My “Class Act” Trailer's Structural Integrity Failure

[redsky49]

How can you reasonably make this comment after only hearing one side of the issue?

If Class Act had explained their position to the OP, or had represented themselves on this or other forums, we would be able to make such a determination. Instead they have responded with silence, which in this case, speaks volumes.

 

[Art From De Leon]

I think that we are only hearing "one side of the issue" is because Class Act has neither responded to, nor addressed his issue in ANY way. It also seems that they have not been in communication with their dealer.

From the way OCG has presented himself, I believe he would continue to, just as he has been doing, give a fair accounting of the situation. Nowhere has he indicated that this is a vendetta against Class Act, and I get the impression that if they would show any interest in working with him, he would be willing to allow them to do so.
Other than this one issue, he seems to be having no other problems with the trailer. In other words he is not nit picking.

 

[buening]

Excellent post lawfirm. I agree with you, once the manufacturer deviates from the standard design it is no longer the trailer dealer's problem. If this were an off the lot trailer and the dealer stated that it would handle his car's weight, then it is an issue to settle with the dealer. Since OCG worked with Class Act to get a specially designed trailer, the dealer is not at fault for misrepresentation. If Class Act does not want to comply with replacing the door with a stronger one, then a lawsuit should be in order to obtain that stronger door. One thing that OCG has not stated is if he has any documentation stating the requirements for the redesigned trailer. That could be the deal breaker in a lawsuit

And yes the typical factor of safety in structural designs are between 2 and 4 depending on the object being designed and the engineer (3 is most common). With the components that this door was made of, it is no wonder why it has failed. I'm amazed it took 2 years for it to bow considering it's foam/plywood construction. Not to bring up the fatigue argument again, but foam/plywood definitely does not allow much repeated cycles of heavy wheel loading. The aluminum frame will help some, but the loads are still a distance away from the frame.

 

[1320stang]

My argument is simply that this trailer would have been more than adequate for the majority of those that have an enclosed trailer to haul "cars." There were easily over 100 enclosed trailers at the track where I race this weekend. I do not know of any that haul a car that would have overloaded the door on this trailer.

See, your argument is flawed. Your limited area of experience is in drag cars, which are lighter weight. (BTW, I did some internet research for Defender Chassis and the only thing I could come up with was Land Rover references. I too have a lot of drag race experience, hence the 1320stang handle. My chassis guy is Mike Duffy of MDRC in Moore Oklahoma. Mike mainly builds 10.5 cars, Super Street Outlaw and Outlaw 10.5 car, but he's built a few full chassis cars and a Pro 5.0 car before for Doug Mangrum.) OCG went to an event where most of the cars in attendance would have buckled the door. OCG told them what he was hauling and how much it weighed. If the parties involved are honorable, there should be no written agreement, you apear to have grown up in a legitious society, the place I grew up, a handshake was all it took. Furthermore, Class Act's lack of response leads me to believe that they'll either not be in business much longer, or will end up with a name change and be screwing someone else. If you've done any Mustang work and gotten a hood from Cincinatti Composites, or one of their many name changes since, you'll understand that they are no Cervini's. What I don't understand is why you're defending Class Act so much. It could be an actual mistake in the fact that they put a toy hauler door on a car hauler trailer. I still think that they should do something to make it right. It's easy for those to say "he should have gotten it in writing in triplicate and notarized" now after the fact. In fact, where were you all when he first posted pics of the trailer that he ordered and didn't buy off the lot, saying "did you get it in writing?" There's a reason hindsight is 20/20.

 

[hetkind]

There is a concelpt in product liability called "implied liability" which simply states that a product should be suitable for the intended use. For instance, if a carpenter hammer fails when used as shim for a multistoried building, that in not intended use, but if it fails while driving common nails, it would be.

The intended use of a car hauler is to haul car up to the trailer's weight limit. Here the test was clearly not met, since the door failed in the intended use.

