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Old-Style Battery Charger: How Do You Determine Fully Charged Point?

PastTense

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Joined
Jun 1, 2013
Messages
4
I have an ESB Brands Sure-Start BE-10B battery charger (perhaps from the 1960s or so) which does Not have the automatic shut-off like current models. It is a 10 amp, 550 watt boost, 6 volt/12 volt charger. It says "Do Not Overcharge battery (see instructions)" and naturally I have no instructions. So what are the instructions as to when it is fully charged and should be disconnected?

Thanks.

PS. Anyone know anything about the manufacturer (ESB Brands located in Cleveland) and when it was manufactured?
 
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gdh33

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Sep 7, 2011
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Northern Ontario, Canada
Most lead acid batteries are charged to a certain voltage, I think 13.7V is safe for most applications. Your battery will say, or google it. So measure the voltage of the battery occasionally with the charger off and then when you get the voltage you want (13.7V for example) disconnect the charger and measure the battery voltage after using it or 24hrs. Should be 12.8V for a full charge.

Google "Battery University" there is tons of information on batteries and charging.
 

crab

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Jan 8, 2015
Messages
940
Most of them have an amp gauge, when it doesn't read anything it's charged.
 

Kevin54

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I have an old charger of y dads, and when it gets down to around 3 on the gauge, the battery is charged. I've never had to let it go down to zero. My dad had an Econoline pickup years back, and he had the charger on it and forgot to unplug it. He actually blowed the battery up. The battery was in behind the drivers seat. Although he tried cleaning everything, it didn't take too long for the battery acid to eat a lot of stuff up.

If it's something that you actually are worried about, just get a new charger with an automatic shutoff. I never leave a battery on a charger overnight. I will put one on, and if the battery isn't charged in a couple of hours, then normally it's time for a new battery.
 

nehog

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Jaffrey, NH
Most of them have an amp gauge, when it doesn't read anything it's charged.

Not a good way to do it as if the regulation is poor on the charger, it will over charge before current drops to zero.

The correct way, as mentioned above, is measure voltage, when it hits 13.7 to 14.0 volts, it's done.
 

Dick in Wisconsin

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Shawano, Wisconsin
Those old chargers MUST BE MONITORED. As pointed out above, they will charge and charge and charge. Eventually they will cook the battery (and its NO GOOD) or you could have a catastrophic event.

The new chargers appear to be reasonably priced. Consider getting one of the new smart ones. As I understand it, they will shut off when the battery is fully charged.
 

Stuart in MN

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Minneapolis
In the old days I imagine they periodically checked the battery's specific gravity with a hydrometer while charging. Once the numbers rose to the correct level, the battery was fully charged.
 

robalmal

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Triabunna Tasmania Australia
In the old days I imagine they periodically checked the battery's specific gravity with a hydrometer while charging. Once the numbers rose to the correct level, the battery was fully charged.

That is spot on. It is the way I was trained as an apprentice. We sometimes had a bank of several batteries charging at the same time. When the float in the hydrometer rose to the top,in all the cells, it was charged. If one cell did not come up the battery was dead.
Nowadays, most batteries are sealed and you cannot access the individual cells.
 

Flivver250

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Messages
797
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Florida/Dubai
I use the timer on the old Schumacher charger when set on 10 amps or more. If the battery is flat and I am in no rush, I set it on 2 amps and let it go overnight. I also store my batteries on trickle chargers. Now you got me thinking about getting a new charger. Damn you guys.
 

jkwilson

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Dec 5, 2012
Messages
758
Location
SW Indiana
Disclosure: I'm an engineer who worked in the battery industry for about 11 years.

Specific gravity is the real indicator. To accurately determine full charge you run until all cells are at the specified SG for that battery.

That's fairly inconvenient though, so most of the time you charge until the battery draws less than 1A with a charging voltage below 15V.

You can't rely on voltage. A 10A charger will raise battery voltage to 13.7V before the battery is even half charged.

In the US at least, sealed flooded cell batteries have become somewhat rare. Before about 2006 they were fairly common, but around that time there was a consolidation in the battery industry spurred by serious environmental liability from having battery manufacturing plants, and after that the true "maintenance free" flooded cells all but disappeared. Many batteries say "Maintenance Free*", but when you check the * you find it says "In normal operation", and the vent caps are actually removable. These batteries have some features to reduce water consumption making them likely to give good service without adding water. Like anything else, you'll usually get a longer life if you do check the water.

A trickle charger can overcharge a battery fairly easily. They run a constant 2A regardless of the state of charge of the battery. For maintaining a charge, you either want a float charger, which maintains a voltage slightly above the battery voltage or a timed charger which cycles on periodically, typically once a day, and checks the current draw by the battery when the charger applies a voltage. If the battery draws more than about an amp, the charger remains on until the current drops, then it goes back to sleep.


Older chargers are best used to boost a battery back to the point it can go back into service where the vehicle charging system can finish the charge. If you want to fully charge a battery from a charger, a "Smart" or multi-stage charger is the best option.

