Network optical fiber to the garage recommendations?

[Innovate1]

220' run (maybe 250 for all the way to the equipment in the basement). I installed 1" PVC conduit and ran outdoor rated CAT5e cable with protectors on both ends. Used DTK MRJPOE surge protectors on both ends. Had to put a switch right after the protector as an additional 25' of cable caused it to fail. Now its failing and dropping packets. Guessing its the long run plus the protectors that is just enough to be marginal even though the protectors are said to be good to 10Gb. So wanting to upgrade. Fiber optic seems like a good option. What's good equipment for this that is low cost (don't want the absolute cheapest junk, just something that's reasonable quality). Don't need super fast either - 1 G would more than cover it. 100M or even 50M would do. Open to other suggestions on other types of connections.

 

[jeepxj]

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08YV47MX9/?tag=atomicindus08-20

the ymake a 246' version too. drop down. 75 bucks.

2 startechs

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B011KH1TTC/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[wyliesdiesels]

You said you used a hub. As opposed to a switch? If its really a hub, that could be your problem.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

You could get pre-term OM3 fiber which will do 10G, though pulling it through 3/4” pipe is gonna be fun with the pulling eye.

Then get either 2 media converters or a small switch with SFP slots and 2x OM3 transceivers. The proper way to do it is with fiber patch panels on both ends along with patch cords.

 

[Innovate1]

You said you used a hub. As opposed to a switch? If its really a hub, that could be your problem.

It's not really a hub - I was just trying to simplify the description. It's a router with only the lan ports used. It's set to an address on the network outside the DHCP range.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

It's not really a hub - I was just trying to simplify the description. It's a router with only the lan ports used. It's set to an address on the network outside the DHCP range.

then its a switch

 

[jeepxj]

You could get pre-term OM3 fiber which will do 10G, though pulling it through 3/4” pipe is gonna be fun with the pulling eye.

Then get either 2 media converters or a small switch with SFP slots and 2x OM3 transceivers. The proper way to do it is with fiber patch panels on both ends along with patch cords.

thats GJ overkill at work. love it

 

[b-boy]

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08YV47MX9/?tag=atomicindus08-20

the ymake a 246' version too. drop down. 75 bucks.

2 startechs

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B011KH1TTC/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Something like this will work.

I'd go with outdoor rated fiber for a few bucks more. I have a 300ft run from my house to my barn. The pull was a pain in the ***. I have 1" conduit. I pulled 290 ft. without a problem. the last 10 ft. was a nightmare. The pulling eye basically self destructed, so I had to make my own.

I can't remember the last time I had to mess with it. It's completely hands off. Even when we lose power, everything comes right back up. I wish I could say the same for my house setup.

I'm getting 400+Mbps.

 

[jblnut]

Here's my shameless plug for GameChanger cable. I've run up to 700' in one run with it testing out at 1G speeds still. Conventional copper wiring but it does require ex-EZRJ45 plugs on both ends. Not sure if you can get less than a full roll but after close to 100,000' installed with most runs averaging 450' or more I can say it'd go the distance and then some that you're looking for.

Any preterminated fiber assembly is going to be less than fun to pull through a 3/4" pipe. I've worked with Tinifiber a fair bit and they have supplied me with something to go through a 3/4" conduit but it wasn't cheap .... Or inexpensive.....

 

[wyliesdiesels]

thats GJ overkill at work. love it

how is that overkill?

 

[jeepxj]

how is that overkill?

you do not need patch panels on either side for this kinda setup. doing so is overkill. i say that as a guy with a 48 port patch panel in his house.

 

[u3b3rg33k]

you do not need patch panels on either side for this kinda setup. doing so is overkill. i say that as a guy with a 48 port patch panel in his house.

**** i've only got a 24 port. i feel inadequate now.

OP might want to swap out the protectors on both ends and see if it works. unifi sells gig PoE rated ones for like $12ea.
throw a 4 light tester on the wire without the protectors and make sure it's not obviously shorted/failed. simple is good. cat6 should have NO problem doing gigE for AT LEAST 100 meters. 220' is cake.

 

[mike93lx]

**** i've only got a 24 port. i feel inadequate now.

OP might want to swap out the protectors on both ends and see if it works. unifi sells gig PoE rated ones for like $12ea.
throw a 4 light tester on the wire without the protectors and make sure it's not obviously shorted/failed. simple is good. cat6 should have NO problem doing gigE for AT LEAST 100 meters. 220' is cake.

Want to feel more adequate?

