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Making a spring for a clutch

rmack898

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 23, 2007
Messages
3,148
Location
Honu Grove NE Florida
So last year at an auction, I bought a plate compactor with a blown Honda engine and a bunch of other stuff for $24.
I figured worse case, I would repower the compactor with a Predator motor from HF. As I figured the Honda was toast and I bought a Predator to replace it.
The compactor is driven with a Vee belt through a centrifugal clutch. When I took the clutch off the Honda motor I found that one of the springs in the clutch was broken. I figured no big deal just buy a new spring and move on with the repower.

I checked everywhere for a new spring, McMaster, Amazon, springs R us, you name it I tried it, no joy. A new clutch price put me in the neighborhood of a new compactors that was out.

The only way forward was to make a new spring. The first place to start making a new spring is Machinery's Handbook. For those of you that don't know, Machinery's Handbook is the Bible for all things mechanical. The book itself is fairly small but very thick with a few thousand pages. Machinist's tool boxes have a drawer in the center of the specifically sized for the book.
998FD06C-202C-48A4-8D64-8D62D665F6CC.jpeg

So after measuring the remaining clutch spring that I needed to duplicate, I needed to get some music wire to make the spring from. McMaster had the wire I needed and the brown truck brought it the next day. .071" diameter music wire.
A0CAC82C-7B34-4E81-986E-2E9DCC447C35.jpeg

Back to Machinery's Handbook. There are pages and pages on the design of springs. I don't need to design a spring only replicate a spring, so I go right to the table for spring arbors to get the size arbor I need to wind the spring I need to make.
4FCA871B-03B4-4C20-A48D-69F6FC52BF76.jpeg
Full disclosure here: The pages and print is very small in MH and I read the wrong line on the chart and made the wrong size arbor. I only discovered my mistake after I made the arbor and wound the spring and the diameter was way off. Back to MH and realized I read the wrong line and made the arbor the wrong size. Old eyes and small print, what can I say but time to make a new arbor.
EB5BE853-B68C-4145-8AAF-E1BEB130733E_1_201_a.jpeg
Now that I have the right size arbor for the spring I need to make, there is one more tool needed. I need to make a tool to feed and tension the music wire in the lathe while I wind the spring. I don't plan on making springs for a living so I made a quick tool from what I had in the scrap bin. I used a piece of 1/2" thick aluminum flat bar to make the tool. I drilled a hole for the music wire to feed through and then drilled and tapped a hole perpendicular to it for a screw to keep tension on the wire. I milled a 1/2" shank on it to fit in a BXA tool holder.

9F42838C-B588-47C3-BAF9-DCD711DDD729.jpeg
This was my first time making a spring and I didn't think that I would get it right the first time and I was 100% correct. I didn't get it right on the second try and three was not the charm. I got a fairly good spring on the fifth try but the winner was # 6. This is and extension spring and the eyes have to be formed after the spring is wound, and that part kicks my ***. Vice grips, a punch, a hammer, and a cut off wheel in a dremel tool finally got me the spring I needed. I did not wind these springs under power since the spring was only 5 coils. I set the wire in the arbor and turned the lathe chuck by hand.
B1F067F1-0D04-4C0F-A14D-3ABDB2709F25.jpeg

7088DB4A-D740-469C-B62A-0C05F00AE8BD.jpeg

The music wire from McMaster was less than $10 and I managed to repair a clutch that I couldn't afford to replace.
7B8EDAE4-3972-43C4-A5B3-D9B380670A59.jpeg
 

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The Cobbler

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Staff member
Joined
Oct 24, 2013
Messages
25,836
Location
Niagara Region, Ontario, Canada
nice job. thanks for sharing.
I remember Mustie 1 did a video on a missing spring on a clutch and he found something closer that worked.
unfortunately we are in an ever increasing throw away society and stuff like this happens less & less .
 

tool_scrounge

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 20, 2010
Messages
4,173
Location
Southern California
Nice write up.

Did you make a spare spring? I consider it the insurance policy. If I have a spare it will never be needed. But if I do not, usually it is needed :)
 

stinkity stoink

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 8, 2007
Messages
731
Location
New Jersey
Nice save !! I like the write up as I am a total newbie with my lathe and mill and love seeing things that can be done with it.
 

txvwnut

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Joined
Jan 1, 2015
Messages
7,603
Location
Bedford, Texas
I've attempted making springs once. My results were as I suspected them to be, actually less than. I gave up on it as I changed the whole apparatus that I was making the springs for. The OP's final spring turned out awesome.
 

cpttuna

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Joined
Oct 31, 2014
Messages
13,176
Location
napoleon ohio
Just my $.02. I walked into my local Ace hardware the other day. They had about 6 big boxes on the floor marked CLEARANCE. One of the boxes must have had 200 different springs in it. I would think that a place like Ace could provide a spring that could be made to work?
 