There are a lot of decent chargers. I use one of these to keep the batteries charged in mowers and equipment during the winter. I swap it to a different battery every Sunday so everything is recharged once a month. I use a big Schumacher with boost for bring dead batteries up to usable when I leave a key on or something else happens.

None of this applies to AGM batteries, which are a different technology and have different charging requirements.
 
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White 99

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Northern CA
Disclosure: I'm an engineer who worked in the battery industry for about 11 years.




There are a lot of decent chargers. I use one of these to keep the batteries charged in mowers and equipment during the winter. I swap it to a different battery every Sunday so everything is recharged once a month.


What is the float voltage that you get with that charger? I had one but returned it because it had a float charge over 14.5 volts.
 

MBfreak

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Dec 10, 2010
Messages
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Location
Linkoping , Sweden
A lead-acid sealed or nonsealed battery can be sharged as follows. To do it with an "old-school" charger ( ie basically unregulated) requires a variac to feed the charger and Volt and Ammeters.
A better way is to use a controlled smart charger.

1 Charge at a low current ( < 200 mA) until the terminal voltage goes above 11 V. This way you will know that one cell is not shorted. '
2 Go to constant current bulk charge at Ah/10 Amps.
3 When terminal voltage reaches 14,25 Vm switch to constant voltage charge at 14,25 V.
4 Current will drop off gradually while voltage stays at 14,25.
5 When current has dropped to 10% of constant current value(2 above) the battery is fully charged with minimal gassing. Switch voltage setpoint t0 13,8 V

VERY tedious, get a smart charger or build one. Get the UC 3906 chip, it will work great.

Best regards

Want the schematic. PM with an email adress will send pdf

Ola
 

sliprig

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
17
Location
Indiana
Disclosure: I'm an engineer who worked in the battery industry for about 11 years.

Specific gravity is the real indicator. To accurately determine full charge you run until all cells are at the specified SG for that battery.

That's fairly inconvenient though, so most of the time you charge until the battery draws less than 1A with a charging voltage below 15V.

You can't rely on voltage. A 10A charger will raise battery voltage to 13.7V before the battery is even half charged.

In the US at least, sealed flooded cell batteries have become somewhat rare. Before about 2006 they were fairly common, but around that time there was a consolidation in the battery industry spurred by serious environmental liability from having battery manufacturing plants, and after that the true "maintenance free" flooded cells all but disappeared. Many batteries say "Maintenance Free*", but when you check the * you find it says "In normal operation", and the vent caps are actually removable. These batteries have some features to reduce water consumption making them likely to give good service without adding water. Like anything else, you'll usually get a longer life if you do check the water.

A trickle charger can overcharge a battery fairly easily. They run a constant 2A regardless of the state of charge of the battery. For maintaining a charge, you either want a float charger, which maintains a voltage slightly above the battery voltage or a timed charger which cycles on periodically, typically once a day, and checks the current draw by the battery when the charger applies a voltage. If the battery draws more than about an amp, the charger remains on until the current drops, then it goes back to sleep.


Older chargers are best used to boost a battery back to the point it can go back into service where the vehicle charging system can finish the charge. If you want to fully charge a battery from a charger, a "Smart" or multi-stage charger is the best option.

There are a lot of decent chargers. I use one of these to keep the batteries charged in mowers and equipment during the winter. I swap it to a different battery every Sunday so everything is recharged once a month. I use a big Schumacher with boost for bring dead batteries up to usable when I leave a key on or something else happens.

None of this applies to AGM batteries, which are a different technology and have different charging requirements.

Somebody got it right, not an engineer but 37+ years in the battery industry.
 

Strouty

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Mar 21, 2010
Messages
38,224
Location
Southern Maine
I need to look into this with my forklift. It is 24 volt and has an old charger that just uses amps as far as I can tell.

The thing I don't understand is when I try and use it to charge my batteries in my 24 volt military truck, it kicks off quickly and then makes noises that I never hear when charging the forklift. I thought it was my slave plug, but then I went directly to the batteries with jumper cables and it did the same thing.

Batteries have always confused me and I am sure I have either gotten rid of some before their time or prematurely caused their demise.
 

Charles (in GA)

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Jan 11, 2006
Messages
12,489
Location
50 mi south of Atlanta
Any thought about using a heady duty appliance time for a set time and then check the SG?
Say two hours?

Then see where it stands?

I have a simple 24 hr settleable lamp timer on my chargers. The type you plug lamps into while on vacation. It has pins set to turn it off, but not on. I manually switch it on and set it so it will run 12 hrs or so. If I forget it, it shuts off and stays off till I get back to it.

I have a trickle charger on a generator battery in a community well house. It is set to allow 30 mins of charge a day. Thats it. Prior to the timer, it charged as it saw fit, till the battery shorted internally and the charger went max for days on end. After that incident, I put the timer on it. The battery is now about 8 years old and still going strong (wal-mart motorcycle battery).

Charles
 
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