Hello all, looking for an oscilloscope for my use as n Auto tech. I do mostly drivability and electrical work so a quality unit is a must. Shop already has a Snap-on Zeus and I've been using that as of late. Should mention I have a Launch Scopebox I acquired for a song, but do not have the PAD II that is required to use it, I have a Marco MaxGo and it is also incompatible. Looking t maybe Pico 4425, but was wondering if there's better options
Oscilloscope recommendations
- Thread starter HEMI-D
- Start date
American Locomotive
Well-known member
Are you looking for an all in one scope scan tool, etc... or a dedicated scope?
Bigmeat
Well-known member
Look at Pico.
vssjim
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Like stated above Pico seems to be the best at this time for a affordable price
GTA Matt
Well-known member
4425
I personally like my Vantage Ultra for the connector database and because it was cheaper than a Pico and I don’t need to drag a computer to the car I’m diagnosing. But as a full time technician with a bay and access to service info, the Pico is so superior to the other choices if you can afford it just do it.
Pico, Using a PC is an advantage generally as on one anyway for wiring info,part lookup etc etc.
I use a used surface pro I picked up off ebay for 120bucks and have the pico on it's own dedicated trolley .
All in one scopes/scanners lack something such as not being able bi-directionally control something while viewing the scope, ideally want both in time to cover all scenarios.
Pico and a Windows platform netbook/touchpad is invaluable in diagnostics and research, amount of decent scan software available too such as delphi, SSM and other open source import diagnostic platforms etc etc for windows makes the windows netbook/touchpad useful cheap tool to compliment a technician massively.
Would like see other diagnostic manufacturers go to software and dongle package and you just use a tablet or netbook.
I use a used surface pro I picked up off ebay for 120bucks and have the pico on it's own dedicated trolley .
All in one scopes/scanners lack something such as not being able bi-directionally control something while viewing the scope, ideally want both in time to cover all scenarios.
Pico and a Windows platform netbook/touchpad is invaluable in diagnostics and research, amount of decent scan software available too such as delphi, SSM and other open source import diagnostic platforms etc etc for windows makes the windows netbook/touchpad useful cheap tool to compliment a technician massively.
Would like see other diagnostic manufacturers go to software and dongle package and you just use a tablet or netbook.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
PICO's are great, but they are EXTREMELY OVER PRICED !! 
Some of the older Snap-On "graphing multimeters" are actually pretty decent but, even used, they are over priced !
Most automotive 'scopes are handheld (Pico is NOT), are battery operated and usually designed to take a 4' fall to a cement floor. The handheld ones have a fairly small screen. You are paying BIG TIME EXTRA for "easy to use" features. If you are willing to be connected to 120VAC and accept that a 4' fall may be fatal and you don't need the "I'll hold your hand" features, then there are good 4 channel, "bench" 'scopes out there for under $500 !
Some of the older Snap-On "graphing multimeters" are actually pretty decent but, even used, they are over priced !
Most automotive 'scopes are handheld (Pico is NOT), are battery operated and usually designed to take a 4' fall to a cement floor. The handheld ones have a fairly small screen. You are paying BIG TIME EXTRA for "easy to use" features. If you are willing to be connected to 120VAC and accept that a 4' fall may be fatal and you don't need the "I'll hold your hand" features, then there are good 4 channel, "bench" 'scopes out there for under $500 !
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
Blue Driver.
They have the right marketing strategy, but just have not been able to "crack" into the top tier.
Personally, I always wondered where all of the "professional" $$$$ diagnostic tools get there data from to build there test and talk to the various modules.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
^ I would like see autel do software and dongle approach for android and window platforms.
Picoscope does not need 120v power supply as takes power from the USB port and you use a netbook or tablet with battery .
Pico is overpriced but it so easy use which big time and hassle saver and very in tune to auto diagnostics.
compared to snapon it no more expensive.
I don't really see an issue with durability Mine been dropped from waist height no issues and with sensible use/storage it seems fine in shop and mobile .
Would like see more competition in auto scope tools .
Picoscope does not need 120v power supply as takes power from the USB port and you use a netbook or tablet with battery .
Pico is overpriced but it so easy use which big time and hassle saver and very in tune to auto diagnostics.
compared to snapon it no more expensive.
I don't really see an issue with durability Mine been dropped from waist height no issues and with sensible use/storage it seems fine in shop and mobile .
Would like see more competition in auto scope tools .
