ratdoggy
Well-known member
I want to attach my metal framing to my concrete floor (it's in my basement-not my garage) Would construction adhesive be fine by itself or should I also use mechanical fasteners, powder nailer or concrete screws.
Metal studs to concrete floor?
- Thread starter ratdoggy
- Start date
crewchief888
Well-known member
i used tapcons in my basement floorFalcon67
Well-known member
My work area non bearing wall in the new shop is tacked down with adhesive. I'd have to beat it off the floor with a sledge to move it. Easier and quicker to set. No drilling, etc.
You may want to research putting metal studs directly on concrete. Concrete will wick moisture and corrode them in no time flat.
If it were my wall I would put a Pressure Treated bottom plate then another non-treated 2x4 on top of that and then your metal stud channel.
I would glue and screw everything.
If it were my wall I would put a Pressure Treated bottom plate then another non-treated 2x4 on top of that and then your metal stud channel.
I would glue and screw everything.
Kevin54
MEMBER EMERITUS
I guess most of the factories that use metal studs to build office space need to remove theirs now?
rsanter
Well-known member
for non load bearing you can use construction adheasive
2 squiggly beads on the bottom will hold great as long as the concrete is clean and dry
bob
2 squiggly beads on the bottom will hold great as long as the concrete is clean and dry
bob
No - but there are better ways to do it that cost only slightly more so why not do it? The OP isn't building a shopping mall where cents matter...
fenderwasher
Member
Any method works…adhesive, tapcon or ramset gun.
The only challenge I see with the adhesive is that you have to “glue” the bottom side of the plate before you build and square your wall. The adhesive might start to set before you can square and straighten the wall. I typically like to build the wall, either in place or as a tilt up, square and straighten it (including the intersecting walls that meet it) and then either ramset or tapcon it down as the last step (on all the walls). Also, the adhesive might tend to “mush” around a bit and make the bottom plate a bit more lose when you put in each vertical stud.
Not get too far off topic…
But when building long walls (>8’), instead of using offsetting 2 x 4 x 8s on the top and bottom plate, I’ll use 16’ long (even 20’s) composite decking board as the bottom and top plate. I’ll top that with standard 2 x 4 x 8s and then build the walls. I like this method because once the wall is built I can straighten, square and level the entire wall. The long composite board (both the sole and top) create one tight unit. I find the when multiple boards are used for the sole and top plates the wall can more difficult to square and straighten across long distances. You can find long (12’, 14’ and 16’) 2 x 4s but since they typically have a twist of some sort they make better propellers than wall framing. Long composites are straight as pin and won’t wick ground moisture. Combine that will quality studding in the middle and you’ll end up with a nice straight, level wall. The dry-wallers (if not you) will love you.
The only challenge I see with the adhesive is that you have to “glue” the bottom side of the plate before you build and square your wall. The adhesive might start to set before you can square and straighten the wall. I typically like to build the wall, either in place or as a tilt up, square and straighten it (including the intersecting walls that meet it) and then either ramset or tapcon it down as the last step (on all the walls). Also, the adhesive might tend to “mush” around a bit and make the bottom plate a bit more lose when you put in each vertical stud.
Not get too far off topic…
But when building long walls (>8’), instead of using offsetting 2 x 4 x 8s on the top and bottom plate, I’ll use 16’ long (even 20’s) composite decking board as the bottom and top plate. I’ll top that with standard 2 x 4 x 8s and then build the walls. I like this method because once the wall is built I can straighten, square and level the entire wall. The long composite board (both the sole and top) create one tight unit. I find the when multiple boards are used for the sole and top plates the wall can more difficult to square and straighten across long distances. You can find long (12’, 14’ and 16’) 2 x 4s but since they typically have a twist of some sort they make better propellers than wall framing. Long composites are straight as pin and won’t wick ground moisture. Combine that will quality studding in the middle and you’ll end up with a nice straight, level wall. The dry-wallers (if not you) will love you.
Big Blue Car
Member
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2012
- Messages
- 8
In commercial construction it is usually specified to have a bond breaker (tar paper or sim) between the bottom track and the concrete.
We also usually shoot the track to the floor (ramset, hilti, etc)
We also usually shoot the track to the floor (ramset, hilti, etc)
+1
Used to do a lot of tenant fit ups and there was no time to wait for adhesive to set and even if there was the building inspector would have laughed at us.
ConCretin
Well-known member
I hate to be disagreeable, but metal studs are placed directly on concrete in the vast majority of commercial buildings. It is a standard construction practice.
Just shoot em down and move on.
lol composite top and bottom plates. thats going to be a pretty expensive wall. i have never heard of this but it seems it would cost and take alot more time than its worth. just use a 3,4,5, triangle and snap some chalk lines and your good.
nehog
Well-known member
Though not framing as you are doing it, there is some metal in my building that sits on the slab (to waterproof the bottom of the walls). It is powder nailed down every 20" or so. However no stress is on these pieces. I like the idea of adhesive though I'd toss in some powder driven nails so I could work with it while the adhesive sets.
