New Circuit to patio, going through attic

[skon1212]

I have a new patio addition that I want to put on a new circuit from my breaker box. The guy who built it and did a good job cut one corner by wiring the patio circuit into the existing living room circuit and putting in a bigger 20 Amp breaker. I just found out the living room circuit also includes the one outlet in our garage, the garage door opener and lights in garage. Needless to say with 3 outside fans and a outlet on our BBQ island for a fridge, It will be overloaded. So I want to run a dedicated circuit to the patio. As I said the guy who built the patio tapped into an outside patio light then ran that to an outside ceiling fan. An electrician who came and gave me an estimate said he would just run the circuit from the ceiling fan back to the breaker box and cap off the wire from the old outside light that turns on and off in the living room.
My first question is when running wire through the attic, does it have to be in conduit? Half of my roof has attic space and the part where the run would start has about a 1 and half foot space between the rafters and the ceiling so not much there. The electrician said he would run the wires through conduit from the crawl space side to the attic side and then just route it to where the breaker box is, run it down into the garage through conduit so it would not have to go through the wall plate, then run through the garage wall into the box. Total cost $345. Seems high for 100 foot roll of romex some conduit a breaker and about 2 hours labor. I know I could do it myself with some guidance, but just need some help on routing it through the roof/attic.
Any suggestions.

 

[soob]

Sounds like he wants it to go in conduit where it's exposed, not where it runs through the attic. At least that's what I'd expect based on your description.

Putting conduit over finished walls is the lazy way to do it, in my opinion. Sometimes it can't be avoided though.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I have a new patio addition that I want to put on a new circuit from my breaker box. The guy who built it and did a good job cut one corner by wiring the patio circuit into the existing living room circuit and putting in a bigger 20 Amp breaker. I just found out the living room circuit also includes the one outlet in our garage, the garage door opener and lights in garage. Needless to say with 3 outside fans and a outlet on our BBQ island for a fridge, It will be overloaded. So I want to run a dedicated circuit to the patio. As I said the guy who built the patio tapped into an outside patio light then ran that to an outside ceiling fan. An electrician who came and gave me an estimate said he would just run the circuit from the ceiling fan back to the breaker box and cap off the wire from the old outside light that turns on and off in the living room.
My first question is when running wire through the attic, does it have to be in conduit? Half of my roof has attic space and the part where the run would start has about a 1 and half foot space between the rafters and the ceiling so not much there. The electrician said he would run the wires through conduit from the crawl space side to the attic side and then just route it to where the breaker box is, run it down into the garage through conduit so it would not have to go through the wall plate, then run through the garage wall into the box. Total cost $345. Seems high for 100 foot roll of romex some conduit a breaker and about 2 hours labor. I know I could do it myself with some guidance, but just need some help on routing it through the roof/attic.
Any suggestions.

wait a minute! He put in a bigger breaker? What size wire is the new 20a breaker feeding? I sure hope its not #14...

 

[pattenp]

Romex in the attic does not need to be in conduit. But it does need to be installed properly if within a certain distance of an attic floor or access opening. Basically if the Romex is installed in an area where it may be stepped on it needs to follow ceiling joist or running boards.

 

[skon1212]

Yes it will be in conduit outside once it exits the bird block. I am pretty sure he was going to use conduit to feed the wire to the attic side of the roof. I don't know how you could get it from the outside through the roof where there is about a 1 and half foot crawl space to the other side of the roof where there is an attic.

It is 12-2 romex, not 14 that is going to the 20 amp breaker. But like I said, there just seems to be too many things on one circuit. Right now it would be 2 TV's, 6 outlets, 4 ceiling fans(1 inside and 3 on the patio) 2 security lights and a BBQ run which will have a fridge. I am sure if everything was going all at once it would not end well.

 

[Redwolf947]

Pictures are worth a thousand words.. Show us where you'll be running this.. Show us the Panel too with cover off. Might help the gurus explain it better..

 

[skon1212]

I will try and take some pics and post them. The attic ones will be harder to get for a day or two due to my schedule.

 

[skon1212]

Here are the pics.
The first pic is where the wire runs out of the bird block and hooks up to a ceiling fan. The Arrow on the right show where they tied into the living room circuit behind the bird block. The electrician I got the quote from was going to run the new circuit from the ceiling fan and cap the LR circuit where you see it coming out of the bird block. I am hoping that the light they spiced into was the end of the circuit. Otherwise I may have to figure out how to remove the bird block to access the wires.
The Second pic is where the wire comes through the bird block. It is taken from the attic side where the peak of the roof is. There is a little more room that I thought, but getting to the place where the wire comes through does not look easy. Even running conduit to the place it comes through and trying to thread it through looks rough. This is where suggestions would be helpful.
The third pic is of my panel. The garage is right on the other side. I know I will have to pop that other knock out, out and go through the wall into the garage. Any tips on that would also be appreciated. Its a stucco exterior house.

 

[Redwolf947]

Is the wiring going to the fan exposed or up in the ceiling cavity?
Note: I'm not an electrician..
If it was my setup I'd run 12-2 NM-B romex from panel (pic3) thru attic (pic2) to a junction box in the attic you can mount that box to the side of the truss try to keep the wire close to the eaves where no one will walk on it. Then run 12-2 UF-B (Outdoor)romex from that junction box to your light/fan(outdoor circuits).. I'd probably Drill a 1/2" hole for the 12-2 UF-B to exit the building caulking that shut. If the switch is no longer used for the light I'd remove the switch nutting the wires and put in a cover plate also nutting off the wires on the other end..

 

[skon1212]

Yes it is an outdoor ceiling fan that is exposed for now. All the Romex that is on the patio is 12-2 outdoor grade. I understand what you mean about putting a junction box on a rafter or truss to keep it out of the way but I am trying to figure out how to get the wire from the hole in the bird block to the junction box. There is more room up there than I thought but I don't want to go crawl through the insulation or fall through the roof because I cant see the trusses. Am I being over cautious? Seems like it shouldn't be a tough job but the cheapest quote so far is $240 from an electrician doing it as a side job.
The switch that controlled that outside light is on a 3 switch plate inside the house so it would basically just be a dead switch.