natural Gas line help

[smashingchuck]

I'm getting ready to install a 60,000 BTU NG Furnace in my shop. Its about a 175 foot run from the meter to the shop.

The house has a 100,000 btu furnace and also a NG water heater.

There is a point in the house where I could hook into the 3/4 black pipe and shorten the run by about 75 feet but I don't think that gains me anything.

I've attached a pic of my meter / regulator.

I plan on using yellow tube with risers.

I need help determining the proper size tube. Also I'm not sure if I should plumb into my meter or plumb it in with the 3/4 black pipe that's in the house, which would shorten the run by 75 feet. If I do need to hook it straight to the meter, do I need bigger pipe at the meter?

 

[fury9]

I stole my supply from my dryer, no issues here.I would plumb it from the shortest run with 1/2" but I'm no expert!

 

[smashingchuck]

I stole my supply from my dryer, no issues here.I would plumb it from the shortest run with 1/2" but I'm no expert!

According to this chart, that's not enough.

 

[Yamaguy]

If the gas line running from the meter to the furnace is 3/4, it will not be
Large enough. Running poly from the meter is probably the best bet, unless you have other things in the way(driveway, buried Utilities). At 175 feet from the meter 3/4 would just do the 60,000 btu's, but I would bump it to 1" to future proof yourself.

 

[smashingchuck]

If the gas line running from the meter to the furnace is 3/4, it will not be
Large enough. Running poly from the meter is probably the best bet, unless you have other things in the way(driveway, buried Utilities). At 175 feet from the meter 3/4 would just do the 60,000 btu's, but I would bump it to 1" to future proof yourself.

Yes the line from the meter to the house furnace is 3/4 black pipe, and is the line I could piggy-back into more easily. That's a "no go" just like I thought. Thanks!

so I can just put a "T" on the low side of the meter before it goes into the house and call it a day?

 

[59 wagon man]

it all depends on the total developed length of the pipe, number of fittings,gas pressure in the area and the btu input needed for all fixtures

 

[smashingchuck]

it all depends on the total developed length of the pipe,

I'm assuming you're talking about inside the house. Lets call it 40 feet from the meter to the furnace and water heater.

number of fittings,,

In the existing black pipe? 7.

gas pressure in the area

no clue. I'm in sw Michigan.

and the btu input needed for all fixtures

garage furnace = 60,000
house =100,000
water heater = lets call it 40,000

 

[smashingchuck]

so from what I'm reading, I think I'm going to run a new shorter line (because its possible) from the meter to the house furnace / water heater in 3/4 black pipe. this will shorten that run by about 1/2 to aprox 20 feet and also half as many fittings.

Then I'd like to run a new line in 1" off the meter to the shop. aprox 175 feet, probably a little less.

will this work?

 

[CKS1955]

it all depends on the total developed length of the pipe, number of fittings,gas pressure in the area and the btu input needed for all fixtures

Need to do a calculation based on your specific information.

Jay

 

[6768rogues]

I had the gas company come out and put another meter at my barn. It only cost a nominal amount as most of the cost was absorbed by them.

 

[smashingchuck]

Need to do a calculation based on your specific information.

Jay

Once someone answers my question on how to plumb intomy meter I can more acurately do calculation on pipe size. I posted the same chart above....

 

[plott hound]

I was in a similar situation as you.tie in at the meter with my underground and trench another 60 feet or add bigger pipe through the house.figured my best option was to add a second 1" gas line tied into the meter and run beside the existing line and out to back of house.your meter should be 1" so get two 1" tee's in there and you should be golden.

 

[CNGsaves]

Game plan should be install T just after the meter. You'll want best pressure possible to make that long haul out to the shop.

Reason is this . . . LOW PRESSURE !! Typical residential pressure is 1/2 psi or 7" to 10" water column. My bet is you have regulator just before your meter that reduces to low pressure.

Thus, you will want LARGE buried yellow plastic polyethelene just after meter with a riser and shutoff valve. At garage, the yellow plastic PE pipe will come up to riser, then enter garage above grade.

I'm not expert, but I would not go to trouble of burying that long run with substandard pipe (ie too small). You'll want to consider ANY ng appliances you may want in garage in future - - ie furnace, hot water heater, and in my case refueling appliance that compresses NG for vehicle refueling !!

