M12 3/8 ratchets

[2ndGearRubber]

Long rambling below - should I buy a 3/8 high speed M12?



My first M12 ratchet was a non-fuel 1/4 drive. It was retired for a fuel-long neck 1/4. I have been curious if a 3/8 electric ratchet would be an improvement to my work flow. I have a pneumatic right angle impact, and impacting air ratchet. Strictly electric as an option. So I converted the weak-sauce 1/4 non fuel ratchet to 3/8 with a new head kit. It's definitely weaker than the M12 Fuel long neck 1/4. Both of these ratchets work great on M6 and M8 hardware. But the 3/8 unit I want running 12mm+ stuff, so as a nut runner up to M12.

So now I have a fork in the road. The Fuel 3/8, the head is way too big and unacceptable. The high speed looks like the right size for what I'm doing, but the torque is 35 ft/lbs. This is only rated at 5? ft/lbs higher than my weak 1/4 converted to 3/8 non-fuel test subject. I want the 3/8 ratchet to work. Mostly it's a nut runner. But it's so weak anything above finger tight doesn't really cooperate.

So here's the issue. I want a 3/8 electric ratchet. M12 non-fuel 1/4 converted to 3/8 is weak. So I don't use it a lot. Which makes me worry the high speed 3/8 will be too weak, which makes me not want to spend $150 on it. Snap on makes one, but I'm invested in M12. It's like $700 for a snap on kit with battery and charger. Very tepid on that route.

 

[dnschmidt]

All cordless ratchets are nut runners. None have the torque of a air ratchet and particularly an impacting air ratchet. The FUEL high speed is certainly better than the OG non-fuel. I have the 3/8 long neck high speed but that's a $249 ratchet. So the question is do you want the long neck or don't you. If you do it's going to cost you about $100 more than the standard neck.

 

[oilslick]

you want the best go snap on brushless.if you can do second best for big savings then get the dewalt off the MAC truck. I am in a ag shop and we run them hard, Milwaukee is not up to our kind of hard work where nuts tend to be hard turning and I also like to rev them up and slam onto nuts to break loose. It’s abuse but I have little patience for weak tools, Milwaukee has way too much protection against ruining themselves by running high amp draw. The dewalt is impressive, especially for the money. By the way I was all Milwaukee, now I’m dewalt impacts,snap on ratchet s. Mac, and some Milwaukee.

 

[Wrench97]

I had M12 at the fleet shop they are now mostly here at home, I went with a Dewalt 12v at the shop and like it better then the M12's it has more torque and runs faster the down side are the batteries I'm charging them a lot more often then the M12's but mostly I still like air over electric except inside the vehicle or walking out front to do something quick I grab a battery tool, I never had a long neck so I may be missing something there.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

I specifically do not want a 3/8 long neck. I want the smaller for factor. I'll look at dewalt too.


EDIT: Now I'm thinking more about the long neck........

 

[2ndGearRubber]

you want the best go snap on brushless.if you can do second best for big savings then get the dewalt off the MAC truck. I am in a ag shop and we run them hard, Milwaukee is not up to our kind of hard work where nuts tend to be hard turning and I also like to rev them up and slam onto nuts to break loose. It’s abuse but I have little patience for weak tools, Milwaukee has way too much protection against ruining themselves by running high amp draw. The dewalt is impressive, especially for the money. By the way I was all Milwaukee, now I’m dewalt impacts,snap on ratchet s. Mac, and some Milwaukee.

I "neutral drop" my 1/4 long neck regularly, doesn't seem to hurt anything. I figured the high speed would be preferable for my use specfically for using this technique.

Hard turning is the perfect phrase for what bolts I'm seeing. I just want to help pull out rear caliper bracket bolts, 15mm head and under sized stuff. Straight nut running on M12 hardware, but for M10 with some crust or locktite I'd like it to do that.

 

[Rusted Nut]

Yes, get the high speed. I have the first Gen, slow one; and it is slow. Bought my kid the high speed, a world of difference. Get the high speed, you will be disappointed with the other one.

 

[JWC86]

I got a 1/4 high speed long neck recently and wasn’t sure about the long neck at first but got used to it quick and prefer it for most applications.

