Non-swivel vises

[DBArt&Design]

Hello everyone,
I'm basically new here, though I've lurked and visited for years. I have also been a member of several of the "Journal" series of web forums at varying times.
My question in this post is in regards to solid, conventional, non-swiveling type bench vises. I'd love to acquire an older one but I'm leaving my options open for something new as well. I'm new to the vintage/antique tool foray but this vise will see hard use so I'd rather abuse something new than something unique and valuable.
I've been searching for a few days now and can't seem to find a new non-swivel type bench vise. Does anyone know of someone making them? Thank you

 

[1982fxr]

Wilton. And I think Milwaukee Morgan. For USA. Won't be cheap though.

 

[DBArt&Design]

Wilton. And I think Milwaukee Morgan. For USA. Won't be cheap though.

Thanks I'll take a look! Any pics of that shovelhead FXR?

 

[tool_scrounge]

Yost has nice fixed base vises made in Taiwan too. You will get better prices searching elsewhere online though.

https://yostvises.com/collections/bench-vise

 

[tool_scrounge]

If you want to search for a used one, at least in my area Starret 4.5” fixed base vises seem to be plentifully and fairly priced. They are also built like tanks. But I have no idea where you are on the planet so I am only making generalizations.

 

[DBArt&Design]

If you want to search for a used one, at least in my area Starret 4.5” fixed base vises seem to be plentifully and fairly priced. They are also built like tanks. But I have no idea where you are on the planet so I am only making generalizations.

I'm located in Montana. I'd like something a tad bigger...5 or even 6 inch, but I've heard good things about the Starrets. All that's local for me is old Wiltons that people want (IMHO) entirely too much for.

 

[DBArt&Design]

Yost has nice fixed base vises made in Taiwan too. You will get better prices searching elsewhere online though.

https://yostvises.com/collections/bench-vise

I'll check them out too thanks! Speaking of the Starrets, a friend of mine scored a nice old Athol 614 which if I'm not mistaken is essentially a Starret, or vice-versa lol. I'm trying to get it off of him. Great old piece!

 

[tool_scrounge]

For example, here is a recent Athol (Starrett) 5” vise I picked up. 5” and above used vises seem a lot less common than 4.5”and below. But if you search, you can usually find them.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...-garage-journal.44782/page-2235#post-10128613

 

[neophyte]

Once swivel vises became common,
the vise designs changed,
so that the swivel and non-swivel vises were mostly the same,
except for the addition of a swiveling base.
If you want a non-swiveling vise, you either order the vise without the swivel base,
if that is an option,
or you remove the swivel base, and simply bolt the vise directly to the workbench surface, usually thru the holes used for the swivel base lock bolts.

Wilton vises simple have two holes on the side for the lock bolts, so Wilton vises might not be the best choice.
Morgan vises appear to have a third hole in the vise body, that sits under the dynamic jaw slide, meant for mounting the vise without the swivel base.
Yost vises look like they’re built like the Wilton vises as far as mounting.
Some of the vises also have a threaded center hole for extra strength when attached to the swivel base, and this might also be usable as a mounting point without the swivel base, although you would have to find the right type of threaded bolt, which likely wouldn’t be a standard item from a hardware store.

This video test of the Fireball vise shows how the swivel bases attach to the vise.

 

[DBArt&Design]

For example, here is a recent Athol (Starrett) 5” vise I picked up. 5” and above used vises seem a lot less common than 4.5”and below. But if you search, you can usually find them.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...-garage-journal.44782/page-2235#post-10128613

Very nice! Yes if I could land something like that it would be great! I recently scored a nice older 4" Craftsman (60s or 70s?) for $55 shipped on eBay. It's in great condition, and I have a Wilton 6 inch multipurpose that's served me well and still does, but I want one in that size category that's non-swiveling, just a heavy lump of iron that I can't damage, like that 615 Athol/Starret.

