Little help with 50A generator inlet (SS2-50P, CS6375)

[dcg9381]

So substantial power outage today and I needed to power up the shop via generator. Have the interlock kit in, tested, everything wired up. Good to go? Sure. Nope. I didn't test the whole deal.


I'm using the following generator inlet box.



The generator cord is 50-Amp Generator Extension Cord, 125/250V, Inline NEMA 14-50P to SS2-50R Twist Lock Connector. Only this thing won't "fit" in the inlet box, goes in about 1/4, won't twist. It also lacks the "threaded collar". I don't see any other way to allign it and keep the ground-ground contact.

There is a center guide pin on this, which looks OK, but I did pull it out, no change on seating... That seems to be the "cord" side difference between CS63564 and SS2-50R.







I see a designation that CS6375 as a 50A 125/250V flanged inlet, while listings for CS6364/SS2-50R describe it as the matching female locking connector.

Trying to figure out what I did wrong before I throw another $100 at a 50A generator cord...

 

[wyliesdiesels]

first off, that inlet is only rated to 10awg which is way too small for 50a. what size wire did you use?

what is the model # on the inlet box?

 

[dcg9381]

first off, that inlet is only rated to 10awg which is way too small for 50a. what size wire did you use?

I didn't catch that in the spec, but I think it's a china typo. It's wired with 6ga copper, no problem getting the wires to clamp.

what is the model # on the inlet box?

I don't see a model on it..

 

[tool_scrounge]

I find that NOS Hubble brand plugs on eBay are the best quality for a reasonable price

 

[yatg]

(obvious) You need to figure out where the interference is.

Take the cover flap off the box and see if you can plug it in.

If that doesn't work, take the inlet out of the box and try to plug in the cord so you can see exactly what's going on.
(more obvious) the prongs of the inlet need to match the connector, and there's grooves and bumps on the cord connector that need to match with the inlet socket.

CS6375 (inlet(plug)) and CS6354 (cord(receptacle)) are compatible with each other.
The SS50R is supposed to be the same as CS6354.

The CS refers to "California Style". Which amounts to having that center pin. Its not connected to anything.

See if there are any numbers on the inlet or cord connector.

Post close up pictures of your inlet prongs and the front face of your cord connector.

Diagrams from Leviton.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

maybe buy one that has a threaded collar

https://www.amazon.com/PlugSaf-Generator-Extension-Yellow-SS2-50R/dp/B0CWH9TFML/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[Chuckster in NJ]

Big question here…….. Does the generator have a floating neutral (aka: floating ground)?

Google Search

 

[wyliesdiesels]

floating ground and floating neutral are not the same thing

 

[dcg9381]

Big question here…….. Does the generator have a floating neutral (aka: floating ground)?

I understand what/why you're asking, doesn't help me solve THIS problem. But to answer that:
Firman T07571. I believe has a factory-bonded neutral. I power up the shop at a sub-panel that isn't bonded, so I think I'm good to go on that.

maybe buy one that has a threaded collar

Yea, so I threw money at it. Threaded collar works. I still haven't figured out what I did wrong in the "planning" phase, other than not test the cables when they came in...

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Firman T07571. I believe has a factory-bonded neutral. I power up the shop at a sub-panel that isn't bonded, so I think I'm good to go on that.

This is incorrect. neutral should only be bonded in one place which is at the first means of disconnect or main service panel. you SHOULD NOT have a bonded neutral on a generator that is connected to an electrical service with a bonded neutral unless the neutral is switched, which only occurs with a transfer switch with switch neutral. an interlock does not do this.

you need to unbond the neutral on the generator.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Yea, so I threw money at it. Threaded collar works. I still haven't figured out what I did wrong in the "planning" phase, other than not test the cables when they came in...

does that new cord have a ground connection point on the plug?

 

[dcg9381]

does that new cord have a ground connection point on the plug?

It does.. about 7-8 o'clock in the photo.

 

[PCustoms]

does that new cord have a ground connection point on the plug?

It does.. about 7-8 o'clock in the photo.

Am I missing something here?

