Mini Farm Build

[jeffg]

I have been reading this forum for 14 years and I have finally gotten to a point where I feel like I have something worth starting a thread over.

Over the past 4 years my now 11 yo daughter has been getting into horseback riding and showing. We just finished our first full show season and she did pretty well. We now own 4 horses and have been paying to board them at various stables.

Last March we discovered a small piece of land, just over 3 acres for sale less than a half mile from our house. We closed on the land this summer and I have been working to finish this years grass hay harvest before we tore everything up. First time doing hand line irrigation, first time cutting and baling hay, first time my kids have had regular chores that required rubber boots. . Its been a great experience for all of us so far.

I hired an architect to help us develop a site plan, but its pretty obvious she has little experience with "farms." All of her site plans has way too much driveway and landscaping and no though about a functional workflow. We finally got a street address today and now its time to start working on some infrastructure and getting the horses moved over so that we can stop paying boarding fees.

My first challenge is getting power and water service to the land. We have irrigation but no potable water or power. There are utilities adjacent to the property so getting them pulled in should be doable.

So here is my first (of many) question. Without a house or other structure on the land, where do I put the utility meters? My first thought was to build a small permanent utility building and place the meters there. I could then run service lines to each of my desired end points. I can't seem to find any online examples of this, so is there any reason not to do this?

I was hoping for something like an 8x10 stick frame building on a concrete pad. I could add a rollup door to make it easier to get equipment and supplies into the building. Eventually we could add a backup generator, water filtering, and maybe solar equipment to the building to feed the eventual house and barn.

Thanks in advance for any ideas or constructive criticisms.
Jeff

 

[Bolson32]

I grew up on a farm and our electric service came in to a meter just on a treated post between the barn and the house. I think this is probably pretty common for farm property actually.

Especially if there's ever a need to split the meters. In fact my parent's built a house on some farm land a few years ago and their meter might still be on the treated wood panel in the middle of the property.

I wouldn't bother building a building for it, just get it put in with a temporary service station like below and have an outlet or two installed there. When you're done building the buildings you want, machine sheds, stables etc, get it moved there.

 

[rok_hunter]

If you're after potable water for the horses, no need - they can drink whatever is feeding your hand lines (those things make me cringe LOL) unless there is a serious water quality issue to worry about, and in that case I'd question the wisdom of using it for sprinkler water too. If it's for you guys...fair game. They'll probably put the meter wherever the line taps into the water main (i.e. Street side), and cap the line there until you're ready for water at the structure - all that to say, wait till the building is build before running water to it.

For power, talk to your servicing electric company, they'll give you a quote to set poles/run power, in that case you'll want that done once the structure is mostly built (at least dried in) so they have something to hang the meter on.

In both cases for building planning, manage the design so the electrical power and water come in on a side close to wherever it's coming from so you don't have to run them around the building to a back wall.

Consider prevailing wind conditions and have doors/stall entry perpendicular. You don't want wind blowing straight in, and you don't want them downwind (especially if you're in a climate with snow, it'll all accumulate there).

Put a power & water outlet right outside each stall. Conduit inside the stalls may be tempting to rub against/chew on/pull down for a bored horse. Make sure lights are high enough that a rider can be in a horse in the stall, if needed, and not hit it. If you elect for sliding stall doors make sure they're clear, of course.

Remember to give yourself a tac room, and some dry storage for hay and feed. You may want something you can fill with straw and throw a heat lamp in, in case you end up with any foals.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

 

[jeffg]

Thank you for the feedback everyone. Here is a line drawing based on our current site plan. In the short term we were planning to put the horse stalls in the small square where the house is. This will allow me to keep hay in the big square to for grazing and potentially baling next year.

We have meetings setup with power and water companies, so I am sure they will tell us what is possible from their end.

 

[ZRX61]

....

 

[jeffg]

Finally making some progress...

The local electric company has finally given us a plan to get electric service to the property. After paying for the engineering services myself, the plan is to install a new pole and pole mounted transformer. The cost for this work is just under $4000. This does not include anything after the transformer. I need to have a licensed electrician install the meter box and a mast for the service entrance. The plan is to install a meter combo box, which will allow me to install some circuits and then two large circuits to feed the house sub panel and the barn sub panel.

I am looking at the Siemens MC0816B1400RLTM. Has anyone used this one before, or is there a better option?

