Mezzanine/Loft questions

[pocketlock]

Looking for some advice regarding my building a potential loft. I've been researching this for weeks and have been finding conflicting or confusing information or ideas that seem overkill for my uses. The building is a 30x50x14 welded steel building (2" square tubing structure). I am planning to build a free-standing loft/mezzanine over my workbench and section off a home gym (12x12). The loft would be 30x12 appx. 8' to the bottom which will leave me needing to crouch when up there but it is only to be used for Christmas decorations in plastic totes on plastic racks and long term vehicle trim storage. Nothing crazy heavy other than my wife's Christmas trees, or the hard top to my Bronco (I would be impressed to find out it was more than 1000lbs of stuff). I would like to keep my work area as clear span as possible so was hoping to do my support around the 18' mark (separating my 18x12 work area from my 12x12 gym). With not needing as crazy of load capacity would this be possible with dimensional lumber or am I going to be stuck with buying engineered beams? Current idea was 6x6 posts in the corners and at the 18' mark. 2-2x12 glued and screwed as headers on the front and back. 2x12 joists on the outside and 2x8 or 2x10 joists in the center. 12" or 16" on center with OSB sheeting for the floor. Was simply going to frame in an attic access to store things. Would this make sense or am I way underestimating the load requirements of this type of structure? Including pictures of the layout for reference. Nothing purchased yet so no money lost. Just looking for extra input. I also have considered shortening my span to 15' and splitting the run. But I would prefer not to do this as it would add an unnecessary post in my work area.

 

[My Old Tools]

Why not just weld it up out of more 2x2 tubing, or a light i-beam for the main beam. If you have a center ridge, run a tube up to it. Support at the 18' mark should be sufficient for your storage needs.

 

[duneslider]

TJI floor joists will span 18' no problem. Then you can put the wall/beam on the shorter dimension.

 

[pocketlock]

Why not just weld it up out of more 2x2 tubing, or a light i-beam for the main beam. If you have a center ridge, run a tube up to it. Support at the 18' mark should be sufficient for your storage needs.

Being that it is a 2x2 building I wasn't sure if a support from the ceiling would support this kind of load. There is not a center ridge, rafters connected by purlins for the metal roofing is all that will be there.

 

[u2slow]

I was chatting up a retired carpenter about my loft prospects and basically came around to putting in a steel I-beam. That way I can run a trolley and chain block on it.

 

[Zeke]

I would approach this with a framed wall at each 12' end. I like walls like this to use for hanging or bolting stuff, be it a work bench or a row of outlets. Any contiguous wall has its benefits. Out to the 18' mark and another wall separating the gym and workspace would hold parallel beams correct for the span and load for the floor. An LVL might be the best bang for the buck. The joists will run the 12' (as you state) length which likely will be 2 x 8's. (Sizes and centers TBD).

The gym part being only 12 x 12 will be a little less demanding on the beams and joists.

Now this: having quite a bit of experience hauling holiday and other stuff up and down from upper storage, I'd consider a ladder or stairs.

 

[pocketlock]

TJI floor joists will span 18' no problem. Then you can put the wall/beam on the shorter dimension.

So basically, building 2 smaller connected lofts with the main beam on the support posts at the 18' mark?

 

[pocketlock]

I would approach this with a framed wall at each 12' end. I like walls like this to use for hanging or bolting stuff, be it a work bench or a row of outlets. Any contiguous wall has its benefits. Out to the 18' mark and another wall separating the gym and workspace would hold parallel beams correct for the span and load for the floor. An LVL might be the best bang for the buck. The joists will run the 12' (as you state) length which likely will be 2 x 8's. (Sizes and centers TBD).

The gym part being only 12 x 12 will be a little less demanding on the beams and joists.

Now this: having quite a bit of experience hauling holiday and other stuff up and down from upper storage, I'd consider a ladder or stairs.

I've considered the ladder or stairs and with the infrequency of use and general lack of space in the rest of the shop I didn't want to encroach on my usable space and felt attic access was the best option. If that need changes in the future I can always add stairs along the back wall. This will mainly be long term storage for holiday decorations and small car parts.

