Mostly tools, but some advice to pass along......

[wantedabiggergarage]

So I've posted here, how I am fighting cancer currently. The business coowner is currently in failing health, soon to pass, leaving it to me. I am looking at my own mortality when the other day I am visiting with some nieces at my parents. I have one that bought her first house about four years ago, and has some basic home maintenance tools, she and a mechanic buddy get first dibs on my tools.

Then I have a niece just graduating, who enjoys working with tools, wood carving/3d printing and some other stuff. She is currently looking for a more complete socket set (has 1/4" thing, I think the Kobalt sale the other day), as well as a toolbox. I discussed size of toolbox with her, and since she is still at home, it needs to fit in her closet. The size is effectively a top box from the old three piece tool chest sets. Mine has been nearly worthless to me as storage since my Montezuma top box, so I am going to give it to her and see what I have for sockets, and such.

But that has made me think of tools and advice to pass along.
Things like Harry Epstein, garage sales for SAE, since used less now.
Breaker bars, which in my view should really come with a socket set.
Now days, from a starting over point of view, I would recommend deep impact sockets, and Nano impact sockets over shallow's, and buying better impact sockets then the chrome ones, because I think for things she enjoys, most chrome sockets would be OK. (she has asked questions about air tools)
Trying to figure out what tools to tell her she will need in SAE, besides some plumbing stuff.

What tools and advice would you give to those starting out, that you don't know where they are going to end up. I've always seen her as being someone to go into mechanical engineering.

Thank you.

 

[Drunkonunleaded]

Is there something specific that you're looking for? Or are you just fishing for general advice to someone who may not know much about tools but is looking to buy some?

If the latter, its don't get hung up on "Lifetime Warranty." That almost means nothing in 2024. How many instances do we see where someone tries to warranty an item and ends up with an inferior replacement? Think the warranty on a USA Craftsman, USA Kobalt, USA Masterforce, or even Carlyle.

Warranty matters on something that has a high likelihood of breakage. If you're not turning wrenches on a daily basis, the chances of you needing to warranty a chrome socket for anything but total misuse/abuse is almost nonexistent.

My recommendation is to buy what you want/like/can afford and worry about the rest later.

 

[impactims]

My advice, make sure everything comes from a tool truck.

Too many times I have tried to cut corners and get away from a tool truck only to regret it later.

That’s my experience. May not apply to all.

 

[tyyost]

I’m finding better ratchet quality is really making breaker bars not needed. A good long handled ratchet really does all I need.
I also find myself not needing cheater handles as much these days, which I only used on breaker bars…

 

[hobie18]

See what her goals may be.
Spend time with them.
Stay alive!

 

[B_Bimmer]

I feel like an idiot for virtually every cent I ever spent at harbor fright. It brings back memories of sears... but it is not. If you're serious about using them many snap on tools are well worth the cost.

 

[mikey03]

Advice I wish I got and also took a few years ago

get a basic tool set to start and only buy tools you need as you go like triple square which maybe you don’t need ever if not working on those euro cars

the hard part is knowing what a basic tool set is esp as a beginner and even me a few years in honestly I still don’t really know I think it’s something like

shallow chrome 1/4 sockets in a American brand that is smaller than Taiwan makes
shallow 3/8 in chrome or maybe Astro nano sockets which Chris said are same size as chrome
deep 3/8 impact
deep 1/2 impact

get all the above in 6 point except for the 1/2 start them in 12 point at around 27 mm or so since axle nuts can be 12pt and unless your a pro you prob just need one

get snap on hex bit and torx bit gold socket set there the best I hear

get universal adapter for each size drive but get a snap on 10 mm 1/4 drive universal socket for 60 bucks

get an extension set for each size

get a regular length fixed size ratchet and a long or XL ratchet in each drive size but honestly I might skip the regular length 1/2 and add in a third 3/8 so maybe

1/4 fixed reg length
1/4 flex long
3/8 fixed reg length
3/8 long flex
3/8 extra long flex
1/2 extra long flex

torque wrenches that cover all sizes

combination wrenches in 8 to 24 mm
snap on flare nut wrench set in metric

pliers would be
knipex pliers wrench 7”
knipex cobra 7”
snap on slip joint needle nose in 9”
electrical strippers knipex or snap on

screwdriver set

lang thread chaser set

multi meter maybe a AC clamp one could do basic car stuff too and house stuff

16 and 32 oz hammers maybe

this is just off my head

 

[Mecha]

I think think from scratch is difficult. I have two sons and think of what they should get. I'm still in my 40's but have enough for myself and both of them for the most part. But I'll give this a go if I was buying new for them. I'm a home gamer and I do basic car maintenance and build sh!t, wood or other wise. Generally handy.

