New Old stock Goodman Mini split with R-22

[Tunajoe]

I recently had the opportunity to pick up a new, old stock Goodman mini split model # WMH24-1 for $500.
The AC guy owed me money and I wasn't sure I'd ever see it, so I took the mini split.
It is brand new, still in the box along with the condenser. Looks really nice!

The manual says it's also a heat pump.
The only thing I need is the line set. Manual says the condenser comes pre charged with R-22 as long as the line set isn't longer than 15 feet.

runs off 220.
I'm concerned about the ability to get R 22 in the future. I'm hoping I get it installed and never have to worry about charging it again.
Anyone familiar with these units?

 

[DpSyChO]

You may or may not ever need R22.
When I done service work for a local HVAC place, we had a system that printed out all prior notes for a customer when we went out. One lady had a 30+ year old General Electric AC on top of a Thermopride furnace.......Yes, a General Electric, I think their AC/Heat pumps were bought out by Trane for the spine fin design. Anyway I went for the fall service of her furnace and got to looking at her service notes and no refrigerant had been added since the notes system was put into place 10 years prior. She changed her system out for a heat pump the next spring because a friend of hers got a new system and talked about how much cheaper her power bill was. Not to sound ugly, but she was in her late 80's and I dont think she would ever make up the cost of the new system with the power bill savings she was going to have.
At the opposite end of the sprectum..........a friend of mine who still works as a service tech at the HVAC place I was at was telling me the other day they have been having problems with a well known brand (that I wont mention the name of) having the tubing going into the drier split in the bend and loosing all refrigerant. These units were all less than a year old and installed around the same time. Other brands they installed in that time frame are not giving any trouble.
There are "drop in" R22 replacements that some people love and others hate.
If you already have the unit, put it in and forget about it till the time comes.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

You may or may not ever need R22.
When I done service work for a local HVAC place, we had a system that printed out all prior notes for a customer when we went out. One lady had a 30+ year old General Electric AC on top of a Thermopride furnace.......Yes, a General Electric, I think their AC/Heat pumps were bought out by Trane for the spine fin design. Anyway I went for the fall service of her furnace and got to looking at her service notes and no refrigerant had been added since the notes system was put into place 10 years prior. She changed her system out for a heat pump the next spring because a friend of hers got a new system and talked about how much cheaper her power bill was. Not to sound ugly, but she was in her late 80's and I dont think she would ever make up the cost of the new system with the power bill savings she was going to have.
At the opposite end of the sprectum..........a friend of mine who still works as a service tech at the HVAC place I was at was telling me the other day they have been having problems with a well known brand (that I wont mention the name of) having the tubing going into the drier split in the bend and loosing all refrigerant. These units were all less than a year old and installed around the same time. Other brands they installed in that time frame are not giving any trouble.
There are "drop in" R22 replacements that some people love and others hate.
If you already have the unit, put it in and forget about it till the time comes.

From what I remember of the old ge furnaces back 60s-70s they were basically rebranded trane wrecks,I don't remember who made theit condensing units.
They were probably a knock off of trane wreck also.

 

[sms1974]

From what I remember of the old ge furnaces back 60s-70s they were basically rebranded trane wrecks,I don't remember who made theit condensing units.
They were probably a knock off of trane wreck also.

Other way around actually...

Tappan became General Electric which then became Trane... We've been with then since Tappan. All along the parent company had been American Standard which has now been bought by Ingersol Rand...

 

[Falcon67]

>You may or may not ever need R22.

We replaced the line set in our old house which had a 1976 vintage Carrier air handler with a Reem 10 SEER a-coil and condenser unit. Used the existing line set when we put in the Reem addition, about tow years later replaced the line set because of slow leaks that were likely under the house somewhere. Never had any more top-off requirements.

The original system in this house (Goodman) was installed when the house was built in 2000/2001. It needed a top off the last two years and when it finally reached EOL last year we replaced it all - including running a new line set. If the connections are well made and tested, and the system maintained there should be almost no issues over an extended time. IMHO anyway. The Goodman here only made it to 14 because for several years nobody cared for it. Like, apparently not even filter changes.

 

[justinjoyal]

500$ for an old R22 mini-split? Non inverter I guess?

Doesnt seem like much of a deal to me..

 

[Tunajoe]

500$ for an old R22 mini-split? Non inverter I guess?

Doesnt seem like much of a deal to me..

Really?
Why do you say that?
No idea if its an inverter or not.
A couple of years ago I paid $675 for a rinky dink Pioneer 110v mini split that doesn't run worth a damn.
If I'm able to heat and cool my garage then Im doing great.
Plus, the ac guy was able to pay off his debt.

 

[Brandon314159]

A cylinder of R22 can go for $500+ easily around these parts.

I hunted high and low and found a nearly full one for $40 after I extinguished my 1/2 full one on this install. Be VERY careful about folks selling 'new' R22 when it is actually reclaimed or contaminated with junk.

