Need help with some fancy RF lighting controls

[91FE]

I'll try to keep this short. I've got 42 recessed 5" can lights in my finished basement on 4 separate circuits. The one "zone" coming down the steps is controlled by a 5-way (4 switches) and the other 3 have just one toggle switch. I'd like to do the following:

1. Control all 4 circuits from a single switch at the top of the steps. I'm thinking something from insteon would do the trick, but I'm not sure.

2. Add one or more ceiling mounted occupancy sensors to turn the lights out after the wife and kids inevitably come upstairs and leave (42) 60W bulbs burning for three days until somebody decides to play in the basement again. Is there an RF solution for this?

3. Replace the incandescent bulbs with LEDs. Easy enough... Just still a bit spendy.

Thoughts and guidance greatly appreciated.

 

[2ManyProjects]

I'll try to keep this short. I've got 42 recessed 5" can lights in my finished basement on 4 separate circuits. The one "zone" coming down the steps is controlled by a 5-way (4 switches) and the other 3 have just one toggle switch.

I'm guessing that your "5-way" switch circuit is set up something like this:

???

I'd like to do the following:

1. Control all 4 circuits from a single switch at the top of the steps. I'm thinking something from insteon would do the trick, but I'm not sure.

That's where I'd start. And either of these:

http://www.smarthome.com/2334-232/INSTEON-Keypad-Dimmer-Switch-Dual-Band-6-Button-White/p.aspx

http://www.smarthome.com/2487S/Keyp...pad-with-On-Off-Switch-Dual-Band-White/p.aspx

would be your "single switch" (so to speak, anyway). Which one you want will depend on whether the load is "dimmable" or not. And note that you can have one of these keypads at EACH of the four locations you currently have those "5-way" switches.

2. Add one or more ceiling mounted occupancy sensors to turn the lights out after the wife and kids inevitably come upstairs and leave (42) 60W bulbs burning for three days until somebody decides to play in the basement again.

Easy-peasy:

http://www.smarthome.com/2842-222/INSTEON-Wireless-Motion-Sensor/p.aspx

Is there an RF solution for this?

Not quite sure what you're asking here. Most of the Insteon stuff communicates via BOTH the power line and RF, redundantly. They call it "Dual Band". This is done to enhance signal propagation, so as to maximize total system reliability. The motion sensor cited above uses RF exclusively between the sensor itself and the plug-in interface module (and for that reason, is battery-powered; which I personally view as a minor negative); but that module DOES require a real connection to the home's electrical system in order to function.

3. Replace the incandescent bulbs with LEDs. Easy enough... Just still a bit spendy.

Given the "family habits" you described (which are not as uncommon as you might think), I'm sort'a surprised you haven't already done this.

Thoughts and guidance greatly appreciated.

Note that each of those keypads cited above can directly control ONE load. The other buttons are used to send commands to OTHER load-controllers elsewhere in the home/system, potentially on a "scene" basis (i.e., one button can be assigned to represent a complex combination of settings on a large number of individual devices). Depending mostly on exactly how your current installation is wired, you just MIGHT luck out and be able to connect one physical load to each of the four keypads you will presumably be installing. But if it turns out that this is impossible or inconvenient, then will want to ALSO use something like:

http://www.smarthome.com/2477D/SwitchLinc-INSTEON-Remote-Control-Dimmer-Dual-Band-White/p.aspx

or:

http://www.smarthome.com/2477S/Swit...-Remote-Control-Switch-Dual-Band-White/p.aspx

...again depending on whether the loads are dimmable or not.

If for whatever reason neither of these approaches works out, then you can use some of these:

http://www.smarthome.com/2475DA1/In...emote-Control-In-Line-Dimmer-Dual-Band/p.aspx

or these:

http://www.smarthome.com/2475SDB/In...ontrol-In-Line-On-Off-Switch-Dual-Band/p.aspx

to physically control those loads to which a keypad or wall switch cannot (conveniently) be directly connected.

Finally, as repeatedly hinted at above, you need to decide what sort of loads you're going to be setting this up for, BEFORE committing to the particular devices themselves. With your current incandescent bulbs, you can use the dimmer-module versions; and the end result would indeed be very nice, what with such features as programmable ramp-up/down, preset dimming levels, and so on. HOWEVER... Thanks to our short-sighted busybody do-gooder politicians and bureaucrats, incandescent lamps are being steadily forced out of existence; so the long-term prospects for this are murky, at best. As it stands now, the type of bulbs you would most likely use in those recessed cans (PAR-type spots/floods) are NOT completely prohibited (only some types of them are going away); so this won't be an IMMEDIATE problem. But the handwriting is on the wall, so to speak; and I fully expect that even these will eventually go the way of the Dodo bird.

For this reason, I would at least strongly consider sacrificing some of the "coolness" features of the dimmable controls, and going with the non-dimmable relay-based versions of the various load controllers from the get-go, so that you can thus side-step the possibility of needing to replace them if/when you convert to LED or CFL lighting.

 

[91FE]

Holy ****! Very informative.... Thank you! I see this is going to be a somewhat costly proposition. And here I thought the LED bulbs were going to be the expensive part.

 

[supperfly17]

Thank you 2mp I am learning as well as I read

 

[2ManyProjects]

Holy ****! Very informative.... Thank you!

You're welcome.

I see this is going to be a somewhat costly proposition.

It can add up. But OTOH, it's a one-time expense, which then pays dividends (in the form of reduced operating costs) forever. And as "wasteful" as you have described your family to be, that "payback" probably won't take forever.

There are also some ways you can reduce the initial cost somewhat. For example, do you REALLY need full keypads at each and every control location where you currently have those "5-way" switches? Also, are any of those "5-way" switches co-located (i.e., in the same, or at least adjacent, workboxes) as the switches for the other loads? If so, then some of the separate wall switches could conceivably be eliminated. In the end, it all depends on the specific layout of your room(s), lamps/fixtures, and switches.

And here I thought the LED bulbs were going to be the expensive part.

FWIW, if you do the Insteon installation right (particularly by making good use of the adjustable time-out values in the motion sensor), you may find your "incentive" to migrate to LED much reduced. Without most of the "wasted" usage, how many hours per week do you expect those lights to be on? And if you program everything to a moderately dimmed (but still fairly bright) level via the Preset Dim function, the existing incandescents will use significantly less juice when running than they do now (tho' their actual efficiency, in terms of lumens/watt, will also be reduced).

Thank you 2mp I am learning as well as I read

Glad to hear it.

 

[Overlord66]

Costco has 4 packs of the 2477d dimmers for 149.95 makes it a little cheaper than Smarthome.

 

[TJG]

FWIW, if you do the Insteon installation right (particularly by making good use of the adjustable time-out values in the motion sensor), you may find your "incentive" to migrate to LED much reduced. Without most of the "wasted" usage, how many hours per week do you expect those lights to be on? And if you program everything to a moderately dimmed (but still fairly bright) level via the Preset Dim function, the existing incandescents will use significantly less juice when running than they do now (tho' their actual efficiency, in terms of lumens/watt, will also be reduced).

This.

I have Control4 in my home - you can program such that when you turn a light on, it only goes on 80% intensity. You can tell the difference when looking at the light going from 100% to 80%, but you won't notice a 'lack of light' in the room. I do it on every light that is on my system.