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Outlets blowing the breaker

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Sean298

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Jul 23, 2014
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I've been working in my grandpas garage a lot with some high load tools at times, power comes down into the switch box and goes out to the outlets, one works flawlessly but all the others down the line blow the breaker with not all that much load.

Pic not so relevant, the one with the chargers and garage door opener works perfectly even with high load items such as 10" saw or shop vac as well as the outlet in the same box as the outlets. That setup is new and very little load. Not an issue as I can see.

I pulled all of the covers and outlets out a while back and cleaned up the wiring so they were all wired properly, I'm jot sore what to go after at this moment, its pretty annoying to only have two outlets in a garage.

06ff46fcb94f1811bebff6fa50488ffd.jpg
 
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torqueman2002

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Not much to go on, but the process of elimination is where I'd start.

1) Disconnect the last outlet in the circuit, test the next outlet in the circuit.
1a) If the the outlet tests OK, the problem is either the last outlet or in the circuit between the test outlet and the last outlet. Replace & reconnect the last outlet.
1a1) Test the last outlet, if it tests OK, you have fixed the problem.
1a2) If it tests Not OK, the problem is in the circuit between the new outlet and the next outlet in the circuit. Note: the connections at the outlet are considered part of the circuit. Check for improper connections, high resistance, ...
1b) If the the outlet tests Not OK, replace & reconnect the outlet.
1b1) Test the outlet, if it tests OK, you have fixed the problem.
1b2) If it tests Not OK, the problem is in the circuit between the new outlet and the next outlet in the circuit.

Repeat the steps until you have found and fixed the fault, remember to re-connect all disconnected circuits, and verify your repair.

Let us know what fixes the problem. :thumbup:

Tip - before opening up the wall to replace suspected wires, run a length of approved conductor between outlets to verify the wiring in the wall is indeed faulty.
 
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C96

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Hi Sean, is this a GFCI circuit that’s tripping?

What size is this circuit that’s tripping, 15 or 20 amp?

Is this circuit exclusive to these particular garage receptacles in question, or are they shared with other receptacles throughout the house?

Oh and welcome to the Garage!
 
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Sean298

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The outlets are not gfci, its probably code to have them be gfci, but not necessary in my mind.

I believe the breaker is a 15a arc fault breaker with multiple other things on it, 14 guage wiring if I recall, nothing special. Not sure if they are very high draw items but I think that's one issue, they're very picky, but I guess if its wired correctly you won't have any issues, I don't have issue with the one outlet so all others should work as well. I'll have to tear into it sometime soon, unfortunately my car is being stored right in front of most of the outlets in question.
 
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C96

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Sounds as though the AFCI breaker is doing its job. You’re going to have some trouble shooting to do. Those breakers can be a real pain sometimes, but something as simple as a loose connection will trip them. Sounds like you may have isolated the problem to the workbench receptacles.

Good Luck!
 
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wyliesdiesels

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If this is an AFCI protected circuit then u most likely have an arcing connection somewhere...

Are the j boxes metal or plastic?

U said u checked the connections and they were good so that rules out an arcing connection. Could be a bad outlet thats arcing internally and u cant see it.

Also, what brand of AFCI breakers do u have? AFCI breakers can have issues with motors.

Also not sure why u would have AFCIs instead of GFCIs in a garage...
 
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Sean298

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They're plastic boxes and the breaker is a Siemons brand.

The circuit apparently had a shared ground between some other new construction and the garage, the inspector made us put an afci, don't remember why, but this older wiring is terrible for those breakers and my lesser knowledge of them.

We had a huge issue of these breakers blowing, turns out they don't like grounds and neutrals tied together. Wired temp lights neutral and ground together, drove us nuts for a few days.

Game plan may be to retest all the outlets with the little wiring tester, make sure they're all good in that aspect, then check all the wiring and maybe just throw new outlets in there junlst because we can, even though they are fairly new. Few years max, isnt it pretty rare to get defecto outlets?
 
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G_P

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I would think that an Arc Fault breaker would trip constantly with many power tools, since motors that use brushes tend to have some arcing going on inside.
 
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wyliesdiesels

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Yeah AFCIs dont like shared neutrals...

G_P said:
I would think that an Arc Fault breaker would trip constantly with many power tools, since motors that use brushes tend to have some arcing going on inside.
Click to expand...

Just the reason why AFCI requirements are dumb in garages!!
 
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wyliesdiesels

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C96 said:
AFCI are not a requirement in garages, however GFCI are, but you knew that! ;)
Click to expand...

I thought AFCIs were required in the 2014 code...I know the OP wouldn't be under 2014 code but was just saying that the OPs frustration is a reason why the AFCI requirements are dumb...maybe the OP should just switch to GFCI breakers...
 
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C96

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wyliesdiesels said:
I thought AFCIs were required in the 2014 code...
Click to expand...

Nope, not in the garage.

I think he has AFCI in the garage because of some new construction that took place in the existing house and the inspector made them upgrade to AFCI. Unfortunately, the garage was part of the old existing circuit that got upgraded.
 
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Sean298

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C96 said:
Nope, not in the garage.

I think he has AFCI in the garage because of some new construction that took place in the existing house and the inspector made them upgrade to AFCI. Unfortunately, the garage was part of the old existing circuit that got upgraded.
Click to expand...
You're right, thats what I said earlier in the thread im fairly certain

Hold up though, its not all the outlets that blow under heavy load, its only some. But its a whole stretch of them in parallel after the working ones that don't work without blowing.They're on the same breaker, I'll check and make sure that it is an afci but I'm pretty sure.
 
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Kevin C

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wyliesdiesels said:
Yup. And NEC code changes every 3 years.
Click to expand...

You should be able to view them online.

NFPA is proud to have been the first organization to provide free public access to privately developed codes and standards, and are pleased to see other organizations following our lead. There are some who argue that we should do more and immediately make all of our documents available online without any restrictions. It is essential that NFPA maintain copyright and the ability to charge for the codes and standards. Most of the money NFPA needs to fund our process and other vital mission activities comes from the sale of codes. We also derive funding from the sale of related products and services.
Click to expand...

You do need to create an account... And depending on what you state you live in there will / might be local amendments. Some states have their own website with read only, non printable manuals.



http://www.nfpa.org/codes-and-standards/document-information-pages
 
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wyliesdiesels

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yeah i knew there was access online but theres nothing like having the book in front of you. Especially when youre in a plant where cell reception is poor...
 
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