New Shop Design - Could Use Some Feedback

[BoWingo]

Hey guys,

Well, I couldn't find anyone that would build my earlier workshop design (two-story monstrosity), so I went back to the drawing board and did a redesign. Can you guys give me a little feedback about this version?

As I have it drawn, it's a 36'x80' building split into three sections. The far right is a 20' gym, the middle is a 30' woodworking shop, and the left is a 30' automotive shop.

The automotive shop has a 20' wide garage door (extra width to accommodate a future lift while leaving enough space to pull in a vehicle beside it) and a 10' garage door in the back for cross-ventilation. The woodworking shop has a 10' wide garage door for ease of loading in materials. Each workshop has a 36" wide man-door for convenience, and the gym is accessible from the woodshop.

I'd like to have lots of windows down the front (west) side with a deep covered porch.

The height to the eaves is 14' and I would like to use parallel scissor/parallel chord trusses to have good interior height with a pitched ceiling. The gym would have a 9' ceiling with a loft space above (mainly expected to be used for storage of woodworking materials).

The gym would ideally be able to be converted into an apartment someday, in case that's ever needed for the father-in-law. As drawn, I've included a bathroom with toilet, sink, and shower accessible from both the gym and woodworking spaces.

So...what do you guys think? See anything that I'm not thinking about that's going to give me heartburn later on? What would you want to change about this design?

Thanks.


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[Justanoldguy]

Is that 30'+ 30'+ 20' ?

Looks good

 

[carcajou]

If you are actively using the wood shop, you may want a outside entry door to the Gym to avoid tracking sawdust in. Gonna need one anyway if you convert it to a living space someday. I like the layout.

 

[RWorth]

only thing I would change is a wider door in the wood working shop. If the shop is 30' I'd do a 20'wide door.

 

[tomroblee]

I would sure want a sink in the garage area.

The design seems OK for a gym, but I can see some issues if you want to convert it to living quarters. I would think that code would require a firewall (and fire rated doors) between the living quarters and shop/garage. That would include your loft area.

Don't forget about access to your loft. Stairways are nice, but seem to take up valuable floor space in the middle of a room.

You need to consider egress requirements for a living area. A separate door to the outside would seem to be a minimum.

If the gym was converted to a living area, I think that additional windows on other walls would make it more appealing. Thought should be given for rough-in plumbing for a "kitchen" sink. The minimum sized bathroom may be adequate for shop/gym use, but might be less than comfortable for an older person----especially if they have difficulty walking and require a walker or wheel chair.

 

[Richard Cranium]

It is large, I like it.

 

[Adittmer]

Maybe go 40x80?? And larger door into the wood shop


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[The Wart]

A 14' eave shouldn't have issues but bear in mind that you will lose some vertical headroom under the eave of the porch roof via the falling roof pitch and beam required to support that roof

 

[BoWingo]

Thanks for all the replies. In reviewing your feedback, I've noticed a few trends:

1. The size seems to be well-liked with just one vote for 4-foot more in depth. Adittmer, could you maybe elaborate on why you say 40' instead of 36'?
2. Separate exterior door for the gym section. Huh, my wife said the same thing, and I shot her down on it. May need to revisit that discussion.
3. Two votes for a larger overhead door into the woodshop. I'm curious about this one. Why? Not saying you guys are wrong, I just want to understand. I figured that having a single 10' wide door would be fine for loading in materials and moving out projects. Would you guys really think a wider door is necessary? Would you go with something like a 16' or match the 20' in the automotive section (which would make me lose all of my windows)?

I really appreciate the feedback so far. Keep it coming!

 

[larry_g]

Being an old fat guy I have to ask, who needs a 720' gym? Our first house was only 480'. Some one has to clean all that space, just sayin.

I've been on this site for a few years and read of a few problems with the 18'+ doors. They are heavy, expensive and prone to failure. My first shop was 30' wide with a 16' door and I could get 3 cars in side by side. My current shop below has 2 10' doors and I have no problem getting trailers backed in, tractors, crawlers, and excavators. To the guy that suggests more than a 10' door on the woodshop, what is going through that door that requires more than 10' width? What height are the doors your showing? It would seem reasonable to me that they be a bit taller than the bottom of the porch beam. That way if you clear the porch you can clear the doorway height without worry.

On the gym end consider kicking the eave up to 16' or so to give yourself a real room up on the second floor. With the low pitch roof your showing, the thickness of the flooring between the upper and lower you will not have much headroom. I suggest that you scale your drawings to figure out the head room before you decide. Maybe give up some headroom in the gym.

I'd also ask you to review what is your passion, wood work or automotive? Adjust your space accordingly.

One thing I did in my shop (below) is to put the breaker panel in the middle of the shop so that I could have shorter, easier runs to the equipment on each side of the divider wall. It has proven to be a good decision for me.

Good luck with your build

lg
no neat sig line

 

[BoWingo]

Being an old fat guy I have to ask, who needs a 720' gym? Our first house was only 480'. Some one has to clean all that space, just sayin.

Dunno, but the wife wants it. Since this whole project started at her suggestion, I'm inclined to give it to her. What she requested was a gym with a dry sauna, a bit of weight equipment, free weights, an elliptical, and room for doing yoga.

