Material Cost: Metal vs. Stick built

[96Mustang460cid]

I have searched on this site, but have been unsuccessful in finding a thread discussing this. It seems like this would be a common question and I could be using the wrong key words, but I couldn't find anything.

With the cost of steel so high, how do the costs of materials compare between metal and stick built? I am not counting the man-hours to assemble/build the structure. If it matters, let's assume a 60'x40' shop.

Best I can tell, people regularly go with metal shops because they're more available. Outside of that, what are the other advantages or disadvantages of each type of building?

Have a good day!
Michael

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Most people compare TOTAL cost. Merely comparing the cost of materials doesn't consider the fact that it is difficult for one or two people to assemble a metal building, most are put up by erection crews. I think materials actually work out similar in cost, but I don't have any hard facts. Much of this depends on how you plan on finishing the inside of the building. Most metal buildings are left unfinished inside but this makes the walls virtually useless for mounting and hanging items. If you consider building false walls inside a steel building, your costs just went up greatly. Also, generally, people wire steel buildings with conduit, as the wiring is exposed and must be protected somehow. With stick structures, the wiring is usually romex in the walls, a cheaper and easier way to go.

Much of this depends on personal preference and if you intend on doing the work or hiring it done. Steel buildings vary from the "carport" shelter type construction using 2x2 galvanized tubing, to the 6" corrugated Quonset hut or straight wall variety of the same, to a standard "red iron" and C channel and Z purlin type of commercial steel building. You have to know what you want and how to compare all types.

Personally, if I had the money to do it over, I'd do 8" or better solid poured concrete walls with a steel roof truss system and steel sheeting.

Charles

 

[dwilliams35]

On the other hand, while it may take a half dozen people to get a metal building up, the man-hours will probably be similar: my 30x40x12 with two doors went from slab to finished in about 1 3/4 work days with four guys working on it. Turnkey, doors, insulation, and everything. Steel is on the way down: you definitely need to just keep an eye on the trends on it: I really personally like the steel buildings better: Lots easier to wire, etc. after initial construction.

 

[rcleaver]

I've been working on a spreadsheet for both a 40x60x16 and 50x80x16 project, to compare the differences between doing a larger and smaller garage in wood and then comparable steel costs. I've been tweaking it for months and thinking about how to build it alone to reduce labor costs.

The materials costs for the wood garage are much less. I can build either of the garages with wood and finish them for much less than just the materials costs for the steel building. And by finishing I mean windows, doors, sheathing (interior and exterior), insulation, a bathroom, kitchen, utility room with washer, dryer, sink, water heater, humidifier, furnace, heat pump and ducting.

Also, there's no reason you can't do it alone with the right equipment. I'm designing a jig to use in building the walls. I'll need a rough terrain forklift that will extend to the peak of the gable, and a man lift.

I'm not sure about using trusses because I'd like to use storage trusses but I don't know if they can span the distance and provide the support for additional finished space (my understanding is there is no load on the bottom chord of standard trusses).

 

[dwilliams35]

I've been working on a spreadsheet for both a 40x60x16 and 50x80x16 project, to compare the differences between doing a larger and smaller garage in wood and then comparable steel costs.

The materials costs for the wood garage are much less. I can build either of the garages with wood and finish them for much less than just the materials costs for the steel building. And by finishing I mean windows, doors, sheathing, insulation, a bathroom, kitchen, utility room with washer, dryer, sink, water heater, furnace, and ducting.

Also, there's no reason you can't do it alone with the right equipment. I'm designing a jig to use in building the walls. I'll need a rough terrain forklift that will extend to the peak of the gable, and a man lift.

I'm not sure about using trusses because I'd like to use storage trusses but I don't know if they can span the distance and provide the support for additional finished space (my understanding is there is no load on the bottom chord of standard trusses).

Are you figuring this as a preengineered building or "stick building" one with steel? I've not figured it the second way in a long time, but around here, there's no way there's that much difference. This could be regional differences in the cost of the materials, but steel has to get pretty high to lose out to wood on just the basic shell construction: the steel building's erection cost generally gets covered by the difference in materials cost. One way or another, I'd certainly sit on it and wait a few months: given the scrap metal price crash, I'd say that finished metal prices won't be far behind: it's still pretty high right now, and it's never been anywhere near what it was a few months ago.

