Looking for tool recommendations for.... daughter starting electrical apprenticeship!!
- Thread starter Chukster
- Start date
I agree with you, Meursault. It just seems .. weird. I've run across a few people like that myself. These are the people that become 'Manager Without A Clue' There are plenty of families that don't have any mechanical abilities, seemingly for generations. On the other hand, I know one guy who has exactly zero mechanical ability, nada, zilch, but his 2 sons are on their way to being wizards. Must've gotten it from their grandfather on their mother's side.
I don't have to worry about that with my DD; she's been taking stuff apart her whole life, and early on figuring out how to put things back together so they work again. Proud dad.
It's good money. And the skills are all teachable. No body is born knowing how to use a screwdriver, we all have to learn. Same with the skills of the trade, they're all taught.
Not having experience repairing things isn't necessarily from lack of interest, it can be from an environment where the belief is that only wizards can fix things. (I had a girlfriend whose parent's house had a front door they hadn't used her whole life because the doorknob didn't work. Her dad (an engineer: he drove trains) was sure it was going to cost lots of money to fix, so it never got fixed. I bought a cheap one at the hardware store, and installed it in an hour, having never done it before, and having to borrow tools from a neighbor. )
kngelv
Well-known member
To get an apprenticeship here you have to already be an employee. You used to take a test but they changed it a few years ago. Too many people did ok on the test but really struggled with the 38 school credits. Now you take three community college classes in manufacturing technologies. If you pass them with a C or better you then go on a list based on your seniority and the year you completed classes. They did this to make sure people could complete the classes. Some of them had not taken any kind of class in over 20 years and really had trouble.
James
James
Meursault74
Well-known member
Almost everything is teachable. But usually, people have certain traits that incline them to do certain jobs. If the guy at 42 didn't know how to use a screwdriver, it seems he didn't have the desire to learn. If he had a home and a car there was a time to use one before that.
I wonder what the guy was doing before he became an apprentice.
msharley
Well-known member
Two pair of COMFORTABLE COMPOSITE TOE work boots.
Wear one pair today, the other pair tomorrow.
Boots last much longer this way.
For home? She may want a boot dryer.
GOOD SOCKS! Always keep a spare pair of socks in her "drag bag"! Never know when your feet are going to get wet...
Particularly if working in a Nuke or in the "High Voltage Suit". (profuse sweating is required)
sparky 1971
Well-known member
I remember this from my Navy days. required to carry around a small 4"x2" pocket notebook and pen as part of the uniform when on board. get her in the habit of having it to take notes, sketch diagrams, and whatever.
ZRX61
Well-known member
In the UK there's no way in hell anyone of that age would be offered an apprenticeship. If ya don't have one lined up by 18, you're done. I started right out of HS at 16.
Dagny
Well-known member
lenox saw klien everything else except adjustable wrench get bacho fluke testers.
Bockscar
Well-known member
The job market is totally different nowadays....plus there are not any lifers anymore....my Dad worked at the same company for 47 years .....there isn't hardly anyone doing that now.....so if they start at 42....whats really the difference than 18.....
catalytic
Well-known member
Biggest recommendation: Have some custom vinyl decals made with her name and phone number on them. Won't stop thieves, but really helps with 'sortof' accidental tool borrowings. I have one on most pieces of equipment that I use around other people.
I really love my Ideal Stripmaster automatic wire stripper---not expensive, USA-made, and works great---soooo much quicker and easier than a standard big box store wire stripper.
Also, looking at your list, I would really want some insulated screwdrivers in different sizes (having only 2 means you'll always have the wrong size, which *****). I would also add one insulated pliers. Insulation means you have to worry less about her exploding while she's learning and around other beginners---if it were my family, I would definitely go for that.
Hacksaw doesn't matter so much, but the blades do. Get Lennox blades or something good---way, way easier to cut with.
I think others have pretty well covered the brands. I have switched to mostly Knipex and some Wiha, but I wouldn't take them into an apprenticeship unless I really liked the people I worked with.
