I'm also incredulous that customers are getting defensive of a manufacturer or seller that touted extremely generous warranties when other customers attempt to exercise those warranties.

 

[ajchien]

IMHO tool owners are often under the false assumption that all tool companies have the same warranty as Craftsman. Craftsman truly stands out as the best warranty out there.

However if you read the warranty from most other tool manufacturers it usually says something like "lifetime warranty for defects or workmanship".

Totally agree.

It's also that there are other tool brands, with local franchises that bend their own rules. (i.e. Truck franchises). They bend their own rules because they assume that the goodwill will bring in more business. And the bending of the rules causes confusion, making everyone think that the official warranty equals what Sears offers.

 

[countryroad82]

I'm just going to answer the question of tool longevity. In the 20 years I have been spinning wrenches as a greenhorn, ameture, and quasi professional the times I have had a tool fail were mostly due to my own stupidity. Such as use a screwdriver as a prybar. I have worn out a few ratchets but not many.

 

[mrborohachi]

I have to give it to Stanley for a no nonsense Warranty. I called customer service and they sent me out a new tool and told me to "destroy the old broken tool"

 

[nehog]

Well, warranties are sometimes the stuff lawyers get paid big bucks to figure out!

A warranty is what is written in the warranty agreement document, and nothing more.

Lifetime, defined by the courts is the life of the item. Most items are not warranted against normal wear and tear, and once the item is worn out, the warranty is over!

A significant number of the posts on this forum regarding warranty and claims constitute warranty abuse.

So: read the actual warranty, not the 'warranted for life' advertising to find out what you are entitled to. And if the manufacturer (or seller) limits the warranty: that is their prerogative and your choice is to either buy elsewhere or accept the limitations (such as original purchaser only...)

 

[houstonch73]

Proof of purchase clause. That's always a good one. The receipt that was printed on thermal paper and will completely fade away in about a year? That proof of purchase? LOL.

Even better are the ones that say you have to mail the product back to somewhere far far away and pay for shipping both ways. A $8 tool that you have to spend at least $15 in shipping to get warrantied.

For that reason, in reality the warranty on most everything is until you walk out the door.

 

[monomach]

Most say for defects in workmanship or materials. If your ratchet wears out after ten years, it's pretty silly to claim that it was made defective.

That's why I literally spit coffee over the 30-year old Proto ratchet warranty complaint in the other thread. That thing was clearly made about as well as a ratchet can be made. No defects there.

 

[Kingcreek]

I had a craftsman socket split after only 40 years of normal use. It rolled around in my glove box for a year before I remembered to take it with me to the nearest Sears now 50 miles away. A smiling young man gladly gave me a new one and laughed when I told him I bought it around the time I bought my first car. That's a warranty.
If I've got to jump thru hoops to make a warranty claim then it ain't a warranty.
Different kind of tool I know but Dillon Precision (ammo reloading equipment) has what they call a "No BS" warranty. It covers their product with no questions asked, doesn't matter original owner, abuse, etc and they mean it. I wore out a reloader press and because it was one of the first ones they sold in that model, they wanted it for their techs and engineers to look over. They completely rebuilt it like new and paid shipping both ways and I had it back in 7 days.

 

[48RON54]

I'm just not going to keep POP around in a file all that long. Once something is a few years old, I figure I got my moneys worth. Going through tons of effort to warranty a battery that died 2 months before it should have just to collect some pittance in the form of a prorated warranty is not really worth my time.

 

[Foose911]

Snowball's chance in Hades? I think I'd get kicked out of the store (it's 18 years old)! I've done a lifetime's worth of work with it and it's never let me down.

 

[Dust Devil]

All the Craftsman loyal are gonna **** a brick when Sears goes TU.

Sears has been on the verge of collapse for years, they could fold at any time.

That and the fact that craftsman tools are NOTHING like they were in the past is enough for me to say...well....enough.

 

[espyking83]

Most say for defects in workmanship or materials. If your ratchet wears out after ten years, it's pretty silly to claim that it was made defective.

That's why I literally spit coffee over the 30-year old Proto ratchet warranty complaint in the other thread. That thing was clearly made about as well as a ratchet can be made. No defects there.

What other thread?

 

[Dust Devil]

What other thread?

There was some other thread where a guy was bitching about Proto taking to long to warranty his ratchet. The guy was coming off as a total jerk customer so Im not suprised he was not getting the satisfaction he figured he deserved. Go figure.

 

[48RON54]

All the Craftsman loyal are gonna **** a brick when Sears goes TU.

Sears has been on the verge of collapse for years, they could fold at any time.

That and the fact that craftsman tools are NOTHING like they were in the past is enough for me to say...well....enough.

The Sears by my house was packed Sunday. With all the doomsday news I read about them on this site alone I would have expected that place to be a ghost town. The appliance section was damned near standing room only.

