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National Auto Tools Triumph C 7000

Wangstang

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Joined
May 25, 2006
Messages
405
Location
Triangle Area, NC, USA
I I would think the pump on a cart with the gear flow divider would have been the main thing.

Those parts are made and patended by a company in China. Yes, China...they came up with a reliable and unique design for this application.

There are a few distributors in the US who sell both the pump and the flow divider(and versions of the divider with 4 ports...4 post anyone) and they are by far the more expensive componenets of this kit based on what I've seen if you were looking for replacement parts.

Wes
 
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jacobsed

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Mar 12, 2013
Messages
129
Those parts are made and patended by a company in China. Yes, China...they came up with a reliable and unique design for this application.

There are a few distributors in the US who sell both the pump and the flow divider(and versions of the divider with 4 ports...4 post anyone) and they are by far the more expensive componenets of this kit based on what I've seen if you were looking for replacement parts.

Wes


Don't the cavemen have the patent on wheels? hahah Seems like you could put wheels on anything you wanted and not have legal problems over it. Danmar's real problem is with China. Either Danmar didn't pay for the exclusivity of those parts or they did and China doesn't care and sells them to other people too.
 

redsand187

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Joined
Dec 1, 2012
Messages
96
Location
Washington
Don't the cavemen have the patent on wheels? hahah Seems like you could put wheels on anything you wanted and not have legal problems over it. Danmar's real problem is with China. Either Danmar didn't pay for the exclusivity of those parts or they did and China doesn't care and sells them to other people too.

It just comes down to legal bs. Danmar is probably only working with one factory in China for their product. They may have an exclusive deal with them, but other factories don't have to follow that a deal. Getting the patent issued and then enforced in China is basically impossible, especially for a small foreign company.

So Danmar did the next logical thing to have some "exclusive," rights. They got a US patent for being portable. I haven't looked up their patents or any of this case, but I'm betting their is a patent exactly talking about portable towers that wheel around and bolt into floor anchors.

Since basically every lift on the market uses towers and bolt to the ground, that was likely not deemed patentable. But they were the first to put wheels on it, so they had a unique idea that they were able to get through the patent office.

It's always joked that you can take an idea that is in the public domain, put a clock on it and get a patent. (basically taking two free designs and putting them together to make a "new one) Danmar basically did that, only instead of a clock, they used wheels. But that means the only unique and patentable part of their idea is the wheels. So NAT can build the whole damn thing, and forget to include the wheels, and be good.
 

Ign

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Joined
Jul 7, 2006
Messages
12,769
Location
Butte Peak ND
What I find interesting and disappointing here is that some members would rather argue our screwed up legal system rather than help others by just providing the requested dimensions. If you really want to beat the system put up the specs of how it WAS built and future owners can modify their lifts. That's why we all own tools - to modify and/or make what we cannot buy.
 

redsand187

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Joined
Dec 1, 2012
Messages
96
Location
Washington
What I find interesting and disappointing here is that some members would rather argue our screwed up legal system rather than help others by just providing the requested dimensions. If you really want to beat the system put up the specs of how it WAS built and future owners can modify their lifts. That's why we all own tools - to modify and/or make what we cannot buy.

It's my understanding that the brackets are included, so all you need is the wheels and bolts. Once you have it in hand, it should be pretty simple to find the proper sized wheels and bolts. It doesn't sound like many people actually purchased the first version, as they weren't available for very long. I really would like to buy one, but don't really have the extra 2500 or so to get it all going at the exact moment.
 

Wangstang

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May 25, 2006
Messages
405
Location
Triangle Area, NC, USA
I will try to get scaled photos of the brackets posted this weekend.

As for the patent issues on the valve system, the valve system can be used in a whole host of hydraulic applications so there was no way the manufacture and owner of the patent would have been dumb enough to give one company in the US an exclusive contract for the design.

Wes
 

alberto

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Joined
May 28, 2007
Messages
756
What I find interesting and disappointing here is that some members would rather argue ..... than help others by just providing the requested dimensions.

It's my understanding that the brackets are included, so all you need is the wheels and bolts.

