MIOSHA inspector------Really?

[funflyer]

Let me highjack this thread for a second,

Ross/Kzoo is that your Goat in your avatar? I have a 66 hardtop, had it since 1981, wish it was a vert.

 

[KEH]

I guess he would really had a cow if he had seen me years ago hauling a 20 foot piece of 1 1/4 pipe by hanging it beneath the frame of my pickup truck.

KEH

 

[RivennHewn]

I guess he would really had a cow if he had seen me years ago hauling a 20 foot piece of 1 1/4 pipe by hanging it beneath the frame of my pickup truck.

KEH

I used to carry rebar on top of my axles.

 

[Todd.Brock]

I don't know about MI, but a company has to have X number of employees to come under OSHA. Your contractor may or may not come under OSHA.



The inspector may have thought your wife was part of the crew, but he has no authority over a private individual. On that issue tell him to pound sand and leave your wife alone.



The guy sounds to me like a bully. Remember BTK? That's how he was.

Did you just compare a possibly over zealous inspector to a serial killer?

 

[rslaback]

Haven't been hurt yet because I use something called common sense. And if I'm unsure of something, I take responsibility to find out before I do it. But sure, keep touting that horn. Ironic you would call someone a plebeian. You're such a hero to everyones rescue.

Those trees are the forest.

 

[XxToolAholicxX]

Safety! Safety! Safety! As most of us here on GJ work with tools should know this. A ladder can fall of the truck and cost a life. Or Contractors working on job site without a hard hat can cause injury to themselves and we all pay for their disability insurance through higher rates. Think about it.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------I am a Toolaholic,Sometimes I regret it,Especially when the Toolman wont give me no credit

 

[koditten]

I can't believe we don't actually have a MIOSHA inspector on this site. Prolly worried about the dog pile that would happen to him.

 

[Clik]

I hate Safety Nazis! I hate the Nanny State! If that had happened to me I'd have been mighty tempted to throw roofing nails in his driveway every night.

 

[6t7gto]

Just wanted to post so my avatar of my cars would show.

 

[Strouty]

Thousands of people have died on the job because of dangerous situations employers put people in. Workplace safety has probably kept you alive. Selfish you are. And a historic pleb.

As an employer, there are plenty of times that trained and competent employees put the employer in a bad spot by not following rules or not using PPE. I don't like to babysit at some point the employee should be accountable, of course with the mindset of this day and age, it would never be the fault of the employee. Besides, the employer has deeper pockets to pick.

A local electrician that I knew ended up closing down because OSHA ran him over with fines. They had a trained employee using a bucket truck to change light bulbs in a parking lot. The employee decided that it was too much trouble to wear the employer provided safety harness and hard hat while in the bucket. So who should be to blame? People wonder why it is so expensive to get things done, half the time the employer needs to pay for a safety babysitter to be on site just to make sure that no one does something dumb.

 

[juiced10]

while he is probably right, he still sounds like a jerk on a power trip. He didn't need to threaten tickets just yet; maybe he should have introduced himself to the new neighbors and made a couple polite suggestions.

Sounds like a 'fun' neighbor; good luck. When you cut your grass, make sure to wear eye protection, hearing protection, and steel toe boots so you don't 'get a ticket'.

I was going to say he needs to make sure the inspector is always using PPE while cutting the grass. In passing just make friendly reminders to always wear gloves when using a steak knife!

 

[captmoto]

Generally he should only have enforcement powers while on duty. I as a firefighter had limited law enforcement power. 1, relating to fire code and 2, while on duty.
As far as the flag on the ladder, that sounds like a traffic enforcement like local LEO or state trooper.
What a ****.

 

[DekeT]

I hate Safety Nazis! I hate the Nanny State! If that had happened to me I'd have been mighty tempted to throw roofing nails in his driveway every night.

Internet tough guy.

 

[Diesel Dan]

Haven't been hurt yet because I use something called common sense. And if I'm unsure of something, I take responsibility to find out before I do it. But sure, keep touting that horn. Ironic you would call someone a plebeian. You're such a hero to everyones rescue.

Consider yourself lucky, as I have been is some cases.
Had foremen send me into confined spaces without proper equipment because I was an apprentice and didn't have confined space training yet. Common sense does not always catch unseen dangers. Reason for first responders on site for our confined space was we had BANKS of Halon fire extinguishers that could displace the oxygen in the work area very quickly. But being new I wasn't aware of those.

 

[41ratrod]

The same here in Missouri, 4'.