 

[DBArt&Design]

Once swivel vises became common,
the vise designs changed,
so that the swivel and non-swivel vises were mostly the same,
except for the addition of a swiveling base.
If you want a non-swiveling vise, you either order the vise without the swivel base,
if that is an option,
or you remove the swivel base, and simply bolt the vise directly to the workbench surface, usually thru the holes used for the swivel base lock bolts.

Wilton vises simple have two holes on the side for the lock bolts, so Wilton vises might not be the best choice.
Morgan vises appear to have a third hole in the vise body, that sits under the dynamic jaw slide, meant for mounting the vise without the swivel base.
Yost vises look like they’re built like the Wilton vises as far as mounting.
Some of the vises also have a threaded center hole for extra strength when attached to the swivel base, and this might also be usable as a mounting point without the swivel base, although you would have to find the right type of threaded bolt, which likely wouldn’t be a standard item from a hardware store.

This video test of the Fireball vise shows how the swivel bases attach to the vise.

Thanks for the information! I have thought of just doing away with the swivel ring and mounting the vise down solid but most I've seen just have one hole for the swivel set-bolt. Drilling another wouldn't be a problem, and using the center hole could be useful too. Might be a good option for my current Wilton because the ring is cracked.

 

[trashfire10]

My son told me I have a vise problem. I told him I didn't smoke or drink! But that's not what he meant.

So I have an extra vise to sell. It's a Reed 103, 3" jaws, fixed base, great condition with patina. Patent dates are

DEC 24 1912
AUG 11 1914

There are also some numbers stamped on the left side of the fixed part. As best I can make out, there's a 725 and a 699. These are stamped in, not cast. I don't know what they are for.

I haven't been in the vise collecting or vise selling lifestyle. I guess I just accumulated these somehow.

I just started researching prices, and I see them all over the place, so I have to look some more.

Here's a few pics. LMK if you're interested, and we can go from there.

 

[DBArt&Design]

My son told me I have a vise problem. I told him I didn't smoke or drink! But that's not what he meant.

So I have an extra vise to sell. It's a Reed 103, 3" jaws, fixed base, great condition with patina. Patent dates are

DEC 24 1912
AUG 11 1914

There are also some numbers stamped on the left side of the fixed part. As best I can make out, there's a 725 and a 699. These are stamped in, not cast. I don't know what they are for.

I haven't been in the vise collecting or vise selling lifestyle. I guess I just accumulated these somehow.

I just started researching prices, and I see them all over the place, so I have to look some more.

Here's a few pics. LMK if you're interested, and we can go from there.

Very nice little vise. I could possibly be interested but it would mostly be as a collector, as I'm looking for something larger. I have always wanted a Reed...preferably an R but this is very cool.

 

[Shiftless]

Shipping a big heavy vise is expensive. A lot of GJ members have an extra vise or three that they might sell but shipping usually kills the good deals.
Dont get too fixated on a 6 inch vise. Lots of the vintage 4 inch vises are heavier and more stoutly built than most all of the new 6 inch imports. My user vise is a 4 1/2 inch wide jaw Wilton C1 that is more than enough for anything I have ever asked it to do.

 

[seber]

If by abuse you mean beat on it, you would be better off with a modern vise made of welded steel or ductile iron. Yost would be one such manufacturer. Rigid is another. These will take a pounding without cracking.

 

[DBArt&Design]

Thanks to all comments. I'm not totally stuck on a 6 inch but I do know I want something big(ish) and on the heavy side. I currently have a Wilton 5 inch (I mistakenly called it a 6 in an earlier post...need to edit that) and know I'd like something bigger.
I don't really want or need to beat on it but I want something that will take the abuse if a situation calls for it. I've had small imports fail right when I need them most and hate those circumstances. I'm also in the market for an old post/leg vise, partly from a collector standpoint but also because that will become my "beat on it" vise.
I'm not dead-set on a vintage/antique domestic made unit...certainly open to new or newer import if it meets my needs. My main point with this post is to find, for myself and others, a compilation of stationary vises that are available. The swivel feature has come in handy on rare occasions for me, but its the first thing to fail and I have 2 swivels already... I need a large, heavy, stationary unit for just being the rock of the shop.
Yes shipping is the real kicker on the larger vises. I've probably not yet exhausted local options like marketplace but I live around a bunch of idiots who think everything they own is gold. But I'm not in a hurry and frankly don't have the $$ at the moment...I'm just learning and compiling information so please keep it coming!