 

[rcleaver]

Are you figuring this as a preengineered building or "stick building" one with steel? I've not figured it the second way in a long time, but around here, there's no way there's that much difference. This could be regional differences in the cost of the materials, but steel has to get pretty high to lose out to wood on just the basic shell construction: the steel building's erection cost generally gets covered by the difference in materials cost. One way or another, I'd certainly sit on it and wait a few months: given the scrap metal price crash, I'd say that finished metal prices won't be far behind: it's still pretty high right now, and it's never been anywhere near what it was a few months ago.

I'm comparing wood costs to a pre-engineered steel building. I'd like to compare with "stick" built steel but I haven't gotten a quote for the steel yet. I agree on waiting -- I'm not planning on building until next spring at the earliest.

The pre-engineered steel buildings have a lot of (high cost?) labor built-in plus, apparently, a hefty profit for the company.

 

[sam 8]

Just went though this last summer.
My contractor, a long time friend, did my addition as he was doing the calcs on his 40x50 shop, comparing his contractor costs to about 6 different steel building compaines who he had bidding against each other on the project.
His findings, in this area, led him to stick build it.
Lumber is down quite a bit, and steel has been up.
Truth be told, I think in today's world lots of time on the spreadsheet is going to be necessary to figure in all the variables, little options, etc. along with materials costs before you can come up with a real number.

 

[dwilliams35]

I'm comparing wood costs to a pre-engineered steel building. I'd like to compare with "stick" built steel but I haven't gotten a quote for the steel yet. I agree on waiting -- I'm not planning on building until next spring at the earliest.

The pre-engineered steel buildings have a lot of (high cost?) labor built-in plus, apparently, a hefty profit for the company.

Are you getting a turnkey bid on that? If so, there's your trouble: a metal building is pretty much the easiest thing out there to do your own contracting on: when I did mine, I ended up saving somewhere in the neighborhood of 35% of the project, and all it really took was two more phone calls: one slab contractor, one preengineered building, and one erection crew.

 

[rcleaver]

Are you getting a turnkey bid on that? If so, there's your trouble: a metal building is pretty much the easiest thing out there to do your own contracting on: when I did mine, I ended up saving somewhere in the neighborhood of 35% of the project, and all it really took was two more phone calls: one slab contractor, one preengineered building, and one erection crew.

No, just the building itself. I assumed the slab is about the same regardless of construction materials. I assumed no erection crew, but instead the cost of renting equipment to do it alone (mostly). I'll be able to work on it as many hours per day as I can stand so my out-of-pocket labor cost will be almost 0. I know not everyone can do it this way, but it seems a lot of people prefer DIY labor even if it takes longer.

I got the quotes for the steel buildings from the web based software on steelbuilding.com

 

[dwilliams35]

No, just the building itself. I assumed the slab is about the same regardless of construction materials. I assumed no erection crew, but instead the cost of renting equipment to do it alone (mostly). I'll be able to work on it as many hours per day as I can stand so my out-of-pocket labor cost will be almost 0. I know not everyone can do it this way, but it seems a lot of people prefer DIY labor even if it takes longer.

I got the quotes for the steel buildings from the web based software on steelbuilding.com

Okay, sounds like there's a possibility that's the difference: I have always been going with their pre-engineered "packaged kits": I've been involved in about three of them, including my own 30x40x12, up to a 100x200: no software involved, just go on their website and see what kind of packages they've got: down here Metal Mart and Mueller are the two big ones that do that: I don't know what the equivalent business would be up there. Mueller makes a heck of a good building, and their 40x60x16 is about $17K currently: How does that compare with that bid you've got? Really just wondering: Are the prices up there that different compared with the "comparison" between wood and steel down here?

 

[rcleaver]

Okay, sounds like there's a possibility that's the difference: I have always been going with their pre-engineered "packaged kits": I've been involved in about three of them, including my own 30x40x12, up to a 100x200: no software involved, just go on their website and see what kind of packages they've got: down here Metal Mart and Mueller are the two big ones that do that: I don't know what the equivalent business would be up there. Mueller makes a heck of a good building, and their 40x60x16 is about $17K currently: How does that compare with that bid you've got? Really just wondering: Are the prices up there that different compared with the "comparison" between wood and steel down here?