Another test of product liability, aside from the fairly weak "implied warrenty" is "express warrenty", where an item is ordered for a specific purpose. A 1930 Packard is car owned by wealthy collectors who have the resourses to purchase a trailer to meet their exact needs and communicated through the dealer to the manufacturer. It apprears that we have a trail of communication between the trailer owner, dealer and manufacturer who "custom" tailored the trailer for this specific use. So we have a met a second test.

My suggestion at this point in time is to hire an attorney, skilled at product liability and prepare a lawsuit.

Howard

 

[OldCarGuy]

What capacity ramp doors do other trailer manufacturers install on their car haulers as standard equipment. Food for thought. Though there's a range of capacities. Only Wells Cargo came within 20% of Class Acts 2,500 pound capacity.. One is almost double!

I asked the following simple question, “What capacity ramp door is standard on your 22' by 102" car hauler with two 5200 pound axles?” to the following trailer manufacturers. I purposely didn't go into any detail, as I didn't want to sway their answers. These are the answers that I received...

4,000 pound,, Haulmark http://www.haulmark.com/

3,000 pound**,, Wells Cargo http://www.wellscargo.com/

4,000 pound,,Pace http://www.paceamerican.com/

3,500 pound,, AllPro http://www.allprotrailers.net/

4,500 pound,, Tramp Trailers http://www.tramptrailers.com/

** They went on to say that there's a large safety factor designed into their ramp door. And would handle any car that would be within the trailer's payload.


.

 

[Defender Chassis]

See, your argument is flawed. Your limited area of experience is in drag cars, which are lighter weight. (BTW, I did some internet research for Defender Chassis and the only thing I could come up with was Land Rover references. I too have a lot of drag race experience, hence the 1320stang handle. My chassis guy is Mike Duffy of MDRC in Moore Oklahoma. Mike mainly builds 10.5 cars, Super Street Outlaw and Outlaw 10.5 car, but he's built a few full chassis cars and a Pro 5.0 car before for Doug Mangrum.) OCG went to an event where most of the cars in attendance would have buckled the door. OCG told them what he was hauling and how much it weighed. If the parties involved are honorable, there should be no written agreement, you apear to have grown up in a legitious society, the place I grew up, a handshake was all it took. Furthermore, Class Act's lack of response leads me to believe that they'll either not be in business much longer, or will end up with a name change and be screwing someone else. If you've done any Mustang work and gotten a hood from Cincinatti Composites, or one of their many name changes since, you'll understand that they are no Cervini's. What I don't understand is why you're defending Class Act so much. It could be an actual mistake in the fact that they put a toy hauler door on a car hauler trailer. I still think that they should do something to make it right. It's easy for those to say "he should have gotten it in writing in triplicate and notarized" now after the fact. In fact, where were you all when he first posted pics of the trailer that he ordered and didn't buy off the lot, saying "did you get it in writing?" There's a reason hindsight is 20/20.

How would you know what the limit of my experience is? You know part of it is drag racing but there is no way you can be certain that is all I have experience with. I am very familiar with the common weights of a variety of cars. That is the basis for my belief that most people would not have had the same experience as OCG with this trailer. I do not believe that he should have to haul his Packard on an open trailer. There are many trailer/door combos that would have hauled his car w/o problems. As a side note, I called my trailers manufacturer and asked if I could use my equipment to haul his car and they stated to me that it would be on the edge of my ramp doors capacity. keep in mind that my trailer has a payload of 9300 lb. Some would have you believe that my trailer should have not been built that way.

You believe that I grew up in a letigious society and a handshake is good enough. The fact is that if OCG did actually speak to ClassAct and acurately portray his needs in a trailer, the guy he spoke to may not even work there anymore. If you are the owner of ClassAct and some guy, two years after the fact, brings this issue to you that directly violates the specifications of the equipment you build and states that someone from your company OK'd the use, what would you do? There is no proof that anyone representing your company actually did anything wrong. But for the fact someone is on the net draging your company name through the mud why would you believe them. Unfortunately, people lie. It is a minority but nonetheless it happens routinely. I just got an order from Summit Racing. There were two MSD rotor buttons in the order. One had been used and evedentally returned. Who does that for an $8 part? Fact is someone does and it makes buisiness owners wary especially on large ticket stuff. We all pay the price for those who cheat. Thats why you always get it on paper. Not because the business may cheat you but because thats the only way to seperate you from the crooks. BTW, dont slam me and say I am putting OCG down. I have no idea nor any reason to believe he is dishonest.