I'd get 3/8 impact deep wells from Tekton or Capri both SAE and metric. Regular sockets from a US made wright, Williams, or used. All 6pt. I'd do Capri or Tekton too, they're nice enough.

New ratchets from Gearwrench, Capri, Williams, or search for some used American stuff.

Vessel or Williams screwdrivers.

Bondhus or Wiha or Wera or Eklind long handle L-shaped hex key sets. Metric, Standard, Torx.

I have tons of old US tools from my two granddads. Hammers, chisels, scrappers etc. I'd likely find used US made combo wrenches, if not Williams or Wright.

That's probably a good start from me.

 

[Vvmvbb]

Make sure they realize that they can get joy out of working with their hands and tools.

 

[impactims]

I feel like an idiot for virtually every cent I ever spent at harbor fright. It brings back memories of sears... but it is not. If you're serious about using them many snap on tools are well worth the cost.

This^^

If it’s not snap on, usa mac or usa cornwell, it’s essentially useless.

 

[terrific]

This forum leans waaaay too heavily towards "get at least one of everything", and occasionally towards pointing people to tool trucks. Sometimes I'm pretty sure it's tongue-in-cheek, other times I wonder. My tool-related advice would lean heavily the other way -- don't buy that much.
There's always going to be another tool, and you're never going to have everything you need to fix something right in the moment. Try to keep up on maintenance and hopefully you've got someone around who can show you what to inspect and how often. Stuff always breaks at the worst time, but you can't make that go away by buying more tools. If your car breaks down, it's much less stressful to have someone you can catch rides with until the weekend. It's doubly nice if you can be that friend.

For people who don't plan to become mechanics. Don't buy the big sizes, and don't buy the complete sets, whether it be wrenches, sockets, or otherwise. You're mostly paying for the bigger sizes and you'll probably never use those anyway. Get a reasonable range (maybe up to 19mm), then find a store that sells singles and grab stuff as you need it.
Hex keys are a good example of this. Don't feel like you need the sets that go above 8mm (or 5/16in). You very probably do not.
Hex is still king for fasteners... Torx plus, triple square, 12-sided, all those strange security-style fasteners... Nope. Check your equipment to see what you actually need and buy them as they come up.
For bit sockets, skip the socket and put a bit in an adapter socket.
For screwdrivers, buy the two or three that you actually use and then get bits for everything else.
Pliers are a black hole. There's a specialty set of pliers for everything, and you should get them when those tasks come up, but not before then. And don't buy all three sizes of the same style unless it's your favorite pair.

Don't try to predict which tools you'll need. When a project comes up, figure out if you need additional tools and go get them. You won't have to go shopping as often as you complete more projects.

Tools made in the USA aren't always better than imports, which is a bummer, but it is kind of nice to support those jobs. I've had a few jobs in manufacturing, and I didn't always like them, but it was a job when I needed one.
There are some tools where US made options are actually price competitive. I'm not sure there's a list; there probably should be. Bondhus hex keys, Proto sockets (Wright are way nicer, but they're hard to find and they're getting pricey), Channellock/Klein/Wilde/ProAmerica pliers, Tekton/Mayhew/Milwaukee/Klein screwdrivers, Mayhew/Wilde prybars (don't buy every single size, be realistic), Craftsman tool boxes. Actually finding them for sale is kind of a nightmare sometimes, and I can't really blame people if they're not willing to spend effort on it. (Seriously, though, check the price of a Milwaukee single socket and compare it to a Proto. It's insanely close. If they sold them at ACE it would be a no-brainer.)

I don't know... Overall, try to be aware of what types of tools are out there and how they're used, but don't fall into the trap that you need every single one of them.

 

[B_Bimmer]

This forum leans waaaay too heavily towards "get at least one of everything", and occasionally towards pointing people to tool trucks. Sometimes I'm pretty sure it's tongue-in-cheek, other times I wonder. My tool-related advice would lean heavily the other way -- don't buy that much.
There's always going to be another tool, and you're never going to have everything you need to fix something right in the moment. Try to keep up on maintenance and hopefully you've got someone around who can show you what to inspect and how often. Stuff always breaks at the worst time, but you can't make that go away by buying more tools. If your car breaks down, it's much less stressful to have someone you can catch rides with until the weekend. It's doubly nice if you can be that friend.