 

[Clik]

DekeT, Yeah, pretty mild for me. I have a record of far more severe retribution but didn't want to sound like Don Corleone or incriminate myself. At 6'3 340lbs biker weight lifter I have to be gentle so as not to intimidate people just by shaking hands.

 

[DekeT]

DekeT, Yeah, pretty mild for me. I have a record of far more severe retribution but didn't want to sound like Don Corleone or incriminate myself. At 6'3 340lbs biker weight lifter I have to be gentle so as not to intimidate people just by shaking hands.

I see your point. I have no doubt you are a tough guy. The nails are for your internet persona. In real life all you would have to do is stare.

 

[maxwage]

Stop whining, be a man. Don't come crying to a online forum. Confront him in real life. We're regular guys, getting regular chit done. Ask him "Why you gotta bust my balls?" Just tell him to f### off and snitch if he wants. Your wife and contractor obviously weren't doing anything inherently unsafe.

EDIT: As has been pointed out by others per MI law. Plus, I am from the UP of MI, so therefore I am a Michigan Man. We are not Pu$$ies. Tell him to stop being such a female dog.

 

[vision8]

I would bite the bullet until all contractor construction is complete and you have your building inspector sign off the building permit and you have your occupancy permit in hand. These people can make life miserable for you in a hurry ! My 2 cents worth.

 

[Ross/Kzoo]

I would bite the bullet until all contractor construction is complete and you have your building inspector sign off the building permit and you have your occupancy permit in hand. These people can make life miserable for you in a hurry ! My 2 cents worth.

Yes, I agree. I forgot about the occupancy permit but I do have the building permit. I'm also going to ask the neighbors and bring up the subject of the overactive neighbor.

 

[Ross/Kzoo]

Stop whining, be a man. Don't come crying to a online forum. Confront him in real life. We're regular guys, getting regular chit done. Ask him "Why you gotta bust my balls?" Just tell him to f### off and snitch if he wants. Your wife and contractor obviously weren't doing anything inherently unsafe.

EDIT: As has been pointed out by others per MI law. Plus, I am from the UP of MI, so therefore I am a Michigan Man. We are not Pu$$ies. Tell him to stop being such a female dog.

I'm not being a ***** about this but was looking for suggestions on this since the building will be going on for a few months and I don't want to screw things up for my builder or myself until I move in. We can't be as free spirited as the UP'ers since we have inspectors inspecting every aspect of our lives.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Probably, but if the sign said instead "Private Property - No Trespassing" they would need probable cause

Nope. There's a HUGE difference between Probable Cause and Reasonable Suspicion. A NJ Game Warden can enter any private property he suspects is being hunted, any time, any where. It falls under expectaion of privacy. Woods, streams, lakes , etc. are legally considered "open field" and as such, the persons on that property have no expectation of privacy, even if they are posted. No warrant is needed. Basically, if the GW suspects private property is hunted, he can inspect that property at any time with or without notice or warrant. In some states that includes walking into your house to inspect what game meat you might have in your refrigerator. That's where the "exigent circumstances" comes into play.

Tommy

 

[alinc100]

If your MIOSHA inspector needs a hobby have him watch the Wallside Windows
commercials. No hardhats,no safety glasses,no workboots,guys climbing to the top of an extension ladder carrying a 4'-5' window 16 ft in the air,etc.
Of course its all on TV in a 30 second commercial.

Miosha comes through our workplace and gives us flak because we pour wood glue into squeeze bottles from 5 gallon buckets and the squeeze bottles don't have a MANUFACTURER label on them, but are clearly marked with a permanent vinyl decal stating the contents.

 

[Rock knocker]

Nope. There's a HUGE difference between Probable Cause and Reasonable Suspicion. A NJ Game Warden can enter any private property he suspects is being hunted, any time, any where. It falls under expectaion of privacy. Woods, streams, lakes , etc. are legally considered "open field" and as such, the persons on that property have no expectation of privacy, even if they are posted. No warrant is needed. Basically, if the GW suspects private property is hunted, he can inspect that property at any time with or without notice or warrant. In some states that includes walking into your house to inspect what game meat you might have in your refrigerator. That's where the "exigent circumstances" comes into play

I think your understanding is based more on what you hear than what the law says

23:10-5. Arrest on view without warrant; interference with or resisting officer
Any constable, police officer, fish and game warden, protector, or deputy warden, or any officer or member of any incorporated game protective society may, for a violation of any provision of this Title, or any provision of any law supplementary thereto, or of any provision of the State Fish and Game Code committed within the view of any such officer or person, arrest, without warrant, the offender and carry him before a court in the county wherein such arrest is made. Any person or persons who shall, by threat, menace or force, or in any manner, attempt to deter or prevent any fish and game warden or other person authorized to make arrests for violation of the fish and game laws of this State, or any provision of any law supplementary thereto, or any provision of the State Fish and Game Code from enforcing or carrying into effect any provisions of this Title, or any provision of any law supplementary thereto, or any provision of the State Fish and Game Code or who shall resist arrest or the seizure of boats or nets or other apparatus illegally used, shall be subject to a fine of one hundred dollars ($100.00).

