metal shop building for beginner

[gekljklefgje]

Planning on building a metal a shop with some livingspace in rural north Texas. I am very new to construction, please share your thoughts on my plan

Currently the land doesn't have any buildings. I want a building so I can stay a few days a week, store stuff out of weather and enough interior open space for future uses that I have not quite figured out yet.

30x40x14' 5/12 pitch with 40x17' 1/12 pitch leanto, 12x10' height garage door.
4" concrete of 30x40". I do want a few feet on concrete on sides and under leanto, but that turned out very expensive (over $8k) and I need to figure out something else instead for wildfire barrier



left side to be finished as livingspace with 8ft walls (nothing above for now), shop unfinished, closed cell spray foam insulation including the divider wall (so fume / dust from shop won't get into livingspace).
9k or 12k BTU minisplit in Room2 and another 18k BTU in shop for heating / cooling.



The quote I got from a local builder is around $70k with plumbing and electrical rough in. Initially I wanted this to be a quick and cheap building as secondary residence, and give me some time to decide if I want to build a house here. I was quoted close to $60k for 30x40x12' without bathroom/plumbing (way over what I initially thought what a metal building would cost). Might as well add a bit more to make the building mostly self-sufficient, I added 2' height and opted for a steeper roof to make the upstairs space more usable (5ft height at the lowest point). The bathroom is more for future as I don't have water / septic sorted out yet.

Does all these make sense? What should I ask the builder before signing the contract?

Do I need to decide the exact location for toilet / sink / shower before concrete pour? What about water heater / hot water lines? I might not get water installed for some time.

For electrical, does it make sense to have the builder run additional conduits before insulation, so I can add additional things later? Things I have in mind: solar panels (another 2" conduit through concrete), additional 240V outlets (conduit in walls, wire them later when needed), networking (between rooms / outside)

For unfinished space (above livingspace, shop), does it have to be framed before insulation if I ever want to put walls up? I do want something to protect the insulation and mount stuff on, but OSB / plywood is expensive now.

What do I need to do to make it possible to add a mezzanine above shop area later? Originally I wanted a 2 story building with shop at bottom and livingspace above, but that would cost a lot more?

In the past few months I keep finding things I didn't know about. Anything else I should consider before starting the build? Thanks.

 

[karoc]

To me quote doesn't sound bad for what you are getting. What does the builder suggest for controlling condensation, if says double bubble ask for something better. I have watch tons of Youtubes on metal bldgs, and there are tons of different ways doing it. This is going to be your weekend get away, or for ever home? Make it nice for wife, shouldn't be any problems. Like the layout

 

[gekljklefgje]

To me quote doesn't sound bad for what you are getting. What does the builder suggest for controlling condensation, if says double bubble ask for something better. I have watch tons of Youtubes on metal bldgs, and there are tons of different ways doing it. This is going to be your weekend get away, or for ever home? Make it nice for wife, shouldn't be any problems. Like the layout

For condensation, the entire building will be closed cell spray foam insulated (roof included) and concrete will have vapor barrier. Is this enough to avoid condensation problems?

Mostly weekend getaway, I plan to build a house near it in the future.

 

[billconner]

Less than $60/sf sounds good.

Is it insulated and at least living quarters sheet rocked?

I think with slab on grade you need to pin down all plumbing - at least all dwv.

 

[finn]

I never understood the idea behind having a slab larger than the footprint of the building. Seems to be an invitation for water infiltration under the walls.

Adding pavement to the perimeter, with a substantial slope elevation change, and drainage is ok, but a single plane slab seems like asking for problems.

 

[My Old Tools]

I did it and lived in it 10 years. Works just fine. My building was red iron with 2x4 interior framing. Insulate the shell then insulate the 2x4 walls again. Very tight and efficient.

 

[gekljklefgje]

Less than $60/sf sounds good.

Is it insulated and at least living quarters sheet rocked?

I was told metal is $30/sf and finished space is $100/sf

Yeah spray foam insulated and drywall in livingspace

 

[gekljklefgje]

I never understood the idea behind having a slab larger than the footprint of the building. Seems to be an invitation for water infiltration under the walls.

Adding pavement to the perimeter, with a substantial slope elevation change, and drainage is ok, but a single plane slab seems like asking for problems.

Good point! I want something around the building to keep some distance from grass (occasional wildfire in the area) and insects (fire ants), protect the foundation from rain erosion. don't care too much about the look.

Pavement of this size (1200sqft+) seems a bit pricey / labor intensive for what I am looking for. Since I need gravel for driveway anyway, can I just dump gravel around the building and under the leanto similar to how the driveway is done?

 

[gekljklefgje]

I did it and lived in it 10 years. Works just fine. My building was red iron with 2x4 interior framing. Insulate the shell then insulate the 2x4 walls again. Very tight and efficient.

what did you use to insulate the shell and walls? How did you put framing in after the shell has been insulated?

 

[joe--h]

If all the plumbing is upstairs all you need at the bottom is a 3" drain line at the building edge inside. Through the slab and out toward wherever the septic will be. A 2" PVC line next to that for future incoming water, so no complicated under slab plan needed.
So all you really need to know is where the future septic might be. All your lines will be in the floor upstairs.

