LVL header question

[NockOn]

So I'm getting a 2 ply 9 1/2" LVL for the header on my overhead 16' foot garage door. I going with 3 jacks as recommended by the Lumberyard. However I saw mention somewhere that I should keep the whole 18 feet instead of cutting it 16' 9". If I did that, what would the framing look like? The garage is 24' so there's 4 feet of wall on each side.

FYI, I'm a visual learner so if you have pictures or diagram of what this would look like, please don't hold back

Cheers,

Claude

 

[pattenp]

Building code calls for at least one end of the header to run over and be tied into the wall. I can't put my finger on the code but this subject has come up before. Google framing garage door header for pics.
https://www.doityourself.com/forum/...ports/554779-building-garage-door-header.html

 

[The Cobbler]

I'm not sure what you would gain by leaving the extra length.
who recommends that?

 

[Hank11]

More info is needed to answer this question, the height of the door and the height of the finished wall are needed and is it in the gable end? (Sounds like it is).

There is no reason to cut the LVL. Just set it down into a pocket on top of the jack studs with the kings on each end. Width determined by the length of the LVL. Space the jacks accordingly to get your correct rough opening. Build on top to get your height. Might want a plate under the LVL too to help with snaking.

You will want to brace it to keep it from snaking. Shear devices of some kind will be good too, whether stick, sheet or metal.

 

[Innovate1]

I many instances code calls for the header to extend over the adjoining side panel for some distance. It's called portal framing. The header goes at the top of the wall. It is to strengthen the wall from racking. If the wall only has narrow sections on both sides of the door there is little strength to keep the wall from tilting to the side and falling. They also require more nails into the panel beside and blocking between the panels. It's a good idea and makes the wall much stronger.

 

[Innovate1]

Here's a link...
https://www.jlconline.com/how-to/framing/the-portal-frame-option_o

 

[NockOn]

More info is needed to answer this question, the height of the door and the height of the finished wall are needed and is it in the gable end? (Sounds like it is).

There is no reason to cut the LVL. Just set it down into a pocket on top of the jack studs with the kings on each end. Width determined by the length of the LVL. Space the jacks accordingly to get your correct rough opening. Build on top to get your height. Might want a plate under the LVL too to help with snaking.

You will want to brace it to keep it from snaking. Shear devices of some kind will be good too, whether stick, sheet or metal.

Door is 7x16, walls are 9 foot, Gable end.

 

[NockOn]

Here's a link...
https://www.jlconline.com/how-to/framing/the-portal-frame-option_o

yes, that's what I was referring to. I'm not sure if its required in my neck of the woods, Nova Scotia. However I would find to be a shame to just cut off some good wood if it can be put to good use. Especially at the price I'm paying for those 2 LVLs. I hope my first born won't mind living with strangers LOL

Looks like I need to do a little research on portal framing options

Thanks

Claude

 

[Innovate1]

I put up a 30 x 40 x 14 garage recently and have a 9 x 8 and 12 x 12 door in the 30 foot gable end wall. Don't really need much to hold up the gable end but did portal framing on both doors because they take up so much of the wall. I was looking at putting up the building across the river in Missouri and they are sticklers for all kinds of details (to the point of ridiculousness at times!) and required portal framing to extend to the corners. So I found out about portal framing from that. Not required where I am now but it seemed like a good idea and pretty easy to do so I did it. Won't have to worry when we have wind storms.

 

[James-W]

I have a 16 foot overhead door and when I built my garage the blueprints called for three jack studs on each side and the header to be sitting on them and ending on the jack studs. This was back is 2012 when I built the garage, so maybe things have changed now. But back in 2012, around her at least, you would cut off the header instead of extending it out further. I doubt a building inspector would have an issue with the header going out further, but then again, it wasn't in the blueprints so I am not real sure how a building inspector would take that.

 

[NockOn]

I have a 16 foot overhead door and when I built my garage the blueprints called for three jack studs on each side and the header to be sitting on them and ending on the jack studs. This was back is 2012 when I built the garage, so maybe things have changed now. But back in 2012, around her at least, you would cut off the header instead of extending it out further. I doubt a building inspector would have an issue with the header going out further, but then again, it wasn't in the blueprints so I am not real sure how a building inspector would take that.

I'm going off my own blueprints so I can do what I want. They don't seem to be very picky around here as long as it looks like the bulk of it is down square and plumb LOL. I think if I go with the full 18' header then I'm building extra strong so I can't see it being an issue. I was just wondering how you would frame it.