23:10-20. Searches and seizures; immunity from civil suit
A member of the Fish and Game Council and any conservation officer may, without warrant search and examine any boat, conveyance, vehicle, fish box, fish basket, game bag, game coat or other receptacle for game and fish, when he has reason to believe that a provision of this Title, or any law supplementary thereto, or the State Fish and Game Code has been violated, and shall seize and take possession of any firearms, bows and arrows, shells or cartridges, fishing rods and reels, fishing lines, knives, lights, slingshots, traps, spears, spear guns or any other article or equipment that has been illegally used or any bird, animal or fish unlawfully caught, taken, killed, had in possession or under control, shipped or about to be shipped. A court, upon receiving proof of probable cause for believing in the concealment of a bird, animal or fish so unlawfully caught, taken, killed, had in possession or under control, shipped or about to be shipped, shall issue a search warrant and cause a search to be made in any place, and to that end, may, after demand and refusal, cause any building, inclosure or car to be entered, and any apartment, chest, box, locker, crate, basket or package to be broken open and its contents examined by a member of the Fish and Game Council or any conservation officer. All firearms, bows and arrows, shells or cartridges, fishing rods and reels, fishing lines, knives, lights, slingshots, traps, spears, spear guns or any other article or equipment that has been illegally used and seized by a member of the council or any conservation officer shall be returned to the defendant when and if the case has been dismissed, if he has been found not guilty, or if he has been convicted and has paid the penalty and costs imposed, if any.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

I think your understanding is based more on what you hear than what the law says

My statements are based on personal experience and court dates that followed. It has happened to me & at least one other hunter I know.

The quotes in your post back it up, too...

Tommy

 

[Blue]

Stop whining, be a man. Don't come crying to a online forum. Confront him in real life. We're regular guys, getting regular chit done. Ask him "Why you gotta bust my balls?" Just tell him to f### off and snitch if he wants. Your wife and contractor obviously weren't doing anything inherently unsafe.

EDIT: As has been pointed out by others per MI law. Plus, I am from the UP of MI, so therefore I am a Michigan Man. We are not Pu$$ies. Tell him to stop being such a female dog.

 

[mrodgers]

Haven't been hurt yet because I use something called common sense. And if I'm unsure of something, I take responsibility to find out before I do it. But sure, keep touting that horn. Ironic you would call someone a plebeian. You're such a hero to everyones rescue.

Common sense might tell you not to stand on one foot on your toes on the top of a 6 foot ladder to reach what you are working on, but without OSHA or some other enforcement regulating the workplace, when the boss tells you to stand on your tip toes on one foot on top of the 6 foot ladder because he's not wasting the money to buy an 8 foot ladder, then you do it or get fired. I'll just get another job you say? Well, the next boss is going to do the same thing, and the next, and the next without someone enforcing safety rules on the workplace.

Workplaces don't care about your safety. They care about following the rules to not get fined and to implement safety programs to cut their insurance premiums. They will spout off about how they care about you though, lying through their teeth.

 

[Rock knocker]

My statements are based on personal experience and court dates that followed. It has happended to me & at least one other hunter I know.

The quotes in your post back it up, too...

Tommy

Nope, he says he has to see it, not "suspect it". Difference there

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Nope, he says he has to see it, not "suspect it". Difference there

That pertains to arrest, not search.

Also see the first line, quote #2. Bold text...

Tommy

 

[Rock knocker]

That specifically excludes real property

 

[LS6 Tommy]

That specifically excludes real property

The second quote absolutely pertains to the list of vehicles and equipment included in the text, but not to open "real" private property. You're correct in saying they can't search your house frige without a warrant, but A NJ Game Warden can & will search any "open field", private or not, if he suspects it is being hunted. It's part of the Open Fields doctrine. It's a specific power held by Game Wardens that is not covered by the Fourth Amendment.

Tommy

 

[Rock knocker]

The second quote absolutely pertains to the list of vehicles and equipment included in the text, but not to open "real" private property. You're correct in saying they can't search your house frige without a warrant, but A NJ Game Warden can & will search any "open field", private or not, if he suspects it is being hunted. It's part of the Open Fields doctrine. It's a specific power held by Game Wardens that is not covered by the Fourth Amendment

So we've gone from "they can search anywhere without a warrant" to open fields and coolers?

