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MaxJax safety concern

weicm3

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Sep 5, 2008
Messages
143
I was trying to assemble things together but then I realized this lift doesn't have internal locking mechanism. The 2 post lifts that I had experience with all have internal lock mechanism inside the column. But it looks to me that MaxJax only relies on the safety bars.

What would happen if cylinder fails while you're raising up the car before safety bars go in? Anyone thinks about it?
 
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Shocker

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He didn't say anything about crushing someone. Just failure of the of the cylinder. Z06 fall down and go boom.
 

ket-tek

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Jan 28, 2009
Messages
1,289
I one cylinder fails then the car could fall to one side and wedge against the post, and/or maybe knock the post loose into what ever is beside it (another car, house wall, roof support column, etc..)

Either way it could be a lot of expensive damage to the car, not just a little dent in the fender..

I think it's a legit concern. A good reason to be on top of maintaining and inspecting the hyro system regularly.
 
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PCW

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Apr 1, 2009
Messages
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You right , but that could happen with any lift, right? The X factor with the Maxjax or any lift, is the concrete. The bolts will hold if your concrete is in good shape and deep enough. Would you want to be under a full size 7, 10, 12000 lbs lift raised to 6' with poor concrete? Of course you wouldn't. All the full size lift share the same requirements for the concrete for the most part, 4-6 ", 2500-3000 PSI. If you not sure about the quality of your concrete then cut it out and re-pour it. There are no guarantee's in life with anything, gather all the facts, do the most research you can and make the best decision. Just my 2 cents.

PCW
 
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weicm3

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Messages
143
You right , but that could happen with any lift, right? The X factor with the Maxjax or any lift, is the concrete. The bolts will hold if your concrete is in good shape and deep enough. Would you want to be under a full size 7, 10, 12000 lbs lift raised to 6' with poor concrete? Of course you wouldn't. All the full size lift share the same requirements for the concrete for the most part, 4-6 ", 2500-3000 PSI. If you not sure about the quality of your concrete then cut it out and re-pour it. There are no guarantee's in life with anything, gather all the facts, do the most research you can and make the best decision. Just my 2 cents.

PCW

Floor strength is something different that applies to all different lifts. My concern is particular to the mechanical locking mechanism inside the column that I have seen on other 2 post lifts. It's a different column design.

MaxJax uses safety bars at 3 different height levels. With other lifts, you can lift the car to any heights allowed by the column and rest the arms at the mechanical locking positions. And there is no safety bar required on other lifts. I'm not too bothered by only 3 height levels on MaxJax. I just worry that without mechanical lock inside the column, what would happen if cylinder fails before you have chance to put safety bars in? The luckiest outcome would be a heavily damaged car. The worst one could be a tragedy. I think ket-tek got my point.

Think about what would happen if floor jack fails before you put the jack stands. Also consider the lift raises car up a lot higher than floor jack. I'm wondering if the product is insured to against this kind of thing.

I'm not trying to bash the product. I own it and I'm pretty happy with Dannmar. It's my concern after reviewing the product design. I just have to think safety more on this type of equipment.
 
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tatra

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more safty features= more cost...........maybe as an option?..........course then you get into full size 2 post territory...........still waiting on mine due to my inexperience in cross border shipping..........gotta say the folks at maxjax are great to deal with, except gabe.................guy just wants to talk on the phone all day about beer and broads.............guess i'll have to go down there and me and deupty dawg will have to take him out and get it outta his system...........:beer::lol_hitti
 

revlover

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Mar 27, 2008
Messages
264
more safty features= more cost...........maybe as an option?..........course then you get into full size 2 post territory...........still waiting on mine due to my inexperience in cross border shipping..........gotta say the folks at maxjax are great to deal with, except gabe.................guy just wants to talk on the phone all day about beer and broads.............guess i'll have to go down there and me and deupty dawg will have to take him out and get it outta his system...........:beer::lol_hitti


LOL :spit:
 

volvo

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You are correct about the internal locking system. I think the engineer in China mentioned something like , translated to,..... $$$ vs It can only fall as far as the floor. but you could occur some damage ?
 

Junkman

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Dec 18, 2006
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more safty features= more cost...........maybe as an option?..........course then you get into full size 2 post territory...........still waiting on mine due to my inexperience in cross border shipping..........gotta say the folks at maxjax are great to deal with, except gabe.................guy just wants to talk on the phone all day about beer and broads.............guess i'll have to go down there and me and deupty dawg will have to take him out and get it outta his system...........:beer::lol_hitti

I have talked with Gabe on multiple times, and every time, he was always professional and courteous, and never mentioned beer or broads. Possibly it is you that started the conversation and he was just being polite to you and went along with it. I have nothing but the utmost respect for Gabe and the others at Dannmar.
 
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weicm3

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I have talked with Gabe on multiple times, and every time, he was always professional and courteous, and never mentioned beer or broads. Possibly it is you that started the conversation and he was just being polite to you and went along with it. I have nothing but the utmost respect for Gabe and the others at Dannmar.

yeah. feel the same here.
 

