My garage frame is ready
- Thread starter nexxus007
- Start date
ace10
Well-known member
Your construction desperately needs more than a single 2X6 to serve as your carrying beam.
You've done such a nice job with all the hardware and attachments, but overlooked a critical design flaw.
You've done such a nice job with all the hardware and attachments, but overlooked a critical design flaw.
Michigan Mike
Well-known member
I don't think he is to far off with the span. Its only nine feet. I think I would put a double 2x10 on the face and maybe support the ends down to the floor.
ace10
Well-known member
gagecalman
Well-known member
How are the ends of the beam attached?
ddurrett896
Well-known member
I'd throw a 4x4 in each corner to transfer the load to the ground.
Unfortunately i cant use vertical supports as my condo corporation was not too keen on me wanting to drill in the garage floor. They said we are not sure about the kind of damage that will cause which kinda scared me.
But i can attach another 2x6 on the front face for support. I have seen the lofts others have in their garages and none have any vertical support.
firebirdparts
Well-known member
I would say yes, plenty. That's a pretty small load. Ultimately the desired design just depends on what you put on there.
A single 2 by 6, southern yellow pine, is good for about 80 pounds per foot (interpolating here), which in your case is 720 pounds. The beam carries less than half the weight because of the way you have the end joists supported, but let's just ignore that and say you could put 1440 pounds up there as it is, if it was adequately distributed left to right. The attachment of the beam itself is probably more of a concern than its strength. You can imagine in that case you'd have about 360 pounds at each end that the attachment needs to hold up.
A single 2 by 6, southern yellow pine, is good for about 80 pounds per foot (interpolating here), which in your case is 720 pounds. The beam carries less than half the weight because of the way you have the end joists supported, but let's just ignore that and say you could put 1440 pounds up there as it is, if it was adequately distributed left to right. The attachment of the beam itself is probably more of a concern than its strength. You can imagine in that case you'd have about 360 pounds at each end that the attachment needs to hold up.
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I'm sorry. Can you please explain a bit more in detail? More specifically about the part of the attachment of the beam...
Thanks.
nadogail
Well-known member
IMHO, Because the load on the uprights is in direct compression, anchoring them to the walls should be more than adequate.
Any advice you take from me is guaranteed to be worth exactly what you have paid me for it. It is entirely possible I am in error.
You wouldn't have to drill into the floor. Gravity will hold it in place. Just attach to the side wall to keep it from moving.
Glue the post to the floor. No drilling! I'd be more concerned with the back anchor points. I see that you have what looks like three screws around each point, but do they actually hit anything. Looks as though they are off to the side of the walls studs. If that's the case I would new ones in angled and long enough to hit the studs
the joist spacing looks erratic, as does the fasteners on the back plate, are they fastened into anything? they don't seem to line up with the drywall screws?
what did you fasten things together with?
I would at minimum double up the front 2x and run double 2x4s on the ends to support it. weight has a habit if creeping up without realizing it. you don't need to fasten them to the floor, to the block will be fine
what did you fasten things together with?
I would at minimum double up the front 2x and run double 2x4s on the ends to support it. weight has a habit if creeping up without realizing it. you don't need to fasten them to the floor, to the block will be fine
The fasteners on the backplate are attached to studs. I used 3 stud finders to verify the stud locations. I know what you mean about the misalignment. Even i was confused about why the stud finders would show something which does not align with the drywall screws.
Also when i used the impact driver to drill the screws in, i did feel that the driver had to work for driving the screw which gave me the assurance that i was driving the screws in the stud.
firebirdparts
Well-known member
So the weight on your joists is held up by the 2 x 6 in the front and the back, half the weight goes each way. The 2 x 6 in the front has to carry that weight to its ends, and it touches the wall just on the ends. How do you transfer that weight back to the building?
Since your end joists are heavily bolted, you do have the potential to hold it up with a strong connection between the "beam" and the end joists, but you don't really show that in your picture.
It's not trivial to attach wood if you don't have much contact area. When you build a house, you always put a vertical support under that sort of thing.
ddurrett896
Well-known member
Set the 4x4 and brace the legs by screwing them into the wall, not the floor. If your storing light stuff you will probably be ok, but ~5' of storage and I guarantee stuff will get stacked high.
There are 2x6s going front to back on both sides. On the left it is attached to studs, on the right to the cinder wall. The dront beam is screwed in to these 2 2x6s with 3 RSS screws each.
What would you term heavy storage as? I dont have kayaks or anything. Its mostly going to be boxes, a couple of bikes and maybe 5-6 cans of paint.
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makemenuconfig
Well-known member
You could certainly add a 4x4 without actually fastening it to the ground. Lagging it into a stud or masonry to hold it in place I would think to be good enough. Better than not having anything.
Still, totally possible to do what you have here. I can't see how the ends of that front beam are attached. That would be the most important part of this. Hopefully a joist hanger on the side boards. I'd probably do what others are saying and double it up. Make sure to use the proper doubled joist hanger.
If you want to post the span in both directions I can plug it into a calculator to see what size board would be technically required for a safe floor.
makemenuconfig
Well-known member
The attachment of the front beam is what would concern me, that would be the first thing to fail here, especially if screwed into end grain of the left and right boards. Much better off using a joist hanger.
Understood. I have a L bracket which i havent installed yet. I will be doing it soon on both ends.
makemenuconfig
Well-known member
I'm an engineer, but not a structural one. I take no responsibility for the accuracy of this; just plugging into a calculator.
Assuming I plugged everything in right, a single 2x6 can't even take a 10lb live / 20lb dead load safely. It takes a triple 2x6 to pass for a standard floor 12lb dead / 40lb live. Which might be higher than you need, hard to say.