For people who don't plan to become mechanics. Don't buy the big sizes, and don't buy the complete sets, whether it be wrenches, sockets, or otherwise. You're mostly paying for the bigger sizes and you'll probably never use those anyway. Get a reasonable range (maybe up to 19mm), then find a store that sells singles and grab stuff as you need it.
Hex keys are a good example of this. Don't feel like you need the sets that go above 8mm (or 5/16in). You very probably do not.
Hex is still king for fasteners... Torx plus, triple square, 12-sided, all those strange security-style fasteners... Nope. Check your equipment to see what you actually need and buy them as they come up.
For bit sockets, skip the socket and put a bit in an adapter socket.
Pliers are a black hole. There's a specialty set of pliers for everything, and you should get them when those tasks come up, but not before then. And don't buy all three sizes of the same style unless it's your favorite pair.

Don't try to predict which tools you'll need. When a project comes up, figure out if you need additional tools and go get them. You won't have to go shopping as often as you complete more projects.

Tools made in the USA aren't always better than imports, which is a bummer, but it is kind of nice to support those jobs. I've had a few jobs in manufacturing, and I didn't always like them, but it was a job when I needed one.
There are some tools where US made options are actually price competitive. I'm not sure there's a list; there probably should be. Bondhus hex keys, Proto sockets (Wright are way nicer, but they're hard to find and they're getting pricey), Channellock/Klein/Wilde/ProAmerica pliers, Tekton/Mayhew screwdrivers, Mayhew/Wilde prybars (don't buy every single size, be realistic), Craftsman tool boxes. Actually finding them for sale is kind of a nightmare sometimes, and I can't really blame people if they're not willing to spend effort on it. (Seriously, though, check the price of a Milwaukee single socket and compare it to a Proto. It's insanely close. If they sold them at ACE it would be a no-brainer.)

I don't know... Overall, try to be aware of what types of tools are out there and how they're used, but don't fall into the trap that you need every single one of them.

What are you doing on a garage site? I'm prepared for making things work through the apocalypse without so much as a trip to the hardware store.

 

[mikey03]

Don't try to predict which tools you'll need. When a project comes up, figure out if you need additional tools and go get them. You won't have to go shopping as often as you complete more projects.

Im mixed on this tbh. I bought a bunch of stuff a few years ago that i didnt really need at the time but is kinda basic stuff like big chrome 1/2 drive shallow sockets from Proto at zoro and now the prices are 50 percent higher over 5 years I checked my receipts recent.

so if your buying tools your prob going to need eventually then maybe it’s good because inflation is killer.

also I havnt come across a triple square fastener yet but I really like the vim stubby 1/4 and 3/8 sockets and got the hex and torx so recent added triple square too to have the full set.

yesterday I got some vim 1/4 hex bit magrails in to set up my bit collection. I wanted to switch which mag rails to put them on and could you believe what holds them on is a XZN6 nut. First time I ever seen one. Honestly it is so low torque maybe I could have jammed a torx or male hex in there to get it out. Just wound up putting my new vim stubby triple square 3/8 socket in and turning it by hand it came out easy.

also people come to me to help them fix stuff sometimes and I like being helpful and useful to friends and family. most threads here about car tools say just have a credit card and triple A card. Fortunate for my friend last night I keep a 8 10 12 ratcheting wrench set in my glove box. Because there brake light was out, we went to autozone bought bulbs and I took care of it real quick. I guess I could have made my friend buy a 10 mm socket from autozone she was getting free labor after all but it was nice being prepared.

honestly it’s a real fine line you could fill up a whole garage of maybe someday tools but there’s a decent size set of maybe probably tools we should all get. It’s just hard to know until you get there and don’t have it and by then it’s kinda late.

 

[mikey03]

I read something real smart on the forum here this week about not needing all the tools in advance for everything that might come because you’re gonna need parts anyway. So just buy the tool the same time as the parts.

the problem is most local tools you can buy aren’t very good. And also most of them are kinda basic core tools we should all have anyway. i bet most people here going to a autozone and we all have at least one of every handtool they sell maybe not speciality pullers they rent out. But we aren’t going to find some wrench or socket or ratchet or screwdriver or prybar there that we don’t already have a higher quality one that might have even been much cheaper. I bet most Tekton tools are much higher quality than duralast tools at autozone for less money as long as you had time to order it in advance and wait for delivery.