If I were forced to bet on what happened in this case I would surmise that there was a volley of information sent back and forth with respect to the specification of this trailer. Likely JTI was doing all the talking with ClassAct. Somewhere in the discussion the details got lost. Maybe there were multiple people at Class Act talking with JTI. There are a variety of reasons that confusion started to take place. In any event, the final specs were not accurately portrayed and hence the issue.

One other thought: Where are the other owners of these trailers with their problems? If this is such a poor design why are there not more failures? Surely if Class Act sold this trailer to OCG and there are so many other people that routinely haul 6k lb cars then other failures are taking place.

 

[1320stang]

Common weights of cars today has no bearing on the common weights of luxury cars of the 30's. To surmise a senario of whether someone works there or not isn't valid either. If JTI didn't acurately give the info to Class Act, then the problem lies with JTI. In any case, OCG isn't a spring chicken (no offense, OCG) and I'm sure his life experiences told him that he needed to make the company he was purchasing the trailer from aware of the loads the trailer woud carry. Based on the stickers now on his trailer, I'm guessing that he went thru JTI's ordering paperwork and found that it had been indeed ordered to his specifications. Prior to OCG's posting, I had never even heard of Class Act or JTI, and how many 6k cars do you think are in Class Act trailers?

Now, based on the info I've learned from Class Act, if I were in the market for a trailer, would I consider them? Sure, I'd consider anybody, other than the door failure, the trailer looks well made and I don't own any 6k cars. But with me, any purchase of that magnitude will be taken with extreme caution and much research. OCG has stated that he's owned several enclosed trailers, I have yet to own one. OCG and your pockets are deeper than mine. I have no problem with you DC, this last post makes it a little more clear of your stance than what I originally perceived, I just had initially been taken aback by your defence of Class Act as I didn't think that OCG would take the tact that he has without considerable consideration of the reality of the situation and much thought towards it.

 

[jake00]

this thread is now over 3 weeks old with no resolution from the dealer or mfg.

Has the dealer offered any solutions?

 

[jake00]

once the manufacturer deviates from the standard design it is no longer the trailer dealer's problem. .

I don't believe this to be the case at all.

For example, I have a hardwood flooring mill who I asked to make a custom run for one of my customers....If I received material that was not to my specs, it would still be my responsibility to find the customer what I sold them, (whether it be with another mill, or having the original source correct the problem)

 

[Tex Arcana]

I'm subscribing to this one, just because I'm curious to see if "Class Act" actually follows through with this customer service fiasco.

Put this way: I work for a major retail home improvement outlet, and had this happened to one of our products, we would have replaced that door with the proper one long before it got to this point--and had ANYONE ever dealt with OCG like "Class Act" has, those people would be in the unemployment office faster than you can say "Defender Chassis".

And were I the head honcho at CA, he'd have a new door waiting for him at the dealer's by the end of the week--and one properly constructed to deal with the intended loads.

 

[SportFury59]

I'm subscribing to this one, just because I'm curious to see if "Class Act" actually follows through with this customer service fiasco.

Put this way: I work for a major retail home improvement outlet, and had this happened to one of our products, we would have replaced that door with the proper one long before it got to this point--and had ANYONE ever dealt with OCG like "Class Act" has, those people would be in the unemployment office faster than you can say "Defender Chassis".

And were I the head honcho at CA, he'd have a new door waiting for him at the dealer's by the end of the week--and one properly constructed to deal with the intended loads.

Right on. As my old boss used to say "you never win an argument with a customer".

 

[bosskong]

And were I the head honcho at CA, he'd have a new door waiting for him at the dealer's by the end of the week--and one properly constructed to deal with the intended loads.

Apparently they have no idea of the weight that this post will have on their business. I'm sure I'm not alone in that I will never buy one of their products unless I become aware of major changes in the way that they handle situations like this one.