I also have a original 3/8 and although the specs for ft/lb are similar it sure seems like the new high speed hits harder. And the speed is addicting. Makes the non high speed seem really slow when I go back to it.

I would recommend the 3/8 long neck high speed.

 

[ihateminimumwage]

The 3/8" High Speed is miles ahead of the original ratchet and doesn't have the giant head of the original Fuel. Absolutely worth it, I use mine daily.

 

[dnschmidt]

I bought a DeWalt 12V extended reach 3/8" drive ratchet as some people here sang the praises of it. I'm not that impressed.

1) It’s too long. Actually about two inches longer than the Milwaukee long neck of any variety.
2) It has a large head. Sort of similar to the non-high speed extended reach Milwaukee.
3) Might have more torque but so what. At the end of the day it's a ratchet and if the bolts is tough it can be used in manual mode to remove damn near anything as long as it is.

Astro just came out with a 22" long neck air ratchet (model 1120) that puts out 85 ft-lb which is a lot more than any cordless will do. But it seems stupid to me (I apologize to all my friends at Astro) but I try to tell it as I see it. What’s next three foot long air or cordless ratchets? There does come a point of diminishing returns.

 

[InjectorService]

I bought a DeWalt 12V extended reach 3/8" drive ratchet as some people here sang the praises of it. I'm not that impressed.

1) It’s too long. Actually about two inches longer than the Milwaukee long neck of any variety.
2) It has a large head. Sort of similar to the non-high speed extended reach Milwaukee.
3) Might have more torque but so what. At the end of the day it's a ratchet and if the bolts is tough it can be used in manual mode to remove damn near anything as long as it is.

Astro just came out with a 22" long neck air ratchet (model 1120) that puts out 85 ft-lb which is a lot more than any cordless will do. But it seems stupid to me (I apologize to all my friends at Astro) but I try to tell it as I see it. What’s next three foot long air or cordless ratchets? There does come a point of diminishing returns.

It's funny you say that. I can't believe someone actually offers that I've never come across it. but I have a specific use for it and I think I'm going to buy it now.

 

[richfinn]

I bought the standard length high speed 3/8 Milwaukee, I use it mostly for vehicle battery/ignition coil installation (so mostly M6 and m8 bolts/nuts), and some interior & trim work.

I absolutely love this tool for roadside assistance work

For my applications it's near perfect as I'm not dealing with much corrosion or Loctite and once you break loose it will zip stuff on and off very fast. I doubt it has the muscle your looking for though.

I have an ancient Snap On FAR70 air ratchet if I need "knuckle busting" type torque on transmissions and engines (in the workshop)

Maybe what you really want is an impacting (reactionless) type 3/8 cordless ratchet??

 

[Buckgnarly]

I have had a bunch of Milwaykee ratchets, but wound up biting the bullet for the Snap On brushless in reg and long. They are both better than the Milwaukee in both power and size. Speed I really don't care about, it's not a huge difference in time, and when the anemic high speed Milwaukee can't run a rusty nut off you lose all that time.
Also keep in mind I get the discount from Snap On, though I paid close to retail for the long neck brushless.
Fun fact, SO took all their cordless ratchets off the SEP site, guess they are selling too well to offer discounts!

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Thank you for all the input guys. I think dnschmidt has made me reconsider long neck. I'm going to do some thinking about the exact form factor required.

I will also reconsider snap on despite the high price as rusty and crusty m8 and m12 fasteners would be great. I'll take some measurements and compare to my pneumatic tools.


Keep the inputs coming.

 

[Tallpilot]

What M12 users need is a second gen right angle impact. Something that can do 200+ lb/ft with a HO battery.

I don't think any of the ratchets are going to be 100% up to the task of rusty brake caliper bolts.

I find the 3/8 stubby with a HO battery is currently the best tool in the M12 line-up for them.

 

[finn]

I bought the Milwaukee 3/8” High speed fuel. Not impressed. Pretty weak.

That drove me to the extended Dewalt Extreme 12v. Not a big fan of that, either, as it’s quite heavy.

Not sure where I’ll go from here, but maybe the standard length 12v Dewalt, or, just forget about electric and go back to non powered ratchets. I don’t do this for a living, so speed really isn’t a critical factor for me.

I like tools, though.

