Love hate relationship with cheap tools!!!

[Exceller8]

*** Please, not another HF vs Snap-On debate ***


Let me start off by saying that I love American made tools. I would be 100% if I could but some tools I simply don't use enough to pay for an American made tool. Yes, I buy a ton of my tools used and I fill in and replace where I can with American made product but I simply can't find everything that I need used.

That brings me to my point. I have a real love hate relationship with cheap tools. I love the fact that I can buy a filler set on the cheap and get the job done. Looks good in the toolbox and works as described. But... when you actually use the tools you say "why didn't I listen" when people complain about cheap tools.

Today I was using my import hex sockets removing some bolts from a TV holder. First use and the plating came off and showed great signs of heavy use. Yes, it got the job done and I really don't use them very often but I can see why people won't buy cheap tools.

Anyone else have a love hate relationship with cheap tools?

 

[Outlawmws]

Nope, I dump any I get in package buys into a box and once a year, set them out at a yard sale of my own, or I give them to someone that had no tools.

 

[Exceller8]

Nope, I dump any I get in package buys into a box and once a year, set them out at a yard sale of my own, or I give them to someone that had no tools.

I think I'm headed in that direction. About 90% of what I have is nice quality so I mind as well finish the other 10%.

 

[Wakefield]

Cheap but not too cheap?

 

[Exceller8]

Cheap but not too cheap?

Yes, there is a difference. The Kobalt ratchets that I have are cheap but they work really well and I've used them without any problems. I'm talking more the tools that you know are junk and you buy them anyway.

 

[jjjrmx5]

*** Please, not another HF vs Snap-On debate ***



Today I was using my import hex sockets removing some bolts from a TV holder. First use and the plating came off and showed great signs of heavy use. Yes, it got the job done and I really don't use them very often but I can see why people won't buy cheap tools.

A TV holder??????????
WTF is that????????


Yes. You are now blocked and man card revoked to me.

Ikea.
Good for Swedish meatballs and Lingonberry jam.
For tools? Not so much.
Lesson for today is done.

 

[cburnscrx]

Um, I have some "cheap" tools by some standards, but as long as I pick and choose my spots, I've been pretty happy. You mentioned hex bits, and I'll use my example of cheap here. I have some Stanley hex bits I bought at Walmart, and they're perfectly fine for my use. I've used them to remove seatbelts in junkyard trucks, so they can take a pretty good beating considering those bolts have been rained on and rusty. I have yet to twist or break one of those torx bits. I have Performance Tool sockets that I use in my travel tools, and Pittsburgh Pro sockets that I keep in my truck. I can't complain about any of them.

I have some junk from various places that I've managed to aquire, but for the most part, I avoid the true junk and have been happy with the rest. I'd avoid **** screwdrivers, as those can be more frustrating than anything else, but other than that...I think most people can tell cheap from inexpensive.

 

[CWP1616L]

I simply don't use enough to pay for an American made tool.

I hear that excuse a lot on here.

 

[Brownsfan]

I don't use mine enough to justify the cost either. But I still do any way. I am not full time in a shop anymore but I still buy from my Cornwell and snap on guy. The last craftsman tools I bought were the last 3 USA made add on socket modules when they went half off. That's the last I will probably ever buy. I just want a quality tool that I can pass down to my kids and then their kids.

 

[mmack66]

A TV holder??????????
WTF is that????????


Yes. You are now blocked and man card revoked to me.

Ikea.
Good for Swedish meatballs and Lingonberry jam.
For tools? Not so much.
Lesson for today is done.

How did you deduce any of that from the OP?

He was probably referring to a device that attaches to a flat screen television.

And the fact that you know that Lingonberry jam is served at Ikea will likely send up red flags, via the NSA, at the department that is responsible for the investigation of suspicious man card behavior.