 

[bry@n]

Has anything changed with Class Act and / or the dealer? Don't get me wrong but for individuals to bicker about this is crazy. From what I have seen, the dealer is trying but Class act *****.

In the end, it's the dealer that sold it and I would let them deal with Class act.

 

[Lyaec350]

The dealer should take the thing back, why are you having to deal with the manufacturer at all? You explained your specs to the dealer, they sold you an item, it didn't meet the specs, they should take it back. Pretty simple.

 

[Tarheelgarage]

The dealer should take the thing back, why are you having to deal with the manufacturer at all? You explained your specs to the dealer, they sold you an item, it didn't meet the specs, they should take it back. Pretty simple.

I agree. If you had problems with a new GM car, you would deal with the dealer not with GM manufacturing plant. The dealer is the rep and needs to step up to the plate on this one.

 

[Ray-CA]

The dealer should take the thing back, why are you having to deal with the manufacturer at all? You explained your specs to the dealer, they sold you an item, it didn't meet the specs, they should take it back. Pretty simple.

In one of the early posts, I believe that OCG stated that he added lighting, cabinets etc. to the inside of the trailer and wanted to try avoiding returning the entire trailer.

Ray

 

[evil16v]

Re: My “Class Act” Trailer's Structural Integrity Failure

Been watching this one for a while.... i have no Idea why the trailer company should do anything.... the dealership should know the product intimatly, BUT ORDERED THE WRONG DAMN DOOR. I could see a trailer with that GVWR and that door at the same time. Not every body loads the entire GVWR at once. some people will have entirely different uses.... with that said... I'll say it again... THE DEALER ordered the wrong damn door. THEy shoud fix this for you as they definatly knew what you where doing with the trailer. I doubt the trailer company had a clue what you where doing.

That is as crytal clear as it gets.

 

[evil16v]

Re: My “Class Act” Trailer's Structural Integrity Failure

BTW..... I think the right thing for dealer to do is, order the proper door, have you drop off the trailer at the dealer and they change it out. seems perfectly reasonable to me. The dealer is going to have to eat this one.

 

[35mastr]

BTW..... I think the right thing for dealer to do is, order the proper door, have you drop off the trailer at the dealer and they change it out. seems perfectly reasonable to me. The dealer is going to have to eat this one.

I beleive that it should have already been done as stated^^^^long before it has gotten this far. OCG ordered the trailer through the dealer with his personal specifications. He did not deal with the actual company. So the dealer should replace the door for OCG and then chase afer their vendor for all costs involved in doing it.

 

[OldCarGuy]

I’m still researching and weighing in all the alternatives that I have. I have a product liability attorney on retainer. That is presently doing a thorough search into both Class Act and Nappanee Window. I also have several structural engineers, one who is familiar with car haulers, evaluating the ramp door construction. Plus I’ve been working with other trailer manufacturers with their ramp door designs and capacities.

Now,, as at the onset of the ramp door failure. I do not feel that JTI is the one to point the finger at. They are a three generation company spanning over 75 years with an unblemished reputation. That I’ve known and trusted for many years. Additionally there is no question in my mind that JTI will make me whole over Class Act’s failure to repair what is clearly their defective product. Not like Class Act,, JTI is in business for the long haul! No pun intended though...

I should have all the information that I need within a week. To make an intelligent decision and will proceed in the best direction. In the mean time I would like to hear your opinions..

 

[Ray-CA]

OCG,

I've read the entire thread at least twice, and one constant seems to be there. You want the trailer you ordered. So, if JTI puts the correct door on the trailer (and pays your out-of-pocket expenses, if any) say thanks and take your trailer home.

Oh, and update us on the results!!!!

Ray

 

[jake00]

maybe I don't understand what the window company has to do with it, They aren't the ones who bolted the door on the trailer......

They supplied a spec'd product to class Act. What CA does with that product is not up to napanee.


While JTI may not be the ones to point the finger at, You ordered product X, They received Product Y from Class Act, Did not inspect it enough to realize it was product Y (or maybe they did ) and then sold product Y to you.

