Modine Hot Dawg heater smell

[PoorUB]

I still wonder about the painted flue pipe. It looks to be B-vent, but it can get very hot. Perhaps the heat is driving VOC's out of the paint. It might be as simple as replacing the vent pipe and don't paint it!

Was the vent pipe itself painted lately? Last few months?

 

[KVF]

I didn’t use the heater all weekend and Monday. I turned it on just now and first it just smelled like metal & warm dust for a few minutes and then I started to smell ozone, meter readings btwn .105-.163, then a minute later .195-.496. The air was thick & stuffy, I started coughing and I had to turn off the heater and open a window. After a minute or so of fresh air the readings went down to .045. Cleaning out the flu only helped a little bit at first and now we’re back right where we started.

 

[KVF]

I still wonder about the painted flue pipe. It looks to be B-vent, but it can get very hot. Perhaps the heat is driving VOC's out of the paint. It might be as simple as replacing the vent pipe and don't paint it!

Was the vent pipe itself painted lately? Last few months?

I will suggest that to my landlords. I’m not sure when it was painted

 

[gmcgeo]

yeah, sounds like after it gets warm then it starts the problem. need to remove and replace all painted pipe

 

[PCustoms]

Is this a legitimate, legal apartment or a warehouse convert?

Seems like a few potentially dangerous "features" of this space.

 

[4x4Pete]

Test for CO! Could be venting is open in the chase.

 

[gmcgeo]

Test for CO! Could be venting is open in the chase.

no, its ozone

 

[4x4Pete]

I guess it's supposed to be o3.....but has anybody actually checked if the venting is properly sealed through the chase? The smell could be ozone and CO or any combination of products of combustion. The ozone seems unlikely so check for correct installation, especially proper venting. The company who checked it may or may not have checked thoroughly enough.

 

[gmcgeo]

I guess it's supposed to be o3.....but has anybody actually checked if the venting is properly sealed through the chase? The smell could be ozone and CO or any combination of products of combustion. The ozone seems unlikely so check for correct installation, especially proper venting. The company who checked it may or may not have checked thoroughly enough.

He has Ozone tests that show its ozone, lets not go away from the diagnosis and steer them in the wrong direction

 

[4x4Pete]

He shouldn't give up on the ozone, but he should at least check for CO. Ozone could be produced by the spark ignition but that would be minimal at most.

 

[KVF]

Test for CO! Could be venting is open in the chase.

Carbon monoxide has been tested for multiple times and is at 2 parts per million and I have smoke detector/carbon monoxide detectors in here carbon monoxide is not the issue

 

[KVF]

He shouldn't give up on the ozone, but he should at least check for CO. Ozone could be produced by the spark ignition but that would be minimal at most.

I have not seen any sparks from the fan at night time when I turned on the heat

 

[KVF]

Everybody I really appreciate all this feedback. Are there any professionals out there who could shine some light on why this could be happening? We’ve discussed the painted flue. I have not been using the heater because I don’t want to put my lungs in any more danger. I have three space heaters that I’ve been using every night, But the past times & EVERY TIME I turn on the Hot Dawg heater I smell chlorine and sometimes exhaust & natural gas…all I know is that an unauthorized build by a previous tenant for the enclosure happened and they also painted the flue and all the smells are coming out of the bedroom where the flue/ enclosure travel and they only happen when I turn on the heater and after the fan kicks on, these are the facts. I live in a warehouse converted into a live work apartment. LIVE means residential. The state of California requires all residential units to have a properly working heater & ventilation system. The heater has been inspected by a professional and everything seems to be in working order. I believe it is the painted flue & dusty enclosure that is a source of the problem. I bought an ozone detector with my own money I have been keeping a journal and tons of photographs and videos with dates and times and temperature/weather conditions like it’s my job. As of yet my landlords have not brought out a professional to test for ozone & measure air quality when the heater is turned on. Any professional help or Internet links or phone numbers that I can call to talk to professionals about this would be most appreciated thank you

 

[KVF]

I guess it's supposed to be o3.....but has anybody actually checked if the venting is properly sealed through the chase? The smell could be ozone and CO or any combination of products of combustion. The ozone seems unlikely so check for correct installation, especially proper venting. The company who checked it may or may not have checked thoroughly enough.

They checked the flue on the roof but I didn’t see it. They say it’s fine

 

[Fly YX]

Did anyone check to make sure the flu gases are going up the flu and not back into the living space. If that checks ok it’s probably the painted exhaust pipes or way they are ran.

 

[KVF]

Did anyone check to make sure the flu gases are going up the flu and not back into the living space. If that checks ok it’s probably the painted exhaust pipes or way they are ran.

Nope, no one checked for punctures or any leaks in the flue since it’s inside the enclosure.

 

[Fly YX]

Don’t know if it’s just the way the pic is but check this.

 

[Fly YX]

And the back of the heater should be a blue flame across the burner. You could have a negative pressure in the vent going back into the living space.

 

[KVF]

Don’t know if it’s just the way the pic is but check this.

Is that a close up of my flue from the pics I posted? Yeah I see what you’re getting at.

