Nugier 100 ton press refresh

[Nugier noobie]

Hi all.. I have this old Nugier 100 ton air over hydraulic press, and I wanted to get it working again. It’s been sitting outside untouched for probably four decades.

I’ve sourced a seal kit for the main cylinder, but this beast seems to be missing something. I think someone may have operated this press with an electric pump, but removed it at some point years ago.

I understand that there are three basic options: Source an air-operated hydraulic pump, source an electric hydraulic pump, or source a hand operated pump.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but all I need is a pump to make pressure, a reservoir to hold fluid, and a dump valve to release the pressure and allow fluid to flow back into the reservoir. Then it is just a matter of sizing the pump correctly as far as volume and pressure.

Wondering what my most practical option is to get this press running reliably without spending thousands of dollars. Worth noting, I absolutely do NOT need this press to make its full 100 ton rated capacity. I’m an auto mechanic, and in my two+ decades I’ve never needed anything beyond what a 20-25 ton press can do.

With all that in mind.. would a hand-operated pump be practical with a cylinder of this size? I don’t really want to have to crank it 100 times just to move the cylinder a half inch. But electric pumps are expensive, and I worry about fine control. I prefer the idea of a hand crank so I have fine control over the speed and pressure on more delicate parts.

Much appreciate any insight you all have. Thanks!

 

[Nugier noobie]

Here’s a picture of it

 

[larry_g]

https://www.youtube.com/@VintageMachinery/videos

This guy has a couple of press powering vids in the last 2 months. A first try wit one pump and the a second with a different one.

 

[tool_scrounge]

Have you contacted Nugier? They are still in business. I have a Nugier 12 ton press and it is heavier built than the 20 ton Harbor Freight press.

https://www.nugierhydraulicsprecision.com/

Here is a copy of one of their catalogs:

http://www.vintagemachinery.org/pubs/11707/23041.pdf

 

[Nugier noobie]

I haven’t contact them, no. I’m not looking to restore this press, I’m looking for advice and opinions on a cost/benefit analysis of the three different methods of operating the hydraulics on a press of this size generally. It’s not about parts sourcing.

 

[larry_g]

I haven’t contact them, no. I’m not looking to restore this press, I’m looking for advice and opinions on a cost/benefit analysis of the three different methods of operating the hydraulics on a press of this size generally. It’s not about parts sourcing.

How can you do a cost benefits analysis if you don't include the cost of bringing back to working condition with factory parts? It looks like a lot of the controls are there.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Nugier noobie]

Because I’m not necessarily going to retain these factory controls, especially if I convert to hand pump. Hence when I wanted to hear from people who have experience with the different methods and what works best and comparing costs amongst them.

 

[Sporker]

I have no experience "...with the different methods and what works best and comparing costs amongst them". but I'll do a little of the work for you and share what I have learned for others reading the thread. Actually, I have a funny story to share, only vaguely related to this thread. I'll get to that in a moment.

I just bought an almost identical unit at auction this weekend. These Nugier presses are really well built, 2600 pounds compared to 1650 even for a 100 ton Enerpac at $23k.

A few specs: Cylinder diameter is 6" and stroke is 14". The stock pump on the Nugier presses looks like it goes to ~7000psi to acheive 100 tons of force. If my calculations are correct. that is a volume of ~400 cubic inches, or 28.26 cubic inches per inch of stroke. Some commonly available two stage pumps of the ~3000psi variety have a first stage displacement around 1 cubic inch, meaning you would not "have to crank it 100 times just to move the cylinder a half inch" to get the ram extended to the work. However, the high pressure stage might roughly be .25 cubic inches, in which case you would have ~56 strokes per .5" travel. There are also electrically powered units that would work with this press. The thing is, both hand pumps and motorized pumps are expensive if sourced from USA, and cheap if sourced from over seas.

