Shop I used to work at did some sub-contract work for a couple body shops. (Mechanical stuff beyond their ability.) We very often were told to do things, and then would get the car back, when whatever we did didn't fix the problem. Never understood it at all.
Mechanics: Tips and tricks you've learned
- Thread starter guitarbutt
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Shop I used to work at did some sub-contract work for a couple body shops. (Mechanical stuff beyond their ability.) We very often were told to do things, and then would get the car back, when whatever we did didn't fix the problem. Never understood it at all.
"Customer declined diagnostics, parts changed at customer request, no warranty on repair."
Not a professional wrench, but learned in a manufacturing facility that a good decent stethoscope can go a long way in determing where a noise is coming from..
Of course the 70's teen in me knows that when trying to determine if a lifter or the mechanical fuel pump on a 78 Chevy truck was making the ticking sound, a 1"x2"x3' long piece of wood worked too..
Of course the 70's teen in me knows that when trying to determine if a lifter or the mechanical fuel pump on a 78 Chevy truck was making the ticking sound, a 1"x2"x3' long piece of wood worked too..
That sounds like a redo in the making. No torque wrench -no surface cleaning
Not to inspect the parts and just slap it back together is poor mechanical work.
I made long studs to hold gasket in place while you slide head into place this prevented head from moving and damaging gasket.
One thing I learned from racing what you don't prepare for is what will catch you out.
Monza Harry
Well-known member
Lots of real good tips here already, but I'll add, listen to the customer especially if he is talkative! I went to visit a friend years ago [waiting for him to get finished work] and a customer was there getting his car fixed, it presented as though it was both too advanced and retarded at the same time. It was an early eighties Riviera [still had a distributor] he was saying to me not the tech unfortunately that they had swapped the engine [3.8 Buick] from a 1976 into the car, I ended up out in the service bay and noticed a V6 cap on the engine [Correct for 198x but not for the odd fire 3.8 that one should have used a V8 cap missing two wires] Hence two cylinders were advanced and two were retarded and two were overwhelmed carrying the dead 4. Along the same thought process get to know your clients I am frequently irritated by the service writer not listening to me, I do some of my own but with age I just don't move like I used to so I job some out, I know my ride and when I say that the problem is *** I expect it to be checked out, I may be wrong but if the Mechanic's fix doesn't bring me joy, and my diagnosis was right, then I'm looking for a new "Guy" for my outsource work Again, Oh my ride is a 2001 so attention is always needed, his lo$$. AND YES YOU NEED HEARING PROTECTION and safety glasses ALL THE TIME! I still have my eyesight [normal age loss] but I can't hear myself think. Harry
MikeF2316
Well-known member
That's seriously screwed up firing intervals. I had no idea they were like that. To me, an odd fire V6 uses a cap like this.
ttpete
Well-known member
That was a worn flat dime back when we had silver coinage.
ttpete
Well-known member
Own a few soft hammers. Brass and copper. They used to make a lead hammer kit. You got a handle made of round steel stock and a mold it fit into. Fire up the lead pot and pour the mold full. When it gets too smashed, just melt it off and re-pour. I also have rawhide hammers and plastic mallets.
Use soft hammers everywhere you can. They don't mark things and they don't bounce.
Use soft hammers everywhere you can. They don't mark things and they don't bounce.
Lots of great stuff here already.
Safety: NEVER get under a vehicle held up by a jack, especially hydraulic. ALWAYS support properly with correctly sized (or oversized) jack stands. People die every year from having a car land on them when a jack fails.
My Dad (retired machinist and toolmaker) taught me that no job is done until the tools are clean and put away. As I grow older, I have taught myself that the molded toolboxes (one space for each specific tool) is the best way to know if a tool is still AWOL (I used to think open boxes were a better use of space).
On brake jobs on my own vehicles, long, long ago I learned not to put anything replaceable back onto the vehicle. Don't just replace the pads: Do the rotors, calipers, hardware, drums, flex lines, etc. Expect the steel lines to be bad and replace (more recently, I learned to replace with CuNi). Buy all of this before jacking up the vehicle.
Don't replace a serpentine belt without a tensioner at minimum, and possibly an idler pulley ready to install.