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Am I missing something here?

yes. the ground connection is a plate of metal on the plug and a plate of metal inside the inlet. cant see it in these pics but if you google the inlet and plug im sure pics of the ground connection will be shown

its an odd design compared to typical nema plug setups

 

[PCustoms]

yes. the ground connection is a plate of metal on the plug and a plate of metal inside the inlet. cant see it in these pics but if you google the inlet and plug im sure pics of the ground connection will be shown

I thought I read earlier that the center pin was ground, guess I mis remembered.

Carry on

 

[Chuckster in NJ]

I understand what/why you're asking, doesn't help me solve THIS problem. But to answer that:
Firman T07571. I believe has a factory-bonded neutral. I power up the shop at a sub-panel that isn't bonded, so I think I'm good to go on that.

PLEASE watch the video I linked in my post #7 before you plug this is in…….. Everything is explained in simple terms.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

PLEASE watch the video I linked in my post #7 before you plug this is in…….. Everything is explained in simple terms.

your link in #7 goes to a google search not a video.

 

[PCustoms]

your link in #7 goes to a google search not a video.

Opens this for me:

Check out this video, "what is a floating ground on a generator youtube" https://share.google/XRuDmMvunABPPJ40I

 

[dcg9381]

PLEASE watch the video I linked in my post #7 before you plug this is in…….. Everything is explained in simple terms.

@Chuckster I watched the video, thanks..

• I have a generator with bonded neutral
• My "interlock" just does the hots
• Because I'm powering up an unbonded sub-panel, I'm good to go there, but because upstream the main is bonded, bonding at the generator is a no-no.
  
  

So the generator needs to have the bond removed when powering up my building.

 

[Chuckster in NJ]

Opens this for me:

Check out this video, "what is a floating ground on a generator youtube" https://share.google/XRuDmMvunABPPJ40I

That’s the one!……… Thanks!

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Opens this for me:

Check out this video, "what is a floating ground on a generator youtube" https://share.google/XRuDmMvunABPPJ40I

how about just posting the youtube link? it works better

 

[PCustoms]

how about just posting the youtube link? it works better

I did, by clicking the share button and posting the link.

No idea why it formatted it that way. Edit: got something to do with the way it was originally posted, now that link doesn't work

 

[dave*99]

I did, by clicking the share button and posting the link.

No idea why it formatted it that way. Edit: got something to do with the way it was originally posted, now that link doesn't work

Perhaps you used the share button on Google rather than the share button on the YouTube video itself?

 

[Treeman]

I just went through this mess. The California Standard CS6375/CS6364 vs. NEMA SS2-50P/SS2-50R conundrum can create brain fatigue. In my case the electrician installed "true" CS6375 inlet boxes (no screw collar threads), so I matched my pre-made cord ends with "true" CS6364.

The center pin seems to be the main difference along with the locking screw collar. The conundrum is that manufacturers seem to offer hybrid dual labeled components to allow both systems to work together..........or maybe not.

Your first set up should have worked. Remember that the side grounds align AFTER you twist lock it.I found that I had to give the cord a forceful push to get it past some resistance, allowing it to fully seat into the box and then twist lock. Maybe Chinese quality control came into play also.


RE the ground discussion: My Generac 8917 does NOT have the floating neutral, so my transfer switches have to be the type that switches the neutrals.

 

[theoldwizard1]

"Typical" generator inlet are L14-20R/P (L for locking, R for receptacle, P for plug) or L14-30R/P.

SS2-50 is common in the marine world !

 

[Treeman]

"Typical" generator inlet are L14-20R/P (L for locking, R for receptacle, P for plug) or L14-30R/P.

SS2-50 is common in the marine world !

It "should" be that simple, but it's not when you buy factory pre-built boxes and cords. The whole CS vs. NEMA thing is all muddled up.

Take a peek: https://acworks.com/collections

 

[mm08822]

It "should" be that simple, but it's not when you buy factory pre-built boxes and cords. The whole CS vs. NEMA thing is all muddled up.

Take a peek: https://acworks.com/collections

I would have chosen a PIB with an L14-xxP and not bothered with CSanythings.

 

[dcg9381]

The center pin seems to be the main difference along with the locking screw collar. The conundrum is that manufacturers seem to offer hybrid dual labeled components to allow both systems to work together..........or maybe not.

I can remove the center pin just pulls out - that didn't fix it, box looks like it would take a center pin.