 

[Jere]

I have a love hate relationship with import tools, import and used is all I can afford. I often find myself explaining to people the evils of Wal mart and other such companies. About how in part their greed and low standards helped to sink our economy. At the same time when I have to fix something around the house and need some specialty tool I go to HF. I love how affordable everything there is, that I can actually buy what I need on my shoestring income. I hate contributing to the same practices that made my job not pay as well.

I am an independent cab driver, and there are dozens of drivers at my company that have worked at the same place when the economy was good. Money was easy to make back in the days and the economy and work in my city was great. Now that the businesses have all but disappeared, every dollar we make, we fight to get. Everyday at work is a gamble of going home after working all day and making a money or owing money. To end, I hate that we traded a good paying economy for loads of inexpensive multicolored plastic cheap import junk.

 

[jmm]

I mostly love my cheap tools at this point. When I first started almost all my tools were ****** as hell. 10-15 years later, most of my starters are long gone. There's absolutely no reason NOT to go cheap on some things in my line of work. Long as I'm careful about the cheap stuff, I have no problems; case in point, I'm not doing rebuilds with cheap torque wrenches, but I'll tear a machine down all day with cheap pry bars. I don't make enough to buy top line across the board.

Disclaimer: to me cheap doesn't mean import, anymore than expensive means USA, and by the same token, import doesn't mean garbage anymore than USA means quality.

 

[mmack66]

I have a love hate relationship with import tools, import and used is all I can afford. I often find myself explaining to people the evils of Wal mart and other such companies. About how in part their greed and low standards helped to sink our economy. At the same time when I have to fix something around the house and need some specialty tool I go to HF. I love how affordable everything there is, that I can actually buy what I need on my shoestring income. I hate contributing to the same practices that made my job not pay as well.

I am an independent cab driver, and there are dozens of drivers at my company that have worked at the same place when the economy was good. Money was easy to make back in the days and the economy and work in my city was great. Now that the businesses have all but disappeared, every dollar we make, we fight to get. Everyday at work is a gamble of going home after working all day and making a money or owing money. To end, I hate that we traded a good paying economy for loads of inexpensive multicolored plastic cheap import junk.

Walmart doesn't really manufacture anything, so they are only a symptom of a much larger problem.

Manufacturers, and companies that have products manufactured for them, such as Sears does with Craftsman, are responsible for the mass exodus of manufacturing to overseas locations.

Garage sales, Craigslist, and sometimes eBay, are good places to look for inexpensive, made in USA tools.

 

[monkeyspanners]

I've got a few cheap tools, either through ignorance of their crapness, or they were the only thing available at the time.

Usually find i use things a lot more than i first expected, and every time they are used their cost is less important, so i prefer better made or at least locally made stuff.

I have got a Rolson 3/8 socket set that was $8 inc p&p that i bought with the idea of seeing how easy the sockets break

 

[kursplat]

cheeps relative, and that's fine, just no garbage

 

[greasemonkey44]

i have some cheap stuff
itll piss you off after a while; screw driver handles that feel just terrible
diacs with misshapen jaws, needle noses that are ****
sockets that crack, wrencehs that round over
they can get the job done and in a pinch will; i would rather get something better

 

[crewchief888]

I mostly love my cheap tools at this point. When I first started almost all my tools were ****** as hell. 10-15 years later, most of my starters are long gone. There's absolutely no reason NOT to go cheap on some things in my line of work. Long as I'm careful about the cheap stuff, I have no problems; case in point, I'm not doing rebuilds with cheap torque wrenches, but I'll tear a machine down all day with cheap pry bars. I don't make enough to buy top line across the board.

Disclaimer: to me cheap doesn't mean import, anymore than expensive means USA, and by the same token, import doesn't mean garbage anymore than USA means quality.

well said

i'm kinda a hardass when it comes to buying tools, i dont buy anything i cant hold in my grubby little hands.
inexpensive tools (not cheap) can be a great thing for seldom used things, or if priced low enough, with a reasonable "lifespan" it's sometimes cheaper in the long run to buy the less expensive tool, and replace when needed.