 

[neophyte]

Places that sell Morgan vises usually sell the vises with the swivel bases, but you don’t have to use the swivel base.
The vises are still expensive, but you might save 35% over the cost of a Wilton.
Vise weight is around the same as a Wilson machinist vise, although Morgans use a rectangular slide rather than the round slide on the Wilton, so it’s sort of hard to compare the two.
Wilton vises are fairly common from industrial suppliers.
Morgan vises less so.
This place has various Morgan Machinist vises listed with some basic specs and prices.

Morgan Machinist Vise with Swivel Base

Milwaukee Morgan bench vise constructed of high tensile grey iron and machined to close tolerances to assure true clamping. Easily replaceable hardened steel face jaws, steel screw and malleable iron nut are provided for a lifetime of service. Swivel base locks at any angle. " Meets all Fed...

lakeerietoolworks.com

A 5” Morgan machinist vise weighs in around 90 lbs. and costs $900.
This is another source.

Milwaukee Morgan Products - Greenshields Industrial Supply

Greenshields Industrial offers industrial vices manufactured by Milwaukee Morgan with high durability tools. Call us today for inquiries.

www.gshields.com

 

[trashfire10]

I have a Morgan 400 as well as the Reed 103. The Morgan is a fixed base.

 

[trashfire10]

Shipping a big heavy vise is expensive. A lot of GJ members have an extra vise or three that they might sell but shipping usually kills the good deals.
Dont get too fixated on a 6 inch vise. Lots of the vintage 4 inch vises are heavier hand more stoutly built than most all of the new 6 inch imports. My user vise is a 4 1/2 inch wide jaw Wilton C1 that is more than enough for anything I have ever asked it to do.

I saw where someone shipped them in two USPS Flat Rate boxes.

 

[F-22]

Once swivel vises became common,
the vise designs changed,
so that the swivel and non-swivel vises were mostly the same,
except for the addition of a swiveling base.
If you want a non-swiveling vise, you either order the vise without the swivel base,
if that is an option,
or you remove the swivel base, and simply bolt the vise directly to the workbench surface, usually thru the holes used for the swivel base lock bolts.

Swivel designs were only really common in the USA, a lot less so in Europe where most vises were fixed and even designed to be bolted on the edge of the table - even new ones you can buy today.




To OP, I'm not sure how much added cost they add on international orders, but a brand new 7 inch wide Heuer is 400€ in Germany. It's forged from steel and quite indestructible. About 200€ gets you a 140mm version.

 

[neophyte]

Swivel designs were only really common in the USA, a lot less so in Europe where most vises were fixed and even designed to be bolted on the edge of the table - even new ones you can buy today.




To OP, I'm not sure how much added cost they add on international orders, but a brand new 7 inch wide Heuer is 400€ in Germany. It's forged from steel and quite indestructible. About 200€ gets you a 140mm version.

Most Euro vises,
even if made with a square or rectangular hole pattern for fixed bolting to a bench, have a rotating base as an option nowadays, and this includes both Gressel and Heuer.
Both manufacturers also make lifts for their vises, which allow the vises to be raised snd lowered in height, and rotated as well, and these accessories have been available for decades. (Probably at least 40 to 60 years or more)

The US swivel designs seem like a continuous progression in design once the side bolting tabs were done away with.
The center threaded hole in some vise designs like the Morgan and Wilton vises that fasten the vises to the swivel bases seem like a direct evolution of the older designs were the vise was both connected to a bench, and allowed to swivel on that single center bolt, by tightening or loosening a large bolt bolt or hand screw under a workbench.
At some point, someone realized that dingle center bolt wasn’t sturdy enough, or loosening or tightening the vise when rotating the vise was a pain when the nut was under the bench, so a cast iron swivel base was designed that could be rotated, tightened, and loosened with nuts on top of the vise base.
The threaded center hole in the middle of the older vise designs stayed though, and is used to hold the swivel base to the vise.
More recently designed vises tend yo lack that threaded center hole.

