Looking for free heat

[schultzy]

Hi Guys,
I have an idea in my head and need some expert input. I plan on building a house next spring with a detached Garage. I am thinking about placing some PEX in the Floor, Digging some trenches behind the Garage as deep as I can get, adding more PEX, bringing everything together properly in the garage and run a solar type pump to get the system to flow. My Dad has a small pump on his boiler system in the house and I was wondering if Solar power would be gfeasible to run something like that.
On the garage I have now I built a passive solar system-

http://www.motherearthnews.com/renewable-energy/solar-air-heater-zmaz06djzraw.aspx#axzz3Gwqho1KS

and was quite impressed with the results. On a sunny day the Garage gets up to 60 degrees most of the day. I kept a little electric oil heater on at night just to keep things above freezing.

Whats wrong with my way of thinking? Will something like my idea work as a booster or am I wasting my nickels?

 

[Charles (in GA)]

First off, update your profile to include your location, it will show under your screen name on the left of the post, at least tell us what state you are in.

Charles

 

[theoldwizard1]

The ground is an INFINITE source of constant 55F "heat". Almost no amount of energy can change that, which is why under slab insulation is so important.

If you like 55F (+/- 5F) then you are all set.

 

[pseudorealityx]

The ground is an INFINITE source of constant 55F "heat". Almost no amount of energy can change that, which is why under slab insulation is so important.

If you like 55F (+/- 5F) then you are all set.

You can certainly change that if you attempt to extract/add enough energy into a small enough area. That's why having a geotechnical person design a geothermal field is really important. You will

 

[schultzy]

First, I am a little south of the Windy City in Illinois. I understand and will insulate the slab. I would be happy if a pump would keep the slab at a constant 55 degrees. My question now is what kind of pump will be strong enough to run this and will work off of Solar Power?

 

[James-W]

If you are happy with the 55 degrees and don't mind running the electric heater at night, then this will work out OK for you. But I can't help thinking that if natural gas is available, you would be better off with a natural gas boiler, or heater, whichever route you decide to go. You would be able to turn the heat up or down as needed, and the cost of natural gas is very reasonable. Not saying your idea isn't good, just giving you an alternative to consider.

 

[MadMechMaster]

I'd like to see where this goes. We get the same weather, and 55° in the winter would be just fine.

 

[creativecars]

If you have trees??/
What about an outside wood boiler to bump the water temp temp up a bit more?

 

[Wuaname]

You can take all our heat in Florida! LOL

 

[buddyboy]

if you are happy with 55 then don't insulate the slab, insultate the foundation walls, the garage walls, and ceiling.

let that 'heat' come up out of the ground, and into the slab and then into your space.

better yet bury the whole structure all six sides exposed to the earth below the frost line.

lol

 

[pseudorealityx]

This all depends on how deep the slab is. I can tell you that my garage floor in Georgia gets colder than 55 degrees in the winter, and we have very mild winters compared with Illinois...

 

[Sureshot]

If your slab is 55 during the day it won't require additional heat to keep from freezing. Maybe look at some of the solar possibilities to further heat the slab during the daytime.

 

[Chitown_hillbilly]

This all depends on how deep the slab is. I can tell you that my garage floor in Georgia gets colder than 55 degrees in the winter, and we have very mild winters compared with Illinois...

You missed what he's trying to do. He basically setting up a Geothermal heating system for in floor heat, but instead of using a Heat Pump to raise the temp, he's satisfied with Deep ground temp of around 55*. And instead of using an electric circulation pump he would like to use one that is powered by Solar (I guess it's still electric, just not electricity from the grid).

 

[-Brent-]

Interesting.

I don't know much about much but what came to mind was also adding the capability to solar heat the water running through the PEX. It's done for pool water but I don't know if it's feasible for winter use.

 

[Denwood]

Have a read on this: http://www.latitude51solar.ca/solar-school/references/85-wayne-larsen-big-bar-lake-bc

He's heating a large space in a cold climate, but using a well insulated plastic tank (1700 liters) to store heat from a whopping 3 evacuated tube arrays. Maybe less excavation expense as well. The panels are much more efficient this way.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

First, I am a little south of the Windy City in Illinois.

Thank you, it makes it much easier for people to make educated recommendations and suggestions. Some people (like myself) don't like to reveal their exact town, but even "NW Illinois" will do if you have any concerns.