 

[NockOn]

Just found this diagram while researching this portal framing and this makes sense to me with the jacks continuing as cripples directly above. I'll adjust my drawings tomorrow and see how it looks.

 

[pattenp]

I'm not sure what you would gain by leaving the extra length.
who recommends that?

The IRC R602.10.6 is where it comes from.

 

[The Cobbler]

The IRC R602.10.6 is where it comes from.

don't forget OP is in Canada , and our code can vary from yours. I had just never heard of it before.

 

[pattenp]

don't forget OP is in Canada , and our code can vary from yours. I had just never heard of it before.

Yeah.... I didn't notice the OP was in Canada when I first replied about building code.

 

[Innovate1]

The plans I saw specified that the header be at the top of the wall but I see now that the code allows a cripple wall above as long as they are strapped across the header.

Normally all the extra header is put on one side of the opening as I think, for example, a 4' wide section is stronger than two 2' sections. Width of required side panel is depends on wall height. With portal framing a 6:1 ratio is allowed. So with 2' on one side the wall can be up to 12' tall. A least that's how I understand it.

I realize the OP isn't subjected to US code and it sounds like he isn't required to do any of this but it still is good guidance for a stronger building and applies to his question.

 

[TractorJeff]

On my 12 foot door opening the Building Inspector wanted 5 Jacks on each side?
In retrospect, I wish I had an Engineered Drawing to follow.
BTW: I "Portal Framed" it also.

 

[ddurrett896]

I spanned the entire length, tying both opposite walls together

 

[old__man]

I'm going off my own blueprints so I can do what I want. They don't seem to be very picky around here as long as it looks like the bulk of it is down square and plumb LOL. I think if I go with the full 18' header then I'm building extra strong so I can't see it being an issue. I was just wondering how you would frame it.

The last garage I built in HRM the header only spanned the 16'. It was on the gable end. After numerous phone calls and messages an inspector finally showed up. He spent all of about 30 seconds on the site, verified that there were indeed 4 walls and a roof, gave me a piece of paper that said it was inspected, and then told me there was never a need to call him again.

You are right, they don't seem too picky, I think they concentrate mostly on new homes being built not homeowner built sheds. That being said I found that it is possible to get a hold of the inspector(s) on the phone and ask them a question or two. This was all in the pre-covid world of course.

 

[NockOn]

The last garage I built in HRM the header only spanned the 16'. It was on the gable end. After numerous phone calls and messages an inspector finally showed up. He spent all of about 30 seconds on the site, verified that there were indeed 4 walls and a roof, gave me a piece of paper that said it was inspected, and then told me there was never a need to call him again.

You are right, they don't seem too picky, I think they concentrate mostly on new homes being built not homeowner built sheds. That being said I found that it is possible to get a hold of the inspector(s) on the phone and ask them a question or two. This was all in the pre-covid world of course.

I can still get hold of them by phone. They are all working from home now. When I got the permit there was an inspection schedule and I wanted to know which one they wanted done. He said roof tight call us. I said what about after insulating and he said its not required but I already paid for the inspections ($400 for permit) so I could get them in if I want to. They don't care about electrical either, he said that was the NS Power.

 

[CraigStu]

In Va my SIL is building a garage w/ 2 doors where the walls on the outside of the doors will only be 2 feet to the corner. He was required to run his headers all the way to the outer wall but just standard support for the end going into the 2 ft wall between the doors.

 

[ford33]

As others have stated this is known as portal framing and codes have changed so the OP should check local codes. OP do a search on IRC building codes for portal framing and you will see videos and pictures of the new requirements. They have made the construction surrounding large garage door openings much stronger than in the past. It is a good idea to follow the new codes for this area.

One other suggestion. It is not only the header length and attachment that have changed but also the sheathing to improve the shear wall at a garage door opening. The sheathing cannot be cut and joined at the corner of the garage door wall and must be one piece around the opening for some distance across and down. A sheathing joint is allowed in the middle of the wall but has specific dimensions and location. Wall tie downs to the concrete foundation also changed.

The changes will greatly increase the strength of the garage structure and prevent damage from high winds and earth quakes.

 

[NockOn]

The plans I saw specified that the header be at the top of the wall but I see now that the code allows a cripple wall above as long as they are strapped across the header.

Normally all the extra header is put on one side of the opening as I think, for example, a 4' wide section is stronger than two 2' sections. Width of required side panel is depends on wall height. With portal framing a 6:1 ratio is allowed. So with 2' on one side the wall can be up to 12' tall. A least that's how I understand it.

I realize the OP isn't subjected to US code and it sounds like he isn't required to do any of this but it still is good guidance for a stronger building and applies to his question.