Last thing---get her some eye protection that is comfortable for her face so she'll actually wear it. Especially around beginners who are snipping wires! I like 3m.
I really love my Ideal Stripmaster automatic wire stripper---not expensive, USA-made, and works great---soooo much quicker and easier than a standard big box store wire stripper.
Also, looking at your list, I would really want some insulated screwdrivers in different sizes (having only 2 means you'll always have the wrong size, which *****). I would also add one insulated pliers. Insulation means you have to worry less about her exploding while she's learning and around other beginners---if it were my family, I would definitely go for that.
Hacksaw doesn't matter so much, but the blades do. Get Lennox blades or something good---way, way easier to cut with.
I think others have pretty well covered the brands. I have switched to mostly Knipex and some Wiha, but I wouldn't take them into an apprenticeship unless I really liked the people I worked with.
Last thing---get her some eye protection that is comfortable for her face so she'll actually wear it. Especially around beginners who are snipping wires! I like 3m.
ArcReactorKC
Well-known member
I will chime in on the folding rule. In my previous life as an electrician I did almost 100% industrial work. Bending 80% rigid, and 20% emt. My folding rule was my best friend, although I stopped using wood and went fiberglass/plastic around 2007. Milwaukee makes a fantastic folding ruler. It is also non-conductive, I've used it recently in switchgear to measure live bus to determine actual current ratings. Cheap, solid, and repeatable https://www.homedepot.com/p/Milwauk...2-la_e92WLLOODAxxEsaAumnEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
I switched from Klein strippers to the Ideal T-strippers in 2005. They always seemed sharper and required less pressure to make a clean strip. Although now instead of carrying linemans and strippers I carry a pair of J2158CR pliers, it's the best of all worlds, screw cutting/threading, crimping, stripping, and still fantastic linemans nose for gripping.
I highly suggest them just to carry one less tool and drop some weight. It's been a long time since I wore my bags but I would have loved to had these back then
EDIT: Came back to add, if she has any chance of working with larger conduit e.g. 2" rigid and larger. Don't get smaller channelocks, go with 440's from the jump, they will reliably grip 2" pipe the 420's will just be frustrating as the jaws are slightly too short if I remember correctly.
I switched from Klein strippers to the Ideal T-strippers in 2005. They always seemed sharper and required less pressure to make a clean strip. Although now instead of carrying linemans and strippers I carry a pair of J2158CR pliers, it's the best of all worlds, screw cutting/threading, crimping, stripping, and still fantastic linemans nose for gripping.
I highly suggest them just to carry one less tool and drop some weight. It's been a long time since I wore my bags but I would have loved to had these back then
Klein Tools 8 in. Hybrid Pliers with Crimper J2158CRSEN - The Home Depot
Strip, cut, twist, shear and crimp with the selections of this Klein Tools Hybrid Pliers with Crimper. Designed for more cutting power.
www.homedepot.com
EDIT: Came back to add, if she has any chance of working with larger conduit e.g. 2" rigid and larger. Don't get smaller channelocks, go with 440's from the jump, they will reliably grip 2" pipe the 420's will just be frustrating as the jaws are slightly too short if I remember correctly.
Well, it's a good thing we're not in the UK. We're in the US. Just in case that wasn't clear the first time around.
depending on type of electrician. (residential. commercial, industrial. construction, service, maintenance) tools will vary a bit. I have been in the trade for over 30 years and these are the tools I carry with me. Power tools, pipe benders, and test equipment are also near by.
ZRX61
Well-known member
I wasn't aware your daughter was 42.
ZRX61
Well-known member
Return on investment from training them. A proper apprenticeship varies between 8,000-10,000 hours. Some are 50/50 OJT/Classes, some are 100% OJT. The Germans have a great system where they start kids out at 14yo working/training part time while still in school.
She's not 42. I never said how old she is. Someone else mentioned 42.
Although she is a longtime fan of Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy. :-D
ZRX61
Well-known member
Took a welding layout & blueprint class at the local college, Two nights a week for 16 weeks (128 hours total). 12 weeks into it we still had guys who couldn't read a 6in scale accurately.