JSK

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Nov 16, 2007
Messages
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Location
Southern CA
I can assure all that the crew at Dannmar will go out of their way when it comes to customer service. Many on this board have already confirmed this.

Regarding the safety concern…

Many two and four-post lifts employ a chain or cable lifting system combined with a hydraulic actuator - the load being suspended by a suspension part. Lifts of this design typically incorporate an automatic "click-click" type safety lock that would be essential in the event of a failure of a suspension part anchor or the chain/cable itself.

The MJ uses direct drive cylinders meaning the cylinders are attached directly to the lifting carriage. No anchors, chains or cables to fail.

I have yet to witness or hear of a catastrophic cylinder failure resulting in a sudden decent.

A catastrophic cylinder failure would be...

• The cylinder itself exploding. That is highly unlikely as the MJ cylinder has a 500% safety factor at full capacity. Lighter loads increase the safety factor.
• The piston seals failing. I have yet to witness a seal failure resulting in a sudden decent. Seals will usually wear causing a gradual loss of pressure. If a seal started showing signs of excessive wear, the cylinder itself would leak giving evidence that replacement is necessary.
• Failure of the cylinder/carriage attachment ring. A shear load capable of shearing the attachment ring off the cylinder would have to exceed well over 15,000 pounds per side.

Jeff
BendPak
 
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PCW

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Apr 1, 2009
Messages
92
I can assure all that the crew at Dannmar will go out of their way when it comes to customer service. Many on this board have already confirmed this.

Regarding the safety concern…

Many two and four-post lifts employ a chain or cable lifting system combined with a hydraulic actuator - the load being suspended by a suspension part. Lifts of this design typically incorporate an automatic "click-click" type safety lock that would be essential in the event of a failure at a suspension part anchor point or the chain/cable itself.

The MJ uses a direct drive cylinder meaning the cylinder is attached directly to the lifting carriage. No anchors, chains or cables to fail.

I have yet to witness or hear of a catastrophic cylinder failure resulting in a sudden decent.

A catastrophic cylinder failure would be...

• The cylinder itself exploding. That is highly unlikely as the MJ cylinder has a 500% safety factor.
• The piston seals failing. I have yet to witness a seal failure resulting in a sudden decent. Seals will usually wear causing a gradual loss of pressure. If a seal started showing signs of excessive wear, the cylinder itself would leak giving evidence that replacement is necessary.
• Failure of the cylinder/carriage attachment ring. A shear load capable of shearing the attachment ring off the cylinder would have to exceed well over 15,000 pounds per cylinder.

Jeff
BendPak

Thanks Jeff. I was hoping someone from BendPak would chime in. I ordered my lift from GES a couple of weeks ago. I just heard from Ryan stating that they just got in and would be shipping soon. One question I wish you would comment on is, would you recommend using concrete epoxy on the anchor's? Lots of people are stating they use and many are saying not to. Could you please comment on that?

Thanks,
PCW
 

///Mflossin

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Joined
Feb 12, 2008
Messages
29
MaxJax uses safety bars at 3 different height levels. With other lifts, you can lift the car to any heights allowed by the column and rest the arms at the mechanical locking positions. And there is no safety bar required on other lifts. I'm not too bothered by only 3 height levels on MaxJax. I just worry that without mechanical lock inside the column, what would happen if cylinder fails before you have chance to put safety bars in?

Although not the heart of this discussion but...if you wanted some more flexibility in raising heights, couldn't you just drill some holes in the column and get the desired heights? I don't see why you couldn't.....just do the measurements, punch and drill the holes, clean up the shavings and your good to go!:pimpflash
 

JSK

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Nov 16, 2007
Messages
432
Location
Southern CA
PCW,

I remember one time we had installed twelve 9,000-pound capacity, floor-plate, two-post lifts in a Yonkers, NY dealership. After three months of use, the location continued having issues with the anchors loosening. The concrete floor was questionable at best – an old dealership with a floor that had to be at least 40 years old. Cracks, worn surface, more aggregate than concrete and at best, 3-3/4” deep. I was not present at the time of install so who knows the exact size or condition of the rotary-hammer drill-bit used. Eventually I flew to the location to assess the problem. On floor-plate style two-posts, the lift is void of the overhead support beam. Without the benefit of the overhead beam, there is considerably more moment load being placed on the anchors as a result of the columns trying to fall inwards.

After inspection I came up with perhaps the only solution - concrete anchor epoxy. I decided that although the concrete was less than desirable, the Toyota dealership rarely lifted heavy vehicles. Because the installers had drilled through the floor it was easy enough to pound the existing anchors deep into the ground below. Once the existing anchors were subsurface, I proceeded with filling each anchor hole with a two-part concrete anchor epoxy mix - kind of messy but manageable. I then proceeded to pound new Wej-it anchors into each hole making sure to tidy up any epoxy that flowed out over the surface. My intent was to make sure the epoxy had not only surrounded the bottom wedge portion of the anchor, but filled all voids subsurface, and surrounded the anchor to the floor surface. Before the epoxy dried and became unmanageable, I cleaned the threads, installed the washers and nuts then tightened each anchor to 45-ft pounds making sure the Wej-it “wings” had indeed spread into the surrounding concrete. I then returned the following day to give each anchor one more turn of the wrench to 75-foot pounds. I presume I could have achieved more torque as the anchors did not yield.