A double 2x8 seems to do it as does a single 2x10.
If you think 10/20 works, a doubled 2x6 does indeed pass.
Attachments
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Wow. That's brilliant! Thank you so much! Unfortunately the HUC26-2 is not available here in Canada.
We have this:
https://www.homedepot.ca/product/si...-mount-joist-hanger-for-double-2x6/1000151887
makemenuconfig
Well-known member
As long as it's rated for the application, I'm sure it's good. I didn't pay special attention to that, just let the program fill in the default hanger. That one looks good.
ZRX61
Well-known member
eh? What's the floor made from.... corn puffs?
Or a couple of 45deg braces at the top from the front 2x6's to the legs
makemenuconfig
Well-known member
If it's post tensioned, or even if they think it could be, this is a valid concern.
Natty Bumppo
Well-known member
Is that wall new? If so, the studs should be 16" OC. And if so, I am not convinced you hit studs on the 2x6 on the wall. Looking very carefully at your pic you seem to have fasteners that do not align with the drywall screws. There may be double studs under the sheetrock for some reason or some kind of weird framing. Unless you have a double stud or a very wide rough sawn stud the 6 fasteners I've circled on the left look like they missed the stud. The circle on the right to me looks like the fasteners are nowhere near a stud? If that's a new construction wall, I think you might want to go back and add fasteners that align with the drywall screws.
Let's assume you've got some messed up wall framing for some reason and you did indeed hit studs, why then did you space the joists so randomly? There seems to be no pattern to their spacing? Probably not a huge concern, but I would have thought you would have spaced them at 16" or 24" OC.
I think you need to support that 2x6 on the end there somehow. All the joists are tied to it using joist hangers....that's good. But I think your L brackets are going to be inadequate.
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firebirdparts
Well-known member
That's pretty strong.
Is that wall new? If so, the studs should be 16" OC. And if so, I am not convinced you hit studs on the 2x6 on the wall. Looking very carefully at your pic you seem to have fasteners that do not align with the drywall screws. There may be double studs under the sheetrock for some reason or some kind of weird framing. Unless you have a double stud or a very wide rough sawn stud the 6 fasteners I've circled on the left look like they missed the stud. The circle on the right to me looks like the fasteners are nowhere near a stud? If that's a new construction wall, I think you might want to go back and add fasteners that align with the drywall screws.
Let's assume you've got some messed up wall framing for some reason and you did indeed hit studs, why then did you space the joists so randomly? There seems to be no pattern to their spacing? Probably not a huge concern, but I would have thought you would have spaced them at 16" or 24" OC.
I think you need to support that 2x6 on the end there somehow. All the joists are tied to it using joist hangers....that's good. But I think your L brackets are going to be inadequate.
I hear your concerns. Below is how the stud finder showed me the studs.
I also tried to space the joists 12" OC. It worked well going from right to left, but, as I got past the center point, it became difficult for me to place them precisely on 12"OC, hence you see it as erratic. It is not the most perfect of the designs, I admit.
About this: "I think you need to support that 2x6 on the end there somehow". How do you propose I do that? Run 4x4 posts to the ground?
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Update: I have taken down the leading beam and I will be installing 2 2x6 beams as per suggestions. I will post a followup photo soon.
Thank you very much everyone of you.
Natty Bumppo
Well-known member
Not sure how the one you have works...but every stud finder I have ever used will light up or turn green or beep as you drag the finder across your wall and it identifies "the edge" of the stud. I'll attach the image again. Please forgive me if I am wrong. But I have a feeling based on your wall and your pics that you may identified the studs incorrectly. I have a suspicion you identified the outer edge of your studs, not the center of it. All of your fasteners look to be offset to the edge of each stud.
In the pic I uploaded, as you drag the finder across the wall from the left (red arrow) and it will go off when it encounters the edge of your stud (vertical red line). Mark your wall there. Then do the same from the right (right arrow) and as you approach the stud it will go off when it identifies it (vertical red line). Mark your wall there. In between those 2 marks...which should be 1.5"....is your stud. Does that makes sense?
Somethings not right? Either your drywall installers got it wrong, or you missed your studs, or you've got some kind of crazy framing going on for some reason.
As for that end 2x6....yes, it just needs to be supported somehow. I don't think you need a 4x4 necessarily. Some kind of a cleat fastened to the wall might be all you need to carry the weight.
makemenuconfig
Well-known member
Doesn't really matter what the stud finder says. You should feel like the screw you are driving could be sucked all the way through the wall if you kept holding the trigger. If it gets weak or just keeps spinning without going more in; then you didn't hit a stud.
I think like you have is good. Ledgers on sides and back screwed to wall. Use joist hanger like we mentioned to hang the front beam from the ledgers on the sides. Nail it all appropriately and that should support the end.
Update: I have taken down the leading beam and I will be installing 2 2x6 beams as per suggestions. I will post a followup photo soon.
Thank you very much everyone of you.
Glad to try and help. Make sure you nail the two boards together for them to act like a beam.
skulldrinker
Well-known member
I would use glue also with those two boards
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Yes. I will be using construction adhesive alongwith #8-2-1/2" screws to attach the boards together.
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logical
Well-known member
I would have run the 2x6 joists the other direction even though it is a longer span, maybe sistering two at the face. I'd even dare to say that would have been the only right way to do it.
As has been pointed out, in your design the 2x6 at the front could easily become overloaded.
Sent from my garage.
As has been pointed out, in your design the 2x6 at the front could easily become overloaded.
Sent from my garage.
I hear ya. I did feel the impact driver had to work towards driving the screw in. It certainly did not keep spinning. Let's just hope the 3 stud finders i used were correct.
and regular wood screws are not meant to hold structural together. I am concerned with your entire project honestly.