so the more I think is should get at least one of all the core tools can you deal with every hex fastener to a reasonable size like 36 or 39 for axle nuts. do you got at least one tool for every male hex torx triple square. Maybe you need a long torx and you only got a small torx. But at least you got some torx.

then for stuff like pullers and presses you prob buy as needed.

it would be real interesting to have a discussion and break down what tools make sense to have in advance as core stuff and what should wait to buy as needed

 

[rust in the eye]

Cancer can be beat, I know.
NIeces are unlikely to be needing or wanting any comprehensive set of tools as someone that frequents this place would have.
What are they capable of? willing to get dirty?
For household repairs a few basics in a small bag will hang pictures, tighten a loose doorknob, repair a faucet or change out a receptacle. Again, given the desire and ability.

Best to you and yours.

 

[impactims]

it would be real interesting to have a discussion and break down what tools make sense to have in advance as core stuff and what should wait to buy as needed

Would you be willing to admit that it is better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it?

 

[wantedabiggergarage]

Would you be willing to admit that it is better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it?

I'd say that depends on the tool.
Years ago, I was in one of my junk shops and had picked up a four foot pipe wrench for sale for $20. I was in another part of the store, when I heard someone come in and go right to where it had been as they needed it for whatever they were working on (don't remember what, some farm thing).

They didn't know or see me, they didn't know I had it, and were disappointed they missed it (this was a cash and carry place and his spouse had absconded with his wallet that morning, so he was after her to give him money for it, or they were going to have to hire it done).

I walked over to them before they left and handed it to them, as to me it was either a conversation starter, or a joke (sure, you need your sink pipes taken off).

I know my nieces father, is a sucker in my opinion when it comes to tools. For years it was a Gator grip socket, and one of those "all in one wrenches" (not an adjustable wrench). I remember him cussing them out when his daughters got a basketball goal, trying to put it together and finally breaking down and buying an actual wrench set.

That reminds me of an old timers piece of advice, that I learned later still worked good (having a set of DBE and DOE wrenches), that I should pass along.

 

[gatewaysysop]

Would you be willing to admit that it is better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it?

I'd say that depends on the tool.

Absent unlimited resources, there's always going to be a tradeoff. If you live in a small home or have a small garage, for example, then no it's not 'better' to have and not need. There are going to be more important uses for the square footage than storing unneeded (or rarely used) tools. There might also be more important uses for the money, in which case it's certainly not 'better' to have and not need. Most folks probably prefer to need and not have a tool than to need and not have food on their table.

 

[impactims]

Most folks probably prefer to need and not have a tool than to need and not have food on their table.

Thats an extreme case scenario. Of course, food comes first. Along with air, water.....

And you don't need unlimited resources, that's an "extreme" going in the other direction.

So now that we are done using extreme cases to make a point...

When room can be made, a tool looks interesting, I have nothing like it already and I'm fairly confident it will come in handy sooner or later....I would have it and not need it than need it and not have it. I can't even count the number of times this has paid off for me. If I were to get only that which is essential at a given moment without thinking ahead, I wouldn't even be able to get through a week of day-to-day life.

And lets not forget, coolness factor. Let's face it, getting tools is fun.

 

[gatewaysysop]

Absent unlimited resources, there's always going to be a tradeoff. If you live in a small home or have a small garage, for example, then no it's not 'better' to have and not need. There are going to be more important uses for the square footage than storing unneeded (or rarely used) tools. There might also be more important uses for the money, in which case it's certainly not 'better' to have and not need. Most folks probably prefer to need and not have a tool than to need and not have food on their table.

Thats an extreme case scenario. Of course, food comes first. Along with air, water.....

And you don't need unlimited resources, that's an "extreme" going in the other direction.

So now that we are done using extreme cases to make a point...

I actually didn't say unlimited resources were needed, I said in their absence there's always a tradeoff. I also didn't use an 'extreme case' to make the point, I offered it as one example of "more important uses for the money." Lots of things, not all of them extreme, can be more important uses for the money than buying tools.

When room can be made, a tool looks interesting, I have nothing like it already and I'm fairly confident it will come in handy sooner or later....I would have it and not need it than need it and not have it. I can't even count the number of times this has paid off for me. If I were to get only that which is essential at a given moment without thinking ahead, I wouldn't even be able to get through a week of day-to-day life.

That's four conditionals in a row and a far cry from the broad generality of "it is better to have it and not need it than need it and not have." You've sorta made my point for me, in a roundabout way, that it's not always better to have and not need, but only under certain conditions. So... thanks I guess?