Both the quotes I got are adjusted for the buiding location (in this case, my property in northeast PA) and include delivery. The conditions are less severe where you are which can help explain the difference. The buildings are single span.

The quotes I got include the red iron for the walls and 4/12 pitch roof, purlins and girts, roofing and siding, windows, doors, overhead door, and 6" of insulation in the walls and roof as well as a radiant heat barrier, but no interior finishing.

For the 50x80x16 building: $50,438.38
For the 40x60x16 building: $39,876.39

Anyone can get a quote for just about any size building by going to their web site. Their interactive quoting software adjusts for the location and allows you to choose options.

I think they charge way too much for roof overhangs and insulation, so I might look for another way if I were to buy from them.

I've looked at several other similar web sites. The prices come in roughly the same with the same options -- much more than wood.

 

[dwilliams35]

Well, I guess you've got snow load to deal with, we've got tornadoes and hurricanes. I couldn't tell you what the snow load on ours are, but I've put some 25T package units on the roof with the blessing of the engineers before. That's pretty much an identical building otherwise: I think I paid an extra $500 for the insulation on mine, so you can extrapolate that to a bigger one. Still seems major-league high. regional differences, for sure. Can you do those big ones clear-span in wood with the snow load on it?

 

[rcleaver]

Well, I guess you've got snow load to deal with, we've got tornadoes and hurricanes. I couldn't tell you what the snow load on ours are, but I've put some 25T package units on the roof with the blessing of the engineers before. That's pretty much an identical building otherwise: I think I paid an extra $500 for the insulation on mine, so you can extrapolate that to a bigger one. Still seems major-league high. regional differences, for sure. Can you do those big ones clear-span in wood with the snow load on it?

I don't see how you could do insulation for $500 unless it was a long time ago. My calc for R-19 walls and R-30 ceiling for 40x60x16 is about $3700.

The truss makers say they can do a clear span for wood, but I haven't gotten a quote for storage trusses yet and I'm not sure about clear span in that case (with a much higher floor load in the loft).

 

[Charles (in GA)]

I can imagine that it costs like rip to stick build a building of the dimensions you cite above, especially considering the height and roof pitch. 4/12 is steep for a metal building. A "standard" one is 1/12 and I went 2/12 on my 60x60x16 and just to give it a better look and help it drain water better.

What you are proposing is a building that is either 24+ feet tall on the 50x80 or 22+ feet tall on the 40x60 (assuming you are running the peak the long way). Both of these are taller than mine which is 21 ft and I thought that was tall! I like the height, but mine is an aircraft hangar, and needed the height, if I were doing this for a home shop (not a hangar), it would be about 14 ft at the eave, just to save some money and some heat.

Charles

 

[Dragster Racer]

I am wondering if it is an EXTRA $500?

 

[rcleaver]

I can imagine that it costs like rip to stick build a building of the dimensions you cite above, especially considering the height and roof pitch. 4/12 is steep for a metal building. A "standard" one is 1/12 and I went 2/12 on my 60x60x16 and just to give it a better look and help it drain water better.

What you are proposing is a building that is either 24+ feet tall on the 50x80 or 22+ feet tall on the 40x60 (assuming you are running the peak the long way). Both of these are taller than mine which is 21 ft and I thought that was tall! I like the height, but mine is an aircraft hangar, and needed the height, if I were doing this for a home shop (not a hangar), it would be about 14 ft at the eave, just to save some money and some heat.

Charles

I doubt it will be a steel building in my case based on what I''ve found so far. For a wood building, I plan to use a 7/12 pitch, so the loft will be a lot bigger and the ridge will be closer to 30' (about the same as the house I plan to build). I expect my wife will fill up whatever loft space I provide, so I want it be a LOT. She has a black belt in shopping. Last year I gave her an unlimited budget for Christmas and she exceeded it!

Also, I want to be able to let an 18 wheeler enter with room to spare on the top and sides -- I have a lot of plans for that building.

