I recently purchased a zero-turn mower. I have an acre lot, but the grass area is around 10,000 SF. I found the 21" walk-behind was taking too long and to many passes. After doing a ton of research, I went with a Scag Liberty Z, with a 36" deck. I would have gone with a larger deck, but I could only fit the 36 in the garage unless I sell a car. When I looked at all the various brands, and I wanted a high-end mower that the lawn guys use, I noticed how good the fit and finish was on the Scag and how heavy duty it was as far as the steel they use. And the velocity plus deck got rave reviews. And I like the looks of them. It came down to this mower and a Wright Standard. The Wright was $2,000 more, so I went with the Scag. I couldn't decide between a zero turn or a stander. The Wright stander was impressive. What do some of you guys have and which manufactures do you think are the best? My neighbor got a new mower today and I went over to talk to him about it. He bought a Simplicity 42" with a 21.5 HP Kawasaki. I have to say that it looked like junk compared to the Scag. I don't see the lawn care crews using those, but I do see them using Scag. I don't have the mower yet, but will get it in a few days. This should take mowing from a chore to far less of a chore, and possibly enjoyable. Also, let me preface this by saying I have only mowed my lawn one time. I have had a lawn service do it for many years, but I wanted to do it myself. But the small walk-behind I had purchased (Honda) was a beating for this size yard. It took me 2.75 hours to get everything done. I think I can cut that in half with the zero turn.
Mower Purchase/Zero Turn and Stander Decision
- Thread starter DRider
- Start date
Firebrick43
Well-known member
Sorry but lawn care companies are not using Liberty Z either.
They are prosumer models. Same as the exmark quest series. It’s mainly a way to pump their name to get into new lower priced markets.
Now that’s not to say they won’t do an excellent job on a yard your size.
As far as the Wright stander, which one? The Stander B is more of a prosumer model with unitized drive units and the Stander I is a commercial machine with individual pumps/wheel motors.
They are prosumer models. Same as the exmark quest series. It’s mainly a way to pump their name to get into new lower priced markets.
Now that’s not to say they won’t do an excellent job on a yard your size.
As far as the Wright stander, which one? The Stander B is more of a prosumer model with unitized drive units and the Stander I is a commercial machine with individual pumps/wheel motors.
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Yes, I know that about the Liberty Z, but I am not using it for commercial use, although my dealer told me that some lawn guys buy them for commercial use. It was the only Scag model they make in a zero turn that was 36". I did look at the V-Ride, but it was quite a bit more expensive. I was looking at the Wright Stander B in a 36". If I had more room in my garage, I think I would have gone either the Patriot 52" or the Freedom Z in a 42" or 48" deck . But that would be overkill for a homeowner with the size of the yard I am mowing. I like that one because of the better hydro transmission and suspension seat, although it is very heavy. However, I think the mower I purchased should be great for this size yard and homeowner use.
Firebrick43
Well-known member
I am not disparaging your choice of mowers. As I said in post 2 that the mower you bought will “ do an excellent job on a yard your size”. There is nothing wrong with your choice of mowers.
But you started a discussion with comments as “ I wanted a high-end mower that the lawn guys use, I noticed how good the fit and finish was on the Scag and how heavy duty it was as far as the steel they use.”
And “which manufactures do you think are the best”
Some small lawn care guys maybe using a freedom z for special small yards due to a 36” size as a second machine. But if they are doing larger properties full time and they try to use a 48 or 52” freedom z they are going to destroy it. Just as they would with other prosumer mowers like the exmark quest, toro timecutter, midline gravely, badboys, ect some more residential and prosumer companies such as grasshopper, snapper, and simplicity now offer pretty v good commercial line now as well. The commercial mowers have much heavier steel and much more robust drive components and engines.
If you look at they way commercial mowers in the big brands are built, most have very little difference in drive components and engine grade/ choices. The only real difference is seat suspension vs wheel suspension and some deck design differences. IMHO it’s better to shop the nearest dealer with excellent service than the actual brand.