"back in the day" inexpensive tools were mostly cheap imports, it's not tru for evereything nowadays

 

[RCStocker]

The real old cheap tools form 30 or 40 years ago were very cheap but the ones form Japan have proven much better than we thought.

Cheap tools can bust your knuckles. I love to hate them but I love them on my boats and wave runners. I have cheap tools on the boats. I oil with a rag and spray them. They have not rusted on salt water in the 5 years I have had them on my sail boat I keep in Long Beach CA. I have dropped a few sockets and wrenches over board when working on an out board motor. It is seldom but if they become fish bate who cares.

I have had a dune buggy that I gave one of my sons. It was street legal but I always took cheap tools. Here in California the break the windows to take HF tools. Nothing is safe. I take cheap HF tools camping in my motor home box.

I have always gotten the job done with cheap tools.

The problem has been that I years ago you could by a hand box of craftsman tools cheaper than you could buy the cheep tools. You don't find the boxes all that often anymore. Now and then but you don't get them for $5 or $10 like you did 30 years ago.

40 years ago I picked up a set of Tat metric wrenches form India. My grand son now has the set. None were lost and they chrome is as good as the day I bought them. They did not spread and if you find any cheap go for it. You will not be sorry.

I have tools in all the good brands and there is a difference but there are time the cheap ones are perfect for their use.

I hate cheap junk but I like feeding fish. LOL

I don't loose my tools. My kids do. I have only dropped one C man socket down in the engine compartment and never could find it. One day I stopped fast in front of my house and out it rolled. I have broken 1 C man socket with a 3 foot cheater pipe and bent a few cheap screw drivers because I was using them to pry. Other than saw blades and replaceable tooling those are all the tools I have broken in over 60 years of work in machine shops, farm and construction. I never have worked on rusted shut things and never would or will.

My bottom line answer is.... I love my chap tools. They have always gotten the job done.

 

[countrytech]

I'm thankful for import tools because otherwise I could afford few if any US made tools for my shop and be extremely limited in the projects that I could tackle. Are my tools as fancy or as tough as the USA made ones? No. But I don't use them hard every day and I find its better and smarter money wise to buy an import tool and then upgrade it to a better version IF I find that I am using it often and it doesn't hold up or work as good.

 

[Duct Tape Man]

Don't buy cheap tools. Buy quality tools for a low price!

Most of the foreign junk I get, if it's good shape I throw it all in a 5-gallon pail and sell for cheap on CL just to get them all out of here. The ones that are rusty, chrome peeling, quality is garbage, I just toss them all the in scrap metal bin at the shop.

 

[wafrederick]

The cheap throw away tools are good for one thing.Modifying them to make a special tool.I have done this to a few cheap throw away wrenches and one socket including screwdrivers.

 

[Rico.]

There are many facets to this thread title.

Cheap doesn't mean rubbish... Expensive doesn't mean good.
Some people spend 10 hours a day 6 days a week using their tools.
Some people use their tools a few hours a month.
Some people are 350lb Gorillas and beat mercilessly on their tools
Some people are very careful and treat their tools very gently.

^^^All of these things means that the same tool can last a day or a lifetime^^^

If you're the 350lb Gorilla beating hard on your tools 10 hours a day 6 days a week
you probably need the best quality going... and even then you'll still break a few...

If however your the gentle. careful DIYer that just does an oil change on your car
2 or 3 times a year... that cheap socket set you've had for 20 years still works
perfectly and will probably see you out.... and you can't understand why someone
would spend 10 times the money on a fancy name set when your cheapo works
"Just as good as the fancy pants brand name ones"

Then there is the issue of Actual Quality vs Perceved Quality.... and perceved quality
is everything that has been thrown at you by the clever Marketing department, stories your
Dad or Uncle or Neighbour told you about a particular brand, stuff your collegues or
friends use. So many things that influence you without you really being aware of it at the
time until you need to buy something.