 

[jeffg]

So a bit of progress. The water company came out and installed two shiny new meters for us to use. The plumber will be out this week to install some yard hydrants.

 

[jeffg]

The next step involved removing some top soil so that we could start layering in footing for the horse runs and round pen. There was a bit of a misunderstanding with the work, and the excavator dug down too deep. We now have three big holes that will need to be filled.

The original plan was to fill with clean rock (1/2" chip) and then add sand over the top for the footing. The over dig would now mean that we have to more than triple our rock order. It might be better to use some "road mix" in the bottom of the hole and compact that in layers before we add the rock and sand. My fear is the fines in the road mix will prevent the drainage that we are trying to establish. What do you think?

 

[ZRX61]

Is the plan to just dump the rock on the dirt or put down some kinda fabric first?


I assume you're going to border the areas with PT lumber planks to keep the sand where it should be?

 

[rmack898]

I am looking at the Siemens MC0816B1400RLTM. Has anyone used this one before, or is there a better option?

That's what I used and I'm quite happy with it.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Finally making some progress...



I am looking at the Siemens MC0816B1400RLTM. Has anyone used this one before, or is there a better option?

That question would probably fare better in the Lighting & Electrical Section.



The area you bought looks residential. Is the "farm" going to fly in that area ?

 

[meathooker]

We ran all of our utilities into a mechanical room in the shop - they distributed those to the other buildings. It’s nice having everything in one spot.

What part of idaho? Looks like it could be Kuna?

 

[Smittybert]

Is there any requirement in your area for number of animals an acre? Some have 1 acre per horse requirement. 3 acres are going to get used up pretty fast I would think if planning to have 4 horses barn and house?
Guess we need to understand the use for your land and goal

 

[meathooker]

Is there any requirement in your area for number of animals an acre? Some have 1 acre per horse requirement. 3 acres are going to get used up pretty fast I would think if planning to have 4 horses barn and house?
Guess we need to understand the use for your land and goal

Far as I know idaho doesn’t have any requirements like that.

 

[jeffg]

Is there any requirement in your area for number of animals an acre? Some have 1 acre per horse requirement. 3 acres are going to get used up pretty fast I would think if planning to have 4 horses barn and house?
Guess we need to understand the use for your land and goal

Idaho does have rules for the number of "livestock" per acre, which is 2. The fun part is that horses are not considered livestock in Idaho. With property daily exercise, the rule of thumb has been 3 horses per acre, but that's not a legal limit. We will be boarding up to 8 horses on this property.

The goal for the property is pure equine at this time. We have a house on an acre about a 1/4 mile down the road. For phase 1, we will have 5 or 6 horses in runs, a round pen, and a storage building for tack and dry feed.
Phase 2 will entail building a barn with stalls, and building a 100x140 riding arena.
Phase 3 will be building the house.

 

[jeffg]

Is the plan to just dump the rock on the dirt or put down some kinda fabric first?


I assume you're going to border the areas with PT lumber planks to keep the sand where it should be?

That was exactly the plan. Originally the excavation was supposed to be just removal of the grass. We ended up with holes that are in places over a foot deep. Should I try to backfill some of the hole with something like road mix before I put the fabric down?

We were going to build PT kick boards all around the runs to keep the sand contained. The round pen we ordered has solid sides for the bottom 24".

 

[jeffg]

The area you bought looks residential. Is the "farm" going to fly in that area ?

The "farm" is right in the middle of some older neighborhoods. The good part is that since they are older and we aren't in city limits, there are no CC&Rs and everyone around us has horses. Most of the lots in the area are 1 or 2 acres. My house is actually on an acre just a 1/4 down the road.

 

[larry_g]

Finally making some progress...

The local electric company has finally given us a plan to get electric service to the property. After paying for the engineering services myself, the plan is to install a new pole and pole mounted transformer. The cost for this work is just under $4000. This does not include anything after the transformer. I need to have a licensed electrician install the meter box and a mast for the service entrance. The plan is to install a meter combo box, which will allow me to install some circuits and then two large circuits to feed the house sub panel and the barn sub panel.

I am looking at the Siemens MC0816B1400RLTM. Has anyone used this one before, or is there a better option?

I used a Square D CU12L400cb Which is similar in function to your box above. Mine has a meter base, two 200 amp main breakers, and 8 slots for circuit breakers. I used the circuit breakers for temp power while developing the site and now have the well pump on one breaker and the shop and house on the two 200a breakers. You can see the layout in my build thread below.

