Mini-split: How do you find an installer if ordering online?

[Dave-H]

Hi all -

My 20x20 garage is going to be insulated with spray foam under the roof, rockwool along the wall, and an insulated garage door before hanging drywall up to the cathedral ceiling.

So, I expect decent insulation although I'm cutting in a few windows and I really doubt that any garage door can seal well

Now for HVAC: I've had 2 companies come out, both recommend mini-split heat pump with the caveat that on a cold winter day in Denver it might need some help. Sounds like a decent option, especially considering I am shooting video inside and need quiet.

One bid was $7200, the other was $6400, both for Daikin 18,000 BTU unit. Wow that's pricey. They told me that I'd void the warranty if I do it online, but I'm seeing that it's not quite that simple. They also told me that mini-splits need yearly maintenance which seems a little much.

For those of you who order online, how did you find an installer? I checked a few and they won't install the ones they didn't source, but certainly someone will do it. If I could get this done for under <5000 without sacrificing too much i'd have to go for that!

Any advice much appreciated!

thanks!!

 

[chrispyny]

I don't know about other places, but i'm pretty sure that ecomfort.com has an 'installer network' where once you buy a minisplit from them, they give you a couple places willing to do the install.

Give them a call and see.

 

[Spdstr280Z]

Wow.... I thought my quotes at around $4,500 for an 18K were on the high side ! Is there some special situation / very difficult install that is driving the cost, or is your area generally high ? The company that quoted a Trane (rebadged Gree) for me was actually very nice about it, and advised they would do an install / turn up on anything I wanted, including an internet sourced unit, they just would not be responsible for the unit warranty.

I think talking to the on line sellers is a good idea, many that I looked at offered help with installers. I simply could not justify the cost for my garage, so I have MrCool DIY 18K arriving in the morning. It's not a Mitsubishi or Daiken, but for the price, and no install labor, I can replace it every few years if need be. You might look in to that option if you have no luck with local installers.

Good luck !

Jason

 

[thammel]

I bought from ecomfort. I did ALL the installation myself with the exception of final line connect and leak check. When I had some HVAC work done at the house, I asked one of the young installers if he did side work and get his phone number. The installation is not that difficult at all.

Tom

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Craigslist

 

[brewchief]

Do you buy a steak at Walmart and then ask a steakhouse to cook it? No decent HVAC contractor wants to deal with any equipment sourced by a customer be it online or locally. There is no upside to it for the contractor, if it breaks it has to be an install problem thus the contractors fault and if it needs parts the contractor will be expected to track them down and install for free.

We turn down **** like that on a regular basis as it always ends badly.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[Dave-H]

And yet, people seem to be doing it all the time. I can't believe that there isn't a single reputable installer who will do a great job installing.

And this business about the profit margin is nonsense. It's just like online glasses - so many opticians say 'oh but we don't make any money online so why should we do fittings, etc.' and then give a big speech about how it can't be done online. But the online glasses industry is exploding and the shops that are just charging people more for fittings if they bought online are doing great.

The 'whose fault is it' thing is also nonsense, in my view. How hard is it to avoid assuming liability for a product you didn't source, and only guaranteeing the installation? It's pretty easy. The industry I work in deals in contractors dealing in all sorts of overlapping things, and the contracts get interesting but we work through it.

I remember people saying nobody would ever buy shoes online. No so much anymore.

Somewhere in this town there is a great HVAC pro who will simply up his price to ensure his margin, and make me sign something assuming responsibility for the unit and I look forward to writing him a check.

 

[Git]

When I ordered my Mr Slim a couple of years ago through eComfort - they were able to provide some names of contractors in my area. So reach out to whoever your thinking of buying from and ask them

Another resource is to contact the manufacturer of the unit your thinking of buying. For example, Mitsubishi has a web page where you can locate contractors in your area. (Mitsubishi calls them "Diamond" contractors)
http://www.mitsubishicomfort.com/contractors

 

[Git]

Do you buy a steak at Walmart and then ask a steakhouse to cook it? No decent HVAC contractor wants to deal with any equipment sourced by a customer be it online or locally. There is no upside to it for the contractor, if it breaks it has to be an install problem thus the contractors fault and if it needs parts the contractor will be expected to track them down and install for free.