 

[GTO]

Job site,yes,your wifes car,**** no.
Tell him to get his little ticket book out and write away.

 

[Tronyadorable]

It's only gonna get worse. Far far worse.
It happens about every 50-100 years. You hear the exact same idiotic bleating.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

So we've gone from "they can search anywhere without a warrant" to open fields and coolers?

All I ever said from my second post was a Game Warden can enter private property without a warrant. Others brought up the "walk right into your house and inspect the refrigerator" thing. I just replied about it. Maybe I should edit my post to say "a NJ Game Warden can enter ONTO private property without a warrant"...

Tommy

 

[Lassen Forge]

I would be on the phone to his superior so fast it would make your head spin like you were in a Exorcist movie.

For the VC violation - tell him to show me his LEO coredentials, or I will have a *real* cop there to explain what police powers he doesn't have. Period. And while they're there, they can explain the meaning of "trespass" and "entry without permission".

OSHA is OCCUPATIONAL. I've dealt with *real* OSHA inspections on jobsites, and they're usually professional, not overbearing, and will issue you a citation or warning notice for violations. Not chew your ***. And... ANY OSHA inspector showing up unannounced and then chewing MY and MY SPOUSES **** on MY PRIVATE property for stuff I was personally doing on MY property, non-occupationally, is way out of his jurisdiction. To approach you asschewing?? He might just meet Mr. Remington encouraging him to take his sniveling, whining *** off --**MY**-- land. This ain't Communist China or the old USSR, kimosabe.

(Added side note - I *have*, on my job sites, asked OSHA to make an appointment for an inspection, during regular buiness hours, both on the bridge and in the warehouse I used to run. I don't have time to babysit them... nor do my employees. SOP was if one showed up, sit them in a chair, call the boss (usually me), arrange a time the boss can get there (always some time in the future), and they have to leave until said boss was available. As they are not "authorized personnel" they cannot be on property wtihout official ****** - and ****** duties were not part of my employees job scope.)

 

[Vvmvbb]

Yeah, I'd be irritated too.
But then I'd introduce myself and thank him for catching those things.
Seems like the smartest move - you might be neighbors for a long time and life is too short to be at war with a guy like that from day 1.

 

[DekeT]

I would be on the phone to his superior so fast it would make your head spin like you were in a Exorcist movie.

For the VC violation - tell him to show me his LEO coredentials, or I will have a *real* cop there to explain what police powers he doesn't have. Period. And while they're there, they can explain the meaning of "trespass" and "entry without permission".

OSHA is OCCUPATIONAL. I've dealt with *real* OSHA inspections on jobsites, and they're usually professional, not overbearing, and will issue you a citation or warning notice for violations. Not chew your ***. And... ANY OSHA inspector showing up unannounced and then chewing MY and MY SPOUSES **** on MY PRIVATE property for stuff I was personally doing on MY property, non-occupationally, is way out of his jurisdiction. To approach you asschewing?? He might just meet Mr. Remington encouraging him to take his sniveling, whining *** off --**MY**-- land. This ain't Communist China or the old USSR, kimosabe.

(Added side note - I *have*, on my job sites, asked OSHA to make an appointment for an inspection, during regular buiness hours, both on the bridge and in the warehouse I used to run. I don't have time to babysit them... nor do my employees. SOP was if one showed up, sit them in a chair, call the boss (usually me), arrange a time the boss can get there (always some time in the future), and they have to leave until said boss was available. As they are not "authorized personnel" they cannot be on property wtihout official ****** - and ****** duties were not part of my employees job scope.)

You are quite the volcano aren't you?

 

[RivennHewn]

Just like the DEA doesn't really go after small time pot users, the OSHA inspectors don't really go after homeowners. That doesn't mean they can't, and if they see something blatant they can and will enforce.

A simple "No Trespassing" sign at the driveway and on your building will actually stop them from wondering in.

If they do stop by, tell them to wait at the driveway until you check to see if your site is 'Safe for visitors'.

That will buy you time to correct any problems.

You can also invite him in for a consult. This way the issues get corrected, no fines issued, everybody stays safe and goes home happy.

Always better to make a friend than an enemy.

 

[Shadowdog500]

The first part of your OP is between him and the builder. Stay out of it!

The second part about the ladder makes him sound like a ****! I thought 4' was the legal limit without a flag everywhere. What is the law in Michican ?

I would find out if he is really the Osha inspector, or just the janitor at the OSHA office.

Chris