Battery cables like to corrode from within, where you might not be able to see the corrosion easily. I once had a shop replace a battery, and got stuck the same week with a dead battery because the cable was bad, and he didn't check/clean/replace it.
Before doing a job for the first time, research, research, research. Before the internet, I would buy both Chilton and Haynes manuals for my vehicles (OEM shop manuals would be even better). I'd always write the tool sizes in the margin as I removed parts, helped with reassembly and in case the job needed to be done again down the road (I tend to keep vehicles longer than most people).
As mentioned above, read forums. Not mentioned, but equally valuable, watch YouTube videos for specific repairs. Be careful with YouTube: Many videos posted by weekend warriors are horrible advice. Read the comments, people are pretty good at policing those things.
Never rule out a root cause just because you already "fixed" that part. New parts out of the box can be bad (especially electrical, thermostats, etc.). I once rebuilt a carb, the engine still didn't run right, and I ignored the carb because I'd already cleaned and rebuilt it. Of course, I missed a jet, which was still blocked...
I'm probably forgetting a bunch.
Mike
Safety: NEVER get under a vehicle held up by a jack, especially hydraulic. ALWAYS support properly with correctly sized (or oversized) jack stands. People die every year from having a car land on them when a jack fails.
My Dad (retired machinist and toolmaker) taught me that no job is done until the tools are clean and put away. As I grow older, I have taught myself that the molded toolboxes (one space for each specific tool) is the best way to know if a tool is still AWOL (I used to think open boxes were a better use of space).
On brake jobs on my own vehicles, long, long ago I learned not to put anything replaceable back onto the vehicle. Don't just replace the pads: Do the rotors, calipers, hardware, drums, flex lines, etc. Expect the steel lines to be bad and replace (more recently, I learned to replace with CuNi). Buy all of this before jacking up the vehicle.
Don't replace a serpentine belt without a tensioner at minimum, and possibly an idler pulley ready to install.
Battery cables like to corrode from within, where you might not be able to see the corrosion easily. I once had a shop replace a battery, and got stuck the same week with a dead battery because the cable was bad, and he didn't check/clean/replace it.
Before doing a job for the first time, research, research, research. Before the internet, I would buy both Chilton and Haynes manuals for my vehicles (OEM shop manuals would be even better). I'd always write the tool sizes in the margin as I removed parts, helped with reassembly and in case the job needed to be done again down the road (I tend to keep vehicles longer than most people).
As mentioned above, read forums. Not mentioned, but equally valuable, watch YouTube videos for specific repairs. Be careful with YouTube: Many videos posted by weekend warriors are horrible advice. Read the comments, people are pretty good at policing those things.
Never rule out a root cause just because you already "fixed" that part. New parts out of the box can be bad (especially electrical, thermostats, etc.). I once rebuilt a carb, the engine still didn't run right, and I ignored the carb because I'd already cleaned and rebuilt it. Of course, I missed a jet, which was still blocked...
I'm probably forgetting a bunch.
Mike
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A similar thing took place many times in the 80s and 90s with the Chrysler 2.2/2.5 engines: leave everything connected to the head and raise it just enough to slip the old gasket out and the new one in. Though I don't think I could bring myself to do something like that, it's surprising how often it was successful.
Ran an office equip. business for 40 yrs. Drilled into the techs.
Troubleshooting sequence: Analyze, Localize, Isolate.
Effect repair: clean, lube, adjust, replace.
The above is by in large no longer adhered to. Instead: black box approach- replace parts till you think you get lucky.
Troubleshooting sequence: Analyze, Localize, Isolate.
Effect repair: clean, lube, adjust, replace.
The above is by in large no longer adhered to. Instead: black box approach- replace parts till you think you get lucky.
SuzukiGS750EZ
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 26, 2012
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Sadly yes, this bothers me so much. I was brought up to repair what you can, replace as a last resort. Now shops throw parts (I've worked in a few) and are less willing to diagnose. All data is a far a their diagnosis goes.
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2ndGearRubber
Well-known member
^ not suggesting throwing parts, but screw taking sub-assemblies apart and trying to salvage them.
