Opinions on foundation work

[92stang5oh]

Sorry in advance for the long post. I recently started working on my garage after months of planing and paper work and am having some issues with my mason. I think his work is extremely sloppy and needs to get redone, but he keeps saying I don't know what I'm talking about and am being too picky. Wanted to get some outside opinions. The second day they spent working on the foundation they got the size of the garage door wrong on the back wall. It was an inch too narrow, not the end of the world. I told them it was okay but to follow the drawings for the rest of it. The next day they started working on the left wall which in the words of their head mason "looks like the Atlantic Ocean". Not only was its a few inches off from being level, it wasn't even close to being plumb. I had a surveyor mark the elevation at each corner but the mason decided to eye ball it instead. Rather then redo the whole wall they took the top two courses off and re-did them. It is now some what level but still not plumb. To level it out they cut a bunch of wedges and put them in the middle of the wall. On the right wall they forgot to leave an opening for the entry door and didn't run the conduit where they were directed. They also had to use a bunch of wedges on the right wall to level it out. The garage was supposed to be 25' by 26'. The walls they built are 25', 25'-1/4", 26' and 26'-7/8" None of the corners are square and none of the joints are even. Some blocks are touching leaving zero room for mortar while others have close to 2 inches between them. Let me know what you guys think. Thanks in advance.

 

[ford33]

I would stop work now and have a discussion with the mason and general contractor. It is easy to fix now. This looks like sub-standard work to me.

 

[Bondo]

Ayuh,.... How much money of yer's do they have,..??

I'm with ford, Stop the work, Right Now,...

That's the worst I've ever seen,....

Masons that never heard of string-lines,..??

 

[OccupantRJ]

Run him off. That is trash work.

 

[matt_i]

Really sketchy.

 

[JCByrd24]

I had never done block work before and did my own stem wall, it looks significantly better than this.

 

[peterl]

You cant fire that crew fast enough! worst ever.

 

[92stang5oh]

Thanks for the quick responses, glad to know its not just me. I've tried talking with him about the work and he basically says that I have no clue what I'm talking about and have never seen a foundation in progress. He goes on and on about how he does at least 10 foundations a year for multi million dollar houses and this is normal. Says once it covered in plaster no one will ever see it. So far he has $6,875 ($1,250 deposit prior to start and $5,625 deposit at the start of the work). As of our last conversation today I told him he has tomorrow to make it right or he will not be back on my property.

 

[DTE]

Did he poor the footing also ? it must be off to for him to be using the wedge cut block.

 

[peterl]

You cant fire that crew fast enough! worst ever.

 

[92stang5oh]

Yes, he poured the footing and did all the digging. I should have known something was off they just eye balled the level of the footing as it was poured.

 

[matt_i]

Anyone setting up footing-forms these days without a rotary laser level is doing something wrong in my opinion.

 

[bczygan]

Give them (In writing) an opportunity to completely redo it, or have it redone.

If they don't respond in a specified time, fire them, and using the money you haven't paid them, and the performance bond that they provided, to have it removed and redone.

Oh you didn't require a performance bond, and you already paid them something?

Shame on YOU!

Bill

 

[DTE]

Man I hate it for you, that is pretty sad looking. The out of level footing is not that big of a deal had it been addressed on the first course, but the walls are for sure going to be out of square and the rest of the work is substandard for sure. It would be some kind of lick to take but you would be better off starting over.

 

[Hilltopmasonry]

3rd generation Mason contractor here. I must say that yes that is some pretty sloppy work. I dont like all of the pieces but will say that yes it will be buried and you wont see it but very sloppy work. As a contractor i would not allow my guys to do **** work like that. I dont like the pieces and hog mortar joints in your foundation. From the looks of it you have up to 1 inch mortar joints and that is a unacceptable. Big mortar joints is a weakness. I really dont understand all of the different heights in the coarses. Alot easier if you start out level from the beginning. It is also unacceptable to be a half a bubble off level. Yes it will be buried but common now. It is easy to be laying block and forget about a doorway thats an easy fix but a time and money waster

 

[boobag]

wow. that looks pretty bad. i'd be upset.

 

[joes169]

As a masonry contractor that does 5-20 garage foundations like this any give year, that's terrible work, and no one on that site is a "mason" by any stretch of the imagination.

It actually takes a lot longer to lay the wall the way they did than actually laying it correctly. Ripped block? Footings that far out of level? The bond makes no rhyme or reason, it's nearly impossible to get an 8" wide wall on 1/4 bond, but they figured a way out to do it? 2" head joints to zero heads?

I've seen some hack jobs done by masons in my life, this one is done by someone other than masons.......