I have network wiring all through my house and use none of it. Mesh wifi FTW

 

[Denwood]

Have you tried testing without the surge bits attached? It might be a lot cheaper to swap them out with another brand, vs fibre. Are you using POE over this link?

I'd agree though that fibre is a great solution for this application.

 

[Innovate1]

I am doing testing of various parts - cable without surge protectors, surge protectors in another location, boxes on each end of the cable, etc. Haven't found anything yet but still going through things. I am not using POE on this link.

Where is a good place to read up on optical fiber? Seems like lots of choices on types, connectors, etc, etc. What cost am I looking at to install a good, basic link? Any suggested sources?

 

[u3b3rg33k]

Want to feel more adequate?

I have network wiring all through my house and use none of it. Mesh wifi FTW

ha. i like to hardwire things that don't move. it's just more reliable than wifi. I've got 4 APs in mesh as well. I move a lot of big files around, and my older stuff with 450Mb/s 802.11n just can't hold a candle to gigE. plus I like the pretty lights.

 

[mike93lx]

ha. i like to hardwire things that don't move. it's just more reliable than wifi. I've got 4 APs in mesh as well. I move a lot of big files around, and my older stuff with 450Mb/s 802.11n just can't hold a candle to gigE. plus I like the pretty lights.

I hear reliability quoted a lot, yet I don't have problems.

Multiple 4k tv's, my work computer, thermostats, couple pieces of pool equipment, besides the phones, tablets and laptops.

I can easily top out my 300 mbit fios connection anywhere in the house and most of the yard. But I don't move files around between devices at home.

 

[jeepxj]

I am doing testing of various parts - cable without surge protectors, surge protectors in another location, boxes on each end of the cable, etc. Haven't found anything yet but still going through things. I am not using POE on this link.

Where is a good place to read up on optical fiber? Seems like lots of choices on types, connectors, etc, etc. What cost am I looking at to install a good, basic link? Any suggested sources?

LC to ethernet converters are what you're after. don't go nuts here. its a rabbit hole of complexity and cost that serves no benefit to youre needs.

LC fiber
media converters. or a switch with a LC port on it.

 

[Metal-Marc]

I hear reliability quoted a lot, yet I don't have problems.

It depends on the application. I can't use my PC softphone if I am wireless. I need a wired ethernet connection for the phone to work.

 

[Innovate1]

LC to ethernet converters are what you're after. don't go nuts here. its a rabbit hole of complexity and cost that serves no benefit to youre needs.

LC fiber
media converters. or a switch with a LC port on it.

Yep. Seems like a rabbit hole. Can you suggest specific suppliers or components? Also still a bit unclear on what I need for in ground (in conduit) fiber. And the 250 ft length is longer than some places have for stock lengths.

 

[GJUser]

I’ve had good luck with fiber from fs.com in both personal and professional applications. For your use case I’d probably end up with something like this - https://www.fs.com/products/70221.html. Not the cheapest option, but they’ll fab it up to your exact length, and the cable assembly will last forever.

 

[jeepxj]

Yep. Seems like a rabbit hole. Can you suggest specific suppliers or components? Also still a bit unclear on what I need for in ground (in conduit) fiber. And the 250 ft length is longer than some places have for stock lengths.

Ok this is what i'd do. you need to be really sure on your distance. if you're not sure just get extra on fiber length.

75 meters:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08L591DJN/?tag=atomicindus08-20

100 Meters:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07YWJT5CZ/?tag=atomicindus08-20

then purchase 2 of these:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B011KH1TTC/?tag=atomicindus08-20

that all ya need. pull the fiber through the conduit. connect up the fiber ends, patch ethernet in. Done. its really that easy.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I hear reliability quoted a lot, yet I don't have problems.

Multiple 4k tv's, my work computer, thermostats, couple pieces of pool equipment, besides the phones, tablets and laptops.

I can easily top out my 300 mbit fios connection anywhere in the house and most of the yard. But I don't move files around between devices at home.

some of those dont push much data at all, even video on 4K steaming TV is compressed nowadays...

 

[mike93lx]

some of those dont push much data at all, even video on 4K steaming TV is compressed nowadays...

Sure. But what I am doing is a common use case. Wifi works great for the majority of stuff.

 

[Innovate1]

Ok this is what i'd do. you need to be really sure on your distance. if you're not sure just get extra on fiber length.