 

[dwilliams35]

I don't see how you could do insulation for $500 unless it was a long time ago. My calc for R-19 walls and R-30 ceiling for 40x60x16 is about $3700.

The truss makers say they can do a clear span for wood, but I haven't gotten a quote for storage trusses yet and I'm not sure about clear span in that case (with a much higher floor load in the loft).

I know it was an extra $500: I can't remember the actual R-value: It was some product made for the purpose on a reinforced plastic backingl, had a foil radiant barrier on one side. I do know that the walls and ceiling are the same. For the most part, winters aren't an issue here, but it does keep it pretty comfortable in the summer: Much more important than the insulation there was making sure I had a North and South roll-up door: 90% of our wind is either north from a front or south off the gulf: makes some pretty high temperatures bearable with a nice breeze.

 

[dwilliams35]

I am wondering if it is an EXTRA $500?

Well, that was an add-on to an uninsulated building. I guess thats extra.

 

[rcleaver]

I know it was an extra $500: I can't remember the actual R-value: It was some product made for the purpose on a reinforced plastic backingl, had a foil radiant barrier on one side. I do know that the walls and ceiling are the same. For the most part, winters aren't an issue here, but it does keep it pretty comfortable in the summer: Much more important than the insulation there was making sure I had a North and South roll-up door: 90% of our wind is either north from a front or south off the gulf: makes some pretty high temperatures bearable with a nice breeze.

That sounds like the radiant barrier that steel buildings often use. It's foil with 2" of fiberglass. Great for your situation. Is that what you have? There's no way it would be enough in northeastern PA.

 

[dwilliams35]

That's it: I think it was more like 3-4" of insulation, though: of course a lot of it gets compressed in installation. I figured that you certainly wouldn't be using the same stuff: just that that and an extra rollup door was my only "options" on top of that package price.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

This thread got kinda hi-jacked. What happened to the original poster?

Charles

 

[dwilliams35]

Aw, it's his own fault if he can't keep up with progress.

 

[96Mustang460cid]

This thread got kinda hi-jacked. What happened to the original poster?

Charles

I'm still here . I've been viewing the thread with my phone while traveling. I believe that my suspicions have been confirmed. Now, I'm going to start comparing the cost of concrete vs. stick built. I have more research to do before posting that question though.

Thanks for the input guys!

Have a good day!
Michael

 

[bugdust]

I built my little 20x20x8 (14 at the peak) carport-style building for under $7k

demo building $2675 (2 roll-ups, 1 walk door, 1 window)
concrete $2700 (20'x20', 12"x12" footer, 4" slab, rebar, mesh, plastic, plus 20'x20' 4" slab in front with just wire)
lighting, outlets, switch boxes, wire, 200a panel, 220 outlet, meter can, about 200' conduit, about 350' 3" conduit (to get service to building) $??
90" of pvc to get water to a hose bib outside bldg
misc screws
10'x2' workbench
permit $50

All done by myself & a friend except the concrete. I bought the dealers demo so I had to put it up myself. The only estimate I got for stick-built was $10k for the slab and a wired shell.

 

[rcleaver]

I built my little 20x20x8 (14 at the peak) carport-style building for under $7k

demo building $2675 (2 roll-ups, 1 walk door, 1 window)
concrete $2700 (20'x20', 12"x12" footer, 4" slab, rebar, mesh, plastic, plus 20'x20' 4" slab in front with just wire)
lighting, outlets, switch boxes, wire, 200a panel, 220 outlet, meter can, about 200' conduit, about 350' 3" conduit (to get service to building) $??
90" of pvc to get water to a hose bib outside bldg
misc screws
10'x2' workbench
permit $50

All done by myself & a friend except the concrete. I bought the dealers demo so I had to put it up myself. The only estimate I got for stick-built was $10k for the slab and a wired shell.

You didn't mention whether it is steel or wood. Most of what you mentioned is virtually the same no matter how you frame it. Also, I gather you got a discount for buying a demo.

So I don't see any way to compare your experience to the subject of this thread.

 

[sberry]

I have steel, fire ratings are better. A pole barn or stick built is probably easier to put ceilings in. I wanted tall ceilings and doors.