M12 3/8 ratchets.... 2557 vs. 2567 (regular vs fast)

[VolvoRyan]

Hi gang,

I'm pretty well bought into the M12 platform. I have a need excuse to buy a cordless ratchet. Does anyone find they prefer the "regular" Fuel ratchet to the "high-speed" or vice-versa? Are the torque numbers (55 vs 35 ft-lbs, respectively) to be believed?

When I've used air ratchets, I always found them to be overkill for M6, M8, and even some M10 fasteners. Nowadays, impacts are small enough to pick up the slack in a lot of places.

Anyone with strong opinions?

Thanks!

-Ryan

 

[FigN⋅m]

My adequately fit opinion:

If I was getting paid to use it - high speed no question. Either/or both lengths.

Since I'm just a driveway bum, I picked up the o.g. M12 model on sale and have been happy
with its performance so far. I'm blessed with a rust-free car and I only see the torque
coming into play with nylock nuts etc. I am fairly certain I will end up with the long reach
high speed eventually, so I say treat yourself to which ever one entices you the most.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Having used snap-on as an example, 300rpm and 60ftlb, or 200rpm and 80, give me 80 every time. Which is what I did, I traded in my brushless for the high torque brushless. Even the brushed Brute version at 175rpm and 70 ftlb is better IMO. If you're okay slumming it and breaking stuff free with a gigantic clunky ratchet, that's one thing. I like to pull triggers and remove things. If the ratchet can't either break it free with a trigger pull or a neutral drop, you need to use a ratchet or wrench in most tight spaces, then switch to the power tool.

IMO the lower speed and higher torque make up their speed with removing more fasteners with less involvement from the user.

 

[WWheeler]

With cordless ratchets I really wouldn't want to go just by how much torque they offer because unlike a right-angle impacting ratchet (like the Milwaukee 2564-20) cordless ratchets have a finger-smashing jerk when they hit full stop. IMHO What you want to look for is one that can handle breaking stuff free and tightening by hand without damaging it so you can use the trigger to be your nut/bolt runner, and you want it to have enough power to do that with less-than-pristine threads.

I've used the Milwaukee cordless ratchets for years and have had a lot of trouble with them handling breaking free and tightening by hand, and the convenience a cordless ratchet offers is null if I have to swap the tool with a regular ratchet every time to do break free and finish tightening. I've had to replace the anvil assemblies on all of my Milwaukees at least once now. I have two down right now waiting on their second set of anvil assemblies to arrive.

I've more recently bought into Dewalt's cordless ratchet line-up and I like them so far, but it's too new to say whether they will be any more reliable than any of my Milwaukees. They are definitely the ones I grab first nowadays though. I do like that they have a lot more torque than any of the Milwaukees BUT they don't jerk as much when they hit full stop. They do a little, but it's much less risk of me smashing my fingers with them. That may just be due to the fact they are a little longer, which I also like BUT that also means in some instances they won't fit places my Milwaukees will.



TorqueTestChannel has done some good testing on Cordless ratchets of most brands worth checking out.

 

[Buckgnarly]

Having used snap-on as an example, 300rpm and 60ftlb, or 200rpm and 80, give me 80 every time. Which is what I did, I traded in my brushless for the high torque brushless. Even the brushed Brute version at 175rpm and 70 ftlb is better IMO. If you're okay slumming it and breaking stuff free with a gigantic clunky ratchet, that's one thing. I like to pull triggers and remove things. If the ratchet can't either break it free with a trigger pull or a neutral drop, you need to use a ratchet or wrench in most tight spaces, then switch to the power tool.

IMO the lower speed and higher torque make up their speed with removing more fasteners with less involvement from the user.

Agreed on this. Nothing more frustrating than switching to a ratchet to "help" remove some rusty **** that JUST barely is too tight for "high speed" stuff. For the like 5 to 15 seconds you are running stuff off the "high speed" stuff saves you .05 seconds. I'll take 20ft/lbs over .05 seconds, even 1 second any day.

Now on a side note, I saw the SO "brushless high torque" long neck on some media **** recently, please don't tell me there is a normal version also.....and REALLY please don't tell me that the "high torque" brushless is worth upgrading to...please.

 

[VolvoRyan]

Seems the overwhelming opinion is higher torque.... makes sense.

Indeed, the SO ratchets are super cool looking. I wish I could justify the buy in..... or that SO had a more diverse platform other than automotive/aerospace.