One thing I will say about this particular forum is..... There aren't a great many fanboys
who spout their gospel... and for the most part every tool and tool brand out there gets
a fair shout...

I tend to be the sort of person that buys the best quality I can afford, but I won't buy
an item just because of it's label and perceved quality, when I know that something else
is just as good quality but isn't a household brand name, I'll buy that instead.

I'm just a careful DIYer, but I do appreciate good quality hand tools, however, the
one off specialty tools I will buy cheap....

I think the key word for everyone to remember is "VALUE"

For the 10 hour a day Gorilla working in a garage, a truck tool may cost 10 times
more than the tools from the big store, but they last the longest without breaking and
when time is money to him they are the best "Value"

For Mr. Joe OilChange his sockets still haven't broken in 20 years and they cost a
tenth of Captain Goriila's sockets... Obvioulsly to him... they are the best "Value"


Holy ****.... I've really rambled on... Thanks for listening... Over & Out.

 

[byoungblood]

There is inexpensive, then there is junk.

For something that will be used infrequently, it is hard for me to justify dropping a large amount of money on a tool that may only get used once every couple of years. However, that usually means that I will look for an inexpensive alternative, not a cheap piece of junk that may break or is inadequate for the job.

For basic hand tools that will be used repeatedly over a lifetime, I don't understand why people skimp. No, you do not need to run out and buy truck brands, but over the span of you life spending that extra $50-100 on a set of wrenches isn't going to break most people.

 

[KinzeMech]

Being disappointed with a cheap tool *****.

Being disappointed with an expensive tools *SUPER ***** BIG HAIRY DONKEY D"

Cheap tools have their place. Let people buy as much quality as they need.

When cheap tools equal or outperform expensive tools, and I bought the cheap one, I love it.
When cheap tools equal or outperform expensive tools, and I bought the expensive one, I am *PISSED OFF*.

 

[Exceller8]

How did you deduce any of that from the OP?

He was probably referring to a device that attaches to a flat screen television.

And the fact that you know that Lingonberry jam is served at Ikea will likely send up red flags, via the NSA, at the department that is responsible for the investigation of suspicious man card behavior.

Yep, you are correct. They would have gave me sh*t no matter what!

 

[Exceller8]

I hear that excuse a lot on here.

Let me put it another way. I bought the import tools that I don't use very often so I would have them when I need them. Today was a good example. I used a HF hex socket for today's project and I may use that socket once or twice a year. After today I can tell you that I'll be getting a better (American) set really soon.

The HF hex socket got the job done and that's all that really matters. My wife is happy, so I'm happy!

 

[Haveblue]

^^best tool rant ever Rico.! You make some valid points that I dont think anyone can disagree with.

 

[Exceller8]

^^best tool rant ever Rico.! You make some valid points that I dont think anyone can disagree with.

 

[zer0cell]

Personally, I do think it can be tempting to buy "cheap" tools on occasion and sometimes i succumb to it, but more often than not I'm like WTF am I thinking, or why did I buy this....

There are exceptions. If I buy something expecting it will be a disposable item and I need to pick up something fast because I forgot my 'good' tool at the house then okay - sure.

Most of the tools I buy are new, and of high quality... with the logic that I will not need to replace it under normal circumstances.

If I am looking for 'cheap' tools my way of thinking is:

I'd rather search pawn shops/ebay/flea markets for used tools which are made to high standards than buy 'new' stuff that's junk.

 

[Exceller8]

Personally, I do think it can be tempting to buy "cheap" tools on occasion and sometimes i succumb to it, but more often than not I'm like WTF am I thinking, or why did I buy this....

There are exceptions. It I buy something expecting it will be a disposable item and I need to pick up something fast because I forgot my 'good' tool at the house then okay - sure.

Most of the tools I buy are new, and of high quality... with the logic that I will not need to replace it under normal circumstances.

If I am looking for 'cheap' tools my way of thinking is:

I'd rather search pawn shops/ebay/flea markets for used tools which are made to high standards than buy 'new' stuff that's junk.