 

[GeoBruin]

Baffled by people who buy electric ratchets with the speed and torque figures right on the box and then are surprised when they perform...exactly as advertised.

 

[dnschmidt]

What M12 users need is a second gen right angle impact. Something that can do 200+ lb/ft with a HO battery.

I don't think any of the ratchets are going to be 100% up to the task of rusty brake caliper bolts.

I find the 3/8 stubby with a HO battery is currently the best tool in the M12 line-up for them.

YOU HIT THE NAIL ON THE HEAD. This is what is really needed by the rust belt boys. Here in Arizona this is a non-issue as we don't allow rusty bolts to cross the border. That's a lie, every winter we get inundated by them from the Minnesota, Iowa and parts North people. The current M12 right angle impact is a 98 ft-lb weakling. If they can give this tool the guts of the Stubby impact that would be the final answer.

 

[dnschmidt]

Baffled by people who buy electric ratchets with the speed and torque figures right on the box and then are surprised when they perform...exactly as advertised.

You expect people to READ!!! Com'on Man!

 

[GeoBruin]

You expect people to READ!!! Com'on Man!

But that's the thing. You don't even have to read. There are YouTube channels like TTC that test and summarize the performance of nearly every wrench/ratchet on the market in a succinct and entertaining manner. Like you have to try to be uninformed these days.

 

[setfocus]

I've only got the m12 high speed in 1/4 drive, so I don't know how it compares to the bushed in torque. I know it feels like it has less power than my bluepoint 1/4 air ratchet. But the bluepoint has horrible socket retention (have lost sockets) and no variable speed trigger, so since I got the m12 HS, I haven't touched the bluepoint. I know my snapon far7200 won't always run off GM bracket bolts coated with the yellow locktite and that ratchet is definitely a knuckle buster

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Baffled by people who buy electric ratchets with the speed and torque figures right on the box and then are surprised when they perform...exactly as advertised.

I know the ratchets are weak sauce. That's why I'm looking for data and input on getting the most power possible.

This isn't my first rodeo.

 

[GeoBruin]

I know the ratchets are weak sauce. That's why I'm looking for data and input on getting the most power possible.

This isn't my first rodeo.

My comment wasn't directed at you, or anyone in particular. That said, I do think the Torque Test Channel videos would help answer a lot of your questions.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

My comment wasn't directed at you, or anyone in particular. That said, I do think the Torque Test Channel videos would help answer a lot of your questions.

I have watched all of their ratchet videos, and am subscribed.

I'm more interested in real world feedback. Running clean nuts and bolts on a dyno rig has little value to me outside of outright speed testing.

 

[GeoBruin]

I have watched all of their ratchet videos, and am subscribed.

I'm more interested in real world feedback. Running clean nuts and bolts on a dyno rig has little value to me outside of outright speed testing.

So you think that if one ratchet repeatedly demonstrates (for example) higher torque than another on a dyno, that somehow their relative performance will change under field conditions? That magically some rust/dirt/grease etc. on a fastener will change one's ability to deliver a given amount of torque? I understand that those field conditions may affect the actual torque required to spin a fastener of a given size/thread, but the relative performance of the ratchets is unchanged.

Or am I misunderstanding and you're looking for some kind of subjective feedback on usability?

 

[finn]

Baffled by people who buy electric ratchets with the speed and torque figures right on the box and then are surprised when they perform...exactly as advertised.

Who’s surprised? All reports are pretty much in agreement that they’re suitable for nut running on virgin or near virgin fasteners, but pretty weak or marginal on “seasoned “ hardware.

Affirmation is a lot different than surprise.

Milwaukee tried to address this shortcoming with their (70 ft lb) ratchet, but it was a market failure because of its slow speed.

The impact derivatives have a huge and clunky head, so that’s a problem, too.

No surprise involved. Lots of affirmation, though.

 

[InjectorService]

One thing I find with the M12 tools in general, is use the larger 4.0 or 6.0 batteries. They just have more power.

Have any of you tried the High Output batteries?

