Need 8' T8/T12 LED with wide angle

[GRB]

I thought I would post a new thread instead of further hijacking the thread titled "T8 LED tube issue".
Thanks, cybrdyke, for the response on that thread.

I have a bunch of 3' wide rows in between parts bins with mezzanine above that supports the second floor of the warehouse. They are each lit by a continuous row of single bulb 8' F96T12 fluorescents. The T12 fixtures are mounted below the heavy steel cross braces so cant go any higher. The T12 bulb is actually slightly below the labels that need to be readable on the top of the 84" top shelf. So I have labels that need to be readable up to about 92" and bulbs mounted about 90". The 5' between cross braces makes it tough for any light to fit in between and it would only gain a couple inches anyway.

This worked really well for the tech available when I built this 40 years ago. Other than replacing about one third of the ballasts during 40 years of 70 hours per week use and regular bulb changes, it works fine. The T12 give light up to the highest shelf and bounce around enough light that even labels on the lowest shelves are readable. I'm sure the light colored epoxy floor helps.
In order to change this to LED and save some energy, I would need bulbs that emit light through a full 180 degrees. The normal 120 degree LEDs used upstairs, where they are mounted at 10-11', don't spread the light out enough and would be blinding. Actually, they are barely acceptable at 10-11'.
Any LED conversion that has emitters in a single plane is probably no going to be acceptable.
Carson Lighting originally put an actual T12 diameter bulb in their catalog with 3 evenly spaced rows of LED and frosted glass for the best imitation of an actual T12 flourescent that there would probably be. It seems to never have made it and isn't in their current listing. They do have T12 diameter LED with two rows at 180 degrees and clear lenses available for dual sided lighted signs. They are also pretty high power as they are designed to replace HO lamps.
Anyone make anything like this?

Here is a picture of one row in one warehouse. I've got a bunch of rows. This was taken while reorganizing. It is a LOT fuller now.

 

[Bert_]

This is what I have been doing for 8' strips,

EPCO tandem retrofit kit (can be had for single lamp or two lamp fixtures).

Then install T8 direct wire tubes. I have been using Universal 17w tubes, listed as 240* beam angle. Most of the light is 180* or less but enough light goes up to keep the ceiling from looking like a cave. Would be good for your low ceiling and labels.

 

[Platonic Solid]

This 8' bulb (link) claims wider beam spread. Distributor page says 180°, spec sheet says 240°. Available with FA8 or R17D ends. No personal experience with it.

 

[tymbo]

search alibaba for the cheapest price. The tough part is the minimum lot order. I need 16 for my garage, but many only sell in lots of 10. I'll probably order 20 assuming some rate of failure. you can find them for under $20 each delivered.

 

[GRB]

I've tried a number of different bulbs claiming wider than 120 degree beam angle. Of the half dozen I've tried, it seems the wider angle claim is either complete nonsense or possible slightly justified by a heavier frost on the glass that does actually help a bit. I think as long as the emitters are on one flat circuit board that the the beam angle can't be wide enough.
All of the 8' bulbs seem to be by the case due to shipping. That isn't a problem as I will need lots, at least 20 for a full test in one section. The problem is that I would need one or two as a sample since you can't really trust much from most of these vendors.
If the bulb is the same in 4' or 8' like Platonic's link, I can try a 4' as a test. That helps a lot because I don't think I've seen the exact same bulb offered in 4' and 8' lengths. It does seem like a glass tube structure would make it possible for light to be coming out in a wider angle but the ones with an aluminum top half and plastic bottom half are certainly not.

In the sections with 5' aisle width and 11' light height, I have 2 lamp fixtures and have been able to take advantage of the FA8 ability to rotate each lamp out 45 degrees to get the light distribution. Optimum light distribution is achieved at 30 degrees of rotation but that still gives unpleasant amount of light out of a small area with the small T8 width. T12 width would probably solve that.

Added: I thought I would measure the actual light hitting the labels.
105FC At the top shelf
70FC At shoulder height
45FC At waist height
20FC At the floor

So it might actually be improved with less than 360 degree output.