Joe H

 

[My Old Tools]

what did you use to insulate the shell and walls? How did you put framing in after the shell has been insulated?

The shell was insulated with standard metal building roll insulation over the frame before the skin was installed. The 2x4 framing was fit under the wall girt so as to not lose floor space, although it's just 3.5". The 2x4 walls were insulated with standard fiberglass bats. Ceiling was blown cellulose. I kept all wiring and AC to the outside 4 feet so I could deck the attic space for storage. I did everything myself except the metal shell.

 

[James-W]

I am curious, where will this building be located? I mean, will it be in the middle of nowhere or will it be located reasonably close to other homes. I was thinking if this building will be sitting someplace where there are no neighbors it might be subject to theft.

 

[05snopro440]

Good point! I want something around the building to keep some distance from grass (occasional wildfire in the area) and insects (fire ants), protect the foundation from rain erosion. don't care too much about the look.

Pavement of this size (1200sqft+) seems a bit pricey / labor intensive for what I am looking for. Since I need gravel for driveway anyway, can I just dump gravel around the building and under the leanto similar to how the driveway is done?

You'll want something around the perimeter that keeps moisture away from the building. Water goes down through gravel, but a properly sloped clay base under any gravel will get the water going in the right direction. If economical enough, I would do a 1 or 2 foot skirt around the building to keep the grass, weeds, water, and bugs away a little bit.

 

[My Old Tools]

Slope the grade properly. Apply weed barrier, then top with decomposed granite. You will need gutters.

 

[dcg9381]

I never understood the idea behind having a slab larger than the footprint of the building. Seems to be an invitation for water infiltration under the walls.

Drop the slab outside the building perimeter for sure.. 1" min. Or do the porches separate.

 

[csp]

Make sure that local code, if applicable, will allow a utility building to be the first building on the site.

I tried to build a 30x48 on 5 acres I live on now long before the house was built and the county wouldn't allow it.

I found this out after I had a signed contract and a non-refundable deposit down on the building, because they had already begun production before their lazy sales rep submitted plans to the county. I ended up with an expensive set of plans.

Just to add insult to injury, there was already an existing 30x45 on the property when I bought it.

 

[gbva]

Please be aware of building code. It so necessary for new building depends upon the area where the buildings is going to build from the zoning permit and covers different issues.

 

[billconner]

I was told metal is $30/sf and finished space is $100/sf

Yeah spray foam insulated and drywall in livingspace

My $60 was for whole building, so maybe not so far apart. Are you just buying materials and doing work yourself or contracted? $30/sf seems low for contracted work. Around here just a 4" slab is $10-12/sf. I was quoted a pole barn, erected, walls and roof no slab, uninsulated at $40 last fall. Can you say where in the world are you? I'm in a rural area but there are less expensive areas in US I'm sure.

 

[nadogail]

There are three things that will greatly influence your costs; they all start with the letter "L", they are Location, Location and Location .

 

[jclem40c]

Wonderful idea except for one thing not too far down the road you will suddenly realize that its not big enough.
I have found that all garages somehow shrink as you move into them. Just a thought....

 

[Feralghoul88]

Please be aware of building code. It so necessary for new building depends upon the area where the buildings is going to build from the zoning permit and covers different issues.

Rule #1 of building anything in a rural area: Ensure that where you get your land is rural enough to not have building and zoning and the government busy bodies that go along with it. If the area you are considering has these things than you are very likely not rural enough, go another county further from the nearest big city and try again.

 

[CraigStu]

Please be aware of building code. It so necessary for new building depends upon the area where the buildings is going to build from the zoning permit and covers different issues.

I agree. This is absolutely your first step. Codes can be a -itch. Can you build just a shop building on the property w/o a living space/home? If you ad in a bath ( or even just a toilet and sink which you now need a septic system for ) for instance, to your shop, does the building suddenly become a residence? Codes for shops and residences are wildly different. If you decide to do a toilet and a septic system maybe it would be good to build the septic so it can handle your shop plus a 3 bedroom house for later. And to meet many codes they will end up specifying where a septic system can be located (type of soil, slope of property, etc), where the backup septic system area is and then where you can build shop or house. I see a long road of learning for you so best wishes to you.

 

[matt_i]

I think you need to also focus on utilities. As they will definitely add to your cost.

Need to figure out water, sewer (septic) and electricity at minimum.

Their entries and exit to/from the building also have to be designed into the concrete so that you have the pipe stubs in the appropriate spots when continuing to finish the interior.

I would start with a "perc" = percolation test where its determined if your soil can support a basic minimum design septic field. If it cannot you have to step up to an "engineered septic field" which has a specific design to be followed so it can support the outflow from the tank.

Next up, getting quotes from septic tank installer, well driller and the electric utility. Very important to understand where pipefitters/plumbers will be needed past the basic dirt-work to rough-in the stubs up to the point where concrete forms can be laid out.

I would fully expect $25k for all of that and I might be thinking too low (!) The quotes will tell you for certain.