ZRX61
Well-known member
That's what I was thinking.
Bockscar
Well-known member
Again my point stands the return on investment probably is better with the older person.....younger folks change jobs a lot more so say the older person has 25 more years to work vs 50 for the 18 yo the time in the company may be the same.....the chance that 18 yo stays isn't any better than the older person in my experience
ZRX61
Well-known member
Around here, neither Lockheed or Northrop will hire anyone with more than three years experience to work on the F35, B21 & RQ-4 lines. Apparently based on "they already learned other ways to do things the way we want them to"
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Jmellc
Well-known member
I once worked with a guy who had been a lab tech of some sort. Had to find something else when his company shut down. Fairly intelligent but not really cut out for electrical construction. He did OK with some tools but never got the hang of channelocks, which way to hold them to bite the pipe well. Clumsy with a hacksaw.
I used to see young guys using small screwdrivers for huge screws and large ones for small screws. Would break hole saw bits by letting the saw slam into the metal.
Husky will do, lifetime warranty and less chance of getting stolen or " borrowed". Spray paint the tools pink!
alinc100
Well-known member
I'll throw 2 cents in on the tape measure. As a Union Carpenter for the last 37 years I really like the Lufkin Nite Eye tape measure in 16 ft and 25 ft. I carry the 16' daily and the 25' is in my tool bag/cart steps away when needed. I like the neon green visibility. It also functions well with the green laser I use daily.
For those that did not read through the thread fully anyone who suggests an IBEW apprentice brings power tools/cordless battery tool;s to a job, would be very shocked to find out that is a HUGE no-no. Power Tools regardless of brand/use are provided by the contractor.
For those that did not read through the thread fully anyone who suggests an IBEW apprentice brings power tools/cordless battery tool;s to a job, would be very shocked to find out that is a HUGE no-no. Power Tools regardless of brand/use are provided by the contractor.
several posts deleted to remove uncalled for and quoted remarks
I banned the sexist guy permanently… not interested in hosting that kind of person.
Half-fast eddie
Well-known member
I need to clean my glasses. I thought you said you banned the **** guy … but i still had access …
ArcReactorKC
Well-known member
This is what keeps me frequenting the GJ, when things turn crazy it gets righted.
Edit: even if it it's me being the crazy!
This is what keeps me frequenting the GJ, when things turn crazy it gets righted.
Edit: even if it it's me being the crazy!
We try super hard, but still make mistakes…
We typically give people one week bans for one-time rule breaking… The one exception to that is racism, sexism, or any other “ism” where one person thinks they are better than another.
I have zero interest in hosting people like that…
and the culprit came back with a new alias to argue his point... guess he's gone too .
kngelv
Well-known member
To the OP. What did you end up getting for your daughter?
James
James
cvairwerks
Well-known member
Good luck to your daughter. A couple words of advice to her. Check her feelings at the site gate. A some point she’ll get yelled at over something she did or didn’t do. Take it in stride and learn from it. Read and know the rules and contracts she will be working under. If she doesn’t understand something, ask the lead or her union rep. Be a team player and do the best she can at what work she gets assigned. Don’t ever be afraid to say she doesn’t know something or how to do a task, but as time passes, don’t fall back on it. When there is down time on the job, take that time to learn new things.
Jmellc
Well-known member
Good hacksaws are hard to find, even with expensive ones. Traditional Klein and Craftsman saws were excellent, the type with the top threaded bar and nut. Most had storage in the tube as well. Get at least 1 blade, 32 teeth per inch. Much easier to cut EMT and other metals she will normally see. 24 TPI are common but hard to cut with. They are better for rebar or heavy rod.
Knife. Klein 44004 is the best I've ever had. Sheepfoot blade is razor sharp and does a good job on cable skinning and general use. Has lockback for safety. Easy to sharpen. Hunt Electric Supply is the only consistent supplier I have seen for this knife but it is worth the trouble. But do not pry with it. Blade will snap.
Large screwdriver, about 1/4 or 5/16 square shank, 4-6 inches generally best.