 

[decableguy2000]

I have 2 Morgans, swivel base is removable. Can be ordered with out one, check Zoro for some deals.

 

[F-22]

Most Euro vises,
even if made with a square or rectangular hole pattern for fixed bolting to a bench, have a rotating base as an option nowadays, and this includes both Gressel and Heuer.
Both manufacturers also make lifts for their vises, which allow the vises to be raised snd lowered in height, and rotated as well, and these accessories have been available for decades. (Probably at least 40 to 60 years or more)

Yes but they're an add on, not the norm. Gressel and Leinen and Schlegel all look VERY awkward on them and get raised up a bit too much for most regular benches.

 

[Packard V8]

The best vise bargain I ever got was a big Rock Island missing its swivel base.

With a bit of shadetree, it became a hell-for-stout fixed base. The center pivot hole is a 1"x 14 TPI, so bought a bolt in that spec. There was one 1/2" base lock hole on the right side and I drilled a matching hole on the left. With those three fasteners, the Rock Island is the most solid vise I own and it is also the least expensive.

jack vines

 

[DBArt&Design]

Thanks all, great information and resources, great conversation happening! Just what I was hoping for.
I love the look of the Hauer. My Wilton does have 2 swivel clamp bolts so I can mount it solidly without the swivel should I choose. My only issue with that is that the vise is of a rotating design, which I like, but which also betrays my requirement for a huge, immovable lump of iron. Its a weak link that can fail.
I am becoming convinced that my best bet is an old vise...I really want an old Athol/Starret, Rock Island, Columbian, or Reed R.

 

[Shiftless]

Thanks all, great information and resources, great conversation happening! Just what I was hoping for.

I am becoming convinced that my best bet is an old vise...I really want an old Athol/Starret, Rock Island, Columbian, or Reed R.

Looks like we have you hooked.
… welcome to the club

 

[DBArt&Design]

Yes for sure...seems like a great group with tons of experience and great insight.

 

[Mgdoug3]

The only difference between a Wilton Bullet fixed and swivel vise is the swivel. A fixed Bullet is just a swivel vise without a base.

 

[DBArt&Design]

So I'm narrowing it down to a couple new vises, should I opt to go that way, and on the used/vintage/antique side its a matter of knowing it when I see it.
I'm leaning very hard toward an Olsa/Capri 7" forged steel vise. It is Taiwanese but seems to be of quite good quality and is a very good value coming in under $400. The USA made vises are just too damned expensive and from alot of destructive testing videos I've been watching they aren't worth the $1K+ the manufacturers are asking. The Olsa has a couple deficiencies where they cheaped out a little but they are somewhat easily addressed from what I can surmise. The materials and basic engineering seem fairly top-notch.
Other contenders in the new category are the Brockhaus Heuer 180 and Rigid F-60. Both are manufactured in Germany and are of excellent quality. The Rigid is actually very similar in design to the Olsa/Capri. Prices seem to range between $500-$600.
The Brockhaus is of the Heuer design and the 180mm (7 inch) is in the $580 range.
While both the Ridgid and Olsa have swivel bases I'm confident both could be mounted solidly.

 

[TailGunner3000]

I personally think you are selling yourself short by not focusing on old iron. I realize the northeast is a tool rich environment, but I've personally bought multiple 6 inch vises and one 8 inch vise for less than $600, and in some cases, considerably less. Heavy duty 4 inch vises are everywhere in the $50-100 range. The Athol 614 is (in my opinion) one of the best vises ever made for general use. It's much more robust than most vises of the same jaw width and far superior to almost any new vise. And if your only option is online, there are many examples for sale at prices , including shipping, for less than your budget.