That brings me to my somewhat off topic but funny story segue:

Many years ago on a trip to Kenedy Space Center, a group of us were eating wings and drinking beer at Frankies Wings, which was a notorius place at the time. At a table next to us were several guys, one of whom was said to be a big wig in the military. They joined us and after a while the military dude had challenged each of us at our table to go outside and fight in the parking lot. He was boasting about what a badass he was and all kinds of drunk big talk. During the conversation, he had mentioned that he was in second place in the national king fishing tournament. My counterpart asked him what kind of reels he used. "Why I use Shimano reels. They are the best that money can buy" he said.

Counterpart, "You mean you use Japanese reels to catch AMERICAN fish? I have nothing against Japanese reels, or drunk military dudes that want to fight for no reason, but I pulled a muscle I was laughing so hard.

End of segue.

In my opinion, putting a cheap overseas pump on a well built press like this would be like using Japanese reels to catch American fish. Well, sorta, I uderstand we are talking a difference in quality here, but at least I got to share my story. Apologies for the brief hijack.

What you may not know about the stock Nugier pump is that it has a fast mode that moves the ram down quickly with air pressure, and then the hydraulic pressure side takes over and moves slower when higher force is needed. Some air over hydraulic units work this way, many others seem to be very slow to move the ram during extension to the work proximity and is a very common complaint in reviews. Yours looks to be complete, and you might be able to get it working, and working nicer that a retrofit, for far less than the thousands of dollars you are expecting.

There is a thread on the Welding Design and Fabrication site that gives some interesting details of the pump patent, and of course a youtube video demonstrating the performance of this pump system.

The system on mine is almost exactly like yours, and I'll be contacting Nugier to see if they have a manual and parts diagram etc. If possible, I intend to keep it.

I can post a closer picture of my system if it will help you should you decide to keep the current set up. I'm not sure if there is a minimum post quota before being able to post pictures.

Scott

 

[All]

Scott ( @Sporker )

Thank you for "doing a little (actually a lot) of work for the OP and sharing what (you) have learned for others (like me) reading the thread."

I don't have a Nugier press, but I really enjoyed reading your "brief hijack" and your calculations of cylinder diameter, stroke, volume, pressure, and travel.

You might find the attitude in the OP's Craiglist ad attempting to sell this press somewhat enlightening, if not a bit ironic.

 

[Nugier noobie]

Scott ( @Sporker )

Thank you for "doing a little (actually a lot) of work for the OP and sharing what (you) have learned for others (like me) reading the thread."

I don't have a Nugier press, but I really enjoyed reading your "brief hijack" and your calculations of cylinder diameter, stroke, volume, pressure, and travel.

You might find the attitude in the OP's Craiglist ad attempting to sell this press somewhat enlightening, if not a bit ironic.

The irony of your post is that his reply was the kind of reply I was looking for. It wasn’t a hijack at all. I’m disappointed with myself that I somehow missed it when he first posted it. It was quite helpful.

Anyone who has used craigslist for a while understands the frustration of dealing with idiots who don’t know what they’re looking at and do not care about wasting people’s time, especially in more recent years (the smartphone era where NOBODY actually reads ads before they respond and they put zero thought or effort into their replies). I’ve probably averaged 2-3 transactions a week via craigslist for nearly 20 years now. I’ve learned how to weed out the idiots and time-wasters. Unfortunately, I’ve had the same trouble with forums of all kinds over the years, where I ask specific questions and give lots of info, but some people just gloss over the words and give canned generic answers. Sometimes they complain about how long my posts are (wHo WaNtS tO rEaD aLl THAT??) Then people get upset when someone calls them out for it. Almost like mediocrity is the rule of the day. It’s an endless battle. Same thing with most of the guys at auto parts stores now. No ability to think outside the box - if they can’t look it up by year/make/model they are LOST. If you bring in some oddball hose or fitting or something you’re trying to make custom, they are totally clueless. And yet they work at an auto parts store. It boggles the mind.

I will receive plenty of predictable flak for this post as well, just as so many times before. I say what needs to be said and what many people need to hear, then people start yapping about anger management and any number of other childish retorts that benefit no one and add nothing to the discussion. Like your needlessly antagonistic post. But I know I’m fighting a losing battle. Nothing will change whatsoever.

Scott, thanks for the helpful post. I do appreciate it.