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New driveway having problems

evan_880

Member
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Messages
20
Hi guys, thought i would post some issues im having and seek your advice.


First off, i live in canada, in saskatchewan. Cold bitter winters and lots of freeze thaw. I didn't use salt on the driveway as this will wreck a driveway for sure, let alone a new one. here is the story:

I had this driveway poured last year and now some issues are coming up. Its started to spall badly and chip at surface level.

When they poured it rained for a bit so they held off, and then when the rain stopped they couldn't brush it to a proper depth. I got a discount from the concrete guys. Free sealer and black edging.

As you can see the edging is chipping, the cut lines are chipping, the outside edges of the driveway are flaking off in small pieces. There is parts of the driveway that have not chipped or anything and seem fine (other than the lack of broom grooves) so i'm wondering if its just the surface in some areas or if others just need more time to fall apart.

I talked to the concrete company through the winter and he said they would likely redo the driveway this year or next. With spring arriving the concrete company has now had several driveways like this, from last year and is blaming the mix. The concrete mix company has said they will supply redi-mix to recover, but i am worried this will just be a band aid on a big problem.

After talking to the company who poured the driveway, he says he doesn't want to leave me "hi and dry" but suggested i get some quotes on refinishing the driveway so he can get some price ideas.
He no longer wants to redo the driveway as he says it will bankrupt him having to rip out more than one driveway. So him and the concrete company have thought that they could pay thirds and the homeowner pay one third also to have it repaired. I don't have a lot of choice since he has been paid since last fall...

Anyway here are some pics, hopefully its not as bad as i think it is.

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nate379

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Feb 2, 2009
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7,279
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Palmer, AK
Was that slab poured on that same mud that is showing in your pics? Doesn't look like topsoil was removed and a good base put down.
 
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evan_880

Member
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Messages
20
there was gravel put under it first and tamped.
Does it need to be pulled out or could it be recovered?
what is a "weak cap"?
thanks
 

SuperSocket

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Nov 2, 2010
Messages
2,683
Location
Michigan
Take him to court and get yourself a new driveway. If he is so worried about being put out of business due to replacements, then perhaps he should check his mix and do his job better... plenty of other concrete companies willing to pickup his slack.


Same thing happened to me, except it was the entire neighborhood and some other new developments... they ended up replacing all the driveways.
 
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LegacyIndustrial

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Jun 7, 2010
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7,994
Location
deerfield, IL
there was gravel put under it first and tamped.
Does it need to be pulled out or could it be recovered?
what is a "weak cap"?
thanks

Too much water in the mix. Water rises to the top, dilutes the mix and creates a weak surface layer or cap. If this was inside you could grind through the weakness and apply a nice coating. The sides probably had water sitting between the form and the slab, weakened this as well.

This is not acceptable outside.
 

mato

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Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
22
Location
Cleveland, OH
Too much water in the mix. Water rises to the top, dilutes the mix and creates a weak surface layer or cap.

I agree...

Water:Cement Ratio is too high. Could be the Ready-Mix suppliers fault, most of the time it is the contractors fault. When they are loading a ready-mix truck at the plant sometimes they put all the water that is needed for a load and sometimes they will leave some water out, assuming the driver will take his hose and spray water into the drum when he gets on site and this will put the mix at the correct slump.
Some contractors will consistently ask for more water to be added to the truck so it is easier to rake and they aren't breaking their backs, which causes the water:cement ratio to be off.

The problem you are going to have is who is going to admit fault? Ready-Mix supplier or Contractor?
Both are going to point the finger at each other and the one who cares about their reputation the most is going to step-up
 
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evan_880

Member
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Nov 4, 2010
Messages
20
okay i understand. so if i try to "go after" someone should i go with the concrete guy or go straight to the redi-mix company?
probably the concrete guy i assume.
 
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Steves32

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Feb 12, 2011
Messages
845
Depends on how you paid. Did you pay for the concrete yourself (direct) or was it included in the bid?
 

pauls340

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Jan 27, 2009
Messages
321
Location
North of Motown
You have an easy fix there in Saska. Contact Kelly Lajeunesse @ 888-462-6092, he is an artist at repairing concrete without removing it and get the first concrete guy who put too much water in the mix to cover the cost. You're water is very high there, tell Kelly to seal the slab with either Vapor Lock 10/10 or D-Tech before he repairs that concrete. He will give you a product that will never spall off again.
 

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pauls340

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North of Motown
Evan, your RediMix guy had a mix ratio slip when he delivered that load of concrete, your contractor used it to light his cigar. That concrete was delivered with, give or take, 32 gal of water in it in order to place the concrete where the contractor wanted it. 15 of those gallons are used to make the concrete leaving 17 gallons of Free Water to cause that damage. You have to stop the moisture vapor emission in that concrete. Since there are no cracks in the slabs yet (assumption) Kelly will put Vapor Lock on it and then rebuild it with Mg-Krete. Totally impervious (both positive and negative) to water, salt, gas, glycol, jet fuel and even pickle juice. Check it out as an option.
 

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mato

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Apr 17, 2011
Messages
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Location
Cleveland, OH
Vapor Lock and MG-Krete need to be applied to solid/sound concrete. This driveway will never be solid or sound.
 

pauls340

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Jan 27, 2009
Messages
321
Location
North of Motown
As with ALL concrete repair products, the repair is only as good as its substrate. Since this is a fairly new pour let's assume there are no cracks, the Vapor Lock can be applied to any cementitious surface, it will penetrate and find the extra water in the concrete. It will also be a great barrier to stop the water migration up to the bond layer under the MGK. Like I said, make it an option.
 
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