AC clutch pulley is bad, internals of the compressor aren't spinning. Remove the compressor and replace the clutch, many can't be done in car. Now the internals mechanically spin, but it has low output even with a full charge. Compressor is mechanically worn, due to low oil charge or whatever. Now what? In what world are you being paid twice for that?
Now you do it again, for free, instead of making a living.
AC clutch pulley is bad, internals of the compressor aren't spinning. Remove the compressor and replace the clutch, many can't be done in car. Now the internals mechanically spin, but it has low output even with a full charge. Compressor is mechanically worn, due to low oil charge or whatever. Now what? In what world are you being paid twice for that?
Now you do it again, for free, instead of making a living.
Wrench97
Well-known member
If your working on something important on the car and you need uninterrupted time, give the wife your credit card and tell her to go shopping. Trust me you will get more work done.
Bad idea, buddy of mine tried that to get her out of his hair for the day.........................she was so excited she backed the car right off the jack stands.........................
MarlynOC
Well-known member
Back in the70's we used to heat up a distributor cap to find tiny cracks in them. They appeared on the inside of the cap and they were source of misfires. Can't remember if
we put cap over a boiling pot of water to do it. Anybody remember doing this?
we put cap over a boiling pot of water to do it. Anybody remember doing this?
We did that on a friend's car. It never blew it again for the 4 or 5 more years he owned it.
Wrench97
Well-known member
Lennyzx11
Well-known member
Loved those old odd fires made a lot of money replacing them
I built an odd fire up for my jeepster commando. Cam, bored, Hei, and fuel injection homebuilt. It was a project that involved a lot of thinking and modification.
I enjoyed it.
Mated it to a Ford T18 4speed with a 7to1 low and dumped into a Dana 20 transfer case from an international Scout. Then into 4:56 gears inside Dana 44s I think also came from a scout. I had to cut them down slightly.
Ended up at better than 100:1 ratio in low low.
I remember wading that thing into a river crossing once over the headlights and it happily running!
I had intake inside cab by windshield and exhaust up by rear corner.
That was 25 years ago at least!
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I understand the desire to repair what you can before jumping into replacing a part, but there is a reason this is more and more common.
First, the abundance of competition has driven the price down on many parts. Used to be just your local parts store, now the internet guys are keeping those stores more honest with their pricing.
Second, alot of the components on newer products are cheaply made, non serviceable, and are designed to fail in one way or another before the end of the useful life of the vehicle, engine, whatever said component may be attached to.
Third, labor is expensive. As a mechanic, I enjoy salvaging and rebuilding cylinder heads, water pumps, whatever manufacturers will sell me the parts for. But when you price in labor, it's usually close enough that my employer would rather sell a new or remanufactured component with a warranty, than try to save the customer a small percentage, then be on the hook for any future warranty work if needed. If the new part fails, it's not his problem.
About the only time I get to rebuild a component is if its obsolete, unavailable, or the lead time on getting a new part is longer than the customer is willing to wait.
Basically, its just a different world than it was 30 years ago. Shipping is fast, parts are cheap Chinese garbage, and the labor rate keeps going up. And customers are never patient.
EDIT: I only really read the first two sentences when I replied. I'm certainly all for diligent diagnosis. Seen many people replace starters for a no start problem, then find out they really needed to clean battery connections or replace a bad ignition switch.
Only reading the first bit of your reply made me think you were one of the old timers that complains that my shop doesn't rebuild water pumps anymore, we just slap on a reman and call it a day
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jsaw
Well-known member
You speak the truth. People do not realize that things are much different than they were 30 years ago.
Someone watched that Car Wizard video...
Actually no, I did some temporary grunt work at a shop and an old-timer showed me this 'trick' when I was putting together a cart (it helped with the one fastener for each caster that sits deep in the hole that holds the vertical supports). But now I wanna see this video.... guessing it's this one which I'll watch later.
momobuttons
Well-known member
I was swapping a transmission alone with a series of floor jacks and had trouble lining it up to get the bolts threaded. I had a spare matching bolt and decided to cut off the head and then notched it to fit a big flathead screwdriver. Threaded that into the top bolt hole and BAM, cheap factory transmission alignment tool. Made two more and was able to secure the transmission alone and not have it lifted on jacks. Safely threaded the remaining bolts, took out the alignment bolts and finished the install.
richfinn
Well-known member
Thats an oldie but goodie, I have a piece of hose that I keep exactly for that job
The spark plug hose is a great idea. But, even if all you have is your fingers, never ever try threading in a spark plug using a wrench, the risk of cross-threading and damaging those threads is far too great. $$$ to fix that mess.