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
I think PICO is going to run into a technology obsolescence issue in the near future ! I have to believe that some of the ICs they are using have already been discontinued. They may have bought a few thousand, but that is not going to last forever !
mrjaw14
Well-known member
Check out LabNation SmartScope. It's a really good deal for the money. I have one and love it. If you outgrow it you can always pony up for Pico later. It works with PC, Mac, Android, etc. So you can keep the thing with you and have an O-Scope with you all the time if you wanted.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
LabNation could "eat PICO's lunch" with a few tweaks of their product. Some more friendly software with pre-set for various types of probes, deeper/longer buffer and a true 4 channel operation.
Coming from a EE background, I would like to see a 10/12 bit A-to-D and a faster sample rate, but those probably are not required for automotive work !
American Locomotive
Well-known member
If you're looking for a dedicated scope, I would recommend an electronics scope like a Rigol 1054z. It basically completely blows any "automotive" scope out of the water.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
It is a good bench scope but 1) requires 120VAC and 2) not drop resistant.
The price is right !
Check out the forums on IATN. You will get better advice there as it relates to automotive
True, but you could get a Rigol DS1054Z, 2 more for spares, and still have some cash left over for the price of one Picoscope 4425.
American Locomotive
Well-known member
The 120 VAC is definitely a hindrance, but the Rigol does not require much power so a little inverter would work.
The laptop required to make a picoscope work isn't exactly drop resistant either.
...and the Rigol 1054z has over twice the bandwidth and sampling speed compared to the Pico 4425.True, but you could get a Rigol DS1054Z, 2 more for spares, and still have some cash left over for the price of one Picoscope 4425.
GTA Matt
Well-known member
What are you guys working on in an automotive application where a pico isn't 'fast' enough? If there was a better automotive platform then the pico, I'm sure more people would be using it. Between its ease of use, portability, after the capture interpretation, waveform library, ease of file sharing, help and support, the pico really doesn't leave much to be desired. Anybody can download the software on any computer platform, even right on your scanner if you desired. You can send the psd files right through facebook messenger for a friend to review. Most guys don't care about cost, it's a drop in the bucket compared to what someone purchasing one already owns in tools. So when a company comes out with a better all of the above, I'm sure they'll sell a bunch. Even the ATS e-scope never took off like the pico, although it is used by techs and industry trainers. If you go to any automotive training event, you'll be shown screenshots from either pico, snap on or ATS. No bench top scopes will be shown, its simply not the best platform for a real working tech whatsoever.
^ +1
Pico not overly expensive compared to what spend in scanners from likes of snapon, bosch, autel, launch etc .
It works well with auto work and great online library of data, Most techs already have a windows netbook or tablet device to use with it.
Pico not overly expensive compared to what spend in scanners from likes of snapon, bosch, autel, launch etc .
It works well with auto work and great online library of data, Most techs already have a windows netbook or tablet device to use with it.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
I am sure it is "fast enough" or it would not be the "industry standard". However, the hardware was probably designed over 10 years ago.
I am happy that they use a 12 bit A-to-D but 20 MHz bandwidth and 100 MS/Sec is pretty whimpy especially when it is backed up by 250 Msample buffer (divide that by 4 if you are using 4 channels).
The "floating input" (is that the same as differential input ?) and 200V input without attenuaters are BOTH GOOD IDEAS !
Faster sample rate and deeper buffer and a MORE REASONABLE PRICE would make me a convert !
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
I think the real issue is, there is nothing in between the el-cheap-o scanners and the >$1000 "professional" scanners.
Blue Driver could fill that gap !
bsaint
Well-known member
Oh I thought we were looking for real oscilloscope recommendations. Like Agilent, LeCroy, BK Precision, Tektronix, etc etc
PICO's are great, but they are EXTREMELY OVER PRICED !!
Some of the older Snap-On "graphing multimeters" are actually pretty decent but, even used, they are over priced !
Most automotive 'scopes are handheld (Pico is NOT), are battery operated and usually designed to take a 4' fall to a cement floor. The handheld ones have a fairly small screen. You are paying BIG TIME EXTRA for "easy to use" features. If you are willing to be connected to 120VAC and accept that a 4' fall may be fatal and you don't need the "I'll hold your hand" features, then there are good 4 channel, "bench" 'scopes out there for under $500 !
