Muriatic acid vs vinegar?

[AceofSpad3s]

I am happy with the rate at which vinegar removes rust, however to soak big parts it or frequently change out for clean solution it can cost more than I would like.
I am aware of muriatic acid being much faster at rust removal due to it being diluted hydrocloric acid opposed to being acetic like in vinegar. I am not aware of how diluted a 1 gallon container of muriatic acid would be and how much stronger it would be relative to vinegar.
What sort of ratio would it have to be diluted to to reach similar strength as normal kitchen vinegar, if diluted to that strength would it be similar safety wise to vinegar, or would it still be dangerous to handle without gloves/respirator as it is HCL instead of acetic?

 

[theoldwizard1]

If you are buying it at a retail store, it won't need to be diluted. If you get any on your hands, just wash with soap and water.

 

[gmcgeo]

I am happy with the rate at which vinegar removes rust, however to soak big parts it or frequently change out for clean solution it can cost more than I would like.
I am aware of muriatic acid being much faster at rust removal due to it being diluted hydrocloric acid opposed to being acetic like in vinegar. I am not aware of how diluted a 1 gallon container of muriatic acid would be and how much stronger it would be relative to vinegar.
What sort of ratio would it have to be diluted to to reach similar strength as normal kitchen vinegar, if diluted to that strength would it be similar safety wise to vinegar, or would it still be dangerous to handle without gloves/respirator as it is HCL instead of acetic?

1:10 acid/water dilution

 

[JohnC1957]

I’ve only ever used muriatic acid to wash concrete for a sand finish or clean mortar off of brick or block. The fumes are hazardous and it will burn your skin. There’s a long SDS sheet and I hated using it

 

[no704]

You can get gallons of vinegar at the $1 store.

 

[AceofSpad3s]

You can get gallons of vinegar at the $1 store.

It's the Dollar Twenty Five store now, don't recall ever seeing gallons there, website shows half gallons.

 

[Walkers]

Mix at least 5:1 with water:acid . Also, you can buy 5 gallon jugs of 20% vineager, which is much stronger than the white vinegar at the store.

 

[paulsomlo]

I know this is not what you asked, but for large items, electrolytic rust removal is always going to be the cheapest option - there's no fluid cheaper than water.

 

[driftpin]

Home Depot sells 30% vinegar, $20/gallon. That's what I use at a 6% strength for cleaning the insides of motorcycle gas tanks. Two or three days, shiny metal. Don't leave potmetal in vinegar. It will dissolve it.



Here's a body panel off a motorcycle, during and after de-rusting with 6% vinegar solution.

 

[AceofSpad3s]

I know this is not what you asked, but for large items, electrolytic rust removal is always going to be the cheapest option - there's no fluid cheaper than water.

I started off with electrolysis, I am just lazy and it's a bit involved to set up since I don't have a dedicated location for it. I'm not talking very large parts, just a few gallons of liquid.

 

[laser3kw]

have you tried "Evapo-rust" or similar products?

 

[paulsomlo]

have you tried "Evapo-rust" or similar products?

$$$ when it comes to large parts.

 

[laser3kw]

^^ Agree - if you want to immerse it. I have a spray bottle and spray, wait and wire brush - repeat. Takes time but it works.

 

[555]

Don't open the muriatic acid jug in your garage or close to any metal you want to keep in nice condition. It will rust everything within the range of the fumes in a short time. I recently used muriatic acid on an old very rusted Cushman scooter project. It worked great but the fumes are horrendous. It stripped the rust to bare metal in about an hour, much faster than EvpoRust or vinegar. However, the stripped parts flash rusted nearly as quickly so be prepared to take care of that after removing the part/parts from the acid bath. This was the first time I had used muriatic acid in about 30 years. I'm not a big fan but these parts were just too bad for other methods. I've had excellent results from EvpoRust and vinegar on most projects. Electrolysis works good but takes a long time.

 

[Jswain]

Citric acid + water. Stores easier/longer and if you can get a bulk bag it is very very cheap.

 

[tester19]

Can you give a link on where to get the cheap Citric Acid? It's all over EBay/Amazon but that's all food grade/organic ****. So too expensive. There must be a industrial or commercial grade somewhere?

I would like to try Citric Acid to compare it to all the other methods I currently use. Price/time and ease of use stuff like that.
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[n8n]

I use electrolysis for rust removal on metal, I reserve the acids for a final dip for stuff that has to be spanking clean like cast iron cookware. Found out the hard way that long dips in acid can change cast iron; tried it on a Packard water manifold and the iron itself got soft and flakey.

 

[steel 35]

Here is a guy that knows the acid, and how to use it.
It does work very well if you have room.

Add the usual. steelfxpatinas

 

[HalfTonTom]

A gallon of vinegar is pretty cheap at Wally World. $3.98

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Heinz-Al...gth-Vinegar-with-6-Acidity-1-gal-Jug/21570071

 

[DenisG]

Chemistry answer: When comparing acids you usually look at the dissociation constant (Ka). For acetic acid it is 1.8 x 10E-5. For hydrochloric acid it is > 20. So hydrochloric acid is roughly a million times stronger than acetic acid for the same amount.