Like in my previous posts, if you bought a custom hardwood floor from me and it wasn't what you ordered, I'd fix it asap, and deal with my vendors on my time.

 

[RAYJAY]

I don't recall if the 2,500 pound capacity was or wasn't on their Website when I purchased it. In any case “WE”, meaning the dealer (JTI) and I, thoroughly went over the type and weight of cars going over the ramp door. And I know he kept going back and forth with Class Act. JTI is an extremely well known and highly respected Cleveland Ohio dealer. That has always served me well over the years. And I'm sure that he wouldn't have sidestepped them!




That's correct. There is NO weight capacity sticker attached to the door!




I really like the trailer though! Particularly after I added the cabinets, aluminum tongue box, winch etc. And would never ask them to take it back. I just want them to replace the defective ramp door!

When further examining the ramp door, it looks as if it was made with no steel or aluminum reinforcements. Just a laminate of fiberglass, wood and foam core in an aluminum frame.. I cannot be sure without cutting it all up though.


.

do a search on this site for there prev. web pages


http://www.archive.org/web/web.php

 

[OldCarGuy]

Has anything changed with Class Act and / or the dealer? Don't get me wrong but for individuals to bicker about this is crazy. From what I have seen, the dealer is trying but Class act *****.

In the end, it's the dealer that sold it and I would let them deal with Class act.

I’d hardly would believe that JTI would have ordered my trailer with a door designed for ATV’s and Motorcycles. It's ClassAct's blunder. And I want them to take the heat...

do a search on this site for there prev. web pages

http://www.archive.org/web/web.php

I took the time to search the archive files on the ClassAct Website at the time that I ordered the Car Hauler,,, thanks RAYJAY. As I recalled there was no mention anywhere about the weight capacity of the door on any of their trailers. And definitely not on the Flat Front Car Hauler style that I purchased. In fact the only mention was, “Cable free ramp door!” And that’s all that I ever recalled. ClassAct never mentioned the weight capacity of the ramp door. And merely informed me that the ramp door could NOT be made 18" longer than standard. But could make one 12" longer, as I ordered, and still work.

This link will take you to ClassActs main Webpage. I remember the maroon Hummer...

http://web.archive.org/web/20070314212537/www.classacttrailers.com/

This link will take you to the Car Hauler Description.

http://web.archive.org/web/20070316193713/http://www.classacttrailers.com/line.html#car

Here’s a picture that was on their Website at the time of order. It shows a door that is constructed like the one in JTI’s inventory. Definitely not like the one I received! And a car being driven in it,,, not an ATV or Motorcycle. ClassAct clearly switched the style ramp door on the Car Hauler that I received.

In my opinion, their earlier Website has a better curb appeal than their present one.


.

 

[35mastr]

Also that car is a real all steel car that is well over the 2500 pound rating of the door that you received OCG. So why would they show a car going into a trailer that the door wont support?

 

[Tex Arcana]

Also that car is a real all steel car that is well over the 2500 pound rating of the door that you received OCG. So why would they show a car going into a trailer that the door wont support?

But it actually isn't ON the door, if you look closely--so they skirted the whole issue there!!

 

[Defender Chassis]

Also that car is a real all steel car that is well over the 2500 pound rating of the door that you received OCG. So why would they show a car going into a trailer that the door wont support?

Who says the door will not support that car?

Despite its larger size and an extra 100 or so pounds of curb weight compared to the ’70 AMX, the 3244-pound ’71 Javelin AMX with a 401 was able to run the quarter-mile in the credible mid 14s at around 93 mph.

http://musclecars.howstuffworks.com/classic-muscle-cars/1971-1974-amc-javelin-amx-401.htm

I am not sure I have the right model but I am close. In addition, the weight quoted above is for a big block model. Notice the weight is well under the 6000 lbs that OCG had on the door when it failed and also over 1000 lb less than the car he loaded many times without failure. Also, keep in mind that only one end will be on the ramp at a time so it is unlikely that even if the car they shopw in the picture was loaded it would not have put more than 2000 lbs on the ramp door at a time.

 

[OldCarGuy]

Who says the door will not support that car?

It wasn’t I!