Confirmed with the manufacturer that it will ship with neither the bracket nor the wheels. For those of you who have one of these lifts with the wheels, please post dimensions of the bracket and the wheels. I suspect we'll also need the location where the bracket bolts onto the lift, as I think they are not going to be predrilled from the factory (although I did not ask about them).
 

jserk

Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2014
Messages
5
Are there any C7000 units anywhere near SE Michigan I could review? I'm interested in purchasing one but I'd like to see it in person before doing so. Also, is there any opportunity for group buy within the next six months? Thank you.
 

jacobsed

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Mar 12, 2013
Messages
129
I got 3 pm's yesterday and replied to you. I'm about an hour west of Kalamazoo in Saint Joseph.
 

Cobra96

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Jul 29, 2014
Messages
88
I was using a hand truck to move the posts of my maxjax around before I set it up...., works fine. Unfortunately...., this lift wasn't available when I pulled the trigger on the maxjax, probably due to the legal issues, otherwise I would have gone with this one with or without the wheels.
 

jserk

Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2014
Messages
5
I plan to take up JACOBSED on his generous offer to let me review his C-7000 before I make any purchasing decisions but I'm trying to figure out why there is such a significant pricing difference between Triumph's C-7000 @ $2599and their conventional overhead NTO-9AE cable-balanced model @$1659? The group-buy price for the C-7000 seemed like a fair compromise but something looks out of line when NAT/Triumph wants a $940 premium for what amounts to hydraulic equalization over cable equalization? Has anyone seen the different Triumph lifts to provide unbiased comparisons?

I don't currently have ceiling clearance issues but I'd like the option of moving the posts out of the way when not using the lift. Costco is running another one of their frequent sales on the MaxJax for $1999.99, delivered, so it's tempting to just go with such a low-risk transaction and be done with it. (If I don't like it they'll accept a return at their local retail outlet.)

Thanks for any insight and feedback.
 

chops101

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Joined
Jul 15, 2013
Messages
554
Location
S. FL
You're comparing apples to oranges.

If you want a permanent setup, go cable. It works.
If you want a temp setup that you can break down in minutes, go hydraulic.

It really is that simple, and price should not be a determining factor, it is about your application.
 

jacobsed

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Joined
Mar 12, 2013
Messages
129
I moved earlier this year and just reinstalled my C7000. I like to move it out of the way if I need to. And if you move you can easily take it with you. Worth the money.


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I plan to take up JACOBSED on his generous offer to let me review his C-7000 before I make any purchasing decisions but I'm trying to figure out why there is such a significant pricing difference between Triumph's C-7000 @ $2599and their conventional overhead NTO-9AE cable-balanced model @$1659? The group-buy price for the C-7000 seemed like a fair compromise but something looks out of line when NAT/Triumph wants a $940 premium for what amounts to hydraulic equalization over cable equalization? Has anyone seen the different Triumph lifts to provide unbiased comparisons?

I don't currently have ceiling clearance issues but I'd like the option of moving the posts out of the way when not using the lift. Costco is running another one of their frequent sales on the MaxJax for $1999.99, delivered, so it's tempting to just go with such a low-risk transaction and be done with it. (If I don't like it they'll accept a return at their local retail outlet.)

Thanks for any insight and feedback.
 
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Trexdadoc

Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2014
Messages
16
Location
boston ,ma
best lift i purchase the c-700 is by far the top lift to get. if you want to move it you cant go cable must do hydro. also to answer your question the c-7000 is a real auto lift not like the maxjax. it has (7000) chain driven and many height position. you cant go wrong
 

Macman9111

Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2008
Messages
6
Confirmed with the manufacturer that it will ship with neither the bracket nor the wheels. For those of you who have one of these lifts with the wheels, please post dimensions of the bracket and the wheels. I suspect we'll also need the location where the bracket bolts onto the lift, as I think they are not going to be predrilled from the factory (although I did not ask about them).


Any body get that information?
 

Macman9111

Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2008
Messages
6
jacobsed, are you able to lift your BMW with the pad or you need to use the arm directly ? What is the distance between your 2 post ?

I moved earlier this year and just reinstalled my C7000. I like to move it out of the way if I need to. And if you move you can easily take it with you. Worth the money.
 

jacobsed

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 12, 2013
Messages
129
All my C7000 arms are triple telescoping. big - medium - small
I don't think the C7000 comes that way anymore.
I put a pad on the medium arm for my BMW and the wife's Mercedes, works fine.

My drive through clearance is 102"




jacobsed, are you able to lift your BMW with the pad or you need to use the arm directly ? What is the distance between your 2 post ?