We turn down **** like that on a regular basis as it always ends badly.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

I had no problem finding a certified Mitsubishi contractor in my area who glad to accept my money for basically what amounted to a 3 hour service call

 

[Spdstr280Z]

Yep, I understand the point that brewchief makes, but the vendor with the quote I couldn't quite handle told me directly they would do anything I wanted, the full job as quoted, install anything I bought, or just do a vacuum / pressure test / adjust and turn up for a self install. He did make it clear that they would not be responsible for any warranty or warranty processing on the unit if they did not provide it, which I would not expect. And this was probably the most well known company in my immediate area, nice vehicles, billboards, etc.

Another option is side work for someone who works for a local company, I had this option too. This may get tricky if your manufacturer requires a "licensed contractor" to install for warranty purposes. This varies around here, I have had companies offer up one of their guys who works on the weekends, and I have talked to people who would do work but said they would get fired if their company found out.

Still surprised at your quotes and wondering what drives that price, a difficult install, or things are just expensive in your area. My quotes were all below your $5K threshold.

Jason

 

[theoldwizard1]

Daikin is not exactly "top quality" !

 

[Dave-H]

When I ordered my Mr Slim a couple of years ago through eComfort - they were able to provide some names of contractors in my area. So reach out to whoever your thinking of buying from and ask them

Another resource is to contact the manufacturer of the unit your thinking of buying. For example, Mitsubishi has a web page where you can locate contractors in your area. (Mitsubishi calls them "Diamond" contractors)
http://www.mitsubishicomfort.com/contractors

I tried this and they provided a huge directory of installers, but it was very unclear if they were all up for the job of installing a unit like this. I can work through the list if need be!

I had no problem finding a certified Mitsubishi contractor in my area who glad to accept my money for basically what amounted to a 3 hour service call

I checked that site and it's a much shorter list, will seriously consider this!

Still surprised at your quotes and wondering what drives that price, a difficult install, or things are just expensive in your area. My quotes were all below your $5K threshold.

Jason

The installer, who I found to be very credible, said that there was some serious overhead in Denver due to double license requirements and a few other things. I believed him.

Here's another question for you all

If I order the unit online, are there a bunch of accessories, mounting kits, hardware or other things I would need to order so that the installer can knock out the job on the first trip?

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Daikin is not exactly "top quality" !

Haven't you heard their commercials?
They say tyre the best in the world. Just ask em,they'll tell ya!p

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

And yet, people seem to be doing it all the time. I can't believe that there isn't a single reputable installer who will do a great job installing.

And this business about the profit margin is nonsense. It's just like online glasses - so many opticians say 'oh but we don't make any money online so why should we do fittings, etc.' and then give a big speech about how it can't be done online. But the online glasses industry is exploding and the shops that are just charging people more for fittings if they bought online are doing great.

The 'whose fault is it' thing is also nonsense, in my view. How hard is it to avoid assuming liability for a product you didn't source, and only guaranteeing the installation? It's pretty easy. The industry I work in deals in contractors dealing in all sorts of overlapping things, and the contracts get interesting but we work through it.

I remember people saying nobody would ever buy shoes online. No so much anymore.

Somewhere in this town there is a great HVAC pro who will simply up his price to ensure his margin, and make me sign something assuming responsibility for the unit and I look forward to writing him a check.

So buy the tools and do it yourself then.

 

[unluckyty]

If you are physically able you can install one of the Mr slim DIY units. You need electric run out to unit with a disconnect, probably hardest part of install. Easy to install by yourself or with a helper.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Thats a LOT of money. We install the same basic Daikin units in the schools all the time. Granted, we save money by installing it ourselves, but our total cost is under $3k...