In a pinch, I've used a spark plug socket (rubber boot inside) on an extension, and threaded that gingerly with my fingertips, but NEVER with a ratchet or wrench on it.
That's a great trick for all sorts of things with multiple bolt holes!
Mike
In a pinch, I've used a spark plug socket (rubber boot inside) on an extension, and threaded that gingerly with my fingertips, but NEVER with a ratchet or wrench on it.
That's a great trick for all sorts of things with multiple bolt holes!
Mike
MikeF2316
Well-known member
Another one I forgot: To change an oil pan or its gasket the cross member is in the way. Remove 2 of the short bolts fastening it to the frame and replace them with 6" long bolts threaded in 1". Remove the rest of the bolt and let it hang on the 2 long ones. Change your gasket, then jack the cross member back up. It will be perfectly aligned, no muscle required.
Lassen Forge
Well-known member
When you're done with a job, go back over it, start to finish, and make sure you didn't forget something. And if you have fasteners left over, find out where and why, and go back and make it right, even if it takes a while...
Lassen Forge
Well-known member
I turn them counter clockwise until I feel the lead-in on the thread
^
This trick works great for JIC hydraulic hoses, especially large ones, 1" and up.
If you have a large hydraulic hose you cant break loose, try hitting the flats of the swivel with a hard faced hammer before putting the wrench on it. Works like a charm.
And as long as I'm going over hammer tricks, I'll toss this one in. When you have a gasket that's a pain in the **** to scrape, use a ball peen hammer to tap the gasket. Sometimes I can get the gasket to fall right off in one piece. But watch how hard you're hitting, you could leave dimples all over the sealing surface. Don't do this if the part is made of soft metal like aluminum or brass, but this can be a real time saver.
smackey05
Well-known member
Being organized when I take parts off and around the car saves a significant amount of time when it comes to putting things back together.
BlakeTheCarGuy
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Use proper PPE like safety glasses and knee pads always. And don’t be like my friend and burn the shop to the ground because you were welding near a gas tank which that is more common sense than tips and tricks but still important. I know many more but that’s just the few I will list here as most have already been covered.
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momobuttons
Well-known member
It saves you a lot of time and your back especially if you don't have someone available to help.
I use a variation on the cardboard template for water pumps. I used to do that but now I use one the many magnetic parts dish you can get free at HF to line up the bolts as I take them out. I just make sure that I store it away from everything until I am ready to install the new pump. Saves me a lot of time from making a template.
bwringer
Well-known member
Yep, some way to keep multiple fasteners organized that DOESN'T involve scaring up a piece of cardboard is faster, easier, and more compact sometimes.
I've also never been a fan of placing bolts back in the holes on the engine. Because then you wiggle and wriggle the part into place down into the blind cavern in the depths... aaaand there's a damn bolt you can't see blocking progress. Plus, when you take them back out, you're right back where you started and you have to keep them organized again for at least a few minutes.
I'd say the only time putting bolts back in their holes makes sense is if it's going to be a few weeks before you get the parts. In that case, it can be a good way to make sure nothing grows legs and runs away.
I usually end up placing multiple fasteners on a paper towel in a logical order; going clockwise from the very top, usually.
And sometimes it's worth having a look at the OEM parts diagram online first; sometimes all the bolts are the same length so it doesn't matter. Or maybe one or two are so obviously different you can't get lost.
Lastly, new OEM bolts are just pure mechanicking luxury... treat yourself sometime to something besides re-using crusty rusty old ****.
I order up new OEM fasteners quite a lot on motorcycles; the fasteners are often visible, so appearance matters in that way, and on bikes with fairings, prior owners and mechanics seem to get lost and frustrated a lot. There are often a lot of fairing fasteners that always seem to be chowdered up with half of them missing. The added cost isn't usually all that much.