Most Efficient Electric Heating Method

[Weedwaka]

What is the most efficient method of heating with electricity ( that is not using a heat pump ) ?

Electric Baseboard ?

Electric Hydronic Baseboard ?

Electric Radiant ?

Hydronic Radiant in slab with electric boiler ?

Something Else ?

We are just trying to finalize our heating plan for our carriage house. It is to be extremely well insulated however, I have heard horror stories of heating with electricity. I want to make sure we do this right.

Electric rates here are 5.91 for your first 675 kwhr per month and 8.27 per kwhr for everything over that.

Structure Details

( Lower ):
1600 sq ft.
3 garage doors
Logix ICF walls

(Upper) :
1000 sq ft
Stick frame - staggered stud
Triple pane glass
Spray foam insulated

 

[ddawg16]

I'm going to assume you live in a really cold area....because Heat Pumps are the most efficent method....unless it's really cold....

In which case...all of the ones you mentioned are about the same....about the only differences in the system is how fast they get heat to you...assuming a well insulated house....x watts in give x amount of heat.....the only waste is going to be through the insulation....so if you want the most efficient....pick something that has no fan....radiant only.

 

[nate379]

Wow, those are VERY cheap electric rates! My normal $60-65 bill here would be ~$18 at your rates!

 

[Dragster Racer]

Very efficient building it looks like too. With the exception of the mentioned heat pump, all electric is the same efficiency..100%

 

[Weedwaka]

Thanks for the reply's.

We are building in Sorrento, British Columbia. It gets very cold in the winters and very hot in the summer so really good insulation is a must.

Any thoughts on the electric heated floor system like Nuheat or suntouch ?

 

[tfi racing]

You MUST need AC there-so won't a heat pump be your best solution?Maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea to go ICF(I know its a bit pricey) the whole way,my friend's 5000 square foot house down the road from here is ICF construction,it has an electric boiler,slab heating and a heat pump-I can't remember exactly what his monthly hydro bill but know it is a fraction of my 2400 square foot stick built.

 

[HoosierBuddy]

I can't for the life of me understand why you are ruling out a heat pump.

When it's in it's sweet spot, it will use about 1/3 the power of any of the resistance heating you are considering. When it gets too cold and it falls back on its electric resistance "emergency" strips...it will be exactly the same efficiency as the resistance heating you are considering.

It will also handle your a/c needs.

Why are you wanting to avoid a heat pump????

Phil

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Especially since they have the new low temp heat pumps that are efficient down to near zero F, and as noted, its electric after that anyhow.

Charles

 

[chevelle67]

I absolutely agree with Hoosier buddy.

 

[chew]

I'll vote for heat pump. Also here in Canada Place it in the sun we heat more then we cool. Down side to the heat pump is the sound I guess. If you have the $$$ there's geothermal.

Electric baseboard would be the cheapest to install. As well being in BC where hydro is a major part of where the electricity comes from you should have among the cheapest rates in Canada. Nova Scotia 11.796¢ per kilowatt hour!

 

[CraigFL]

The "most efficient" of the ones you listed in your original question is the electric baseboard(or radiant if its resistance). This is because almost 100% of each KW of electricity goes into heating the living space(except for the resistance/heat losses in the wiring). All of the others waste heat in moving it around the house losing efficiency in places where you don't actually want the heat, like the slab or the boiler.

But... Many of the people are correct in that the Heat Pump would be the best since the COP(Coefficient Of Performance) is about three which essentially means you can get 3KW of heat out for every 1 KW of electricity you put in.

 

[Weedwaka]

I understood that heat pumps offered poor performance in the cold weather. You guys make good points.

Can you recommend any brands or models ?

 

[Weedwaka]

I have confirmed that we are in an area where air to air or air to water heat pumps are not efficient enough to justify their high initial costs. Maybe by the time we build our main house these will be better suited to our situation .

Thanks for the feedback .