After owning a Ferris for the last 10 years I am not a fan of their suspension ruining the cut nor am I a fan of woods ztr which are repainted gravely’s that the charge twice the price for parts that gravely does.
But you started a discussion with comments as “ I wanted a high-end mower that the lawn guys use, I noticed how good the fit and finish was on the Scag and how heavy duty it was as far as the steel they use.”
And “which manufactures do you think are the best”
Some small lawn care guys maybe using a freedom z for special small yards due to a 36” size as a second machine. But if they are doing larger properties full time and they try to use a 48 or 52” freedom z they are going to destroy it. Just as they would with other prosumer mowers like the exmark quest, toro timecutter, midline gravely, badboys, ect some more residential and prosumer companies such as grasshopper, snapper, and simplicity now offer pretty v good commercial line now as well. The commercial mowers have much heavier steel and much more robust drive components and engines.
If you look at they way commercial mowers in the big brands are built, most have very little difference in drive components and engine grade/ choices. The only real difference is seat suspension vs wheel suspension and some deck design differences. IMHO it’s better to shop the nearest dealer with excellent service than the actual brand.
After owning a Ferris for the last 10 years I am not a fan of their suspension ruining the cut nor am I a fan of woods ztr which are repainted gravely’s that the charge twice the price for parts that gravely does.
Kurt4440
Well-known member
I have owned a Great Dane Surfer with a 48" fabricated deck and a Kawasaki engine for the last 17 years. It has been used at my home and my shop during that time, so about 3 acres total per week. During my ownership I have only done one repair, an ignition igniter, of course there has been maintenance, fluids, filters, belts, tires...
I would highly recommend a new or slightly used commercial unit that has serviceable hydraulics.
I would highly recommend a new or slightly used commercial unit that has serviceable hydraulics.
I guess I meant I wanted to get a brand that the lawn service companies use, but the only Skag I could fit in my garage is the Liberty 36". And it's for residential use anyway. I could have gotten the V-Ride II in a 32" or 36", but it was quite a bit more money. Hard to say whether I would prefer a zero turn or a stander - I haven't used either one. I can see the plusses and minuses with both.
No offense OP but this is a head scratcher for me. You didn’t want to pay a lawn care company any longer so you went out and bought a Honda walk behind. That was taking you too long to cut roughly a 1/4 acre so you went out and bought a 5k zero turn. You probably could have paid the lawn care company for many years before you break even not to mention the time savings. Sounds like this is more of an ego thing considering your comments about your neighbors purchase and your intention to have a lawnmower the pros use. First hint if it’s sold at home depot or Lowe’s it probably is not pro grade.
Firebrick43 advice is spot on. Service is more important than brand.
Firebrick43 advice is spot on. Service is more important than brand.
i went over kill some years ago and have a kubota 26 hp diesel with. 60” deck. My lot is one acre but I also do some mowing on the common area within our subdivision . This Kubota replaced a smaller diesel I had used for 13 years and it still ran like new . At 80 I want quality that will last, do the job and maintain its value. By the way the seat is great fully suspended and easy on this old back
I have a 50" Toro TimeCutter that I purchased brand new 10-12 years ago. My mower has a Kawasaki V-twin engine on it. I had some old friends who were in the commercial lawn care business and they recommended the Toro TimeCutter to me. Sure, it's not a "commercial" machine but even so, it still seemed very well built compared to other non-commercial machines at that time. Plus, I've always been a Toro guy anyway.... Toro world headquarters is less than a half mile from my place and I've had several friends and acquaintances who have worked in the Toro engineering department over the years.
logical
Well-known member
The "pro-sumer" on the left did my 2 acre lot for 15 years and was sold for over 50% of the original purchase price. The one on the right I replaced ot with seems to work "OK" even if the "pros" wouldn't be caught dead hauling around a trailer load of yellow equipment. I wouldn't touch the Home Dept Cub Cadet models but the local pro dealer sells the mid and high end stuff. I would wear out a $3k mower in two seasons but I also don't need a $18k mower. 