It has been over 20 years and the lifts are still working faithfully. They have not had a single problem with the anchors since. The same procedure was used eight years ago at a Pasadena, CA Porsche dealer with similar results.


Mflossin

Although I would not recommend it, I’m sure adding one more set of lock-bar holes positioned midway between the existing, would not be a problem. The lift columns were designed to operate at 150% load with no permanent deformation of parts. Our concern was that an extra set of holes would degrade the column integrity.

Jeff
BendPak
 

PCW

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
92
PCW,

I remember one time we had installed twelve 9,000-pound capacity, floor-plate, two-post lifts in a Yonkers, NY dealership. After three months of use, the location continued having issues with the anchors loosening. The concrete floor was questionable at best – an old dealership with a floor that had to be at least 40 years old. Cracks, worn surface, more aggregate than concrete and at best, 3-3/4” deep. I was not present at the time of install so who knows the exact size or condition of the rotary-hammer drill-bit used. Eventually I flew to the location to assess the problem. On floor-plate style two-posts, the lift is void of the overhead support beam. Without the benefit of the overhead beam, there is considerably more moment load being placed on the anchors as a result of the columns trying to fall inwards.

After inspection I came up with perhaps the only solution - concrete anchor epoxy. I decided that although the concrete was less than desirable, the Toyota dealership rarely lifted heavy vehicles. Because the installers had drilled through the floor it was easy enough to pound the existing anchors deep into the ground below. Once the existing anchors were subsurface, I proceeded with filling each anchor hole with a two-part concrete anchor epoxy mix - kind of messy but manageable. I then proceeded to pound new Wej-it anchors into each hole making sure to tidy up any epoxy that flowed out over the surface. My intent was to make sure the epoxy had not only surrounded the bottom wedge portion of the anchor, but filled all voids subsurface, and surrounded the anchor to the floor surface. Before the epoxy dried and became unmanageable, I cleaned the threads, installed the washers and nuts then tightened each anchor to 45-ft pounds making sure the Wej-it “wings” had indeed spread into the surrounding concrete. I then returned the following day to give each anchor one more turn of the wrench to 75-foot pounds. I presume I could have achieved more torque as the anchors did not yield.

It has been over 20 years and the lifts are still working faithfully. They have not had a single problem with the anchors since. The same procedure was used eight years ago at a Pasadena, CA Porsche dealer with similar results.


Mflossin

Although I would not recommend it, I’m sure adding one more set of lock-bar holes positioned midway between the existing, would not be a problem. The lift columns were designed to operate at 150% load with no permanent deformation of parts. Our concern was that an extra set of holes would degrade the column integrity.

Jeff
BendPak


Thanks Jeff, sounds like a yes to me for epoxy:) Appreciate the reply !!!

PCW
 

UPSHIFT

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Messages
188
Location
Simi Valley, CA
PCW,

I remember one time we had installed twelve 9,000-pound capacity, floor-plate, two-post lifts in a Yonkers, NY dealership. After three months of use, the location continued having issues with the anchors loosening. The concrete floor was questionable at best – an old dealership with a floor that had to be at least 40 years old. Cracks, worn surface, more aggregate than concrete and at best, 3-3/4” deep. I was not present at the time of install so who knows the exact size or condition of the rotary-hammer drill-bit used. Eventually I flew to the location to assess the problem. On floor-plate style two-posts, the lift is void of the overhead support beam. Without the benefit of the overhead beam, there is considerably more moment load being placed on the anchors as a result of the columns trying to fall inwards.

After inspection I came up with perhaps the only solution - concrete anchor epoxy. I decided that although the concrete was less than desirable, the Toyota dealership rarely lifted heavy vehicles. Because the installers had drilled through the floor it was easy enough to pound the existing anchors deep into the ground below. Once the existing anchors were subsurface, I proceeded with filling each anchor hole with a two-part concrete anchor epoxy mix - kind of messy but manageable. I then proceeded to pound new Wej-it anchors into each hole making sure to tidy up any epoxy that flowed out over the surface. My intent was to make sure the epoxy had not only surrounded the bottom wedge portion of the anchor, but filled all voids subsurface, and surrounded the anchor to the floor surface. Before the epoxy dried and became unmanageable, I cleaned the threads, installed the washers and nuts then tightened each anchor to 45-ft pounds making sure the Wej-it “wings” had indeed spread into the surrounding concrete. I then returned the following day to give each anchor one more turn of the wrench to 75-foot pounds. I presume I could have achieved more torque as the anchors did not yield.

It has been over 20 years and the lifts are still working faithfully. They have not had a single problem with the anchors since. The same procedure was used eight years ago at a Pasadena, CA Porsche dealer with similar results.


Mflossin

Although I would not recommend it, I’m sure adding one more set of lock-bar holes positioned midway between the existing, would not be a problem. The lift columns were designed to operate at 150% load with no permanent deformation of parts. Our concern was that an extra set of holes would degrade the column integrity.

Jeff
BendPak


Thanks Jeff !!:bowdown:
 
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