Metal Lathe

[Dentaltec]

So I run CNC all day at my business "dental restorations", I have always wanted to make small parts at home on a metal lathe, I love RC cars and think I can do some fun stuff. I have a bunch of projects in mind that to me would seem fun to do in my spare time in my garage.

After using the search function I was surprised that there were so few mini lathe threads on GJ. I know there are a bunch of machinists on this forum so Id love to have some of them chime in on how to get started on a lathe/mill. My garage is kind of filled now but I was thinking a 3 in one may be a good fit but not sure.

Love to hear some thoughts, I am trolling hobby-machinist and some others, just seems like most of the small stuff is chinese, like most tools I hate to buy twice but god knows I do not need a 15k tool here so I want to choose wisely.

Thanks for any info and interest is starting a fun thread.

 

[Stuart in MN]

If you go to YouTube and look up This Old Tony, he recently did a couple videos on how to tune up one of those cheap offshore mini-lathes to improve its performance.

 

[Farrier]

I have a SB lathe and a small hobby lathe from littlemachineshop.com. To be honest, I hate the hobby lathe. Its cheaply made, never get it to stay true, and its not a rigid machine for accurate work. I keep solely for small projects and quick fixes. If i had the coin for a quality mini lathe, I'd throw this hobby lathe in the dumpster.

Edit: The hobby lathe is a great machine for starter machine for people wanting to learn.

 

[Innovate1]

Check out cnczone.com
They have a lot of good people there but as the name suggests it is mainly cnc. Keep in mind a 3 in 1 machine is a compromise between functions but depending on what you want to do and the space available it may be a reasonable choice.

The other thing to consider is what material you want to cut. Steel is slow going on a small machine. Aluminum is much easier. Plastic is even easier.

I have been getting into metal milling and CNC some myself recently but don't have a background in it.

A lot of the small machines are made by just one or maybe a couple factories in asia and get different colored paint and minor differences depending on who is selling them in the US.

 

[Falcon67]

There are groups on Yahoo that specialize in the mini and 9x20, 12x36 type import lathes. Might also check out The Hobby-Machinist, The Home Shop Machinist and The Home Machinist! on the web. For parts see littlemachineshop.com - a go to place for sure.

3-n-1 - the issue there is mainly with the mill. The tall support on those will let the mill head flex. Means taking very light cuts to stay on target. However, most of the smaller units will need the same care - mini mill, mini lathe, etc.

Beware - you can make small parts on a larger machine but it's not easy to make larger parts on a small machine. Rigidity and capacity limits come up quick on the small guys.

I have used the heck out of my 9x20, my square column mill and my 12x36. I started with a mini mill and quickly discovered I needed something mo-betta-bigger.

 

[rsanter]

Because here at GJ we like the bigger lathes.
The small ones tend to not be as rigid and not be as powerful.
With that said, I have had a few small ones that got the job done, you just need to know what your expectations are and what you will really be working on.
I currently have 3 metal lates. 2 I’m using and the other is in the process of a resto

 

[cvairwerks]

Unless you are limited to a space the size of a closet, forget the 3-n-1's. Every time you change processes, you have to tear things down for the other process. For example, you are turning a shaft and need to slot it or cut a keyway...off comes the cross slide and now build up and align the vertical set up. Done with that and now tear it down to finish the shaft.

Another thing to keep in mind about the combo machines, is that the work envelopes are very limited, and the tool capacity likewise.

Figure out the size parts you want to deal with, add at least 10% to the dimensions and start looking for machines that will handle them.

A good reference on machines is here: http://www.lathes.co.uk/

 

[larry_g]

I find that machining specific forums are a better source for this type of information. That said I got into machining with two goals, make/modify parts for the different rigs we have around here and build some model engines. I have wheeled and dealed a lot to get the machines and tooling I have over the last 20 years. Quite a few lathes and a couple of mills have come and gone over the years as I learned, up graded, and opportunities arose. To me the best deals were to buy fully tooled machines, keep all the tooling and send the bare machine on to someone else. I also say for the beginner just jumping in get some thing. It will not be the final tool but a learning tool. You will discover what you want and need as time goes on and you will upgrade.

It might be well worth your while to check out the machine SSDave has. EMCO is a good name in the field. I had one of those machines pass through and would recommend it in your case of RC related parts.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[matt_i]

Its a conundrum. A machinist is going to tell you to get full size multi hp knee mill and a lathe with a camlock spindle because that's what the machinist needs to make parts efficiently.

The 3:1 is fine, its a good place to start, if you find yourself wanting to get more involved that's going to be just a lily-pad so to speak, you won't own that for very long, but it will probably hold its value as long as undamaged....typically meaning not crashed in rigging or transport.

If you can ever find a machine that's being sold with all of its accessories (collets, chucks, tool post & toolholders) then imo that's very worthwhile because buying them all independently can rack up a lot of coin.

 

[tfinniii]

Try hear also/ http://www.mini-lathe.com/Links.htm
The cheaper small lathes need a bit of work to run true.