 

[KVF]

Is that a close up of my flue from the pics I posted? Yeah I see what you’re getting at. It ONLY smells in the bedroom. Downstairs is normal. I really do think it’s the paint

 

[KVF]

New pictures of heater/flue/fan. I got a good deal on a used 10 ft ladder so I could see better. Haven’t turned on or touched this heater for a while because of health hazard.

 

[Aileron]

Is that space sealed up tight? It needs air to burn. It needs a combustion analysis done on it. Were did they test for CO. A proper combustion anaylsis is done in the flue piping exiting the heater. The outside of b vent should not be getting hot enough to burn the paint. That is why they use it.

 

[KVF]

Is that space sealed up tight? It needs air to burn. It needs a combustion analysis done on it. Were did they test for CO. A proper combustion anaylsis is done in the flue piping exiting the heater. The outside of b vent should not be getting hot enough to burn the paint. That is why they use it.

What space my apartment? Well there’s no weatherstripping around the front door and there’s definitely a breeze that comes in if that’s what you’re asking. I don’t know if they did a combustion analysis probably not but I’ll ask thank you for your reply

 

[Aileron]

No the space the heater is in. The fuel mixes with room air and the fuel burns depleting the oxygen in the room if it does not have any fresh air to make up and replace it. Usually 1 sq in for every 3ooo btu. If you put a screen over the fresh air opening it de rates the size of the opening by 25%. The flame will start going rich as you use up your air. You can produce co with too much air and not enough air. A combustion analyzer meter is the really only way to check.

 

[KVF]

No the space the heater is in. The fuel mixes with room air and the fuel burns depleting the oxygen in the room if it does not have any fresh air to make up and replace it. Usually 1 sq in for every 3ooo btu. If you put a screen over the fresh air opening it de rates the size of the opening by 25%. The flame will start going rich as you use up your air. You can produce co with too much air and not enough air. A combustion analyzer meter is the really only way to check.

Carbon monoxide is not the issue that’s been checked several times and has not been detected at dangerous levels. The issue here is that the flu goes through the bedroom upstairs and every time the fan kicks on when I turn the heater on there is a strong smell of chlorine and ozone has been detected up to .4 to .6. With the windows open in the bedroom lower levels of ozone have been detected at .01 and slightly above. But it is counterproductive to open windows when you’re trying to keep the heat in. Heat just goes right out the window

 

[Fly YX]

I would have them replace the flu. With all the same size pipe. Wonder what the black stuff is ?

 

[nadogail]

If the problem does not get corrected, can you call your local Department of Public Health?

 

[Aileron]

JMO, there is no clean out on the flue piping, second, there is no drip leg in the gas supply line to the heater. Just two items that make me question its a DIY install and most likely a cut and run. That flue may not be maintaining a draft after the heater has been running for a while if it does at all. That fluehas to pull air from somewhere. If the heater can not draft correctly were is the byproducts going? Combustion produces NOX.

What is Ozone? | US EPA

description of ozone for ozone and your patients' health training for health care providers

www.epa.gov

 

[PCustoms]

JMO, there is no clean out on the flue piping, second, there is no drip leg in the gas supply line to the heater. Just two items that make me question its a DIY install and most likely a cut and run. That flue may not be maintaining a draft after the heater has been running for a while if it does at all. That fluehas to pull air from somewhere. If the heater can not draft correctly were is the byproducts going? Combustion produces NOX.

What is Ozone? | US EPA

description of ozone for ozone and your patients' health training for health care providers

www.epa.gov

Since when does a gas flue require a clean out?

 

[Showkey]

After all this confusion and lack of actual facts and data:
Maybe it’s not the heater ? Makeup air, sewer gas etc

• Ozone can be confused by instrumentation with other oxidizing gases such as chlorine compounds, acid fumes, and oxides of nitrogen (NOx). Strong “reducing” gases, such as vapors of alcohol and solvents, can reduce the apparent concentration of ozone.

 

[Aileron]

Since when does a gas flue require a clean out?

Where does the condensate go when the flue sweats. Its common practice to have a tee at the bottom of the vertical riser.

 

[gmcgeo]

JMO, there is no clean out on the flue piping, second, there is no drip leg in the gas supply line to the heater. Just two items that make me question its a DIY install and most likely a cut and run. That flue may not be maintaining a draft after the heater has been running for a while if it does at all. That fluehas to pull air from somewhere. If the heater can not draft correctly were is the byproducts going? Combustion produces NOX.

You may need to brush up on the Codes, This does not need a flue pipe clean out. and the drip leg is good to do, however would not effect what is going on.

 

[Aileron]

You may need to brush up on the Codes, This does not need a flue pipe clean out. and the drip leg is good to do, however would not effect what is going on.

It may not effect whats going on but its a hack install and wouldn't have passed here. Section 408.4 of the fuel gas code requires a trap in the gas line before that heater.

 

[woodfirenewbie]

No sediment trap on the gas line, no condensate tee before the vertical section of vent. Shain't good!

@KVF, did you ever get this one figured out?

 

[gmcgeo]

No sediment trap on the gas line, no condensate tee before the vertical section of vent. Shain't good!

@KVF, did you ever get this one figured out?

No tee is needed, and is not recommended on a b-vent system drip leg could be used. but i have never put one on for a garage heater.