Lubing sealed bearings

[andyvh1959]

I'm refurbbing a used ZTR for resale. Some of the pulley idlers are ok, one is shot and I'm replacing it. They have sealed bearings set as non replaceable because of the rolled flange that retains the bearing. Does anyone use a large hypodermic needle to push through the seal and inject grease into the bearing? Seems like it would be a way to get fresh lube into the bearing and no disturb the seal itself.

Something like this: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000FMO6XU/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[Los_Control]

The few sealed bearings I have messed with, Riding lawn mower decks the pulleys have sealed bearings and also zirk fittings on the shaft to make you feel good.
Usually they have the plastic or neoprene whatever it is cover you can just pry off. Then pack the bearings as normal and re-install the cover.

I watched a "how to" youtube vid on showing how to grease these bearings. The creator actually left the cover off. Now you can use your grease gun and the zirk fittings and keep them greased inside the sealed shaft.

I bought new bearings for my mower, I pulled off one dust cover and expected it to be low on grease and was going to pack them before installing ... I was lucky and well packed so just put cover back on and left rest alone.

Not sure if that helps you, I say the large needle could slowly get grease in, if you have access just removing the cover can be done and put back on.
If it is in a sealed area like a tube you can just leave the cover off, maybe install a zirk fitting? ... no structural integrity to the bearing ... just there to keep dust out.

 

[pcmeiners]

Unless you have the exact same grease it is not advised as mixing different grease types does not work well. That said Ebay has a large assortment of needle sizes/ syringes. I have multibles of about 20 different sizes.

 

[kelpaso1]

Unless you have the exact same grease it is not advised as mixing different grease types does not work well. That said Ebay has a large assortment of needle sizes/ syringes. I have multibles of about 20 different sizes.

In a lawnmower this will not make any difference at all mixing grease. Any grease is better than no grease.

 

[nadogail]

IMHO, Injecting grease into a sealed bearing is generally just a temporary measure to get the bearing “good enough to sell”. A temporary repair to mask the real proble

 

[kelpaso1]

What I find stupid is, manufacturers of mower deck spindles is that they even have a grease fitting on them at all. As stated, most bearings are sealed and injecting grease into the fitting does nothing but fill up the spindle housing but does nothing to actually "grease" the bearing itself. I've taken apart spindles and they are full of grease in the housing, but the actual bearing itself is dry and noisy/loose/ worn out.

 

[marinusdees]

I'm refurbbing a used ZTR for resale. Some of the pulley idlers are ok, one is shot and I'm replacing it. They have sealed bearings set as non replaceable because of the rolled flange that retains the bearing. Does anyone use a large hypodermic needle to push through the seal and inject grease into the bearing? Seems like it would be a way to get fresh lube into the bearing and no disturb the seal itself.

Something like this: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000FMO6XU/?tag=atomicindus08-20

If they're not noisy, leave them alone. If they are, replace them with sealed bearings. If you are able to turn them individually, you can feel a bad bearing. If its rough and not noisy, it's a matter of conscience. You are not selling a new mower. It's buyer be(a)ware.

 

[bassJAM]

If they're not noisy, leave them alone. If they are, replace them with sealed bearings. If you are able to turn them individually, you can feel a bad bearing. If its rough and not noisy, it's a matter of conscience. You are not selling a new mower. It's buyer be(a)ware.

That's where I'm at. Sealed bearing typically last long enough that I'm not about to go through the trouble to make them last a tad longer.

 

[andyvh1959]

Thanks guys, pretty much what I was thinking, just checking if our brains align

 

[firebirdparts]

It’s not the space shuttle, so why not give it a try. On those bogus greasable spindles, you could pull a seal off the lower bearing, but I never thought that would help the upper. I was never willing to put the that much grease in.

 

[K'ledgeBldr]

Many years ago I worked for a small outfit that rebuilt GM a/c compressors. The sealed bearings that were in the pulleys were always pressed out, seals removed (carefully with dental picks), washed, rinsed, dried; checked for any rust, pitting, or other anomalies- if they passed the QC checks they were repacked with syn-grease and resealed.

they would go back into a pulley, and installed on a compressor that had better/smaller tolerances than a factory original. For the short time I was there- never heard of a compressor failing due to a bearing. AAMoF- never knew of a compressor that failed except for one; because the tech forgot to flush the system before recharging (ring shards were found in the condenser).