I like the idea of putting it all to one side to have extra shearing strength. So I decided to go that way. I've seen other references to that effect as well.
I'm just posting some JPGs of my own building plans, now in this tread.

Thanks

 

[NockOn]

Here's first what I first thought and then what I will be doing. Remember I'm in Canada and there is no requirements for me to do this but since I had that extra 14", I might as well put it to use instead of just cutting it. We also get the odd weak Hurricanes out this way sometimes so why not add that little bit.

Cheers,

Claude

 

[Firebrick43]

So 9 1/2” lvl seemed smaller to me for a header, even doubled up. And by your drawing it is supporting the rafters and not on a table end. So I went and looked and the header beam table recommends a 16” deep lvl 5.5” thick if using 24’ span trusses.

 

[NockOn]

So 9 1/2” lvl seemed smaller to me for a header, even doubled up. And by your drawing it is supporting the rafters and not on a table end. So I went and looked and the header beam table recommends a 16” deep lvl 5.5” thick if using 24’ span trusses.

Not sure how you determined that its not a gable end since the roof is not in that drawing LOL. Its definetly a gable end, I know I'm the one putting them in. The 2 ply 9 1/2" was given to me by the lumberyard selling me the trusses and the LVL and will provide the specs on delivery tomorrow as those have to be on hand for my roof tight inspection.

Having said that, the information you provide might come handy to someone not putting their garage door on the gable end

 

[Firebrick43]

Sorry, it appeared to me that the bottom of the trusses was sitting on top plate/stub wall over the headers.

But on a side note, most minimum sized double garage headers(which is what the lumber yard probably spec’) will sag over a few years. And it might not be significantly more money to upsize it and do away with the fuss of the little knee above the header.

Also it provides a more solid place to attach the shaft/springs/pulley for the door

 

[spudley]

But on a side note, most minimum sized double garage headers(which is what the lumber yard probably spec’) will sag over a few years. And it might not be significantly more money to upsize it and do away with the fuss of the little knee above the header.

Also it provides a more solid place to attach the shaft/springs/pulley for the door

Not sure about doubled LVL's sagging but who knows.
I used three 14" x 1 3/4" on my 16' door but I'm on the "hip" side. My yard spec'd a double 16" but that messed with my stair height so we went 3-14"s.

OP... since you're using up less than 12", could you opt for a 8' high door? I really am happy with mine.

 

[NockOn]

Not sure about doubled LVL's sagging but who knows.
I used three 14" x 1 3/4" on my 16' door but I'm on the "hip" side. My yard spec'd a double 16" but that messed with my stair height so we went 3-14"s.

OP... since you're using up less than 12", could you opt for a 8' high door? I really am happy with mine.

I thought about it but the wait was going to be too long to get it besides I only have an SUV and even with something like a Ford F150 at 77", I still have 7" of play to get it in.

 

[NockOn]

Not sure about doubled LVL's sagging but who knows.
I used three 14" x 1 3/4" on my 16' door but I'm on the "hip" side. My yard spec'd a double 16" but that messed with my stair height so we went 3-14"s.

OP... since you're using up less than 12", could you opt for a 8' high door? I really am happy with mine.

Actually I'm ahead of the original lumberyard. The suggested I use four 2x10x10' and laminate my own. I said no thank you. They still delivered them but I can return anything I don't use. I'm positive, from looking at a few garages on my street that I'm ahead of 99% of garages in my neighborhood.

Cheers,

 

[spudley]

Actually I'm ahead of the original lumberyard. The suggested I use four 2x10x10' and laminate my own. I said no thank you. They still delivered them but I can return anything I don't use. I'm positive, from looking at a few garages on my street that I'm ahead of 99% of garages in my neighborhood.

Cheers,

Good choice. I don't mind laminating dimensional 2x's for a beam supported by posts but for a clear span, lvl's are hard to beat. And on the gable side, you should have no issues.

I think the inspector who ordered 5 jacks per side on Tractor Jeff's build must own stock in the local lumber yard.

 

[ford33]

Op if you have tall walls why not go with an 8 foot tall door? It will allow a large pickup or boat to park in the garage.

 

[Samh]

Extending the header to the wall for portal framing is indicated where the side walls of the door at less than a certain length, which I believe is 2 feet.

 

[NockOn]

Extending the header to the wall for portal framing is indicated where the side walls of the door at less than a certain length, which I believe is 2 feet.

Makes sense. My area doesn't require it but I'll do it because I don't want to waste that extra wood. Too expensive to toss in the burn pile LOL

Cheers,

Claude