The Cobbler

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Staff member
Joined
Oct 24, 2013
Messages
25,836
Location
Niagara Region, Ontario, Canada
I would think that a place like Ace could provide a spring that could be made to work?
But, this is GJ, and part of belonging here is that you have to make a one off project. In order to do that you may need to buy 20K in tools & equipment. How do you earn your stripes by going & buying something that costs $6.95 when you can make it for a few thousand dollars?:lol_hitti
 

Merch1

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 28, 2014
Messages
292
As a lot of us on GJ can attest, the satisfaction of making something with our hands and some imagination, skills etc is what keeps us excited to have a shop/garage, place to fiddle and a reason to get up in the morning.
 

2oolhound

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Joined
Dec 18, 2010
Messages
5,918
Location
BC Canada
As a lot of us on GJ can attest, the satisfaction of making something with our hands and some imagination, skills etc is what keeps us excited to have a shop/garage, place to fiddle and a reason to get up in the morning.
This is so true but the other thing is the moment you step foot out of your yard you enter down a rabbit hole where a whole myriad of **** awaits you. Fender benders, parking tickets, parking spaces, pickpockets, squabbles, ****** salesmen etc. plus you end up coming back half a day later with 3 or 4 different springs all from different places and none of them are quite right.
Much better to stay home and make one yourself.

Nice work OP!
 

Sumboodie

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Joined
Mar 20, 2021
Messages
10,663
Location
AK
What plate compactor is under $200 new?
One I have was about $12k. Even the little ones are $800-1000+
 
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Modern Garage

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Joined
Mar 26, 2015
Messages
583
Location
Southern Minnesota
The problem is, Capttuna, that when you go into the Ace store to pick up the spring you need you discover it's not there because they just threw two garbage canfulls into the dumpster to make room for more Bluetooth head sets and plastic plumbing parts. They had boxes of rare hardware fittings marked "clearance" but customers just walked right by them with their noses in their phones so out they went.
I count my blessings that I'm near a real hardware store - creaky floors, third generation owners, "We Fix Screens" sign in the window. I try to patronize them as much as I can so they stay open. Last month I needed a six volt bulb for an antique radio repair. Fetched it out of a flat cardboard display that looked to be from the sixties. Love this place!
Joe
 

mikegt4

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Joined
Sep 12, 2005
Messages
3,265
Location
sw ohio
The problem is, Capttuna, that when you go into the Ace store to pick up the spring you need you discover it's not there because they just threw two garbage canfulls into the dumpster to make room for more Bluetooth head sets and plastic plumbing parts. They had boxes of rare hardware fittings marked "clearance" but customers just walked right by them with their noses in their phones so out they went.
I count my blessings that I'm near a real hardware store - creaky floors, third generation owners, "We Fix Screens" sign in the window. I try to patronize them as much as I can so they stay open. Last month I needed a six volt bulb for an antique radio repair. Fetched it out of a flat cardboard display that looked to be from the sixties. Love this place!
Joe
Those 3rd generation stores are becoming extinct, a local store is closing after nearly 100 years. The neighborhood has changed in the last 20 years and the older clientele has been dying off. Covid hit it hard and when a Menards opened about 2 miles down the street the writing was on the wall. I was in there about a month ago looking for something that no one else had. Add in that the city has been "revitalizing" the business district with trendy shops and wants the land.

 

mark-NJ

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 1, 2019
Messages
769
Location
new jersey
Did you just wrap hardened piano wire? Or did you anneal, wrap, heat & quench harden, then relieve? I've never made a spring, but I would think the latter would be the way. No?
 

bimmer1980

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 5, 2009
Messages
2,104
Location
York, PA
Nice job on forming the spring!!

I was in a similar situation a number of years ago with a "new to me" (it was old) power trowel. The clutch that is between the motor and the main gear box was toasted due to broken springs. It would immediately engage upon start up. I was able to tear it apart and then I bought a variety pack of "brake drum" springs from advanced auto. With some modification, I was able to get two of the springs to work.

Ended up working well for me and I power troweled the 40 yards of concrete in the floor of the garage.

Good tutorial on spring making. I am now set up with a lathe and would have the capability. Back when I was building the garage, I did not have access to my lathe.
 

Firebrick43

Well-known member
Joined
May 12, 2015
Messages
13,999
Location
West central Indiana
So last year at an auction, I bought a plate compactor with a blown Honda engine and a bunch of other stuff for $24.
I figured worse case, I would repower the compactor with a Predator motor from HF. As I figured the Honda was toast and I bought a Predator to replace it.
The compactor is driven with a Vee belt through a centrifugal clutch. When I took the clutch off the Honda motor I found that one of the springs in the clutch was broken. I figured no big deal just buy a new spring and move on with the repower.

I checked everywhere for a new spring, McMaster, Amazon, springs R us, you name it I tried it, no joy. A new clutch price put me in the neighborhood of a new compactors that was out.