I've been on this site for a few years and read of a few problems with the 18'+ doors. They are heavy, expensive and prone to failure. My first shop was 30' wide with a 16' door and I could get 3 cars in side by side. My current shop below has 2 10' doors and I have no problem getting trailers backed in, tractors, crawlers, and excavators. To the guy that suggests more than a 10' door on the woodshop, what is going through that door that requires more than 10' width? What height are the doors your showing? It would seem reasonable to me that they be a bit taller than the bottom of the porch beam. That way if you clear the porch you can clear the doorway height without worry.

The doors are all 10' tall in my drawing, which matches the bottom of the porch beam. I agree that cars should be able to fit three-wide in that 30' section. It's really this dang theoretical lift that's messing things up. I feel like it needs to be positioned away from the wall to give enough room to work around, but then, because of the extra width that it eats up, I feel like I need more space to the other side just to get a second vehicle in. That's what pushed me to the 20' door.

On the gym end consider kicking the eave up to 16' or so to give yourself a real room up on the second floor. With the low pitch roof your showing, the thickness of the flooring between the upper and lower you will not have much headroom. I suggest that you scale your drawings to figure out the head room before you decide. Maybe give up some headroom in the gym.

I didn't explain it in my original post, but the horizontal and two vertical lines in the image of the loft represented the 6' tall and 8' tall points. I wanted to know how much area would be "hunched over" space in the loft. I really only lose 6' on each side of full-height ceiling. Here's a dimensioned version that explains it a little better:

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Of course, this is just estimated at this time because I don't yet know the exact height of the gym's ceiling joists or the construction of the trusses. I know that a step-up to 16' eaves at one end of the building adds cost as it complicates the roofline a bit. If I did decide that I wanted some more height over the loft, I wonder if it would be cheaper to step-up or just bump the height of the entire building?

I'd also ask you to review what is your passion, wood work or automotive? Adjust your space accordingly.

Good thought. I lean more toward woodworking right now, but I've always been a project-to-project kind of guy, so I don't know that I'll really focus on just one. That's something I'll keep thinking about.

One thing I did in my shop (below) is to put the breaker panel in the middle of the shop so that I could have shorter, easier runs to the equipment on each side of the divider wall. It has proven to be a good decision for me.

This is an excellent idea! Thanks for the suggestion.

Good luck with your build

Thanks, and I really appreciate all of your well thought out feedback!

 

[gnpenning]

I like it. Many good ideas already given. A few things I would add.

For the gym/living space. I would bump that wall out more under the over hang and make it 16' or 18' wide and put the extra couple feet in the shop areas. Leave some overhang if you want for a sitting area. I might even move the whole gym forward and use the area on that was that part of the gym as a paint/stain booth, dust collector room , wood storage, or ??? BTW I prefer wood storage to the sides of where you first come in and the table saw, chop saw for large material breaking down. Make sure you plan for a range vent ducting and power. Plumbing wall for sink, washer -dryer, dishwasher, etc. Really good idea for that space.

Woodshop a 10' maybe 12' wide door. Loosing wall space for a wider door for just loading and unloading material doesn't make sense to me. While I can back a trailer in the 10' like the extra space for when it's dark and snowing or raining when it's harder to see a 20' trailer behind a extended cab truck with an 8' bed.

I've done 20' doors for many with great results. One couple we did 16' for there first place. The next was 18' the last 20' and they love it. The both drive full size trucks.

Between the 2 shops I would put in double doors for moving equipment , tools , or projects between. I live in a cold climate and with the recent cold snap as a reminder that I don't want to have to raise the garage doors and go outside .

I don't know how deep the overhang is but a lot of usable enclosed space for small cost once framed. Would be nice for welding, grinding, sanding, etc as is tho.

 

[extropic]

Most, if not all, of my suggestions have been mentioned already. Just adding my vote.

Bump the front of the gym out 8' (minimum). Add gym entry door on North face of bump out. Add staircase to loft behind the gym. Staircase has landing at SE corner of building and 90* turn to maintain full headroom on stairs. Closet/storage under the stairs? I think door/window size and placement are based on aesthetics and your specific plans for the space. Personally, I'd go with 2 x 10' doors over a 20' door. Incorporate SolaTubes/skylights for ambient light and use fewer windows in the shop areas. Add clear story windows to North and East walls to gain daylight while maintaining security and shop arrangement flexibility. My most emphatic suggestions have to do with plumbing. Make the gym bathroom nearly luxurious in size. 36" door. 3'x4' minimum shower. The FIL (or whomever) may be handicapped if/when he lives there. Put a window in the bathroom. Plumb and electrical for kitchenette (sink, microwave, small electric range top, fridge). Plumb for utility sinks in both auto and wood shops. Think about acoustic isolation for the gym. Doing it up front isn't a huge deal but will make it very much nicer for all uses.

It's fun planning to spend someone else's money.

Please keep us posted on the project. Enjoy.

 

[Westozfixer]

Needs to be double the size but otherwise I like it.