I bought a used low-use R22 Trane AC only (I have a newer goodman 95% nat-gas furnace) 15 SEER unit. Got a lineset, installed the a-coil, changed the oil in the compressor, brazed it all up and it's been working well. I wouldn't have bought it without having the R22 on-hand though.

I thought I had a leak in my system but turns out my gauge set was dumping from the low-side valve randomly. Gah!

 

[bazar01]

A cylinder of R22 can go for $500+ easily around these parts.

Last time I was at the hvac supply house, R22 was over $700 for a 30-lb tank.
Just hope that OP makes all the fitting connections leak tight.

I will not install any R22 unit unless they are free.
R410 is less than $100 a tank.

 

[Jackfre]

Well, it is over 10 years old, single stage, not manuf by Goodman, but I am not sure which Chinese manuf they sourced from then. As you say, you got something where you likely would have gotten nothing. My question is, what is the line set it is pre-charged with. Assuming it has held that charge and you can install it within the pre -charge line set length, it will blow cold air. Heat, not so much, but you are in S CA so perhaps not a big deal. As said, having to buy R22 makes it a looser, but what the hell, you have, go for it!

 

[RTUmark]

R-22 is getting very expensive and will only continue to rise.

 

[Tunajoe]

Well, it is over 10 years old, single stage, not manuf by Goodman, but I am not sure which Chinese manuf they sourced from then. As you say, you got something where you likely would have gotten nothing. My question is, what is the line set it is pre-charged with. Assuming it has held that charge and you can install it within the pre -charge line set length, it will blow cold air. Heat, not so much, but you are in S CA so perhaps not a big deal. As said, having to buy R22 makes it a looser, but what the hell, you have, go for it!

Ok, I see.
So really it's the availability and cost of the R22 that makes it not that great of a deal.
Sucker punched AGAIN! lol
I am worried about the charge still holding after all these years. The fellow I got it from, said he has R22.
And the box says Manuf. in Taiwan. Not sure if that's any better than China lol

Hey Jack, sounds like you are familiar with this model unit?
Are you saying the heat function is weak? Or doesn't work very well?

Thanks

 

[Jackfre]

Mimi-split heat pumps prior to the introduction of the 410a inverter units were very weak in the heat output. Single stage R22, on-off type units, which you have, can't come close to the inverter units performance wise in the heat side. They do cool well but are generally 10 seer or less, where today's inverter units can, dependent upon model be 30+ seer. When I represented Fujitsu if one of my customers called saying he bought an R22 heat pump I'd call him back and ask, "what are you nuts?" When the 410a inverter units came out and the same guy called and said he wasn't going to buy the heat pump I'd call him back and say, "what are you nuts?" The inverter units are the very definition of disruptive technology in the hvac business. You own this unit. The contractor says he has R22 for you. If you can get it, assuming you need it, and not have to spend a fortune on the install, you may as well go forward and install it. That is unless you can unload it and get a 410a unit

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

Other way around actually...

Tappan became General Electric which then became Trane... We've been with then since Tappan. All along the parent company had been American Standard which has now been bought by Ingersol Rand...

American standard is trane wreck in my world,any way the all had that wonderful heat exchanger that I had so much fun condemning on so many differant ocassion over the years for cracks in the same place.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Just a couple of thoughts. There should be no difference in an NOS unit's factory charge regardless of how long it's been sitting. A properly installed system never "needs" refrigerant unless something causes a leak. There are almost no legal "drop in" replacements for R22 that don't have drawbacks or require other system modifications. That unit might not have even had a precharged line set. If your total length of run is below what the installation manual calls for without adding refrigerant, run your line set, leak check, evacuate and release the charge...

Tommy

 

[sms1974]

American standard is trane wreck in my world,any way the all had that wonderful heat exchanger that I had so much fun condemning on so many differant ocassion over the years for cracks in the same place.

The good old BLU models... that was actually a SJC design that became Tappans first condensing 90+ furnace. They rotted out heat exchangers quickly.

GE and Trane's first generation had fish tail burners, that series were poorly engineered. second generation had a longitudinal burner and were a good furnace. I just serviced one a week ago 31 years old and had no issues at all, other than coming out at 67% efficient but he has a gas well and doesn't pay for the gas...

 

[TangoFoxTrot]

What percentage of home's AC still use R22? My guess is it's probably the overwhelming majority. My units still run it.

I would use what you have and just see what happens. I went like 20 years on my home's AC without a leak.

Consumers though really got shafted on this whole R22 phaseout. It should have been handled much better and I wouldn't be surprised if there were some changes in that department with the new Administration's EPA where the timeline's got extended out a few more years. The EPA also said the average fuel economy for all car brands is supposed to be 54.5mpg in like 9 years, and everyone knows that's going to be cancelled as it's completely unrealistic.



It's all a scam for companies like DuPont. R-134 replaced R-12 because it was "green" for the environment, now that is trying to be phased out as well, etc. They are now saying R410 is actively trying to be banned because it's not good for the environment.