Light won't turn off or pops circuit.

[thickhead]

Just got a call from MIL about new to her condo.

Two switches for kitchen ceiling light.

Switch 1: turns light on and off fine.

Switch 2: if 1 and light are on, up and down with 2 leaves light on. If 1 and light are off, up and down on 2 pops breaker.


What is causing this to happen?

 

[James-W]

Obviously it is wired wrong.

 

[astroracer]

The condo should have a maintenance dept.... Call them. This is not your issue.
Mark

 

[thickhead]

That's no help. I'm not going over there guys.

But, what's going on with the circuit?

 

[sublimate]

What is causing this to happen?

Someone replaced a 3-way switch with a normal switch.

 

[DC73]

Someone replaced a 3-way switch with a normal switch.

If this is not it, then there's a direct short somewhere in the circuit. Could be a bad switch. I'd pull both switches from their boxes and inspect for any obvious wiring issues, burnt places (signs of arcing), etc. If everything looks good, you could swap the two switches. If the problem moves with the switch, replace that switch. If there are no obvious problems in either switch box and both switches prove to be okay, then the problem is in the wiring somewhere.

DC

 

[James-W]

Someone replaced a 3-way switch with a normal switch.

That's possible, but the opening poster said, "Just got a call from MIL about new to her condo". That is not very clear, but I took it to mean the condo is brand new. If it is a new condo then I would assume it was wired wrong. But if it isn't a new condo then anything is possible.

 

[thickhead]

Condo is not new, she is new to it.

 

[Norcal]

3-way is miss-wired, whoever did it did not pay attention to which terminal was common.

 

[alfredeneuman]

And due to that miswiring, may mistaken the neutral white wire with a white wire, which is hot coming from the 3 way.

The Code that says it must be remarked as hot (tape, etc) was only enacted in 2008.

 

[sublimate]

How good is her eyesight?
Have her look closely at the 2 switches - regular switches often say "on" & "off" in small letters on the switch lever (but not always). 3-way switches do not.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

I don't mean to further complicate things, but I have a thought or two.

1. Did this just start happening, or has it been this way since the first time she tried the switch? If it just started, it's not miswired. Call maintenence before there is a fire.

2. Was the property inspected and if so, does the inspection have any sort of warranty for accuracy?

3. Did the property come with any sort of a warranty?


Just some things to keep in mind when the finger pointing starts.

Tommy

 

[ctfjr]

And due to that miswiring, may mistaken the neutral white wire with a white wire, which is hot coming from the 3 way.

The Code that says it must be remarked as hot (tape, etc) was only enacted in 2008.

I think this ^^^ is the winner
Eliminating the possibility of a wire actually shorting out, that leaves the 3-way being wired incorrectly - the neutral is connected to one of the switched sides.

The three terminals on a 3-way are all essentially 'hot', there should be no common on the switch.

 

[Mustang51js]

Either that or there's two separate feeds but that would cause both breakers to trip.

 

[Norcal]

I think this ^^^ is the winner
Eliminating the possibility of a wire actually shorting out, that leaves the 3-way being wired incorrectly - the neutral is connected to one of the switched sides.

The three terminals on a 3-way are all essentially 'hot', there should be no common on the switch.

The darker screw is a common on a 3-way switch, but you are referring to the neutral/grounded conductor as a common.

 

[justsam]

There is no combination of miswiring, (all the right wires but in wrong places), that will trip a breaker.

There has to be a wrong wire in play, such as neutral or ground as others have pointed out.

So it must always been like this or a wiring short has developed.

 

[thickhead]

Simplify this for me, why does switch 1 make it work correctly and switch 2 make it all go fubar'd?

 

[nehog]

The condo should have a maintenance dept.... Call them. This is not your issue.
Mark

Condo, not apartment. Condos are owned property and anything inside is the owner's full responsibility. Only common areas are maintained by the association.

 

[ard]

Did prior owner pull out a personal dining room fixture and replace it with a generic one? I could see a bonehead doing that and crossing a traveler for neutral.

Draw a diagram of how they work, all the words in the world will not help.

I suspect that a neutral is attached to one switch. WHen they switch is NOT on the neutral the other switch turns it on and off. But when the first switch is connected to the neutral the other switch, when flipped, connects power to neutral- pop.

Diagram....

 

[wyliesdiesels]

How about posting some pics....short of that we are all just guessing! Could be a number of things!

 

[n8n]

Simplify this for me, why does switch 1 make it work correctly and switch 2 make it all go fubar'd?

That's probably where either a neutral and a white traveler got confused, or a bare neutral is touching one of the traveler screws at that switch.

Sent from my XT897 using Tapatalk

 

[thickhead]

Thanks for the input all.
I'll let her get it sorted with an electrician tomorrow - just told her to leave the circuit off for now.

 

[FordTruckWench]

I'll let her get it sorted with an electrician tomorrow - just told her to leave the circuit off for now.

Have the electrician install new switches. The lifespan of the contacts may now be seriously compromised - they aren't made to routinely handle a short circuit current, especially not right as the contacts "make" the circuit.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

OP do u have an update?

 

[thickhead]

I did not talk to the electrician, but he told MIL that it was wired incorrectly from day one.
Gave her a couple new switches and corrected the error.

Sorry no better details, but it is corrected.