I would suggest that if you are not an electrician that you talk with a local supply company to get the box with all that you need. There are plenty of options for these boxes and if you mail order and then need small parts you may be in a bind. Also think ahead to see if this line of boxes are compatible with what you intend to put in other buildings. For me it's important that I have spare breakers on hand and can do whatever is necessary.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[jeffg]

I used a Square D CU12L400cb Which is similar in function to your box above. Mine has a meter base, two 200 amp main breakers, and 8 slots for circuit breakers. I used the circuit breakers for temp power while developing the site and now have the well pump on one breaker and the shop and house on the two 200a breakers. You can see the layout in my build thread below.

I would suggest that if you are not an electrician that you talk with a local supply company to get the box with all that you need. There are plenty of options for these boxes and if you mail order and then need small parts you may be in a bind. Also think ahead to see if this line of boxes are compatible with what you intend to put in other buildings. For me it's important that I have spare breakers on hand and can do whatever is necessary.

lg
no neat sig line

I am definitely getting a licensed electrician for the service connection and initial installation. I just wanted to make sure I was asking for the right kind of device. I know the brand debate is huge in some circles. It looks like the local electric doesn't like the lever disconnect anyway, so we will probably end up with a different model anyway.

You usage is exactly what I was hoping for. Using the small circuits for temporary power until the barn and house get built.

 

[jeffg]

What part of idaho? Looks like it could be Kuna?

Southwest Ada County (Five Mile and Victory)

 

[larry_g]

I know the brand debate is huge in some circles.

You usage is exactly what I was hoping for. Using the small circuits for temporary power until the barn and house get built.

I'm not qualified to suggest a brand, just to suggest that all your equipment be the same brand if possible. The brand I have is what the local electrical contractor favors and stocks for.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[NUTTSGT]

I'm not qualified to suggest a brand, just to suggest that all your equipment be the same brand if possible. The brand I have is what the local electrical contractor favors and stocks for.

lg
no neat sig line

No electrician here either but Larry is correct on the same brand theory. Keep everything the same brand. It allows you to swap breaker in the event that something happens.

Not sure what's available in your area but I would lean towards either Eaton (Cutler-Hammer) CH or Square D QO series. I don't think you can go wrong with either one.

 

[meathooker]

Southwest Ada County (Five Mile and Victory)

Nice. I’m just a few miles away. Love the area.

How do you like the traffic changes in the last few years!?

 

[jeffg]

Made a bit more progress this weekend before the snow hit. Had 105 yards of gravel delivered to fill in the footing for the horse runs and round pen. Another 60 yards of sand will be delivered today to finish up the footing.

Got water service connected.

Still waiting on an electrician that can come install the meter and pole. It seems like not very many companies want this kind of work.

 

[jeffg]

Nice. I’m just a few miles away. Love the area.

How do you like the traffic changes in the last few years!?

I hate it. I wish whoever was talking about how great Idaho is would have not done it. I cant believe Maple Grove, Five Mile and Cloverdale will all be 5 lanes wide.

 

[jeffg]

Footing in and graded.

 

[jeffg]

Its been a little bit since I updated this thread. Lots has happened in the last few weeks and I just haven't had too much free time.

A couple of week ago we had to move the horses over, as our old boarding facility needed their stalls for some new horse. We moved everyone over into new runs and so far things have been working pretty well. Each horse gets their own 12x48 run with a 12x10 shelter on one end. Corner feeders and waterers are under the shelter. The horses are a bit messy so we had to add rubber mats under their feeders. We will still probably need to use some SandRid every couple of weeks to prevent sand colic.

The power company came out and installed the new power pole and transformer. They had to hole dug and the pole up in less than an hour, which I though was pretty quick. They took some more time to get everything hooked up, but overall I think it went pretty well. I am happy because the power company had charged me extra in case they encountered "difficult digging conditions," which they obviously didn't. I should be getting a refund on at least that part of the fees.

I rented a trencher and dug the required trench from the base of the pole over to where my field meter is going to be installed, about 35 feet. I spent an entire day getting the 400A meter base and two 200A main breaker panels wired up. Tomorrow I hope to get the rest of the pieces installed so I can call for an inspection on Monday. It will be really nice to get power out to the property.

We also ordered a 12x16 shed, which will be delivered this week to store our feed and supplies in. It will be really nice to get things out of the weather before any seriously bad weather hits.