I moved earlier this year and just reinstalled my C7000. I like to move it out of the way if I need to. And if you move you can easily take it with you. Worth the money.
 
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Macman9111

Member
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Jun 17, 2008
Messages
6
Still the same triple arm. I was doing the exact same thing, was just asking myself if it was normal
 

jacobsed

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Joined
Mar 12, 2013
Messages
129
Ok, I had read some where that a guy got a newer one and only one arm of each post was a triple and the other was a double.

Still the same triple arm. I was doing the exact same thing, was just asking myself if it was normal
 

cagullett1

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Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Messages
2,203
Location
North Texas
Got this from nathan Clark this morning...

The C-7000 is back in production and will be in stock and ready to ship within 30 days from now. Per the terms of Dannmar’s conditions the lift will no longer be shipped with the two wheels that bolt on the bottom of the legs. We have been asked with extreme prejudice to not produce a mobile lift for sale in the US, removing the wheels is our only way to make the lift “non-mobile”, however nothing else will be changed.

Upon reactivation on our site, we will keep the price at the Group Buy price for the first month to allow interested parties a chance to buy at the old price from before everything went a bit south.

Thank you for being understanding and giving us time to sort this out.

Also, has anyone contacted NAT lately to see about getting this price (even though we are WAY outside of the 1 month window Nathan mentioned)?
 

alberto

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Joined
May 28, 2007
Messages
756
The guys at National can't say anything, can't even supply drawings or give specs (I've asked). I am, however, sad and disappointed to see that no one here that has one with the lifts that were issued with the wheels has provided details of the wheel design for the rest of us to be able to replicate them. I'm going to buy one of these shortly and the main reason is because of its ability to be stored away when not needed and the second reason is the higher height clearance over the Max Jax. If I need to reinvent how the wheels are set up, I will, but clearly there are quite a few that would like to get more detail on the original set up.
 

fredd1

New member
Joined
Jan 25, 2015
Messages
3
Hi all, new to this forum. I have been searching for an economical low headroom lift and came across this thread. I have some questions for those of you who have this lift installed:

1. What is the diameter of the hydraulic cylinder pistons?
2. What size are the leaf chains? BL-LH? AL? EL? ie. BL646, etc.
3. What are the thickness/dimensions of the base and columns?
4. Will NAT arrange for lift-gate w/pallet jack home delivery? have there been any delivery issues?
5. What is the horse power (or current x voltage rating) of the pump motor?

This looks like the ideal fit for my new garage but the specs are not available online. BTW, for those wanting portability, Harbor Freight sells castors rated at 200#s or more. Drilling a few 3/8" bolt holes in a 1/4" angle bracket for mounting should be all that's needed.

Odd about the portability issue. Mohawk, Bendpak, et.al. all make scissor lilts that are portable.
 
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cagullett1

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Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Messages
2,203
Location
North Texas
Hi all, new to this forum. I have been searching for an economical low headroom lift and came across this thread. I have some questions for those of you who have this lift installed:

1. What is the diameter of the hydraulic cylinder pistons?
2. What size are the leaf chains? BL-LH? AL? EL? ie. BL646, etc.
3. What are the thickness/dimensions of the base and columns?
4. Will NAT arrange for lift-gate w/pallet jack home delivery? have there been any delivery issues?
5. What is the horse power (or current x voltage rating) of the pump motor?

This looks like the ideal fit for my new garage but the specs are not available online. BTW, for those wanting portability, Harbor Freight sells castors rated at 200#s or more. Drilling a few 3/8" bolt holes in a 1/4" angle bracket for mounting should be all that's needed.

Odd about the portability issue. Mohawk, Bendpak, et.al. all make scissor lilts that are portable.

Good luck getting answers....
 

RAYJAY

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Joined
May 29, 2006
Messages
2,638
Location
UNION DALE PA
Good luck getting answers....

just call national auto tools ...... 1-866-563-5438

they have answered any questions in the past i have asked and should be installing one this summer ( have to do some concrete work first ) it is 3 times the lift the only portable one is ......

Just don't ask about wheels ........:scared:
 

alxdgr8

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Joined
Mar 27, 2012
Messages
668
Location
Seattle, WA
1. What is the diameter of the hydraulic cylinder pistons?
1.5" diameter

2. What size are the leaf chains? BL-LH? AL? EL? ie. BL646, etc.
I don't know chain sizes, but I measured 3/4" link spacing, 1" wide, 3/4" thick .