Whichever way you go, best of luck.

 

[DBArt&Design]

I personally think you are selling yourself short by not focusing on old iron. I realize the northeast is a tool rich environment, but I've personally bought multiple 6 inch vises and one 8 inch vise for less than $600, and in some cases, considerably less. Heavy duty 4 inch vises are everywhere in the $50-100 range. The Athol 614 is (in my opinion) one of the best vises ever made for general use. It's much more robust than most vises of the same jaw width and far superior to almost any new vise. And if your only option is online, there are many examples for sale at prices , including shipping, for less than your budget.

Whichever way you go, best of luck.

Oh I'm not selling myself short. My preference is for an older vise. Problem is it's not a consistent market, especially where I live. In the past month I've seen 2 go up locally on marketplace, and I think 1 of those was no-name import junk, the other was a dinky 3.5 incher.
In all honesty an old vise is probably the way I'll end up going, but I won't take a chance on an 80-100 year old vise that I can't physically inspect when I can pay the same or less for something new with a warranty. My previous post was just highlighting the new vises that are on my radar.
The 614 is great...a friend just snagged one, but ice already got a good old 4 inch and a decent newer 5 inch. I want and need something in the next size up that I can mount stationary.

 

[neophyte]

So I'm narrowing it down to a couple new vises, should I opt to go that way, and on the used/vintage/antique side its a matter of knowing it when I see it.
I'm leaning very hard toward an Olsa/Capri 7" forged steel vise. It is Taiwanese but seems to be of quite good quality and is a very good value coming in under $400. The USA made vises are just too damned expensive and from alot of destructive testing videos I've been watching they aren't worth the $1K+ the manufacturers are asking. The Olsa has a couple deficiencies where they cheaped out a little but they are somewhat easily addressed from what I can surmise. The materials and basic engineering seem fairly top-notch.
Other contenders in the new category are the Brockhaus Heuer 180 and Rigid F-60. Both are manufactured in Germany and are of excellent quality. The Rigid is actually very similar in design to the Olsa/Capri. Prices seem to range between $500-$600.
The Brockhaus is of the Heuer design and the 180mm (7 inch) is in the $580 range.
While both the Ridgid and Olsa have swivel bases I'm confident both could be mounted solidly.

The Olsa/Capri forged vises appear to mostly be just a copy of the “Ridgid”design, which has been around for decades in Germany, (since at least the early 1970s, and possibly longer).
I’m fairly certain the design can be easily mounted without the swivel base, since the swivel bases aren’t used when mounting the vises on the loft mechanisms, and the lift mechanisms usually just have a flat steel top with a couple bolt holes.

 

[DBArt&Design]

The Olsa/Capri forged vises appear to mostly be just a copy of the “Ridgid”design, which has been around for decades in Germany, (since at least the early 1970s, and possibly longer).
I’m fairly certain the design can be easily mounted without the swivel base, since the swivel bases aren’t used when mounting the vises on the loft mechanisms, and the lift mechanisms usually just have a flat steel top with a couple bolt holes.

That was kind of what I gathered too. I love that Brockhaus but from an economics standpoint the Olsa seems very hard to beat. It claims 90K psi tensile strength. Pretty stout.

 

[DBArt&Design]

The only difference between a Wilton Bullet fixed and swivel vise is the swivel. A fixed Bullet is just a swivel vise without a base.

Yes it looks like the base portion of the casting is really thick and stout.

 

[F-22]

I like Heuer for havign a fairly unique design (but still well thought out). I think it's the only one that is fully forged without welding the front jaw on the guide - though I'm certain the ridgid is welded really well...

 

[Nutria]

If you do go old iron, non-swivel vises are generally a much better deal. That swivel seems to add ~60% to the cost.

 

[neophyte]

If you do go old iron, non-swivel vises are generally a much better deal. That swivel seems to add ~60% to the cost.

Swivel jaws usually added at least 40% onto the cost of new vises when Swivel jaws were still being offered by most manufacturers.