 

[Wrench97]

I've only got the m12 high speed in 1/4 drive, so I don't know how it compares to the bushed in torque. I know it feels like it has less power than my bluepoint 1/4 air ratchet. But the bluepoint has horrible socket retention (have lost sockets) and no variable speed trigger, so since I got the m12 HS, I haven't touched the bluepoint. I know my snapon far7200 won't always run off GM bracket bolts coated with the yellow locktite and that ratchet is definitely a knuckle buster

I don't even attempt to use 3/8" 12v ratchet for bracket to knuckle bolts, only for the caliper to bracket bolts.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

So you think that if one ratchet repeatedly demonstrates (for example) higher torque than another on a dyno, that somehow their relative performance will change under field conditions? That magically some rust/dirt/grease etc. on a fastener will change one's ability to deliver a given amount of torque? I understand that those field conditions may affect the actual torque required to spin a fastener of a given size/thread, but the relative performance of the ratchets is unchanged.

Or am I misunderstanding and you're looking for some kind of subjective feedback on usability?

Both:

Snap on brushless ratchets don't show up for me when searching "torque test channel snap on ratchet" on youtube. Maybe I missed it. So I'm missing an entire data point which people in the thread have made positive statements about. I did watch a few other videos about the brushless units on youtube. The head on the snap on is smaller than the 3/8 fuel non high speed M12, while making similar torque. While torque on a dyno is fun, and also very valuable data, it's not the real world. Bolt takes 20ft/lb to spin, until a section of locktite raises this to 25ft/lb. However this ramp in required force will cause a spike in current draw. Depending on how the ratchet electronics are setup, a high enough sudden inrush current could cause a forced power cut on the unit despite the ratchet being rated for 30ft/lb. I like TTC, and have bought numerous tools thanks to their testing. I'm being super picky about this and I want more than they have offered.


I also want subjective feedback. I'm now interested in snap on, and long neck, after feedback here. I'm thinking the higher torque with a marginally larger head would be worthwhile. I sat my M12 long neck and standard head down on my tool box and did some thinking today. I'm really stuck on this, as the long neck would be better overall access, but worse for working within a wheel well. With considering such a tool, with 60ft/lb advertised torque, I'm also concerned I am ignoring criteria in my application of needs because I typically cannot use an electric ratchet for such work.

Two coworkers told me to just by both from snap on. LOL

I don't even attempt to use 3/8" 12v ratchet for bracket to knuckle bolts, only for the caliper to bracket bolts.

I'd like to break an M10 55ft/lb bracket bolt free with a ratchet, then swap the electric in the run the bolt. This would be quieter and not require swapping an air line off my cut off wheel while do brakes, saving maybe 30 seconds overall on a single axle brake job.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

One thing I find with the M12 tools in general, is use the larger 4.0 or 6.0 batteries. They just have more power.

Have any of you tried the High Output batteries?

I have not tried the new HO batteries. When I have another battery failure I will likely consider HO for the replacement. I normally keep a 2.0 on my ratchets for form factor.

 

[plinker]

I've used the regular fuel 3/8 ratchet on some car caliper bracket bolts, mixed results, mainly from random amounts of threadlocker and/or rust. I ended up with a 1/2 drive fuel ratchet two years ago and it does better with bracket bolts, car/truck, but some it just wont handle, threadlocker build up being the issue. There's been times where I just ratchet the bolts out, unless I can fit a 1/2 impact and run them out that way. 3/4 ton GM truck rear brakes are are a pain with the loctite they use, plus access issues.

FWIW, I'm running 3.0/4.0 batteries unless I have a reason to use a 2.0. I've run into where a long neck 3/8 would be useful, still have yet to actually buy one though.

The boss has a couple of the Snap-on 3/8 units, they are better in some ways (ratchet head mainly IMO), but for me it isnt worth it for the extra money over the Milwaukee. Same with the Matco cordless. Having a reliable Snap-on dealer may make some difference.

 

[Zewnten]

I use a 3/8 fuel almost every day. Works fine on 1/2 and under bolts, above that thread conditions really matter if it's going to work on it's own or if I'm going to have to assist with ratcheting the tool through the rough spots.

 

[johninct]

Is there such a thing as a Snap-On 1/4" cordless ratchet with 3/8" square drive ( without an adaptor)?

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Choice made, SNA shareholders rejoice. 3/8 brushless long neck 3/8. I'm happy with the power using it for a few brake jobs today.

THANK YOU to those who put snap on back onto my radar despite the price. This was my least favorite color option, but it was in stock and on sale, it can manage with it.