Tommy

 

[walrus]

Daikin is not exactly "top quality" !

Daikins are being sold left and right in Maine. Some installers I know love them and say they are great units?? We are using them for heat more than cooling though

 

[Dave-H]

Problem solved. I used the Mitsubishi site to find a diamond contractor and quickly found 2 that were happy to perform the install. Both of them said that it was fine to do that, but you get a longer warranty if you buy it through them - I don't know if that's true.

Sure enough, both of them offered my a nice deal on the unit and my installed price for a Mitsubishi unit purchased directly from a licensed installer with god reviews is now around $4200. The both quoted the same price for installation of an online-bought unit - $1600. This means that I'm paying a big more to get it from the installer but there are some benefits to that and I'm willing to do it.

In my view, this is yet another example of a long-standing economy/service being forced to change because of the internet. Like books, shoes, real estate and so many other things. And, like those other things, there will be some vendors who still maintain that it's somehow best to charge an obfuscated price to customers where there is obvious markup and value but the customer doesn't know how it breaks down, really.

And there are others who will simply accept the new reality: it's now possible to buy the exactly same unit that your installer can get, frequently with the same warranty. Any consumer can understand why the installer now needs to recover some of the margin that they lose when they don't get the markup on the unit. So, those installers will find new pricing for their services that keeps the profitable while offering the customer more value.

Quote from the installer, "I have to charge you more for the install since you aren't buying the mini split through me, but we can definitely install it for you."

 

[Git]

At the end of the day - if you are happy with the price and the 'peace of mind' that goes with it, that is all that really counts

There are a lot of dinosaurs out there (like Sears, etc) that just don't get it.

I was reading on a Contractor's Forum I frequent where one guy was pissed off because he went out to a house for an estimate and ended up doing some kitchen 'design work' for a bid that took him an hour or two. It sounds like the homeowner blew him off and won't answer his calls so now he thinks he is going to be able to bill them $250 (for his time) for the free estimate

It takes all kinds...

 

[BD1]

I would definitely have it installed by a manufacture recommended company.
My brother in law bought a unit online and had some local cheap a$$ guy do it. Well they had issues during the FIRST year. They contacted manufacture since online seller had nothing to do with it except sell it. Manufacture stated that the written warranty in manual clearly states unit must be installed by factory authorized contractor. Since he didn't it was on him.

 

[Spdstr280Z]

Wow, you went from what seemed to be a rediculous quote to less than I was quoted on Trane and Daiken for a Mitsubishi ! As long as they do a good job, that worked out ! Did they give any insight as to why the other quotes may have been so high ?

Jason

 

[Dave-H]

No, but a retired gen. contractor in my family said that HVAC clients fall into two categories:

1. People who do a little homework, come to understand a bit of what they are paying for, and therefore spend less by making better decisions and having some idea what a good price is.

2. People who call the HVAC company, pay whatever they ask for, and are thankful that they don't have to deal with any 'scary HVAC stuff'.

I can really see that. This stuff is greek to a lot of people. I see now that many companies are simply setup to cater to #2, and that's good business for them.

 

[Wizzard]

Try to find a good and honest steady HVAC tech that you will have a long relationship with. Hard to do but a win-win for both parties if you can find someone you trust. A lot easier to do in smaller towns.

 

[fastjohnny]

I think a good living could be made installing these...

Self-install from out of the box to running on my 3, soon to be 4 mitsubishi hyperheat's, and never looked back.

 

[Dan Babb]

I'm starting to research this myself and the installation really doesn't look all that hard. Found this video from This Old House.

I have an electrician that I can get out to my house to run the power...but the rest really looks like plug & play.

I got a quote yesterday for a Mitsubishi Mini-split for my 30x30 shop.$5,644. The unit is at eComfort for $1,800. It seems like the hardest part of the job will be running the power...I can't understand why installation would be almost $3,900?