BTW, cores should be filled at EVERY anchor bolt, or the bolts aren't doing anything. Technically, there should be dowels into the footing at those cores as well, but I'm sure there isn't. I wouldn't be surprised if the yahoos plug the bottom courses with block pieces or the empty mort bags to save grout. The pilasters should also have a full length rebar in them, from footing to top of wall. Lastly, you're going to need to use a full width treated plate on top of the wall now too, as they apparently don't know what cap block are...........

 

[fury9]

I agree in the shoddy work. I have a couple things to point out though, a speed square in the corner is not a good way to tell if something like that's square, do a 3,4,5 or bigger. A torpedo level isn't the greatest either, get a bigger level 4'

 

[James-W]

If the foundation is poured wrong, you have even more problems. I would stop the work and have another contractor, a known good one, come in and give his opinion. You really need to get this whole thing ironed out right away before any further work is done.

 

[DTE]

The easiest way to check if things are square would be get an exact measurement from corner to corner , they should be the same , I bet if you check yours it will be off by a mile Pull your tape so it would form a X across the building..

 

[Bluedodge]

Looks like ****.

 

[dynahoe]

I feel for you. That looks like they are learning as they go. they need to "go" off your property. Cut your losses and start over

 

[Slowgsr]

It's unfortunate, you paid them too much.
Legit companies can float jobs small jobs, it's typical

I hope you paid the GC and not the mason directly. Who hired whom?

 

[Conner]

How did you find these jokers?

 

[jrsulo]

I feel sorry for you and those many million dollar homes that are sitting on **** like this !!!!!,,,,,,,Where are you located ??

 

[emtmark]

Oh my lord!! Dealing with contractors can be trying but the minute one tells you that you (the money) doesn't know what's right or wrong I stop work. It's insulting, disrespectful, and shows that he doesn't have your best interests in mind.

Contractors that educate and explain will get my hard earned money all day long and with fast good work sometimes a bonus. Folks do stuff themselves when they can because of guys like this that do **** work. There's been more good honest contractors than bad but the bad ones can really leave a sour taste in your mouth.


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[Big Bad Dad]

The easiest way to check if things are square would be get an exact measurement from corner to corner , they should be the same , I bet if you check yours it will be off by a mile Pull your tape so it would form a X across the building..

THIS is correct!

 

[readhead]

Not correct. Checking diagonals only works if the ends are equal length and the sides are equal length. If for instance one end was 2" narrower than the other and the sides are equal the diagonals could be equal.

 

[jeepinerdeep]

Yowza. I think I would shut that jobsite down. Was he drunk?

 

[Karvette]

Does this clown have a license? Where are you located? I have been a mason since 1964 and a mason contractor since my father retired in 1986. The slop you have shown in your photos was not done by a mason. I have labors that would do better work than what you have. Your job looks like jobs I have seen done by non lic. boot trunk operators. Over the years I have had to fix many screwed up jobs done by this type of fly by night operations.

It also appears that you have been overcharged. I my state the most I can collect up front is 1/3 of the contract price, balance due on completion. It sounds like you have already paid about 50% of the price.

If you had real masons on the job the work I see would have been completed in 2 days with supervision and 3 men. That includes footings and the block walls.

I hope for your sake this is only a foundation to be framed above. If this is a masonry garage, you need a real mason contractor not a bunch of boots.

 

[rburke65]

Wow. My father worked in an office running payroll and did beautiful masonry work. That job is a shame. I'd stop them now.

 

[92stang5oh]

As a masonry contractor that does 5-20 garage foundations like this any give year, that's terrible work, and no one on that site is a "mason" by any stretch of the imagination.

It actually takes a lot longer to lay the wall the way they did than actually laying it correctly. Ripped block? Footings that far out of level? The bond makes no rhyme or reason, it's nearly impossible to get an 8" wide wall on 1/4 bond, but they figured a way out to do it? 2" head joints to zero heads?

I've seen some hack jobs done by masons in my life, this one is done by someone other than masons.......

BTW, cores should be filled at EVERY anchor bolt, or the bolts aren't doing anything. Technically, there should be dowels into the footing at those cores as well, but I'm sure there isn't. I wouldn't be surprised if the yahoos plug the bottom courses with block pieces or the empty mort bags to save grout. The pilasters should also have a full length rebar in them, from footing to top of wall. Lastly, you're going to need to use a full width treated plate on top of the wall now too, as they apparently don't know what cap block are...........

They plugged as much as they could with broken pieces and extra mortar. They did not use any dowels or rebar in the foundation, just when they poured the footing.

 

[gregtwojeeps]

Wow, what a mess, my condolences to the OP. ... Hindsight is 20/20 we know and we live our lives and THEN get the lessons... ***** sometimes...

 

[Kevin54]

There are so many fails in that foundation. I would fire the crew in a heartbeat. Hopefully you haven't paid them yet. And make sure you document everything with pictures because it will end up in court.