Thanks, guys!

-Ryan

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Seems the overwhelming opinion is higher torque.... makes sense.

Indeed, the SO ratchets are super cool looking. I wish I could justify the buy in..... or that SO had a more diverse platform other than automotive/aerospace.

Thanks, guys!

-Ryan

If you're not using it for work, snap on makes ZERO sense.

Fwiw my coworker bought an M12 insider. Nice form factor, 60 ftlb, has adapters for hex bit, 1/4, 3/8, plus their special sockets. If you're looking at m12 and a long neck, consider it. I personally think the long neck works better for a cordless ratchet. Keeps your hands out of the way and slims down your profile.

 

[richfinn]

I have a high speed, the head is more compact than the regular version which works slightly better for what I do (euro cars with lots of plastic parts and zero room), I have an ancient Snap-On FAR70 air ratchet if I need a bit more brute force.

 

[Hakeem]

Seems the overwhelming opinion is higher torque.... makes sense.

Indeed, the SO ratchets are super cool looking. I wish I could justify the buy in..... or that SO had a more diverse platform other than automotive/aerospace.

Thanks, guys!

-Ryan

I’m as far from a pro as they come but I’d vote for higher speed over higher torque. For me, the cordless ratchet comes out for applications with lots of small bolts (eg: valve covers, oil pans) or for longer bolts with limited access, where it’d be a huge pain to loosen it 15deg at a time. So the less time I have to wait for it to run the threads down/up, the better. I never considered it a burden to break it loose with a wrench.

I have the plain jane m12 ratchet and it’s fine. I don’t find it especially enjoyable to use, so it only comes out in the aforementioned scenarios.

 

[plinker]

I had picked up the regular fuel ratchet used from my Matco guy and it has worked very well for me. Torque is decent, though I will re check with a ratchet depending on what I'm doing (12mm bolts & larger). I picked up the extended length ratchet recently and debated the high speed vs regular fuel and decided on the fuel version. I didnt see the need for the higher speed (YMMV) as more torque is more helpful to me. The larger size ratchet head really has not been an issue like I originally thought it might be. The whole tool body itself isnt exactly small anyway.

6/8/10mm bolts are the common usage, rusted/heavy loctite on 10mm and 12mm and larger can be an issue with them and best to use an impact or break it free with something else. I treat them as nut runners that actually have enough torque to do something most of the time.

 

[WWheeler]

I had picked up the regular fuel ratchet used from my Matco guy and it has worked very well for me. Torque is decent, though I will re check with a ratchet depending on what I'm doing (12mm bolts & larger). I picked up the extended length ratchet recently and debated the high speed vs regular fuel and decided on the fuel version. I didnt see the need for the higher speed (YMMV) as more torque is more helpful to me. The larger size ratchet head really has not been an issue like I originally thought it might be. The whole tool body itself isnt exactly small anyway.

6/8/10mm bolts are the common usage, rusted/heavy loctite on 10mm and 12mm and larger can be an issue with them and best to use an impact or break it free with something else. I treat them as nut runners that actually have enough torque to do something most of the time.

OOPS, I was meaning to reply to the post above yours. Sorry.

Let's try this again ...

I’m as far from a pro as they come but I’d vote for higher speed over higher torque. For me, the cordless ratchet comes out for applications with lots of small bolts (eg: valve covers, oil pans) or for longer bolts with limited access, where it’d be a huge pain to loosen it 15deg at a time. So the less time I have to wait for it to run the threads down/up, the better. I never considered it a burden to break it loose with a wrench.

I have the plain jane m12 ratchet and it’s fine. I don’t find it especially enjoyable to use, so it only comes out in the aforementioned scenarios.

Like other above were discussing, and as the TorqueTestChannel YT vids embedded above show in their rounds of testing, the 'high speed' ratchets with a lower torque are definitely faster IF what you are working on has nice clean new threads. As soon as they start fighting any sort of rust or corrosion, not necessarily salt-belt level but the kind of stuff typical on most any vehicle after just a few years in most every part of the country, save maybe for Arizona, they can slow to a crawl or stop and leave you having to turn it manually making them much slower than a lower RPM higher torque model.

 

[oldschoolcraft]

If the ratchet can't either break it free with a trigger pull or a neutral drop, you need to use a ratchet or wrench in most tight spaces, then switch to the power tool.