 

[eurojetta]

The outdoor design conditions for Salmon Arm, (as close as I could find to Sorrento) are -23C (-10F) most units will still work down to that temperature although yes their output will be limited. What can also be done is to use a heat pump to give you cooling in the summer and to provide your heat during all but the coldest periods and add an electric heating coil to function as backup during the coldest parts of the winter.

Andrew
(HVAC Engineer in BC)

 

[holdmybeerandwatchthis]

Reverse Cycle, Split System, Air Conditioner,

I don't know if that is what you call them in your part of the world, but as mentioned earlier, this is the most efficient way of heating a space electrically, I have an 8kw (heating/cooling) system that draws less than 12Amps at 240V single phase, ( 3kw electrically) paid $100 second hand, new is about $600 to $800 here in Brisbane,

A Radiant heater will only heat the things it radiates into, whereas an Air Conditioner will heat and/or cool the air, which is much more efficient,

Where I am the temperature only gets down to 4-5degs,( sorry thats Centegrade, about 40degF , its usually only for 1 or 2 days too, once again sorry) but inside I set the temp to 30 C (86 F) and I cruise around in shorts and no shirt, ,
In summer outside can occasionally get to to 40C (105 F), inside I am putting on a sweater because its 18 C (64 F), both are achieved on low speed so I have never actually run it on high speed,

I believe you can get down around minus 40-60F, truthfully I couldnt survive that, so these systems may not work,
Iam sure there is a refrigerant gas to work in these ranges,

Check out Fujitsu, Daikon, LG, etc, there is also cheap Chinese stuff that is not too bad, but please, please do your research, ask the local fridge/air cond mechanic, most will say its **** but some will be fair about it,
Most big manufacturers source parts from china anyway,

What do the Shopping Centres use over there?

 

[holdmybeerandwatchthis]

Just got in after eurojetta, he's an HVAC Engineer, listen to him, he'll have the best answers

 

[Weedwaka]

The outdoor design conditions for Salmon Arm, (as close as I could find to Sorrento) are -23C (-10F) most units will still work down to that temperature although yes their output will be limited. What can also be done is to use a heat pump to give you cooling in the summer and to provide your heat during all but the coldest periods and add an electric heating coil to function as backup during the coldest parts of the winter.

Andrew
(HVAC Engineer in BC)

Sending PM

 

[redsky49]

In extreme cold conditions, earth coupled heat pumps are very successful.

http://www.osti.gov/geothermal/servlets/purl/892033-wCdeeQ/892033.pdf

There is plenty of information about them. McQuay is my favorite manufacturer, though good products are also available from Florida Heat Pump and California Heat Pump.

Some of these units involve wells, while others utilize horizontal fields.

In your location I would never utilize solely radiant heat due to the excessive costs.

As always, offered only as opinion

 

[meddac]

Geothermal is 500% efficient (yes that's 500%) if you want to do the initial outlay. You can do deep well or 400 foot 6 foot deep ditches (if you have the room) or put thme in the bottom of a pond at least 8 feet deep (that's what we did) my heat and air bill is less than1/2 what I used to pay. Uses the heat of the earth..in Canada I'm guessing 56-58 degrees year round...IN PA it was 58 and here in GA it's 60. It really is quiet and 50 year warranty. CHeck out Trane or water furnace websites. They are really coming into popularity now

 

[Weedwaka]

Geothermal is big bucks though. Pretty much need a large home to get your pay back.

Edit: I had priced it a while back but I think I should look at this again. If I can find a designer that will plan our system, I think I can do the installation myself. We have the room for sure and the Geothermal would heat the carriage house and future main house no problem.

 

[bookman51]

A few years ago I brought a new house with geothermal heating. The builder may have planned it for his own house but then went backrupt. i do not know the payback, but it is an all electric house in the midwest and I seldom have an electric bill (summer or winter) much over $100 and many times it is in the $70-$80 range. I have friends who think something wrong with my meter, but I am not having the electric company check it <smile>.