75 meters:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08L591DJN/?tag=atomicindus08-20

100 Meters:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07YWJT5CZ/?tag=atomicindus08-20

then purchase 2 of these:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B011KH1TTC/?tag=atomicindus08-20

that all ya need. pull the fiber through the conduit. connect up the fiber ends, patch ethernet in. Done. its really that easy.

Under questions it is stated that it is not up to long term water exposure (which is likely to accumulate in an underground conduit) and also not good for the tension required to pull it in. Not sure how valid those points are but it gives me pause...

 

[jeepxj]

Under questions it is stated that it is not up to long term water exposure (which is likely to accumulate in an underground conduit) and also not good for the tension required to pull it in. Not sure how valid those points are but it gives me pause...

if you're super worried about it:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XT7VNTN/?tag=atomicindus08-20

i just use mule tape with half hitches ever 10' or so to spread the tension on it. edit: thats for wire. for fiber just tape it to some mule tape for the pull.

 

[u3b3rg33k]

I hear reliability quoted a lot, yet I don't have problems.

Multiple 4k tv's, my work computer, thermostats, couple pieces of pool equipment, besides the phones, tablets and laptops.

I can easily top out my 300 mbit fios connection anywhere in the house and most of the yard. But I don't move files around between devices at home.

I have a few devices that are fussy. for normal use it really doesn't matter. big backups or moving video around in bulk, wired please.

some of those dont push much data at all, even video on 4K steaming TV is compressed nowadays...

many smart TVs are known for having 100Mb/s ethernet and AC wifi. lol. depends on what you're streaming/transcoding. i've got 10GbE between my storage server and my switch.

Under questions it is stated that it is not up to long term water exposure (which is likely to accumulate in an underground conduit) and also not good for the tension required to pull it in. Not sure how valid those points are but it gives me pause...

i wouldn't worry about it. fiber is cheap. did you get the outdoor rated cat 6 gel filled? I always use gel filled cable for burial. water can't get in if it's full of that nasty. unwanted capacitance can do weird things.

 

[Innovate1]

Yes, I did get gel filled CAT6.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

if you're super worried about it:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XT7VNTN/?tag=atomicindus08-20

i just use mule tape with half hitches ever 10' or so to spread the tension on it. edit: thats for wire. for fiber just tape it to some mule tape for the pull.

Theres a reason why theres fiber made for different applications.

Loose tube should be used underground for many important reasons.

But if you like wasting by all means use the wrong type

Also 2 strand fiber is a waste of money. Better to buy 4 or 6 strand that way if one or 2 strands go bad you have backup strands

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I have a few devices that are fussy. for normal use it really doesn't matter. big backups or moving video around in bulk, wired please.

many smart TVs are known for having 100Mb/s ethernet and AC wifi. lol. depends on what you're streaming/transcoding. i've got 10GbE between my storage server and my switch.

i wouldn't worry about it. fiber is cheap. did you get the outdoor rated cat 6 gel filled? I always use gel filled cable for burial. water can't get in if it's full of that nasty. unwanted capacitance can do weird things.

Gel filled *****. Use the dry gel tape CAT6 instead.

 

[u3b3rg33k]

Gel filled *****. Use the dry gel tape CAT6 instead.

I have gel filled run to here:


50x7Mb/s fixed wireless internet.
it's been in service for maybe a decade now. no issues with the cabling.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I have gel filled run to here:


50x7Mb/s fixed wireless internet.
it's been in service for maybe a decade now. no issues with the cabling.

ok and? it ***** to terminate. i said nothing about its performance

 

[jeepxj]

Theres a reason why theres fiber made for different applications.

Loose tube should be used underground for many important reasons.

But if you like wasting by all means use the wrong type

Also 2 strand fiber is a waste of money. Better to buy 4 or 6 strand that way if one or 2 strands go bad you have backup strands

sure. just gotta balance cost to risk to need.

ideally yea toss in some 6 strand and never worry again aside from mechanical damage. just gotta find something in the right cost profile.

 

[mike93lx]

ok and? it ***** to terminate. i said nothing about its performance

To be fair, you said it ***** and didn't specify that termination is the issue

 

[KSJeff]

I have hundreds of copper runs over 220' that work just fine (old Lucent Cat5, Mohawk Cat 5 and the latest stuff we ran was general cable cat 6. Everything we run is plenum rated since it's in a plenum. Most of this is just on cable hooks in the ceiling. This is a call center with a PC and IP phone hanging on the end. I have them run two lines per station and then terminated and tested for attenuation.