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Personaly i wouldnt worry about what the pros use. They just want something to last and cut, not to sure they car about the actial quality at least the pros I see. Some of landowners actually wants the cut to look good. Never owned one myself but when i was looking I kept hearing Simplicities had the best cut. Maybe that was years ago. I have 9000 sq ft of grass and the best cut is with a 21" persaonl pace 2015 model not the new ones. I cut it with my deere 42" deck and the 21" wins hands down , looks like carpet but my legs and back are done afterwards. Reason for the deere.
Farmall450
Well-known member
I wouldn't be scared to mow a residential long with any Ultima - even a ZT1. Personally I'd get a ZT2 or bigger with the Kawi, but the average Joe mowing <=5 acres would do just fine with a Vanilla ZT1 54, too.The "pro-sumer" on the left did my 2 acre lot for 15 years and was sold for over 50% of the original purchase price. The one on the right I replaced ot with seems to work "OK" even if the "pros" wouldn't be caught dead hauling around a trailer load of yellow equipment. I wouldn't touch the Home Dept Cub Cadet models but the local pro dealer sells the mid and high end stuff. I would wear out a $3k mower in two seasons but I also don't need a $18k mower.
beemerphile
Well-known member
I may be the biggest Scag mower fan alive, but the Liberty Z does not have a Velocity+ deck. I believe that the Tiger Cat II is the least expensive model with the Velocity Plus deck.
Stand on mowers are nice and, if you can stand it, more comfortable than a regular zero turn if you're going to spend all day cutting in the heat of summer. You can lean back and have airflow around your entire lower body. It's hard to avoid a musty rear end in August after eight hours on a zero turn.
If you aren't spending all day on the mower a zero turn can be had much more economically than a stand on. They're also less hazardous on steep hills. A stand on can have a mind of its own if your wheels point downhill and take you straight to the bottom.
I think you'll be very happy with the little scag. Throw a set of gator blades on when the OEM blades wear out and it should do a very nice job so long as you keep them sharp.
If you aren't spending all day on the mower a zero turn can be had much more economically than a stand on. They're also less hazardous on steep hills. A stand on can have a mind of its own if your wheels point downhill and take you straight to the bottom.
I think you'll be very happy with the little scag. Throw a set of gator blades on when the OEM blades wear out and it should do a very nice job so long as you keep them sharp.
There's nothing wrong with the advantage deck either. We just replaced the advantage on a seventeen year old turf tiger and it cuts very well. It doesn't mulch or discharge as well as the velocity plus decks on the newer scags but that mower is still running a smaller engine than they are.
beemerphile
Well-known member
The Liberty Z advertises to use the Hero deck. Unlike the Velocity+ deck which I know well, I have no experience with it so can't say good or bad. It is possible to make a heavy fabricated commercial looking deck that doesn't have good cut quality. I have a Bad Boy that fits that description. I bought it for a smaller property and was swayed by price and the fact that it had top shelf components such as motor and hydros - better even than the price-equivalent Scag Freedom mower. But is a wannabe commercial mower and not the real deal.
OP should be the first guy on the street to cut a 1/4 acre of grass every week with a Turf Tiger. Needs to build it it's own garage. Because, you know, GJ.
OP should be the first guy on the street to cut a 1/4 acre of grass every week with a Turf Tiger. Needs to build it it's own garage. Because, you know, GJ.
DieselNut88
Well-known member
I have run Scag and JD zero turn mowers. The Scags are a much better mower, even the lower ends ones. I have currently mow about 6K sqft with a JD 7h19 54" walk behind. It is overkill for my little yard, but like you I was tired of using a 21" walk behind. I have better things to do than mow grass, but still want to do it myself. I can mow my yard in about 15 min. I think you will be very happy with the Scag.
logical
Well-known member
Cub was still having trouble getting all the engines they wanted back in 2022 and it was a little random which engine the mowers in stock had. I wanted the Kawasaki or I might have gone with the ZTX3. Some deck widths were hard to find too. I wantedb54 and they only had some of the other models in 48 or 60.