The only way forward was to make a new spring. The first place to start making a new spring is Machinery's Handbook. For those of you that don't know, Machinery's Handbook is the Bible for all things mechanical. The book itself is fairly small but very thick with a few thousand pages. Machinist's tool boxes have a drawer in the center of the specifically sized for the book.
998FD06C-202C-48A4-8D64-8D62D665F6CC.jpeg

So after measuring the remaining clutch spring that I needed to duplicate, I needed to get some music wire to make the spring from. McMaster had the wire I needed and the brown truck brought it the next day. .071" diameter music wire.
A0CAC82C-7B34-4E81-986E-2E9DCC447C35.jpeg

Back to Machinery's Handbook. There are pages and pages on the design of springs. I don't need to design a spring only replicate a spring, so I go right to the table for spring arbors to get the size arbor I need to wind the spring I need to make.
4FCA871B-03B4-4C20-A48D-69F6FC52BF76.jpeg
Full disclosure here: The pages and print is very small in MH and I read the wrong line on the chart and made the wrong size arbor. I only discovered my mistake after I made the arbor and wound the spring and the diameter was way off. Back to MH and realized I read the wrong line and made the arbor the wrong size. Old eyes and small print, what can I say but time to make a new arbor.
EB5BE853-B68C-4145-8AAF-E1BEB130733E_1_201_a.jpeg
Now that I have the right size arbor for the spring I need to make, there is one more tool needed. I need to make a tool to feed and tension the music wire in the lathe while I wind the spring. I don't plan on making springs for a living so I made a quick tool from what I had in the scrap bin. I used a piece of 1/2" thick aluminum flat bar to make the tool. I drilled a hole for the music wire to feed through and then drilled and tapped a hole perpendicular to it for a screw to keep tension on the wire. I milled a 1/2" shank on it to fit in a BXA tool holder.

9F42838C-B588-47C3-BAF9-DCD711DDD729.jpeg
This was my first time making a spring and I didn't think that I would get it right the first time and I was 100% correct. I didn't get it right on the second try and three was not the charm. I got a fairly good spring on the fifth try but the winner was # 6. This is and extension spring and the eyes have to be formed after the spring is wound, and that part kicks my ***. Vice grips, a punch, a hammer, and a cut off wheel in a dremel tool finally got me the spring I needed. I did not wind these springs under power since the spring was only 5 coils. I set the wire in the arbor and turned the lathe chuck by hand.
B1F067F1-0D04-4C0F-A14D-3ABDB2709F25.jpeg

7088DB4A-D740-469C-B62A-0C05F00AE8BD.jpeg

The music wire from McMaster was less than $10 and I managed to repair a clutch that I couldn't afford to replace.
7B8EDAE4-3972-43C4-A5B3-D9B380670A59.jpeg
Nicely done.
 

bwringer

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
10,253
Location
Indianapolis
Did you just wrap hardened piano wire? Or did you anneal, wrap, heat & quench harden, then relieve? I've never made a spring, but I would think the latter would be the way. No?
No added treatment is needed. Music wire/piano wire has the needed properties.

To think about this another way, music wire (if it were actually used in a stringed instrument; "music wire" these days is more of a shorthand for wire with specific properties) needs to have enough elasticity so that it doesn't work-harden or break as it flexes/vibrates, along with enough strength so that it doesn't permanently deform when within the limits of the material.

To form a spring, you're deliberately exceeding its elastic limits in one way. When you're using it as a spring, you have to stay within a specific range of motion.

It's not hardened, but it is pretty hard and so you need to be mindful about what you use to cut the stuff.
 

dutchgray

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 28, 2014
Messages
6,465
Location
Dorset. England.
I know I have a spare clutch spring on hand because a few years ago I had to replace the clutch on one of our plate compactors after it had worn out, it had one broken spring and one good one, we kept the spring as a just in case spare.
 

Monza Harry

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 29, 2018
Messages
1,433
Location
Windsor ON
I find it hard to believe that spring couldn't be sourced. I bought springs of different strengths [different engagement RPM"s] for one of my go-cart clutches (Comet) I think some actually came from "Jegs" as they had a pretty decent Jr. Dragster section. Here are a few sites worth checking out for spares. Harry
 

jpaw

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
524
Location
Michigan
You really should replace both springs. You have no idea of the tension of the original spring and at least with 2 homemade springs you'll have a better opportunity for even engagement.

Great work creating a solution.
 

hop up

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 22, 2010
Messages
121
Great job on the spring and that’s how we made them in the Model shop .Also we used a Carlson and Perkins spring winder Machine co. This is the picture of the Perkins and you can coil with different points and arbors So it’s basically a mechanical spring winder.
Music wire is half hard and can be heated for a higher load but not necessarily but longevity will be shorter..
 

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