3. What are the thickness/dimensions of the base and columns?
15"x18"x9/16" for the bases

4. Will NAT arrange for lift-gate w/pallet jack home delivery? have there been any delivery issues?
I had mine held at the freight terminal since I was out of town when they wanted to deliver. The freight company will call you to arrange a delivery and you can request a lift-gate then.

5. What is the horse power (or current x voltage rating) of the pump motor?
3hp, 3360rpm, 20A, 220V. They shipped me the 220V motor, even though I think the 110V motor is the norm and you're supposed to pay extra for the 220v.
 

cagullett1

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Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Messages
2,203
Location
North Texas
just call national auto tools ...... 1-866-563-5438

they have answered any questions in the past i have asked and should be installing one this summer ( have to do some concrete work first ) it is 3 times the lift the only portable one is ......

Just don't ask about wheels ........:scared:

What happens when you ask about wheels? lol I want them to sell me the wheels or brackets separate, as if they don't know what I'm going to do with them.
 

RAYJAY

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Joined
May 29, 2006
Messages
2,638
Location
UNION DALE PA
What happens when you ask about wheels? lol I want them to sell me the wheels or brackets separate, as if they don't know what I'm going to do with them.

due to the agreement with the "only portable lift company " they can not sell the wheels with the lift,or make the brackets,

can not believe other company's can be so petty, if you have the better product ....:shocking:
 

rice rocket

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Joined
Mar 24, 2011
Messages
3,175
That's the point though, the product is inferior on multiple levels, so they have to resort to litigation to continue to sell their product.
 

fredd1

New member
Joined
Jan 25, 2015
Messages
3
1. What is the diameter of the hydraulic cylinder pistons?
1.5" diameter

2. What size are the leaf chains? BL-LH? AL? EL? ie. BL646, etc.
I don't know chain sizes, but I measured 3/4" link spacing, 1" wide, 3/4" thick .

3. What are the thickness/dimensions of the base and columns?
15"x18"x9/16" for the bases

4. Will NAT arrange for lift-gate w/pallet jack home delivery? have there been any delivery issues?
I had mine held at the freight terminal since I was out of town when they wanted to deliver. The freight company will call you to arrange a delivery and you can request a lift-gate then.

5. What is the horse power (or current x voltage rating) of the pump motor?
3hp, 3360rpm, 20A, 220V. They shipped me the 220V motor, even though I think the 110V motor is the norm and you're supposed to pay extra for the 220v.

Alex,

Thanks for the useful reply. The 1.5" piston would suggest a fairly moderate 2ksi minimum hydraulic pressure, so a 3hp motor should be more than adequate for a decent quality pump.
Here's a handy reference for leaf chain nomenclature:
http://www.leafchain.com/leafchain/products/part-number-system

The chain would be a BL6xx depending on the number and arrangement of the links (BTW, the light 7k-10k load Mohawks use a BL646 chain over dual rollers and a 2" dia. piston - definitely in the brick outhouse category, IMHO :eek:). Based on your info and what I've read this seems like fairly robust design for a home hobbyist garage lift. I only mention the Mohawk design because I may have the opportunity to get a a used A-7 for about the same price. I'll have to wait and see what's being offered. Thanks again for the info.
 

GYPSY400

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Joined
Mar 21, 2013
Messages
517
Location
Naughton Ontario
I wouldn't be too upset about a lack of wheels.. you could always use a hand cart or make up your own brackets and wheels. I'm glad I found this lift before buying a Max jax.. I wanted portability, but wasn't too fond of the 48" lift height.. I have 12ft ceilings so I have room for a higher lift.
 

JonM

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Joined
Dec 13, 2014
Messages
52
Location
Austin, Tx
Since this thread is more active than the last Group Buy thread that was closed, I'm curious to know if we could get another Group Buy going on these. I had been considering the MaxJax, but this is clearly the superior setup. Does anyone have any connections at NAT or is there enough interest?
 

cagullett1

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Joined
Sep 29, 2013
Messages
2,203
Location
North Texas
Since this thread is more active than the last Group Buy thread that was closed, I'm curious to know if we could get another Group Buy going on these. I had been considering the MaxJax, but this is clearly the superior setup. Does anyone have any connections at NAT or is there enough interest?

According to Amazon, they only have 9 left. NAT is familiar with GJ, so you might give them a call and see if they will still honor the GB price.
 
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