 

[espyking83]

There was some other thread where a guy was bitching about Proto taking to long to warranty his ratchet. The guy was coming off as a total jerk customer so Im not suprised he was not getting the satisfaction he figured he deserved. Go figure.

That would be mine you jackwagon... What in the hell gave you the idea it was a 30 year old ratchet? Are you on crack?

 

[Dust Devil]

The Sears by my house was packed Sunday. With all the doomsday news I read about them on this site alone I would have expected that place to be a ghost town. The appliance section was damned near standing room only.

I hope Sears can keep itself afloat. Sears is an American institution it would **** to see them go.

 

[Foose911]

 

[Dust Devil]

That would be mine you jackwagon... What in the hell gave you the idea it was a 30 year old ratchet? Are you on crack?

LOL that didnt take long.

Im just messing with ya' calm down.

 

[espyking83]

Oh.....


Well played.

 

[ADSR]

Lifetime warranty = Warranty on the tool.

Limited lifetime warranty = Warranty on the first time purchaser of the tool.

 

[IndyGarage]

Yeah, it baffles me when I see somebody who thinks they need to get a replacement for a 30 year old tool that is worn out. clearly there is no defect in a tool that someone has used for the past 30 years.

If you like a tool buy it and use it and when it wears out buy another one.

 

[SASORacing]

Lots of people abuse and malipulate warranties, but its still + EV to label a tool "lifetime warranty".

 

[2ndGearRubber]

We had a discussion like this at the shop last week.

Ideally, no one would ever buy tools again. Everyone could just perpetually warranty **** from the 50's, and since the tools had been discontinued, receive brand new models as replacements. Old craftsman 30 tooth becomes a high tooth comfort grip. Old snap on wrench with more rust than steel becomes flank-drive wrench.

However, we did decide it would be ultimately unsustainable, as the number of mechanics increased, someone would be stuck buying tools occasionally.





Lifetime means different things to me. If I'm not the original buyer, I refuse to warranty it. I had to warranty a blue-point torx bit, via mail. They never asked for the broken one back. A co-worker joked he could also warranty in. I made sure I threw it in the dumpster, out of principle. The warranty is between myself, and the company selling the tool, and I take their trust seriously. Cost also comes into play. A harbor freight impact breaks, after 3-4 years of daily shop use? I buy a new loose socket from another vender. I got my money, the tool worked hard, and failed by no failure of the company who made it. That tool paid me back.


IMO, trying to warranty some ancient tool you bought second hand, is ********. And I feel behavior like that caused the decline of craftsman. I never thought craftsman was amazing, but they affordable, available, and stood behind their product.... maybe too well?

 

[d.mcfarland]

I think a valid point is that how could a tool made in the 1920s even be warrantied by the original owner (hypothetically they passed away by now)? Therefore, they had a "lifetime" warranty on their tool.

 

[ChevyEFI]

I tried to have a discussion with a guy at work on warranty.

My take: If you invest your money and have to buy a tool every 10 years, you're better off than spending double or triple and having lifetime warranty.

The economics (as on most people here) were lost on him.

:shrug:

 

[ClineWrench]

It's interesting...I feel like I've seen a completely new side of tool purchases than I'd considered before.

Most my stuff has been craftsman, Cornwell, snap-on and I think I have a half dozen or so Mac tools. I always bought what I thought would,so the job for the next year or so, knowing that's there's a distinct possibility that I may damage the tool beyond repair and beyond the scope of warranty.

So while lifetime warranty sounds nice, it's just not realistic in both real terms of tool usage not financial terms of the companies offering them. Now a limited lifetime warranty I can see being more honest and useful.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[monomach]

What other thread?

On the first page of your thread, some guy said they wouldn't warranty his 30 year old ratchet, so he sold all of his Proto.

 

[ihateminimumwage]

Lifetime Warranty: If it breaks, they send someone to kill you.

That would be a surefire way to put an end to tool abuse and quite a bit of internet bitching.

 

[Spudland_Dave]

IMO, trying to warranty some ancient tool you bought second hand, is ********. And I feel behavior like that caused the decline of craftsman. I never thought craftsman was amazing, but they affordable, available, and stood behind their product.... maybe too well?

These warranty threads come up often and are always good reads

Ultimately I feel that there is more to the whole picture which is in "grayscale" vs Black & White...people seem to want a clear cut policy but I think thats unfair. I'm fine with "Grayscale" Warranty. Probably why I prefer the whole tool truck thing as well.

One thing I WILL agree with though is I agree with you 2ndGearRubber...I think that those people who rummage thru garage sales or flea markets looking for broken tools for pennies with the sole purpose of warranty are whats wrong with America today.

On the other hand, last summer I had a rebuild kit put into a 1/4" SnapOn Ratchet which belonged to my grandfather, Date stamp of 1952 on it. He was MORE then happy to put it in there and he knew full well it was my grandfathers (told him he didnt HAVE to service it). I didnt pull the wool over his eyes, he was more then happy to service me.