I totally agree but my thinking is that I can have instant sets. I go to the local swap meet three or four times a week and I pickup a ton of nice tools, but sets of specific tools are kind of hard to find, especially quality ones.

 

[jd_1138]

Nope, I dump any I get in package buys into a box and once a year, set them out at a yard sale of my own, or I give them to someone that had no tools.

That's what I do. I recently gave a cheapie Harbor Freight tool assortment to my wife's friend to keep in her van (small needle nose pliers, Phillips and straight screwdrivers, and an adjustable wrench). The hood release handle was missing, so she had no way to open her hood. She probably never would deliberately go to a store to purchase tools herself, so I imagine she would've been locked out of her engine bay indefinitely.

 

[jd_1138]

For basic hand tools that will be used repeatedly over a lifetime, I don't understand why people skimp. No, you do not need to run out and buy truck brands, but over the span of you life spending that extra $50-100 on a set of wrenches isn't going to break most people.

Some people are pathologically cheap. Being cheap is expensive (ends up costing lots of money and time).

 

[KinzeMech]

Another point of view:

When I began wrenching, it was a sudden career change. I had a toolset that was greater than the average Joe Oilchange, but there was a good number of things I needed *right now*.

Options at that point are:
(A) Have deep pockets already (didn't work for me).
(B) Finance (whether on a card, or on the truck).
(C) Cheap.

I got by with a combination of a very limited use of financing (presently $0 balance, and never owed more than I could pay off in 3 months), the tools I already owned as a shade tree wrench, and the things I just had to have right now, from cheap sources, like HF, or ebay. The basic premise being I don't need the tool to last forever, just until I can replace it with a "real" tool. Some things failed within 90 days, and were replaced with better items. Some were a pleasant surprise in that actual performance so greatly exceeded expectations that plans to replace them have been cancelled. Most of the tools that have been replaced have been retired to home duty, where they will likely last decades, but I'm out little to nothing if they fail.

 

[03protege]

I've been buying a lot of Gearwrench items lately, I can tell the quality isn't as good as the Snap On items I own but for a very small fraction of the cost even if the item fails and I decide to rebuy a higher brand I am really not out much.

If I was to start out buying snap on I would have a much more limited tool selection and I feel that would be a greater hamper on my ability to fix my car than having multiple types of wrenches, sockets, and ratchets of a supposed lower quality.

For some having nothing but the best may work for them, for me finding the happy medium allows me to be more productive.


The one thing I hate about cheap tools is they fill the toolbox too damn fast!

 

[shoggoth80]

I have mostly "cheap" tools. I am just starting to get into the "I should invest more in higher end gear;" mostly because I am working/wrenching full time, and getting OT on occasion etc. and am finally making a little more than needed to *just* pay the bills.

Inexpensive doesn't always mean cheap. There are some bargains out there. HF's impact sockets seem nice for the price (I haven't broken any, but have lost some, left some in cars etc.), however I busted their 3/8" drive impact swivel. I still have a bunch of Companion branded stuff that I got when I was in my teens. Yes I use that everyday now. My ratchets run from Kobalt, Titan, CMan, Thorsen, and even a Stanley 1/4" that I got from wally world. They work. I'll be getting my first GearWrench roto soon (probably also a cheap tool by some. Looked nice). Still rocking Pittsburgh wrenches along side my Armstrong stuff, and my 1/2" impact stuff is a mix of Armstrong and Kobalt, paid no more than $8 for any one of those impact sockets.

It's all relative really. I've bought cheap stuff because it is what I could afford, and needed it for a job that I knew was coming in the next day. I still have that stuff, and it still works. Would I upgrade as and when I can afford to? Sure. Can I right now? Not entirely. It'll be a slow build process due to being stubborn about not wanting to finance tools. Also, when I have to be the 350lb gorilla, and break something loose using my hammer...it's nice to have a cheap wrench or ratchet to do it with.