 

[CN Spots]

I always assumed the zerks were there to fill the spindle void with grease to keep water displaced.

 

[bwringer]

These are standard industrial bearings made for speeds and loads far above anything a mower or motorcycle can put them through. They come from the factory with the correct small amount of grease so that they don't overheat at high speed and high loads.

They should NOT be filled with grease, especially whatever random potentially incompatible grease you have on hand.

 

[like2wheel]

I have a couple larger hypodermic needles with Zerk fittings on the other end made just for that. I use them occasionally, it would be hard to push grease thru a needle with just a syringe.

 

[kelpaso1]

I always assumed the zerks were there to fill the spindle void with grease to keep water displaced.

What would the point of that be, unless you are mowing under water? Just a waste of grease to do that. Filling the void with grease does NOTHINIG for the bearings if they are sealed.

 

[seber]

I just replace them. They're pretty cheap if you buy them from Amazon.

 

[kelpaso1]

I just replace them. They're pretty cheap if you buy them from Amazon.

Yep, spindles are so cheap doesn't make sense replacing just the bearings.

 

[kelpaso1]

These are standard industrial bearings made for speeds and loads far above anything a mower or motorcycle can put them through. They come from the factory with the correct small amount of grease so that they don't overheat at high speed and high loads.

They should NOT be filled with grease, especially whatever random potentially incompatible grease you have on hand.

You are so wrong! I've popped the seals off of new bearings and have found little to no grease in them. And your term "correct amount of grease" means what? Explain please.

 

[Los_Control]

Yep, spindles are so cheap doesn't make sense replacing just the bearings.

Maybe ... My old John Deere the spindle is almost $50 + shipping. The bearings are less then $8 each ... so 4 bearings at $32, or 2 spindles at $100 ... One number seems smaller to me, and just not hard to do.

 

[kelpaso1]

Maybe ... My old John Deere the spindle is almost $50 + shipping. The bearings are less then $8 each ... so 4 bearings at $32, or 2 spindles at $100 ... One number seems smaller to me, and just not hard to do.

Well, most of the ones I change are because the DIY guy did not remove the deck and flip it over to change the blades and didn't line up the star pattern of the blade to spindle. And this just results in a mashed star on the spindle. But I'm not complaining. I make good bucks from DIY guys.

 

[rburke65]

I wouldn’t be too concerned with mixing grease....it’s not like it’s going to catch fire or explode.

 

[shoot summ]

Used to wash out and repack the rear axle bearings on our ATV's. All of the power washing after riding took its toll on the bearings. I found washing them out, and packing them full from the beginning extended the bearing life significantly. I never had an issue with the bearings over heating, not saying it couldn't happen, but I think it would be a pretty extreme use case.

The OP indicated the pulley has a rolled flange the retains the bearing making it non-replaceable, in that case I would remove the seal with a pick, pack the bearing, and put the seal back in. Different grease isn't going to make a bit of difference IMO.

 

[dave_dj1]

It was common practice on my Yamaha Apex sled to have to take a pick and remove the seal off the jackshaft bearing and clean it with brake clean then repack it a couple times a season.
The big bearing store if you are shopping

 

[CraigStu]

I have a Husqvarna tractor w/ their 'Fabricated' deck and it has grease fittings on the spindles. I grease maybe 2x per year. Pump a fair amount of grease in there and never see any coming out anywhere. So I give it 5 pumps and go to the next one. Now I guess I know why I never see any grease. Thanks guys.

 

[Davefr]

I've never met a bearing yet where I couldn't carefully remove the metal shield(s), flush them totally clean, inspect and repack them with fresh grease appropriate for the application. It's rare that I've encountered bearings that were actually worn out. An ultrasonic cleaner works well but brake cleaner will also dissolve the old grease to clean them out. (don't simply inject them with more grease - that's a "hack" repair!!)

IMHO, OEM bearings are usually superior to new no name bearings from China. The price of quality name brand bearings makes it worth a try to save old ones.