3/16 cabinet tip screwdriver for switches and receptables, other small screws. 4 inch generally good.
#2 Phillips is by far most common. Again about 4 inches.
Avoid Craftsman. Their screwdrivers have been junk for years. Klein is good, Husky or Kobalt are fairly good and less costly.
A 10 in 1 is good as a back up or for odd bits but pieces are easy to lose and they are heavy. I have an 11 in 1 Klein, also have a Klein stubby multi pocket driver. It can be good at times.
Channellocks. 2 pairs of 430's are good starters. Good for 1/2 to 1 inch EMT fittings. Stick with Channellock brand. Others are hit & miss. May later need some 440's for larger fittings. 426 "babylocks" are great for working threaded rod. She will see as she learns.
6 foot wood ruler. Get a yellow or beige one, not a white one. White ones are bricklayer type, not useful for electricians. Some have a slider tip on one end that is very useful.
Side cutters. 9 inch Klein D213. If bare handled, get pair of red grips to put on with hot water. Channellock are good too, not as costly.
Tool Bag, Box. Hard to say. A lot out there. Many younger workers are using backpacks now. Easier to carry longer distances or for climbing ladders, etc. Klein is probably the best, most durable. Metal boxes are durable but very heavy. Plastic boxes can be good. I have Ridgid stack boxes that I like. But these are not a starter purchase. She will buy lots of different types if she stays long term in this work.
Strippers. I have come to love the Milwaukee needle nose strippers. 2 tools in one. High quality and they have screw cutters for 6-32 and 8-32 screws, the most commonly used for switches, receptacles and light fixtures. They cut with a clean thread, very important.
Tape measure. Start with a standard 25 foot Stanley or Lufkin with top thumb lock. Magnetic tips are sometimes good but they hang up and pick up a lot of little scrap too. There are other types she may like as she goes along. Easy to upgrade, as most of us have to replace them often.
Pencil. Start with a child's heavy pencil. Good for marking concrete & metal. Don't break as easily. I have had thicker mechanical pencils too that were good. A lot of those come and go. She will find her favorites as she goes. Use pencils for marking bends on conduit, then erase the marks later with your thumb. Leaves a neater looking bend. Try not to ever use markers for that.
Markers. Standard Sharpies are best starters. I always tried to keep black and red. Black for marking most junction boxes, red for marking fire alarm junction boxes.
Best to mark her tools with an engraver or paint marker in some way. Even honest coworkers will pick up others' tools by accident and many have similar tools to start with. I knew one guy who went to great lengths to find odd brands for that very reason. Her ability to keep up with tools should also affect choices. If she keeps losses to a minimum, she can afford better stuff. If she is like me and loses a lot, better to get less expensive stuff.
Knife. Klein 44004 is the best I've ever had. Sheepfoot blade is razor sharp and does a good job on cable skinning and general use. Has lockback for safety. Easy to sharpen. Hunt Electric Supply is the only consistent supplier I have seen for this knife but it is worth the trouble. But do not pry with it. Blade will snap.
Large screwdriver, about 1/4 or 5/16 square shank, 4-6 inches generally best.
3/16 cabinet tip screwdriver for switches and receptables, other small screws. 4 inch generally good.
#2 Phillips is by far most common. Again about 4 inches.
Avoid Craftsman. Their screwdrivers have been junk for years. Klein is good, Husky or Kobalt are fairly good and less costly.
A 10 in 1 is good as a back up or for odd bits but pieces are easy to lose and they are heavy. I have an 11 in 1 Klein, also have a Klein stubby multi pocket driver. It can be good at times.
Channellocks. 2 pairs of 430's are good starters. Good for 1/2 to 1 inch EMT fittings. Stick with Channellock brand. Others are hit & miss. May later need some 440's for larger fittings. 426 "babylocks" are great for working threaded rod. She will see as she learns.
6 foot wood ruler. Get a yellow or beige one, not a white one. White ones are bricklayer type, not useful for electricians. Some have a slider tip on one end that is very useful.