That particular door may very well support that car. However if you read what I had to say, the door that they used on my trailer is of a different design. And most likely not made by Nappanee Window.

.

 

[Defender Chassis]

It wasn’t I!

That particular door may very well support that car. However if you read what I had to say, the door that they used on my trailer is of a different design. And most likely not made by Nappanee Window.

.

So, are you suggesting that if you had gotten a door of the design shown in the picture you would not have had any trouble with loading your 6000 lb Packard?

 

[ptschram]

Just how long is the door that failed?

 

[OldCarGuy]

Just how long is the door that failed?

About 90" long. And my door doesn't have the ramp extension that is shown in the the picture.

 

[OldCarGuy]

So, are you suggesting that if you had gotten a door of the design shown in the picture you would not have had any trouble with loading your 6000 lb Packard?

I don't know how that particular ramp door is designed. But if it's designed anything like the door I received, I wouldn't bet a dollar that it would hold up to the car pictured. Anymore than my door failed the test of time.

First off I paid ClassAct for number of changes to their standard Flat Front Car Hauler. Two of which, in my opinion, they didn't take into account in redesigning the door they installed on my trailer. The first being the length was increased by 12”. The second one was that I had paid them to increase the deck height by 4”. That turned out to be more like 6”. Making the approach angled significantly increased over their standard car hauler. Just compare the two pictures below. Common sense dictates that a steeper approach angle needs to be taken in account when figuring the loads the ramp will handle. I paid extra to ClassAct to design and build a ramp door to load cars over. As it turns out I received a ramp door that was designed only for ATV's and Motorcycles....

Standard ramp angle approach.

Angle of approach on my car hauler...

 

[ptschram]

About 90" long. And my door doesn't have the ramp extension that is shown in the the picture.

LOL, I have a truck in my shop right now with an 88" wheelbase.

This truck could have all four wheels on the ramp at once!, come tothink of it, there are three of them in the shop right now!

Kinda takes away the ammunition of those who don't think one could have all four wheel on the ramp at the same time, doesn't it?

 

[Defender Chassis]

LOL, I have a truck in my shop right now with an 88" wheelbase.

What kind is it? Details? Weight, etc....

Not that it matters, with the wheels an inch from each edge the hinge and the bumpers would be taking the majority load. Even with an 88" wb, worst case loading would be with the heavy end dead center on the ramp.

 

[hobie1dog]

LOL, I have a truck in my shop right now with an 88" wheelbase.

This truck could have all four wheels on the ramp at once!, come tothink of it, there are three of them in the shop right now!

Kinda takes away the ammunition of those who don't think one could have all four wheel on the ramp at the same time, doesn't it?

Like a Mini Cooper

 

[Defender Chassis]

Like a Mini Cooper

Probably like a Geo Tracker. They weigh 2400lb so the point is moot.

 

[ptschram]

Probably like a Geo Tracker. They weigh 2400lb so the point is moot.

Nope! 88" Land Rovers with steel box frames and cast iron engines.

One of them is a military model and weighs more. Weight somewhere between 2900# and 3400# depending upon configuration.

Land Rover also made a truck with a wheelbase of 92" that weighed nearly 6K#.

 

[OldCarGuy]

Something interesting what the engineers have pointed out to me how the ramp door that came with my car hauler differs from other ClassAct ramp door I could find. Notice that all of the archived photo’s plus the one that was manufactured one month after mine have straight edges around the aluminum frame. While the frame on my ramp door has a 45 degree angle for half the door thickness. That would significantly reduce the strength of the door frame.

Why would ClassAct design them straight,, Then make mine different? Only to return to their original design.

Now if I can find just when ClassAct updated their Website. And added the line to describe their ramp door, “120 lb weight with a 2500 lb capacity?” The same on all their trailers from 2,000 to 14,000 GVW’s....

Archived picture from when I placed order.

Another archived picture from when I placed order.

Another archived picture from when I placed order.

Ramp door that was made one month after mine (JTI’s used inventory)

My ramp door...

Closeup view.

 

[bmwpower]

interesting. I'm sure one of the internet gurus on here can figure out the date for you.