Charles

 

[schultzy]

Chitown_hillbilly gets it! My plan was or is to use an environmentally safe RV antifreeze and just keep it pumping in a continuous loop year round.
I dont want to use any plastic tanks as that will take up too much space in the Garage unless I bury it. I will have to deal with village inspectors on this so there might be some problems.
The property is a little tight (1/4 acre) so any large excavation would be impossible, however, I have no problem renting a mini excavator and doing the work myself.
So next question is..... what kind of pump?

 

[CNGsaves]

This is interesting and feasible idea. One more twist I'd add is whether you could supplement with ON ROOF solar heating of a portion of loop during the day?? Would gravity effect of water running downhill assist the pump once the water was moving?? Thus, start with 55 degree fluid from geothermal field, then up to roof for solar blast of heat, and finally to slab of garage for heat. At night when no sunlight, then that portion of loop would be shutoff.

I've got old passive "air" solar heater on roof (approx 5' x 12') that I'd like to convert & stuff full of tubing that would provide hot water tank with pre-heated water, thus lower the delta of change HWH had to overcome.

 

[schultzy]

I have excellent southern exposure and plan on installing a passive solar heat system that is also on my Garage now

http://www.motherearthnews.com/renewable-energy/solar-air-heater-zmaz06djzraw.aspx#axzz3Gwqho1KS

I think it would be a great booster.

I did a search for circulation pumps and came up with this so far

http://www.ussolarpumps.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=71

 

[larry_g]

So next question is..... what kind of pump?

A wind mill given your location.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[xtremek]

I get what you're asking, but isn't it more about what powers the pump? Are you looking for a solar panel to power the pump? There are all kinds of 12v pumps out there. Check out Hotfr8's "The Beast Runs" thread. He just put one on his Falcon. I bet you can find them dirt cheap on Summit racing or Speedway Motors.

 

[JCByrd24]

if you are happy with 55 then don't insulate the slab, insultate the foundation walls, the garage walls, and ceiling.

let that 'heat' come up out of the ground, and into the slab and then into your space.

This combined with a passive solar structure (well insulated and with windows facing south) will likely do exactly what you want without any of the excavation/pex/pumps. A shop is the perfect application for passive solar.

The solar air heaters you posted would also help, but just windows I think would be better as the sun would warm the slab/ground under the slab instead of just the air.

Design overhangs so in the summer you don't roast in there.

Once you have this any type of heater would easily get you to 65 or 70 degrees when you are out there working if you want.

 

[pseudorealityx]

You missed what he's trying to do. He basically setting up a Geothermal heating system for in floor heat, but instead of using a Heat Pump to raise the temp, he's satisfied with Deep ground temp of around 55*. And instead of using an electric circulation pump he would like to use one that is powered by Solar (I guess it's still electric, just not electricity from the grid).

Yes... but a 55 degree slab does not mean you'll have a 55 degree garage. If the OP understands that, then cool.

 

[schultzy]

I feel that if I can keep the slab at 55 Degrees any type of booster system will get me where I want to be in temperature.

Though I did think that a 55 degree slab meant a 55 degree garage.

 

[bmxdukie]

I feel that if I can keep the slab at 55 Degrees any type of booster system will get me where I want to be in temperature.

Though I did think that a 55 degree slab meant a 55 degree garage.

Does this mean the slab will be 55 degrees regardless of outside temp?
I think I should do this when I build my next garage.. I am near ottawa ontario Canada.

 

[walrus]

Good luck on the free heat, my slab is heated with solar. 53 degrees today in slab, shop was 45.

 

[Autorotica]

if you are happy with 55 then don't insulate the slab, insulate the foundation walls, the garage walls, and ceiling.

let that 'heat' come up out of the ground, and into the slab and then into your space.

This is what I am going with my "shed". Can anyone share their experience with this approach?

Thanks!
Chris

 

[toplessHO]

I get what you're asking, but isn't it more about what powers the pump? Are you looking for a solar panel to power the pump? There are all kinds of 12v pumps out there. Check out Hotfr8's "The Beast Runs" thread. He just put one on his Falcon. I bet you can find them dirt cheap on Summit racing or Speedway Motors.

I ve used 120v hot water circulation pump. Most other pumps wont give the head pressure needed and will not stand up to hot water.
March is a good one as well as Grundfos.
while not free look into a ground source heat pump