 

[pocketlock]

I would approach this with a framed wall at each 12' end. I like walls like this to use for hanging or bolting stuff, be it a work bench or a row of outlets. Any contiguous wall has its benefits. Out to the 18' mark and another wall separating the gym and workspace would hold parallel beams correct for the span and load for the floor. An LVL might be the best bang for the buck. The joists will run the 12' (as you state) length which likely will be 2 x 8's. (Sizes and centers TBD).

The gym part being only 12 x 12 will be a little less demanding on the beams and joists.

Now this: having quite a bit of experience hauling holiday and other stuff up and down from upper storage, I'd consider a ladder or stairs.

So still using the 6x6 columns but a framed wall in between each 12 foot section at 0', 18' and 30'? For my inside and outside beams supporting the joists (2x8 in the main area and possibly 2x6 12"OC over the gym) would 2-2x12 be sufficient? I know I should be good on the 12' leg (actual length will probably be 11'10" after taking consideration for the outside wall.) Curious about the 18' span I guess.

 

[clutchee]

Are you meaning something like this?
Let me know, I built mine, it’s WAY overbuilt.
Buddy who built my shop and house, said I could park a car up there no problem.

 

[pocketlock]

Are you meaning something like this?
Let me know, I built mine, it’s WAY overbuilt.
Buddy who built my shop and house, said I could park a car up there no problem.

Yes similar to that, lighter shelves up to (plastic ones for light totes) All of my heavy storage will be on ground floor. Main concern is that outer 18' span.

 

[clutchee]

So I used the corner, then used 4x4 post, one is near the two rear I beams from shop, the third is near the door of shop, the 4th is floating, basically squared to others then L brackets off bottom and lag bolted down.
I beam across the front and back welded to 4x4s, then “think” 8” purlin set ever 10” with 3/4 MDF screwed to them.

 

[mepstein]

I’ll be getting some large shop space soon and will build a mezzanine with used pallet racking. Pretty cheap, holds tons and easy to assemble. Breaks down reasonably easily as well. Last time we used it to store cars but this time the cars will be on the floor and car parts up top.

 

[billconner]

I think Zeke has this one - a pair of parallel 30' LVLs supported at 0', 18', and 30'. If head hy is an issue, upturn the LVLs and support joists on hangers between them. I believe for attic storage loads, 2x6 #2 SPF 16" oc are fine

 

[pocketlock]

I think Zeke has this one - a pair of parallel 30' LVLs supported at 0', 18', and 30'. If head hy is an issue, upturn the LVLs and support joists on hangers between them. I believe for attic storage loads, 2x6 #2 SPF 16" oc are fine

By pair, do you mean one on either side of the joists or doubled up on each side of the joists?

 

[pocketlock]

I'm trying to stay safe with the structure without going too crazy on it. But also trying to keep logistics in mind and work with materials I will be able to get ahold of pretty easily.

 

[ridgebk995]

Looking for some advice regarding my building a potential loft. I've been researching this for weeks and have been finding conflicting or confusing information or ideas that seem overkill for my uses. The building is a 30x50x14 welded steel building (2" square tubing structure). I am planning to build a free-standing loft/mezzanine over my workbench and section off a home gym (12x12). The loft would be 30x12 appx. 8' to the bottom which will leave me needing to crouch when up there but it is only to be used for Christmas decorations in plastic totes on plastic racks and long term vehicle trim storage. Nothing crazy heavy other than my wife's Christmas trees, or the hard top to my Bronco (I would be impressed to find out it was more than 1000lbs of stuff). I would like to keep my work area as clear span as possible so was hoping to do my support around the 18' mark (separating my 18x12 work area from my 12x12 gym). With not needing as crazy of load capacity would this be possible with dimensional lumber or am I going to be stuck with buying engineered beams? Current idea was 6x6 posts in the corners and at the 18' mark. 2-2x12 glued and screwed as headers on the front and back. 2x12 joists on the outside and 2x8 or 2x10 joists in the center. 12" or 16" on center with OSB sheeting for the floor. Was simply going to frame in an attic access to store things. Would this make sense or am I way underestimating the load requirements of this type of structure? Including pictures of the layout for reference. Nothing purchased yet so no money lost. Just looking for extra input. I also have considered shortening my span to 15' and splitting the run. But I would prefer not to do this as it would add an unnecessary post in my work area.