Absolutely correct. I find the Picoscope software to be awesome but the hardware at this point should be relatively commoditized so the prices they are charging for it are outrageous. One would think some disruptive entrant would come along but I guess the market is too small and mechanics are so accoustomed to Snap-on pricing they find it reasonable.
^
Have a look at professional software prices, many are ridiculous .
While pico definitely overpriced for material value it so good in auto use and you earning money you can justify it, until market has more competition I can't see pico reducing prices or revising the scope soon .
Reality is as autoshop diag equipment costs the picoscope is a pretty small one time outlay .
Have a look at professional software prices, many are ridiculous .
While pico definitely overpriced for material value it so good in auto use and you earning money you can justify it, until market has more competition I can't see pico reducing prices or revising the scope soon .
Reality is as autoshop diag equipment costs the picoscope is a pretty small one time outlay .
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
The current "game"/cell phone app model clearly does not fit (sell the software cheap because you are going to sell a very large quantity). But let's get realistic, how much does the PICO software change year to year and how much do upgrades costs ?
Most of those upgrades are simply add more values to existing table. You don't need a >$100K/year software engineer to do that !
Concur !
The 2 thing PICO needs to watch out for is 1) parts obsolescence and 2) a "dark horse" (like Lab Nation) deciding there IS enough market space there.
Likely true, but you have to be a very busy shop to justify modern diag equipment and online services for theory of operation, wiring diagrams, etc.
^
Pico is one time cost, no update fees.
Online subscriptions are not that expensive. scan tool software updates is the biggest expense .
I wouldn't say I the busiest shop but be pretty hard do any decent diagnosis and verification of faults without decent scan tools and a scope and tech data, it pretty much a must requirement for any pro level autoshop .
Reality is an autoshop dso is one of the cheaper tools to buy .
Pico is one time cost, no update fees.
Online subscriptions are not that expensive. scan tool software updates is the biggest expense .
I wouldn't say I the busiest shop but be pretty hard do any decent diagnosis and verification of faults without decent scan tools and a scope and tech data, it pretty much a must requirement for any pro level autoshop .
Reality is an autoshop dso is one of the cheaper tools to buy .
VinceG
Well-known member
Take a look At hantek the 6074BE is what we use on CAN issues and sensors on our Class 8 trucks it is good enough and PC based
Calebdean
New member
Has anyone had experience with the carscope viso or micsig automotive oscilloscopes?
2ndGearRubber
Well-known member
For the price google reveals those run, $700-$850, a used snap on modis would be a contender.
I have a gen 1 modis, and a pico 4425.
I have a gen 1 modis, and a pico 4425.
Fluelikesymptoms
Well-known member
Good thread, I've been wondering about the Autel Mp408 lab scope. It seems to go for about 4-500 bucks and can be used with pc or the maxisys scan tool. Wondering what the limitations of this scope would be, and how well it operates on pc vs scan tool?
Seems like a good price, usb powered (2.0 or 3.0?) and free software updates
Seems like a good price, usb powered (2.0 or 3.0?) and free software updates
Fluelikesymptoms
Well-known member
I thought the 2206b wasnt good for automotive work because of voltage input protection, low buffer count, and lower resolution?
I thought the cheapest picoscope option for automotive would be the 2 channel 4225?
^
even the 2204A can do a lot of test on auto testing scenario.
Don't need that magic a scope especially as first scope or a quick test scope .
I used a 2206b for some time and software side is that nice it good tool learn with .
also used a hantek dso1202b I got used for 150bucks, still use that mobile as handy portable quick scope and dmm in one .
Biggest plus with pico is software and forum support for learning and waveform comparisons .
In terms of scope hardware spec even the 4225 is basic but reality is it pretty basic electrical and electronic testing requirements and fairly small money can get you some very functional capability .
even the 2204A can do a lot of test on auto testing scenario.
Don't need that magic a scope especially as first scope or a quick test scope .
I used a 2206b for some time and software side is that nice it good tool learn with .
also used a hantek dso1202b I got used for 150bucks, still use that mobile as handy portable quick scope and dmm in one .
Biggest plus with pico is software and forum support for learning and waveform comparisons .
In terms of scope hardware spec even the 4225 is basic but reality is it pretty basic electrical and electronic testing requirements and fairly small money can get you some very functional capability .
bimmerteck
Well-known member
^this or similar, I ended up buying a second vantage used to keep at home. They go cheap on eBay and are reasonable rugged for use in the garage.
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