 

[Disney]

I have a Mini lathe 7x16. I bought it at an estate auction. I spend some time getting it set up and tuned up. I have no idea what i'm doing. But, I subscribe to the Yahoo mini lathe group and I look up videos when I can't figure something out. So far it's done about everything i've asked of it. I haven't hurt it or myself yet either. For what I do (mostly auto fabrication) it's been awesome. When I need a small spacer or somehting cut down I just handle it there on the spot. I haven't yet got into making my own AN fittings and stuff yet, but that's coming soon I suspect.

 

[fordkid88]

I have the 7 x 14 and its not a bad little machine. Does require modifications but all said and done under a $1000 ist bad for little part making.

 

[Aaron_W]

For model makers Taig and Sherline are US made, but quite small. Unimat is an older mini-lathe that was built in Europe and still fairly popular.

I've got a Sherline lathe and mill which I have been quite pleased with.

 

[Dentaltec]

Keep em coming guys!!! Lots of great info, I find the more I dig and read the more confusing it gets. I am not going to let my OCD kill me here, I think I am just going to swallow that no matter what I buy "with in reason" it will not be the end all Mill/Lathe for me. God knows if I will even dig it. I assume I will but I get so fixated on new hobbies and sometimes it takes away from really getting to the point of why I feel it's what I want to do.

Sometimes I wonder if its just the learning part that I am after.

Hitting craigslist pretty hard tons of things I assume 80% are wore out junk and unless its 10cents on the dollar Im not a player. I am also quickly realizing that even if I get a good machine the tooling will probably end up costing just as much or more.

 

[bobcatdan]

Over the last week I have been looking into getting into hobby machining and this is what I have gathered so far. When it comes to smaller lathes, it comes down to how patient you are at finding a nice older one, hopefully with at least some of the tooling you need. When it comes to a new lathe, unless you plan on only doing small stuff, I'd skip the mini and start with a 10" benchtop. It's far from big, but it's also not tiny. Precision Matthew seems to be a very respected supplier of import lathes and mills on several different hobby machinist sites and pages I have joined. A 10" benchtop lathe is going to be in the $2500 range, so if the right old USA one comes along, the USA could easily be cheaper. Now with mills, that is where the water is muddy. When it comes to a USA vertical mills, it's a lot of 3 phase with minimal single phase options. Units like an Atlas/Clausing or a Rockwell- Delta bench top would be a sweet little unit, but from what I see, hard to fine. For someone looking for a smaller mill, going with a good import seems to be the realist answer here since not everyone has room for even the smallest bridgeport. As for the lathe mill combo, I wouldn't touch one. So that is what I have to say after four days of diving into the world of machining equipment.

 

[Ign]

My buddy in AZ just bought this. I gotta say, I hate anything that's not an engine lathe but this thing is pretty sweet with 2-axis DRO and digi spindle speed control.

https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-10-x-22-VS-Lathe-with-2-Axis-DRO/G0752Z

Now everyone in the machinery belt will rabble rabble rabble that it's way too expensive (wait for it, I'm psychic and never wrong!), but there's just no machinery market in the Southwest. I supported his decision to buy new because sometimes you don't want to wait for that survivor Shelby Mustang w 100 miles left untouched in a storage unit for the past 60 years for $1000.....

 

[txvwnut]

My very first machine was a Smithy 1220XL. I had a limited budget and needed a lathe and a mill and the Smithy offered that. I used that little setup to machine many aircooled veedub cases and heads plus many other machining jobs that arose in the shop. For the OP I think it would be a good starter machine to his feet wet and see how he likes making chips fly in his own shop.

 

[Packard V8]

It's been said hear already, but wait for a fully tooled machine. Buying a new or used bare machine is seldom-to-never a bargain. The tooling is so expensive and the machine is useless without it.

As a rule of thumb, a fully tooled machine only costs a bit more than the bare machine and almost always less than 25% of what the tooling costs to add. That's if you can find it before the eBay vultures have swooped in and picked the carcass clean.

They can be anywhere. I saw a spotlessly clean, completely tooled lathe sell at a bargain because it was in an auction house which gets mostly furniture and art work from estates.

jack vines

 

[fordkid88]

This Old Tony got one and has done 2 videos so far and i believe the plans are to make it cnc. It did a video on installing tapered bearings.

 

[fordkid88]

Upgrades to do-
Tapered head bearings
Metal gears
Brass gib strips
Carriage lock
Belt gear change with a speed reduction and torque multiplication
Quick change tool post

At least this is whats on my list to do.

Ive done the tiag milling vice attachment.

 

[Aaron_W]

Looking for something with an assortment of tooling is particularly important for the older American made lathes, because finding it loose (not being sold with another machine) can be difficult. Many of the new machines either come fairly well equipped or offer some good package deals.

You really will want to figure out the size of the stuff you want to make. The Sherlines are really nice little machines, tons of accessories, great customer service, available as CNC ready kits and just down the road from you in San Diego County so you could even save on the shipping.