 

[CN Spots]

What would the point of that be, unless you are mowing under water? Just a waste of grease to do that. Filling the void with grease does NOTHINIG for the bearings if they are sealed.

I don't think it's for the bearings. There was an open area in the spindles on my old mower that was pretty rusted. Some people wash off their mowers after they mow and if water gets in there it could lead to premature spindle failure. Packing it with grease would displace any water. As cheap as manufacturers are I doubt they would add a zerk on spindles to grease ungreasable bearings. Not to mention, you over fill it and it will jam the sealed bearings.

 

[58Yeoman]

Sometimes, new spindles aren't available. I had a Husqvarna articulated mower where the spindles weren't available, so I replaced the bearings.

 

[andyvh1959]

Me too. I am selling my Simplicity ZTR because I bought a Husqvarna R120S articulating mower that I prefer for my yard. Since the spindle assemblies aren't available I'll replace the bearing when needed. Its the perfect machine for my yard.

One of the idler pullies on my ZTR spun so notchy and rough that no amount of cleaning and grease would revive it. So that one gets replaced with a new assembly which has the formed flange design to retain the bearing on both sides. Actually, the pulley design is two piece, that are spot welded together after the bearing is installed. If it really came down to it, I'd cut through the flange just enough to peel it open and push the bearing out from the other side, then pound back down enough flange to retain the bearing.

 

[laser3kw]

OEM bearings are usually superior to new no name bearings from China.

I can verify that. When our purchasing department tried to reduce cost with "quality import" bearings. We would have poor fitment to start and likewise, heat issues. Take them out and put in the specified bearing (SHF, Nacchi) and the machine would perform as engineered. I have witness bearings drop into properly sized bores, have double the interference fit on shafts, bearings with little if any grease amongst other apparent problems that went away with trusted brands.
PS- there are also counterfeit bearings sold in very convincing looking packages. I avoid Amazon and other dubious vendors. If the price sounds to good to be true, think twice.

 

[Showkey]

Instead of injecting grease ………carefully pull the seals clean, regrease and but the seals back in.
While it’s clean it easy to judge the bearings true condition.

Typical wheel bearing grease is too thick to inject with a needle.

 

[andyvh1959]

All good ideas. Another option, get the bearing specs and go to a local bearing supplier and get matching or even higher grade/better bearings as replacements. I agree too, its too easy to get knock off **** bearings from Amazon to save a few bucks? Stick with the real brands like ***, SKF, etc, spend a few bucks more and get better quality, longer lasting bearings.

The idler pulleys on my ZTR are spot welded together after the bearing is placed so there is no option to just replace the bearings. Though, I wonder if idlers from Ferris or Snapper commercial ZTRs would also fit and could be a type with replaceable bearings.

 

[wayne55]

You can drill out the spot welds and replace with small bolts.

 

[gungatim]

You can drill out the spot welds and replace with small bolts.

was just going to suggest that. did that with a Toro I flipped, drill out the spots replace bearings and plug weld back up. worked great.

 

[matt_i]

If you can carefully raise the seal with an oring pick (etc) then you can apply a drop of oil which is going to go to all of the places its needed and some of it is going to be retained behind the seal.

 

[jar944]

You are so wrong! I've popped the seals off of new bearings and have found little to no grease in them. And your term "correct amount of grease" means what? Explain please.

High speed bearings only require a certain amount of grease. Packing them like wheel bearings will cause more damage then leaving them alone. Basically it kills the grease and eventually the bearing.

"Too much grease volume (overgreasing) in a bearing cavity will cause the rotating bearing elements to begin churning the grease, pushing it out of the way, resulting in energy loss and rising temperatures. This leads to rapid oxidation (chemical degradation) of the grease as well as an accelerated rate of oil bleed, which is a separation of the oil from the thickener.

The heat that has been generated over time along with the oil bleed eventually will cook the grease thickener into a hard, crusty build-up that can impair proper lubrication and even block new grease from reaching the core of the bearing. This can result in accelerated wear of the rolling elements and then component failure."

 

[1984shovelhead]

Been using needles for this for years unless your working on a lunar module get some fresh grease in there you good to go with no disassembly and chances are the new replacement will be junk compared to the poem part