IMO the lower speed and higher torque make up their speed with removing more fasteners with less involvement from the user.

I've never used a cordless ratchet, only an impact wrench. But I came up with the same theory that @2ndGearRubber 's real world experience uncovered.

That the high speed ratchet seems less good compared a slower one that has more torque. Unfortunately, it seems like they are prioritizing making the high speed ones. I wonder if that's because that's what the market is demanding, or that's what they perceive the market is demanding, or if it's just cheaper/easier to make those compared to high torque in the same size tool, and they are trying to make make it sound like they're ideal until the technology gets better to make them higher torque.

 

[darkzero]

I have had both and I prefer the high speed. Obviously I had the 1st gen Fuel first, was my very first M12 tool actually. I was never really happy with it. Used it at home on my own stuff so the time is money thing didn't apply. Although the big head didn't bother me, I didn't like how heavy & unbalanced it felt & really didn't like how slow it was. Maybe I was just spoiled by my 2 speed IR air ratchets but I haven't used them in years.

When the high speed was announced, I didn't have any interest. Then one day while using the 1st gen Fuel, I thought, ok I'm really not happy with this thing. As soon as the high speed was available, I bought it. First & only time I have ever paid full price for a MW tool, I always hunt for some kind of deal.

I like the high speed so much better. Not the prefect cordless ratchet but better than the 1st gen Fuel for my needs. Put a tall shift knob in it which made it even better.

There's no rust here that I need to deal with. I am now working on cars again & took my high speed to work. But the vehicles I work on are either new or barely seen the road & it's not repair work. The nylocks I run into aren't a problem. Yes there are times where I need to break things loose manually but that don't matter to me.

 

[VolvoRyan]

I'm leaning towards the "Regular" Fuel. High speed seems applicable to the job at hand, but the "regular" is probably fine, and more versatile for future jobs. Either way, 200rpm's is a lot faster than I am at swinging a ratchet.

-Ryan

 

[Rusted Nut]

I have the slow one. Bought my kid the high speed, big difference. I’d recommend getting the high speed if you’re not in the rust belt. Nice thing about the Milwaukee ratchets is you can use them manually to break stuff free.

 

[Kkmk]

I had the non fuel 3/8 and snapped the drive pin using it manually. Also dod the same to a Ryobi.

Warrantied it and gave it to a mate. Work replaces broken tools and got me a Fuel non-high-speed. Its massive and heavy but I trust it using it manually. Using it manually is the most important to me, because I feel any time saved with others then swapping to a hand ratchet to break/tighten are negated.

I’d probably choose high speed if I had the choice, because its nicer to zing up and then tighten by hand than run the impact up hard, jerk your knuckles into something, and then check tightness by hand anyway.

Definitely go for the tall knob though, so much easier to use.

 

[finn]

I have both the 3/8” drive regular and the high speed, plus the long version of the Dewalt. Of the three, the only one I’m comfortable with for breaking loose stubborn bolts, is the Dewalt. It feels sturdier, but that may be perceived, not real.

The Dewalt is heavier, though, so it’s not my first choice unless reach is an issue.

Of the two Milwaukee Fuel ratchets, the high speed wins.

 

[M635_Guy]

I like to pull triggers and remove things. If the ratchet can't either break it free with a trigger pull or a neutral drop, you need to use a ratchet or wrench in most tight spaces, then switch to the power tool.

IMO the lower speed and higher torque make up their speed with removing more fasteners with less involvement from the user.

I have the OG/higher torque model, and when the hi-speed came out I was easily able to avoid temptation because of the lower torque. I don't tend to want to really grump on the power ratchet, but with the specs I do crack a fair number of fasteners with it. The idea of 35 ft/lb made me feel like I'd swap between a regular ratchet to break things free and then swap to the M12 more often, which kinda makes the speed less useful. That's probably more in my head, but...

The size of the head is rarely an issue for me - I think my DIY work style tends to revert to regular ratchets in tight spaces.

 

[mreisner]

Having used snap-on as an example, 300rpm and 60ftlb, or 200rpm and 80, give me 80 every time. Which is what I did, I traded in my brushless for the high torque brushless. Even the brushed Brute version at 175rpm and 70 ftlb is better IMO. If you're okay slumming it and breaking stuff free with a gigantic clunky ratchet, that's one thing. I like to pull triggers and remove things. If the ratchet can't either break it free with a trigger pull or a neutral drop, you need to use a ratchet or wrench in most tight spaces, then switch to the power tool.