Your first set up should have worked. Remember that the side grounds align AFTER you twist lock it.I found that I had to give the cord a forceful push to get it past some resistance, allowing it to fully seat into the box and then twist lock. Maybe Chinese quality control came into play also.

Thanks.. I've tried it all sorts of ways, including clocking it slightly off the ground side. No bueno. New cord solved it (with threaded collar), despite the 4.5+ star reviews, I'm chalking this up to some sort of Chinesium issue.

 

[yatg]

You've narrowed it down to the female cord ends.

How about some close up pictures of each, front and sides.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I would have chosen a PIB with an L14-xxP and not bothered with CSanythings.

agreed. tried and true!

 

[dave*99]

I would have chosen a PIB with an L14-xxP and not bothered with CSanythings.

I have the L14-30 on my inlet. But how do you handle a 50A inlet? I didn’t see options beyond SS and CS styles?

 

[mm08822]

I have the L14-30 on my inlet. But how do you handle a 50A inlet? I didn’t see options beyond SS and CS styles?

You bring up a very good point.....L14's stop at 30A. There aren't any L14-50R/P's. PIBs I'm aware of are all locking style, too. So therein seems to be the reason for using CS style for 50A PIBs!
(Any generator project I've done over 30A has been hard-wiring fixed standby units, so never looked for a higher rated PIB.)

 

[yatg]

You could use an L14-50P on a short pigtail out of a box.
But only if you have an interlock.
The plug won't be connected to the bus unless the main is off and its breaker is flipped.

Repurpose an old 3R panel and you can keep the cord in the panel while its not in use.
IOW, gut the panel and install a jbox and the cord in the weatherproof panel,

 

[mm08822]

You could use an L14-50P on a short pigtail out of a box.
But only if you have an interlock.
The plug won't be connected to the bus unless the main is off and its breaker is flipped.

Repurpose an old 3R panel and you can keep the cord in the panel while its not in use.
IOW, gut the panel and install a jbox and the cord in the weatherproof panel,

got a part number for the L14-50P?? Or do you mean 14-50P? (Read my post above)

The suggested installation wouldn't pass an inspection.

 

[yatg]

got a part number for the L14-50P?? Or do you mean 14-50P? (Read my post above)

I guess not. It seems like it should exist, but it doesn't. It references the CS equivalent.

The suggested installation wouldn't pass an inspection.

Por que?

 

[theoldwizard1]

I have the L14-30 on my inlet. But how do you handle a 50A inlet? I didn’t see options beyond SS and CS styles?

There is a non-locking 14-50R/P. If there is a locking version, I can't find it !

50A @ 240V is (approx) 12,000W !!!

 

[mm08822]

There is a non-locking 14-50R/P. If there is a locking version, I can't find it !

50A @ 240V is (approx) 12,000W !!!

Not shown in NEMA charts or on mfr websites.

 

[mm08822]

I guess not. It seems like it should exist, but it doesn't. It references the CS equivalent.



Por que?

Why? You are using hardware in a way it isnt listed.
Secondly, how could you install that at a customer's place with a straight face?

 

[dcg9381]

You could use an L14-50P on a short pigtail out of a box.
But only if you have an interlock.

Would that work? Yes.
Is that legal? I can't imagine that it's legal, but can't cite code. Having a "male" plug hanging out of any sort of panel, even if the hots were disconnected sounds like a terrible idea.

You've narrowed it down to the female cord ends.
How about some close up pictures of each, front and sides.

I'll take some photos if you guys want to chase it a little further, but correcting the cord to one with a threaded collar (NEMA SS2-50R Twist Lock) and it dropped right in..

 

[dave*99]

There is a non-locking 14-50R/P. If there is a locking version, I can't find it !

50A @ 240V is (approx) 12,000W !!!

Yes and that is what you find in the generator end of things. I'm referring to the house end. I only see SS and CS types in an inlet housing.

My question was prompted by this statement:

I would have chosen a PIB with an L14-xxP and not bothered with CSanythings.

Seems the availability of compliant parts forces one into SS/CS when you need a 50A PIB.

Even a generator with a 32A output often has a 14-50R on it's panel. So the cable and PIB is what the OP used. Not that I know his generator, this is just an example.