My gut is saying bury no smaller than 1 1/4" but definitely get guru opinion from gas company or plumber in your area. Also, ensure that yellow PE pipe is buried proper depth with a tracer wire. Good idea to draw out on grid paper where this line gets buried so you'll know location, without having to call the Dig-Safe locate service at later date.

 

[ripperd]

Also, are you sure you have 1/2 psi? Our area of 1995 construction we all have 2psi service inside the house. Makes for much smaller diameter pipe.

 

[KCarGuy]

A Friend, who was a Builder, ran 1/2" copper line to his garage 100' away, to run his 60K furnace and had no issues for the last 20 years. (even thou they do not recommend copper).
I ran 1/2" black pipe to 1/2" CSST (underground) back to 1/2" Black Pipe for a total of 75' to my Garage. I use a 75K unit for the last 8-10 years in Chicago Weather.
I may Loose a little BTU here and there, but it keeps my 25'x30' Garage very comfy.

 

[smashingchuck]

alright.... so here's where I'm at. The 1-1/2" pipe leading into the house has a "T" with a plug in it right inside the wall. So pop the plug and I plan to run 1" pipe through the house (56 feet total), then outside for another 85 feet of burial (plus risers) and into the shop for another 30 feet to get to the furnace.

I'm trying to get my hands on some "Tracpipe" for the underground portion. Are there any special tools required for the tracpipe or do the fittings do all the work?

Once I get to the shop, would it be ok to use 3/4 black pipe to plumb everything after the riser?

 

[59 wagon man]

everything needs to be sized according to where it is taken off the main run and the main run since it will be handling everything has to be sized for everything running at full load. the distance is calculated from the meter to the furthest fixture

 

[CNGsaves]

OP . . . don't fall into trap of taking shortcuts with Trakpipe or csst ****. Do NOT do it !! Every single run that monopoly gas provider installs around here is yellow plastic polyethelene pipe (PE as abbreviation).

Your idea of running 1" black pipe off of main 1 1/2" black pipe steel sounds pretty good to non-expert here. This is assuming that plug you're removing is pretty close to when NG supply first gets inside house. Minimize any 90 degree turns on that 1" run across interior of house as they will slow down your flow to garage. Cost of the yellow PE pipe was dirt cheap for me (55 cents a foot from Groebner Assoc in Kansas City) so don't skimp on size of pipe. I'd still say go with larger 1 1/4" on your 85 ft of buried yellow PE in ground with risers on each end. The extra 30 ft inside garage could be 1" black pipe steel to get over to heater (ie outside you'd use 1 1/4" risers then reduce to 1" with black pipe steel above grade entering the building).

Do it right . . . . Do it once. Make sure it's big enough as you're working with low pressure residential NG service.

Pencil out all those distances, sizes, and elbows with Btu requirement in garage and see what an expert plumber says in your area.

 

[brewchief]

alright.... so here's where I'm at. The 1-1/2" pipe leading into the house has a "T" with a plug in it right inside the wall. So pop the plug and I plan to run 1" pipe through the house (56 feet total), then outside for another 85 feet of burial (plus risers) and into the shop for another 30 feet to get to the furnace.

I'm trying to get my hands on some "Tracpipe" for the underground portion. Are there any special tools required for the tracpipe or do the fittings do all the work?

Once I get to the shop, would it be ok to use 3/4 black pipe to plumb everything after the riser?

Pipe going into house from meter looks to be 1" to me, 1" blk pipe is 1.315" od, 1 1/4" is 1.660" od and 1 1/2" is 1.9" od.

Tracpipe cannot be direct buried unless it is their product with a special outer sleeve made for underground. The standard tracpipe can be run underground but must be in conduit, CSST also has a higher resistance to flow so you will most likely need to upside it.

Poly pipe and risers will be the most cost effective .

 

[smashingchuck]

Pipe going into house from meter looks to be 1" to me, 1" blk pipe is 1.315" od, 1 1/4" is 1.660" od and 1 1/2" is 1.9" od.

Tracpipe cannot be direct buried unless it is their product with a special outer sleeve made for underground. The standard tracpipe can be run underground but must be in conduit, CSST also has a higher resistance to flow so you will most likely need to upside it.

Poly pipe and risers will be the most cost effective .

after spending the day on the net, I have come to the same conclusion - use the poly pipe. I'll take another look at the size of the pipe coming in...

 

[rartuin270]

I had the gas company come out and put another meter at my barn. It only cost a nominal amount as most of the cost was absorbed by them.

How much is nominal?