IMO the lower speed and higher torque make up their speed with removing more fasteners with less involvement from the user.

868?

 

[2ndGearRubber]

868?

CTR868 is the long neck high torque, the one I just picked up. They make a standard length as well, but I already have a Brute in that size.

 

[mreisner]

That's what I'm looking to get also is the long neck one, very happy with the one I have now but I can use just a bit more torque and with this being 25% more it should fit the bill. Speed isn't a problem, but I would definitely like a little bit more torque.

 

[boom_bap]

If go with the high speed. As a diyr, you have the luxury of breaking stuff loose with a ratchet and running out with the m12. If you break stuff loose all the time with the m12 the batteries get messed up and fall out of the tool. The high speed is nice for putting fasteners in when you’re holding heavy stuff in awkward positions.

I would also get 1/4 inch, I find myself using it more on smaller bolts and an impact on the bigger stuff. I have 3/8 and wish I had gotten the 1/4

 

[Rusted Nut]

I would also get 1/4 inch, I find myself using it more on smaller bolts and an impact on the bigger stuff. I have 3/8 and wish I had gotten the 1/4

I’ve thought about getting a 1/4” version, is the 1/4” that much smaller than the 3/8”? I use an adapter on my 3/8” with 1/4” drive sockets, works most of the time.

 

[boom_bap]

They are the same size. I think a lot of people buy the replacement head kit, so you can swap between them.

 

[JWC86]

I have a few configurations. The high speed long neck 1/4 is my go to and most used by far.

 

[darkzero]

got me a Fuel non-high-speed. Its massive and heavy but I trust it using it manually. Using it manually is the most important to me, because I feel any time saved with others then swapping to a hand ratchet to break/tighten are negated.

I’d probably choose high speed if I had the choice, because its nicer to zing up and then tighten by hand than run the impact up hard, jerk your knuckles into something, and then check tightness by hand anyway

Speaking of which & not that it actually matters cause we all do it with any powered ratchets anyways. But with the 1st gen Fuel, MW never stated it was ok to use it manually. When asked about it they only said they don't recommend it. Basically that's their answer just to cover their *** when need be.

With the High Speed Fuel, the specs actually do say it can be used manually. If you compare the 2 you can see MW made changes to the body/case & with bigger screws. Or maybe it has nothing to do with it.


When I had the 1st gen Fuel, I still used it to break free & tighten fastners. Although it had more torque it still wouldn't break fasteners loose for me many times. And I never trusted it tightening, I always snugged up by hand so the "higher torque" was useless to me.

I used air ratchets, & now cordless to speed up turning fasteners, so I rather have the speed, again tightening & loosening done manually. Some say the high speed may be too fast for their needs but keep in mind the trigger is variable speed, you don't have to go full send if you don't want to.

At work, my high speed ratchet is my second most used tool, some days it's the most used. I use it on fastener sizes from 5.5mm to 19mm. I deal with nylocs often & never had a problem running them on. Most of what I deal with is smaller than 14mm head size which will mostly break free with the power of the ratchet. Many of the fasteners I can tighten with the power of the high speed ratchet & be fine, if it had higher torque no.

No way I would go back to using the 1st gen Fuel for what I do (I grew to hate it anyway). But again, no rust here, & the vehicles I work on are new. If my HS broke tomorrow, I'd buy another one right after work.

And the fact that there is a tall shift knob for it is another huge plus (stupid MW should have included it). Today I had to use my coworker/team mate's high speed ratchet. I had forgot what it was like with the stock recessed shift knob. He didn't know about it & when I showed him mine he immediately wanted one.

It's not perfect but I still like it the most for what's currently available. Other coworkers have Makita, Snap-on, & Dewalt. One downside I have run into is when running SS nylocs onto SS screws 1" & longer, I have run into galled threads quite a number of times. Learned my lesson having to cut them off. So now I just remember to run them on slower with the variable trigger and/or add some oil to the threads.

 

[PCMusicGuy]

For ratchets, speed is way more important than torque for me. The first thing I will reach for is my fuel impact or even my impact driver with a hex socket adapter as those can both go North of 2500 rpm. My M12 ratchet is so slow by comparison. The high speed model is about twice as fast thankfully although a bigger tool and significantly slower than the impacts.