 

[AV tinker er]

When I was required to maintain my toolbox for work I bought the best, it's not like there was a sears or SO truck running around Dubai and other places I went. I still buy great hand tools when I need them. However, I have no problem using my $15 HF buffer to wax the cars twice a year. I cannot even begin to justify that expense for something I rarely use. That money saved over years can really beef up the retirement account. Lets see you eat that $400 tool you've used three times over 4 decades.....

 

[monster1]

I buy inexpensive but not cheap. My lastest purchases of inexpensive tools have been a set of kobalt full polished ratchet set, a set of sk line wrenches, and some Pittsburgh pro impact sockets. I'm 320lbs and lean on everything. I've stripped countless fasteners and threads but never broken an inexpensive tool if I was using it as it was intended for.

 

[William Payne]

I have been thinking about this. I would love a good quality toolbox full of high end USA and German tools however I can only buy that stuff when the wallet allows.

As far as making a living with your tools or even the home guy, you really have to look at it like this. What is more important? having the best tool money can buy, or just having the tool you need to do the job?

What do I mean you ask? well I will use this as an example. I am on a budget I have to watch my spending. I have a hotrod project, I could save up my money and buy all the best tools but then the hotrod would have to wait, or or I could buy the best tools that I can afford without breaking the bank and have the tools needed to build my hotrod.

If those tools dont last and break then I will replace with higher quality as needed.

I can dream of having all the best tools but my wallet does not match that reality and I want tools to do things and the things I want to do are a bigger deal then the tools I am using.

 

[decaf]

I have been thinking about this. I would love a good quality toolbox full of high end USA and German tools however I can only buy that stuff when the wallet allows.

As far as making a living with your tools or even the home guy, you really have to look at it like this. What is more important? having the best tool money can buy, or just having the tool you need to do the job?

What do I mean you ask? well I will use this as an example. I am on a budget I have to watch my spending. I have a hotrod project, I could save up my money and buy all the best tools but then the hotrod would have to wait, or or I could buy the best tools that I can afford without breaking the bank and have the tools needed to build my hotrod.

If those tools dont last and break then I will replace with higher quality as needed.

I can dream of having all the best tools but my wallet does not match that reality and I want tools to do things and the things I want to do are a bigger deal then the tools I am using.

I can understand how you think.
For me it's more about precision and looseness, etc..

for example: If I must use a water pump plier. and it only has a few settings that do not fit on the subject I would be working on.

or I will unscrew a screw on the screwdriver has been so poor fit that does not fit.

there are lots of examples where I get mad and throw away the bad tool.

If I instead buy good tools, then I know it will be fun using them while i work.
That means more to me then saving some money in the pocket.

 

[ArcStyles]

Tools are a personal choice. How I feel about the work defines the relationship with my tools.

I approach everything from the craftsman perspective, which makes me extremely annoying to people who don't share the same perfectionist ideas. I am not an ******* about it, but I can't help sheep dogging any project I am involved with.

My personality is such, that I expect, when ever possible, the same quality from my tools, as I do my work. In most cases, companies that are like minded, build tools that reflect this philosophical approach. These companies usually have designers that want to express these ideas in the tools they create. These are the "I want to build a better mouse trap" idealists. People I want to sit at the dinner table with and pick their brains of ideas.

I love the work I do and want the the same passion in the tool designs I work with. These tools keep me focused on my work and less distracted by the tool. Like I said this a personal choice and not a "call you out" thread.

Point is, I don't want to think about my tools at all!

Cheap tools have there place. They can get you by when you have no other means to afford different. There are many quality deals out there that don't require you emptying your wallet.

You don't have to be the Snap on/Hazet extremist like myself, but you don't have to settle for the "this is ******* ****" offerings either. If your am member of this form, you are probably part of the "most bang for the buck" crowd. The truth is usually somewhere in the middle.

Now get out there and start swinging those tools!