But they are little, length isn't bad, but you will have a hard time turning something bigger than 2" diameter.

I don't have a high opinion of the 7x10, 12, 14, 16 lathes, personally if a Taig, Sherline or Unimat was too small I'd jump over the 7x and look at an 8x16, 9x20 or 10x22 lathe as you will get a lot more for the extra cost.

The 10" lathes are typically the smallest lathes where you start to see a quick change gear box offered.

The Chinese 7x, 8x and 9x lathes are pretty common on the used market and you can find some good deals if you are patient.

$0.10 on the dollar is unrealistic. For a lathe that is currently available, you should expect to pay about 50% of new, and make allowances for extra tooling. A well tooled lathe may very well be a good deal if bought for the price of the lathe new without the added tooling. A lot of hobby lathes get very little use, unless abused they will likely have little wear even if they did get used. Older lathes can be much more difficult to assess. An older American lathe will also be around 50% of the price of a new Chinese lathe of the same size.

Older small-ish US made lathes like a 9-12" Atlas, Logan or Southbend could have been bought as a hobby machine used gently by retired machinist only on Sundays, been in a high school shop class where they were well maintained, but exposed to decades of novices or bought by a small production shop and run to death. Production on these ended by the early 80s so at best you are looking at an almost 40 year old machine. These can be great machines, but it really helps if you know what you are looking at.


Also get familiar with what a new lathe comes with. Some of the companies sell their lathes standard with a decent package of tooling, others you get the lathe and that is it. Someone selling a lathe may try and play up the tooling to raise the price, and it is just what you would get buying it new anyway. You may also find the reverse, what looks like a Craigslist dreamer asking near full retail for a used lathe may actually be quite a deal because of all the added tooling.

 

[Aaron_W]

When it comes to a USA vertical mills, it's a lot of 3 phase with minimal single phase options. Units like an Atlas/Clausing or a Rockwell- Delta bench top would be a sweet little unit, but from what I see, hard to fine. For someone looking for a smaller mill, going with a good import seems to be the realist answer here since not everyone has room for even the smallest bridgeport. As for the lathe mill combo, I wouldn't touch one. So that is what I have to say after four days of diving into the world of machining equipment.

Agree, finding an old American made lathe in a useful hobby size is much easier than a mill. When you even find them small American bench top mills go for nearly as much as a good import benchtop mill new.

You can occassionally find a used Bridgeport or similar sized mill for less than a good import benchtop mill which is great if you have the space for a near 7 foot tall 4 foot wide machine and have the ability to move a 3000lb piece of equipment. Many of us don't.


The lathes by contrast can be found much more easily. I was contemplating buying a Grizzly 9x19 or 10x22 or PM 10x22 lathe ($1200-2300) when I scored a deal on a 40 year old 11x24" Logan for $600.

 

[scooternut]

Levin Lathe, this is mine, and it's for sale in Pa.



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[Aaron_W]

Levin Lathe, this is mine, and it's for sale in Pa.



Sent from my iPhone using Garage Journal

I wasn't familiar with these, just looked it up. That is even smaller than my Sherline, and new they are crazy expensive $10,000+.

What were you making with this, or was this a case of getting a Porsche for the price of a Pinto?

 

[scooternut]

I definitely did not pay pay the roughly $30k that it would take to tool this package, but it definitely cost a pile. I've just been mostly cleaning everything up, making random parts for fun. Such a nice tool.


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[El_Guapo]

I've got a little Atlas/Craftsman 6x18 that I make a lot of small/just for fun stuff on. The small machines can do a lot, but you have to recognize their limits.

For straight up hobby work, a Smithy or Grizzly 3 in 1 can do just about anything you ask of it.

 

[51Leadsled]

I have really enjoyed this thread, any chance of someone posting a picture of some of the cool things you have made?


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[Dentaltec]

I have really enjoyed this thread, any chance of someone posting a picture of some of the cool things you have made?


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I am happy to see the participation and wisdom being shared here. Most of my stuff is CNC at the lab, here is a case leaving the lab all materials are milled.

View media item 90153

 

[shirk]

I recently picked up a King 10x22 lathe, it is the same as a Grizzly G0602. I have not used it yet just finished getting it cleaned up and set up along with moving my little King mill.

I build mountain bikes so this will get used to make pivot axles and parts for my jig. Also some custom bolts I need to make.

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[DocsMachine]

-See, that's what a kitchen is supposed to look like.

Doc.

 

[shirk]

-See, that's what a kitchen is supposed to look like.

Doc.

It's the kitchen we all wish Ikea actually made.

We ripped this kitchen out of a house that was about to be torn down and got it along with a whole bunch of other cabinets and stuff for $250 bucks. It was intended to get used when we renovate our basement rental suite. After a number of years stored in the garage my lovely spouse suggested it would be better used for garage organization as there are plenty of free kitchens coming up on Craigslist for when we are ready to reno our suite. The spacing worked out perfect for the mill and lathe and the chunk of granite counter top I have. The granite still needs to get cut to size so that it doesn't stick out.