Steevo
Well-known member
Even outdoor barbeque islands are built with steel channel flat on the patio, and studs screwed to that.
5lima30
Well-known member
+1 (Ever see water heater that rusted out from sitting directly on concrete?)I would at least put a strip of roofing paper beteen the plate and the slab and then fasten w/ Tapcons or Hilti gun. JMHO.
Toolman12
Well-known member
My dad and i put up some walls up awhile ago we used treated 2x4 then used a ramset to hold the channel for the metal studs it also was easy to nail the trim on after the drywall was up and finished and looked very nice
I'd probably use Tapcons and a PT 2x to set them on.
On second thought, I'd probably wouldn't even use metal studs.
On second thought, I'd probably wouldn't even use metal studs.
Rick98Z
Well-known member
Here in MD, I see metal studs being shot direct to the concrete all the time in construction of schools, hospitals...etc. For my pole barn, I am using treated lumber at the concrete with construction adhesive and then power nails to assist holding it for my stud wall framing between my posts...
fenderwasher
Member
Hey Yfz…
I use the composite top and bottoms only for walls longer than 10 feet, in place of using PT bottom. For shorter walls, I’ll use PT 2x4s for the bottom plate and regular 2x4s for the top…like normal. For longer walls…15 and 20 feet long, I won’t try and piece together 3, 2x4s for the plates since getting everything to line up vertically can be tough. When building a wall in place, toying around with 3, 2 x 4 top plates is a real PITA. I rather tack up one long 16’, straight has a pin, board and be done. One on the top, one on the bottom and you can start to stud the verticals. With one long continuous bottom and top plate, I can straighten that wall (vertically) with just a few taps of a mallet to the bottom plate. I’m not sure if this is cost prohibitive. I can buy a low grade, 1x4x16 composite board for about $12. Two of those…$24. I also use 3,4,5 to square walls to each other, so I have as close to possible 90 degree corners. 3,4,5 does not come into consideration here. I’m talking about creating straight vertical walls, top to bottom. I’m sorry for any confusion my original post caused.
tjpavlov
Well-known member
I know that this is an old thread, but I have the same question.
Is anybody using anything between the metal stud track and your concrete basement floor?
I'm starting a project soon and have been wondering whether it would make sense to add a material there.
Is anybody using anything between the metal stud track and your concrete basement floor?
I'm starting a project soon and have been wondering whether it would make sense to add a material there.
Danno1
Well-known member
.
I've seen a lot of walls go up in commercial buildings and around here they fasten the bottom steel channel using 3M VHB. No mechanical fasteners at all. And I can tell you, even on loading docks, those walls do not move. Oh, and for the guys worried about rust, there's your separation of steel and concrete.
.
I've seen a lot of walls go up in commercial buildings and around here they fasten the bottom steel channel using 3M VHB. No mechanical fasteners at all. And I can tell you, even on loading docks, those walls do not move. Oh, and for the guys worried about rust, there's your separation of steel and concrete.
.
tjpavlov
Well-known member
Woah.... I've never heard of that tape before. A quick googling led me to read all about it. Tough stuff!
What size tape do they use? Just a couple of beads of the narrow tape, or do people use the 3 inch stuff?
Since I'm the OP for this thread....
I ended up using tar paper(roofing felt) between the track and floor and using a powder nailer to hold the track in place..
Nothing exotic except for Tapcons in areas near saw cuts..
BTW if you do use Tapcons use an impact driver as the instructions say to
I ended up using tar paper(roofing felt) between the track and floor and using a powder nailer to hold the track in place..
Nothing exotic except for Tapcons in areas near saw cuts..
BTW if you do use Tapcons use an impact driver as the instructions say to
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The FIB
Well-known member
I like to use tapcons. They are cheap, fast, and removable.
tjpavlov
Well-known member
Thanks, Ratdoggy. This isn't a huge job, so the added cost of some roofing felt or a layer of sill gasket is really negligible. So if something like this is going to add a little bit of protection, then I'm all for it.
Any other good ideas would be appreciated.
Any other good ideas would be appreciated.
tjpavlov
Well-known member
Thanks for the offer. For my job though, I think that a $5 roll of sill gasket is going to be more than enough. In fact, I'll probably be offering the remnants up to other garagejournal'ers like you!
-Tom
leeniehaus
New member
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2016
- Messages
- 1
Metal studs should not be used directly on concrete that is in contact with the ground. Commercial projects usually use galvanized tracks, treated wood (plywood or framing) or framing felt to control the moisture that wicks up from the concrete, and if you are not doing this then you are not following the industry best practices (or probably the manufacture or project specifications). It is okay to anchor directly to concrete on floating slabs (slabs above the first floor) as moisture vapor will follow gravity downward (yes, even through galvanized metal deck), but on the ground level there is normally a vapor barrier under the concrete slab that only allows the moisture to escape in one direction, that is up.