Can it be saved? No. Not with wedges, not with slivers of block. It has to be taken down and started over. Why? Because it appears they don't have the size of anything correct, this shows by the small block they have to put in to fill the void. Even on a ******* size foundation, at the most you only have to cut 2 blocks, and not a bunch to use as fillers.

Did they start with the corners and set them first, then run their line to maintain straightness and level? Is the footer even level? They should have set pins every so often so they could pour the footers to the top of the pins. Once your footer is level, then they can adjust ever so slightly with the first layer of mortar and block. Then they should check level as they go along. A good mason will always have his level with him. He will check for plumb and level as he goes along.

If I'm correct, they started at one end and started laying block and never set their corners first. This would let things start to run off drastically. they should have set up batter boards, set their corners at the set dimension of the building, and filled in a block at the end of their course run. This block would be set between two blocks. Then you start your next course. Another sure fire way to tell they don't know what they are doing is their vertical joints from course to course. The joints of one course should be in the middle of a full block, and not offset to one side like you show in pic #2 and #4. A couple of blocks are almost sitting on top of one another. The reason for having a full block, then the next block sitting on only half of the full block is for structural integrity. This has been compromised with their shoddy work.

Don't get taken to the cleaners with their ******** excuses. If anything, get the inspector in there now before things get backfilled. He will reject it for sure. I think a drunk monkey could have done a better job than these guys. Get it rejected by the inspector right away and shove that in their face. Let them tell the inspector that he doesn't know what he's talking about.

Good Luck and keep us posted. I feel for ya man!!!

 

[Kevin54]

Thanks for the quick responses, glad to know its not just me. I've tried talking with him about the work and he basically says that I have no clue what I'm talking about and have never seen a foundation in progress. He goes on and on about how he does at least 10 foundations a year for multi million dollar houses and this is normal. Says once it covered in plaster no one will ever see it. So far he has $6,875 ($1,250 deposit prior to start and $5,625 deposit at the start of the work). As of our last conversation today I told him he has tomorrow to make it right or he will not be back on my property.

I should have read everything first, but in lieu of that, take picture after picture after picture, because you will have to take this jackwad to court. You have paid him for everything 100%.

Here is what I paid to have my foundation put up. I did all the transit work and setting of the pins for a level footer:

415 block including 94 termite block - $1000.00
10 yds footer concrete - $1126.13
Labor for block - $1350.00

Total - $3476.13

Now this was for a 28'x36' garage addition and a 7'x24' bumpout. Also this doesn't include digging the footers or the rental of the mini excavator, but that would be around $1000 if that much.

 

[CJ7VFR]

That is one ugly job.

In a few of your pictures, it appears that there is no mortar between some of the joints in the rows of blocks.

Is this just an optical illusion? Or did they actually forget to put mortar there?.

If you look at the right side of this wall, at the top, and also at the bottom row of blocks in the center, it looks like there are joints with no mortar:

Jim

 

[joes169]

They plugged as much as they could with broken pieces and extra mortar. They did not use any dowels or rebar in the foundation, just when they poured the footing.

Every state has different codes, but even here in WI, we have to anchor down to the footing for high wind conditions. I wonder wht code is in your area, and if the building inspector has anything to say about it.........

 

[slickgt1]

Dayamn. That is pretty bad. I usually don't reply to structural effups like this, but this time I had to.

There is no way this guy is making foundation for million dollar homes and getting away with this. Get a real mason to see that right away. You are getting shafted, paying top dollar for zero skill.

 

[Jess]

I'm speechless after looking closely at the pics. I'd be ashamed to admit to having done that work given its supposed to be pro work. When the set up the corners for the first couple of courses, they could have fixed the footing level issue on the initial course of blocks with a string between the corners. Plumb is easy as you go up from there. The mortar should also be tooled to make it tight and ensure there are no voids visible. I am no mason, but when I built my storage barn, two side were into a hill and I did 8 courses of block, 32 and 40ft in 6 days, on my own. If he claims to do foundations on million dollar homes, I'd like to see that because my amateur work is near perfect by comparison. I hope you can get this resolved or at least not end up paying.

 

[FordTruckWench]

In the second and fourth pictures: They've placed a corner block in middle of the run around the area of the missing door. And then at the opening that I assume is for the garage door, they've placed a half corner block backwards. The groove on the end is exposed. It should have been turned around so that the groove can hold some mortar.

Your "masons" must be related to the crew that did the foundation of my house. (I'm the second owner.) The portion that is essentially a slab is fine. However, the half that is a crawl space has the long stepped wall climb the grade about 4 inches. The short end wall really shows the error as all the block courses curve upwards to the corner. This error started with an incorrectly poured footer. A smart crew would have fixed the problem in the first course. Instead they left it for the carpenters to fix!

I'd suggest firing the crew, demoing everything, and starting over.