Thanks for the input. I just got through re-arranging things in the garage. The 36" will fit nicely in the spot I created for it, but anything wider would be a problem. I would prefer a 42 or 48, but that is not happening unless I sell a car and open up a bay. Right now we have three cars, two motorcylces, a motorcycle trailer, 3 bikes and all kinds of woodworking and other tools. I have squeezed every square foot out of it I can. It will take me a little longer to mow with the 36 vs a 42 or 48, but it will be a lot faster than using the 21" Honda self-propelled. If I had the room, I might pop for higher up the line Scag model, but then you are talking a minimum of 52" and that is kinda of overkill for what I will be mowing. I do have a big yard and an acre lot, but the lawn area is probably only 1/3 of the acre at the most. The small Scag should be fine for my needs. What I noticed about Scag mowers is how solid they look with heavy gage metal - nothing looks flimsy or cheap. They look like very well-made mowers. I looked at some other brands and I didn't get the same impression, other than Wright. However, I didn't look closely at Big Boy, Grass Hopper, Hustler or Exomark. There are a lot of manufactures making mowers so great that we have such a selection to chose from, but it is time consuming to do the research.
As far as poster that mentioned something about ego. I bought my Scag before I even knew the neighbor was or had bought a new mower, so it wasn't a competition. I just happened to look at it and I was not to impressed with Simplicity. My dad had a Toro many years ago and I recall what a piece of junk that thing was. I bought a Snapper with a Briggs and Stratton and those were bulletproof back then. I never got that stigma of Toro out my mind, although I'm sure they make some good mowers in their professional line, not the time-cutter line. Those looked cheap.
As far as poster that mentioned something about ego. I bought my Scag before I even knew the neighbor was or had bought a new mower, so it wasn't a competition. I just happened to look at it and I was not to impressed with Simplicity. My dad had a Toro many years ago and I recall what a piece of junk that thing was. I bought a Snapper with a Briggs and Stratton and those were bulletproof back then. I never got that stigma of Toro out my mind, although I'm sure they make some good mowers in their professional line, not the time-cutter line. Those looked cheap.
Farmall450
Well-known member
Cub wasn't having any issues with the Kohler 7000 used in the XT or Ultima lines...same engines used since at least 2015 minus the XT1 42.
No issues with the Honda or Kawi either.
desertdog256
Well-known member
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- Nov 22, 2015
- Messages
- 103
Congrats on the new mower. I am sure it will serve you well. I wouldn’t be surprised if your 2.75 hrs drops well below an hour. Which engine did you get? I see the Liberty can be had with Kawasaki, Kohler, and Briggs.
I just got my very first zero turn, but my situation is a little different. I am in the country on 10 acres mowing between 2-3 of it. My new ride is a John Deere Z720e, 60 inch with 23hp Kawasaki.
I just got my very first zero turn, but my situation is a little different. I am in the country on 10 acres mowing between 2-3 of it. My new ride is a John Deere Z720e, 60 inch with 23hp Kawasaki.
Yeah, with that much to mow, you need a 60. I got the Kawasaki 18 HP. I think the 42 would be the ticket for my yard, but it would cause issues in the garage with the wider deck. I only have so much space between the cars. The 36 should be nimble and light. Thanks
logical
Well-known member
Supply chain issues. Trouble getting, not trouble with.
desertdog256
Well-known member
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- Nov 22, 2015
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The 36 will work well. Before we moved to the country I mowed my suburban yard with a 30” rider that I bought at Sears. Like you, I tried a walk-behind mower but I just about vapor-locked one hot Louisiana afternoon and the hunt for a rider was on! I gifted the rider to my daughter and son-in-law and they use it now as a second mower.
greenlizard
Well-known member
Dang that's some fancy stuff. Y'all would've been real upset with my old toro lawn tractor after the methhead neighbors rammed it into a tree stump and broke the steering. I flipped some stuff in the linkage upside down and got it to turn left and almost return to center, got a season and a half out of it running nascar style lawn loops before she lost turn left again.
Ton ton
Well-known member
Looks cute to me!Just got the new machine - Scag Liberty Z 36". This thing is sweet. Fit perfectly in the space I had left in the garage. This should make mowing the yard a pleasure rather than a chore with that 21" Honda walk behind.