Side cutters. 9 inch Klein D213. If bare handled, get pair of red grips to put on with hot water. Channellock are good too, not as costly.
Tool Bag, Box. Hard to say. A lot out there. Many younger workers are using backpacks now. Easier to carry longer distances or for climbing ladders, etc. Klein is probably the best, most durable. Metal boxes are durable but very heavy. Plastic boxes can be good. I have Ridgid stack boxes that I like. But these are not a starter purchase. She will buy lots of different types if she stays long term in this work.
Strippers. I have come to love the Milwaukee needle nose strippers. 2 tools in one. High quality and they have screw cutters for 6-32 and 8-32 screws, the most commonly used for switches, receptacles and light fixtures. They cut with a clean thread, very important.
Tape measure. Start with a standard 25 foot Stanley or Lufkin with top thumb lock. Magnetic tips are sometimes good but they hang up and pick up a lot of little scrap too. There are other types she may like as she goes along. Easy to upgrade, as most of us have to replace them often.
Pencil. Start with a child's heavy pencil. Good for marking concrete & metal. Don't break as easily. I have had thicker mechanical pencils too that were good. A lot of those come and go. She will find her favorites as she goes. Use pencils for marking bends on conduit, then erase the marks later with your thumb. Leaves a neater looking bend. Try not to ever use markers for that.
Markers. Standard Sharpies are best starters. I always tried to keep black and red. Black for marking most junction boxes, red for marking fire alarm junction boxes.
Best to mark her tools with an engraver or paint marker in some way. Even honest coworkers will pick up others' tools by accident and many have similar tools to start with. I knew one guy who went to great lengths to find odd brands for that very reason. Her ability to keep up with tools should also affect choices. If she keeps losses to a minimum, she can afford better stuff. If she is like me and loses a lot, better to get less expensive stuff.
Jmellc
Well-known member
I forgot to mention a planner. Good habit to get into. Some projects ask for a summary of work end of day or week. Probably won’t be required of her yet but she will be ahead of the game by keeping brief notes who she works with on what projects. She may need to do time sheets too, where notes are good.
I want to update on this thread. Daughter has been doing classwork Fridays & Saturdays, and working at (wll, now, 2nd) industrial construction sites. She's been learning a lot, and fast, and they've found her a to be a good hard worker, willing to take on tasks. Sometimes she surprises people with her quick pick-up. 
She also has done very well with her first bits of conduit bending; people told her if she's a good bender she'll never lack for a job!
She even asked for a Klein conduit reamer for Xmas, which Santa dropped in her stocking.
A belated thanks to everyone who answered my query back in August!
She also has done very well with her first bits of conduit bending; people told her if she's a good bender she'll never lack for a job! She even asked for a Klein conduit reamer for Xmas, which Santa dropped in her stocking.
A belated thanks to everyone who answered my query back in August!
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Jim greengo
Well-known member
I'd tell her not to be brand specific ,every brand has something specific they're good at making.
Walk her up and down the aisles at home depot and lowes,and find tools that fit her hands.
I personally prefer kobalt screw drivers/channel lock brand pliers with rounded Jaws instead of flats.
I've never had a problem with Lennox heavy duty hacksaw frames.
Lennox makes a good 6n1 screwdriver also.
As far as wire strippers pointed her in the way of a decent pair of $30-$40 strippers with curved Jaws that fit her hands comfortably.
Brand name means nothing if the tools don't fit while you're using them all day.
Specialized stuff is going to very depending on what kind of work she is stuck doing everyday.
Walk her up and down the aisles at home depot and lowes,and find tools that fit her hands.
I personally prefer kobalt screw drivers/channel lock brand pliers with rounded Jaws instead of flats.
I've never had a problem with Lennox heavy duty hacksaw frames.
Lennox makes a good 6n1 screwdriver also.
As far as wire strippers pointed her in the way of a decent pair of $30-$40 strippers with curved Jaws that fit her hands comfortably.
Brand name means nothing if the tools don't fit while you're using them all day.
Specialized stuff is going to very depending on what kind of work she is stuck doing everyday.
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