You're going to want a professional to polish the fiber, so you might as well just have someone come out to re-terminate your ends and measure the attenuation on your line. Something else is going on because that's not a long run.

However, if you just want fiber, hire someone to run multimode, get LC connectors and if your switches/routers don't support SFPs, get some that do and buy the appropriate SFPs. Can't help you with cheap - we're a cisco/meraki shop and I've never put my hands on anything else for fiber.

 

[larry4406]

No expert at all but I book marked a fiber cable with pulling eye and staggered connectors which is underground rated and for pulling thru conduit. Max outer diameter on assembly is listed as 3/4". This was why I ran 1" conduit to the barn but it remains empty as the Orbi wireless is working fine.

I thought this was a neat setup.

https://www.lanshack.com/4-Strand-Custom-Multimode-50-micron-10-GiG-IndoorOutdoor-Assembly-P1982C236.aspx

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I have hundreds of copper runs over 220' that work just fine (old Lucent Cat5, Mohawk Cat 5 and the latest stuff we ran was general cable cat 6. Everything we run is plenum rated since it's in a plenum. Most of this is just on cable hooks in the ceiling. This is a call center with a PC and IP phone hanging on the end. I have them run two lines per station and then terminated and tested for attenuation.

You're going to want a professional to polish the fiber, so you might as well just have someone come out to re-terminate your ends and measure the attenuation on your line. Something else is going on because that's not a long run.

However, if you just want fiber, hire someone to run multimode, get LC connectors and if your switches/routers don't support SFPs, get some that do and buy the appropriate SFPs. Can't help you with cheap - we're a cisco/meraki shop and I've never put my hands on anything else for fiber.

The Epoxy and Polish method is old school and i dont know anyone that has used it in years. Nowadays people use pre-polished connectors or splice on pre-termed tails... epoxy and polish is a waste of time...

 

[u3b3rg33k]

ok and? it ***** to terminate. i said nothing about its performance

dunno. i wore gloves for the 2nd side.

sure. just gotta balance cost to risk to need.

ideally yea toss in some 6 strand and never worry again aside from mechanical damage. just gotta find something in the right cost profile.

personally, I'd just get a long patch cord and vacuum it through the conduit. if it fails, tie the new one on and use the old one as a pull string.

The Epoxy and Polish method is old school and i dont know anyone that has used it in years. Nowadays people use pre-polished connectors or splice on pre-termed tails... epoxy and polish is a waste of time...

I've done it. kits are still available. the nice thing about it is if you F it up, you can often polish out your mistake. some specs say no splices, so it's the only way to have a 0 splice run from end to end. I had a co-worker who could do in-spec hand polished connectors faster than most of the guys could do the index matching gel twist-locks. my connectors were the best, but i was half as fast as him. you can look at the end in the scope and see if it's gonna pass spec well. I just went for "does it look perfect" and if it did, it was.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

personally, I'd just get a long patch cord and vacuum it through the conduit. if it fails, tie the new one on and use the old one as a pull string.

thats a horrible idea. patch cords are stranded and the jacket is not rated for water.

I've done it. kits are still available. the nice thing about it is if you F it up, you can often polish out your mistake. some specs say no splices, so it's the only way to have a 0 splice run from end to end.

Definitely not the only way to do it without a splice. we use corning unicam connectors and we have no issues with them. they pass cert...

I had a co-worker who could do in-spec hand polished connectors faster than most of the guys could do the index matching gel twist-locks. my connectors were the best, but i was half as fast as him. you can look at the end in the scope and see if it's gonna pass spec well. I just went for "does it look perfect" and if it did, it was.

thats impossible because you have to wait til the epoxy dries.

 

[u3b3rg33k]

thats a horrible idea. patch cords are stranded and the jacket is not rated for water.



Definitely not the only way to do it without a splice. we use corning unicam connectors and we have no issues with them. they pass cert...


thats impossible because you have to wait til the epoxy dries.

it's cheap. it's what i'd do for me if I could get one long enough.

Monoprice OM3 Fiber Optic Cable - LC/LC, UL, 50/125 Type, Multi-Mode, 10GB, Aqua, 5m, Corning - Monoprice.com

Because of its immunity to electronic interference and its greater speeds over longer distances, fiber optic cabling has become the conduit of choice for high speed network communications. Monoprice&t

www.monoprice.com

unicams use index matching gel and is NOT a continuous fiber from end to end. some customers demand it in the spec. why idk, unicam works fine, maybe they had a bad experience with it once (bad installer?). you can even reuse them a few times, even though you're not supposed to.