This is the best place ever, got a mega steel free-standing 30 x 20 loft with decking and 3/4” T&G and stairs for $7k

Supplier of New & Used Material Handling Equipment

Used material handling equipment for sale including pallet rack, all types of conveyor, shelving and mezzanines

www.americansurplus.com

 

[billconner]

By pair, do you mean one on either side of the joists or doubled up on each side of the joists?

Apologies - maybe both. One against wall and one 12' out - both the long edges of the loft. I don't know without specific product what size lvl, but would guess in the 3 1/2 x 14 range. Lumber yard will calculate it - 18' span 120 plf live load and 60 plf dead load.

 

[duneslider]

This is more what I was thinking. Just 9.5" TJI 210's which will net you L/360 at 18' and carry a 40/10 Live/Dead load. No messing with trying to figure out beams and no nailing hangers etc.

 

[vrinner]

Are you meaning something like this?
Let me know, I built mine, it’s WAY overbuilt.
Buddy who built my shop and house, said I could park a car up there no problem.

Question on your stairs...

Looks like we have a similar setup. The guy who assembled my garage said that I should be fine taking out one of the stringers (I'm thinking at that back corner) and then build stairs there. So I would basically be cutting a stringer in half and then putting a 4' piece across to support where it was cut. Did you do anything special for your stairs?

Structurally I "think" it should be fine. The mezzanine was engineered to be a full second story @ 100psf.

 

[clutchee]

Question on your stairs...

Looks like we have a similar setup. The guy who assembled my garage said that I should be fine taking out one of the stringers (I'm thinking at that back corner) and then build stairs there. So I would basically be cutting a stringer in half and then putting a 4' piece across to support where it was cut. Did you do anything special for your stairs?

Structurally I "think" it should be fine. The mezzanine was engineered to be a full second story @ 100psf.

I’ll go out and look, no issue should be seen.
I added cross bracing at the flooring in that area to support.
I’ll get pic later today.

 

[pocketlock]

This is more what I was thinking. Just 9.5" TJI 210's which will net you L/360 at 18' and carry a 40/10 Live/Dead load. No messing with trying to figure out beams and no nailing hangers etc.

I will have to see if my local lumber supplier or lowes can get me some of these.

 

[billconner]

I will have to see if my local lumber supplier or lowes can get me some of these.

And be sure you can get a 30' something into the building. It's a real good and simple solution; I thought it would go it more and take 4" in height compared to 30' LVLs and 2x6s.

 

[pocketlock]

30’ might be a tough fit since that’s the outside dimension of the building. Actual measurement between the frame would be 29’8”.

 

[duneslider]

You can get the TJI's at whatever length you want, as long as they can put them on a truck to get them to you...

I have some 42' in my house. 29'8" won't be a problem. Most likely your local lumber supplier will be less expensive than ordering through lowes, assuming your lowes can get them. I don't think all lowes/HD locations will order them in.

 

[duneslider]

You can get the TJI's at whatever length you want, as long as they can put them on a truck to get them to you...

I have some 42' in my house. 29'8" won't be a problem. Most likely your local lumber supplier will be less expensive than ordering through lowes, assuming your lowes can get them. I don't think all lowes/HD locations will order them in.

The disadvantage to the LVL's that size is how much that would weigh. I would also assume that you would need at least 2 of them doubled up and probably at least a 14" depth if not more for an 18' span. That would be a super heavy beam to hoist up. I don't have the details for my garage door opening at 18' but I think it was a double 14" LVL and it was only carrying a gable end wall, no floor load.

I built a little mezz in my garage with a 13'7 span and used 3 2x12's and then 2x6's running 8' spans. It is just used for relatively light storage. Even lifting the 13' 2x12's into place alone wasn't super easy, two people wouldn't have been bad though. I don't know that I would run 2x6's for a 12' span though, that's pretty small.

 

[pocketlock]

The disadvantage to the LVL's that size is how much that would weigh. I would also assume that you would need at least 2 of them doubled up and probably at least a 14" depth if not more for an 18' span. That would be a super heavy beam to hoist up. I don't have the details for my garage door opening at 18' but I think it was a double 14" LVL and it was only carrying a gable end wall, no floor load.