 

[Bert_]

search alibaba for the cheapest price. The tough part is the minimum lot order. I need 16 for my garage, but many only sell in lots of 10. I'll probably order 20 assuming some rate of failure. you can find them for under $20 each delivered.

This is an option if you're fine with cheap junk...

 

[Bert_]

At the bottom of the spec sheet I linked for the 17w Universal brand tubes it shows the light distribution. It tells much more than just listing beam width as an angle.

You should be able to find this information in the spec sheet for any tube make by a decent manufacturer.

 

[GRB]

At the bottom of the spec sheet I linked for the 17w Universal brand tubes it shows the light distribution. It tells much more than just listing beam width as an angle.

You should be able to find this information in the spec sheet for any tube make by a decent manufacturer.

I appreciate the reference and did notice that the spec sheet made these look like a real product and not "no name junk". I'm going to try some of those for a row of offices that originally had four 2xT12 40w wraps too close to the center of the room. When converted to LED, these became unacceptable due to insufficient light on the wall cabinets and into the corners.

It simply wouldn't be worth converting the lower floor warehouse fixtures to two 4' lamps instead of one 8' as it is too much work. I pretty much need to do this myself as we don't allow others in the warehouse unless escorted.

 

[Bert_]

It simply wouldn't be worth converting the lower floor warehouse fixtures to two 4' lamps instead of one 8' as it is too much work. I pretty much need to do this myself as we don't allow others in the warehouse unless escorted.

I thought the same thing at first but with the lack of options for 8' lamps it becomes more desirable.

The conversion kit takes only takes a few minutes to install once you've done a couple. You don't take down the existing fixture.
The old tombstones and brackets will pop out and the new ones attach with a couple zip screws. I would honestly say it takes maybe a minute or two more than rewiring the existing tombstones and it opens up so many options for lamps.

 

[BillK]

The problem is that I would need one or two as a sample since you can't really trust much from most of these vendors.

Why not buy them local ? My local electric supply house sold me single tubes to try at the same price I could get them on line.

 

[GRB]

Why not buy them local ? My local electric supply house sold me single tubes to try at the same price I could get them on line.

I do buy as much local as is practical. Most of the local suppliers are busy with the construction and building boom and don't want to bother with something they would have to special order if it isn't a normal supplier. My local wholesale lighting supplier won't order tubes except in case quantity.
I didn't realize that the manufacturer that Bert suggested is part of Phillips so perhaps it will be easy.

 

[BillK]

I do buy as much local as is practical. Most of the local suppliers are busy with the construction and building boom and don't want to bother with something they would have to special order if it isn't a normal supplier. My local wholesale lighting supplier won't order tubes except in case quantity.
I didn't realize that the manufacturer that Bert suggested is part of Phillips so perhaps it will be easy.

Ok, My guys had them in stock so it wasnt a problem.

 

[cybrdyke]

I do buy as much local as is practical. Most of the local suppliers are busy with the construction and building boom and don't want to bother with something they would have to special order if it isn't a normal supplier. My local wholesale lighting supplier won't order tubes except in case quantity.

Call these guys and ask them where you can pick up some tubes locally: Forman & Associates 8200 Haskell Ave
Van Nuys, CA 91406 (818) 787-4900 (818) 787-4994

I didn't realize that the manufacturer that Bert suggested is part of Phillips so perhaps it will be easy.

Universal is not part of Philips. They're a direct competitor.
Universal (Nashville, TN) has been in the lighting business for a million years. They are one of the leading manufacturers of LED drivers and diodes.

 

[GRB]

Call these guys and ask them where you can pick up some tubes locally: Forman & Associates 8200 Haskell Ave
Van Nuys, CA 91406 (818) 787-4900 (818) 787-4994

Universal is not part of Philips. They're a direct competitor.
Universal (Nashville, TN) has been in the lighting business for a million years. They are one of the leading manufacturers of LED drivers and diodes.

Thanks so much for that info. Van Nuys isn't out of the question anyway.

On Universal, I was confusing my "P" companies: Panasonic & Phillips.