 

[NUTTSGT]

I might suggest that you position the location of the bathroom near the door between the gym and wood shop. If you are working on something in the woodshop/garage, you don't want to track that throughout the gym. Maybe put a small 4x4 tile area in the entrance of the gym area, something that easy to clean and the bathroom door right off that.

You start tracking through the wife's gym, you may hear about it. . . . happy wife, happy life.

Wall space in all three sections for a TV.

 

[kwb]

The farmers porch is going to preclude being able to move bigger toys like boats and RV's. They may not be your thing now but things change.

I know my dad said he wasn't going to be one of those old guys in an RV but... guess how he now spends his winters.

 

[lakeroadster]

Along the lines of what KWB mentioned, (RV Storage), you could frame out the gable end wall for a future owner installed overhead door?

Minimal cost addition if designed into the construction.

 

[manwithtools]

Along the lines of what KWB mentioned, (RV Storage), you could frame out the gable end wall for a future owner installed overhead door?

Minimal cost addition if designed into the construction.

This is a good idea if the site lay out permits it. Just remember, a RV is easier to maneuver with lots of space. If you plan for a future gable end door just be sure you can provide space for a large driveway on that end in the future.

 

[bcoke]

IMHO the size of the auto shop will really be filled up quickly, I would suggest a 40 -24-16 breakup on the room sizes with the 36 depth.......of course if it could be larger ,say 100 x 36,than I would go 50-30-20 ,you get the idea of course I feel that if you have any long term car project they eat up a lot of room......Good luck bobbycoke

 

[ard]

One thing I see in a lot of plans, is a focus on 'front' and 'back'', with nothing on the sides...as if designed for narrow lots in a subdivision. In fact I see homes bulit on acerage, with sight lines from many sides, yet they still have a 'front elevation' that looks good and sides that are an afterthought...

so having said that, I would try to create a bit more visual interest AND functional separation between the gym/man cave/FIL quarters, by making it's 'front' around to the side. So the front entrance to a lving quarters is not next to big doors, maybe cars/trucks/tools parked, etc, etc. Could wrap the porch roof around the corner, much more visually interesting building.


or at the least put in a window or 4.

 

[Triumph8]

It looks like an awesome plan. I'm breaking ground next week on my own similar shop. So my ideas are marred by my own overthinking. My shop is the maximum my lot and budget will fit. It will be 30X60 main building with a 12X60 shed down one side. All of the shed will be enclosed except 12X12. I was going to go 12' walls on the main building but the builder told me it was only $750 to add another 2 feet in height. That would also ensure clearance for the lift. I would imagine a similar cost for you going to 16' at the eaves. I have no intention of going two stories inside but If you do that would be money well spent. If you enclosed the shed portion into the gym, it would give you quite a bit more shop or storage space and might actually be pretty cheap to do since the eve height on the metal is lower.

My 2¢.



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[Kevin54]

If it were me, I would put (2) two ten foot wide doors in where the twenty foot door is, and eliminate the windows. My garage is 28' wide x 36' deep, and the windows in the doors are more than adequate. Plus you could always put a couple of windows on the side for light.

One think to take in consideration with the garage and placement of windows is how the garage is situated to the house. I didn't see anywhere where that was addressed unless I missed it. Ideally, you don't want windows or doors where you can't see them from the house, unless they are up higher. That way a thief can't break in and no one see him doing it. Also, like ARD stated, wrap the porch around the corner of the garage on the left side so you have a roof over the man door.

On the gym side, I would eliminate (2) two of the (4) four windows. In a space that is only 20' wide, you have a 3' door, and (4) four windows. A standard window is 3' wide normally. So adding that up, that equals 15' of space taken up out of 20' leaving you 5' to divide up. That only leaves you with 1' between windows and doors.

Your drawing looks good, but I think you have some things out of proportion in relationship to the doors and windows. If your garage door is 20' and 10', it looks like your walk-in door is 2' wide and your windows are 2' wide. I think you would be more pleased with 3' windows, 3' walk-in door, and have less windows.

But like I said, that is if it were mine. I can only give an opinion as to what I would do.

I did a quick sketch showing what it would look like with the (2) ten foot doors instead of the 20' door, a few less windows, and with 5' tall windows x 3' wide.

 

[kwb]

10' wide doors are fine for cars - they **** for toys and trailers.

Single door on a shop should be no less than 12', do a 16' for a double bay, 20' in that case is overkill (and not a standard size).

Windows are over-rated. If you must, have the sill no lower than 10' to keep the walls below open for mounting things.

 

[padroo]

What kind of work are you planning on doing in the garage section?

 

[ard]

When you look at a structure and like it, you will see two things- proportion and alginment.

I have not seen great ways to deal with people doors (at 6'8" or even 8'0') and garage doors or roll ups at 10, 12 or more feet. Then there are windows- do you set the top of the window to the top of the door? or top of the garage? Is there a way to create a more distinct horizontal 'band' that captures your eye, so that the potentially uneven alignment of the doors and windows is hidden? One thing Ive been considering is a window over the people door, to align to the top of the roll up. Then maybe mounting windows to let light in aligned with the same height- maybe high enough to allow work areas, cabinets below?