I built a little mezz in my garage with a 13'7 span and used 3 2x12's and then 2x6's running 8' spans. It is just used for relatively light storage. Even lifting the 13' 2x12's into place alone wasn't super easy, two people wouldn't have been bad though. I don't know that I would run 2x6's for a 12' span though, that's pretty small.

I’ve been struggling to find information about load support on the clear span end. Most information I find is support as a floor joist so it’s been a struggle. I know the 2x6 should be able to support if it is. 12” OC. I was planning to do 2x8 on the main section and just 2x6 over the gym area for a little extra head room if I go that route. I could have sworn I had read somewhere that 2-2x12 could span 15 ft but looking now I can’t find the information anymore. With 3-2x12 does your span show any deflection or have any bounce? I’ve been watching other builders and have seen where they have done a 16’ span with a glued and screwed 2-2x12 and it didn’t appear to have any give so that gives me a little confidence in my plan but still. There’s a lot of conflicting information out there.

 

[duneslider]

Here is one of the charts I use. 3 2x12's is not good for 18'. 3 2x12's are only good for about 10' in your application.

Also, 2x6's are only good for about 8-10 feet based on the chart I use. You might be close 10 that 12' going with 12" centers.

 

[pocketlock]

Here is one of the charts I use. 3 2x12's is not good for 18'. 3 2x12's are only good for about 10' in your application.

Also, 2x6's are only good for about 8-10 feet based on the chart I use. You might be close 10 that 12' going with 12" centers.

What does the footage across the top represent? The distance it’s supporting perpendicular?

 

[Hank11]

Do the big LVLs front and rear, using the wall at 18 feet for mid support, then drop 12 foot 2X10 (or 8s) in on hangers for your floor joists. You could also use shorter LVLs long enough to span between your walls. (12s and 18s) They will be lots easier to move and install.
You will want some bracing to keep this from racking in all directions. That might make stairs more appealing as they can do double duty.

 

[pocketlock]

Do the big LVLs front and rear, using the wall at 18 feet for mid support, then drop 12 foot 2X10 (or 8s) in on hangers for your floor joists. You could also use shorter LVLs long enough to span between your walls. (12s and 18s) They will be lots easier to move and install.
You will want some bracing to keep this from racking in all directions. That might make stairs more appealing as they can do double duty.

I was thinking of strapping it to the frame of the building to prevent racking/shifting, but did not want the building to be supporting the weight of the lift since it wasn’t engineered for it.

 

[duneslider]

What does the footage across the top represent? The distance it’s supporting perpendicular?

Yes, it is essentially a chart for decks but works the same for a floor like this. So you the dims across the top are the joists perpendicular to the beam.

 

[pocketlock]

Yes, it is essentially a chart for decks but works the same for a floor like this. So you the dims across the top are the joists perpendicular to the beam.

gotcha! In my research, when using a table the calculation for the length supported by the beam is half of the run of the joists because the other half is supported by the beam on the other side. So I’m that case 6’ would be the run and I could do 3-2x12 if I put my support at 15’?

 

[pocketlock]

This is more what I was thinking. Just 9.5" TJI 210's which will net you L/360 at 18' and carry a 40/10 Live/Dead load. No messing with trying to figure out beams and no nailing hangers etc.

This has me thinking of changing my design layout a little. Instead of focusing on having my clear span edge beam at 18'. Having my clear span edge beam on the 12' end at 0', another at the 18' mark and the last at 30'. Then running 18' joists instead. 2x10 on 12" or 16" centers. And something a little smaller in the gym for head room (possibly 2x6 on 12" centers). Possibly doubling up each of the outer joists for peace of mind but similar concept to this on a lighter duty scale? I would still get my 18' clear span and would simply need to redesign the attic access ladder I was intending to put in, and have it face the other direction.

 

[clutchee]

Sorry for delay.
Attached are pics.

 

[clutchee]

Final pic

 

[vrinner]

Sorry for delay.
Attached are pics.

Doesn't get much simpler than that version. So looks like you just welded the stairs to the beam. I think I'm way overthinking my solutions. LOL.

Thanks for the reply!

 

[clutchee]

Yes sir. Just like the purlin, two kick outs and then the purlin stairs down.
I made the steps wide, cause of totes, thus you can set them, move up, set them move up.
People wanted them like normal stair case, I was like your two stairs can’t hold tote, mine can.