Paint: Behr or SW
- Thread starter Beowulf
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simpler=better
Well-known member
x2
Go for their best subbrand (I think it is Emerald).
They're the only brand I buy. Behr, Valspar, etc. pale in comparison for both coverage and adhesion.
Make sure you wash the walls with TSP (Tri Sodium Phosphate) first or no brand will stick.
kmacht
Well-known member
Valspar. Cheaper than SW but much better than Behr. We used to buy Behr paint all the time but over the past few years it seems to be going down hill. It just doesn't cover well anymore. We have switched over to Valspar. Just painted a bright red room a light yellow and it covered in a single coat.
Keith
Keith
Leaflessshadetree
Well-known member
I tried Behr paint once. Actually twice because it covered so bad. Instead of refunding they gave me more paint redo it again. Took 4 coats to evenly cover an almost identical shade of off-white.
I've had good results from Wal-Mart paint which I believe is made by SW.
I've had good results from Wal-Mart paint which I believe is made by SW.
Cyberbear
Well-known member
From years ago I remember S-W as being costly but the Cadillac of paints when it came to coverage and durability.
What paint brand is like what oil brand.
However I switched to SW years ago and it just flows better - hides better than anything else I've ever used. You won't catch experienced pros at the paint desks at HD or Lowes.
X2 on getting signed up, the 40% off makes it a bargain.
However I switched to SW years ago and it just flows better - hides better than anything else I've ever used. You won't catch experienced pros at the paint desks at HD or Lowes.
X2 on getting signed up, the 40% off makes it a bargain.
aircommuter
Well-known member
I use Dunn Edwards suprema, you can scrub with detergent when you have hand prints or whatever. I have tried the others and they aren't even close. I don't know if you can get it in your area. Have been using it for 35 years.
four.cycle
Well-known member
I wouldn't put BEHR products on a doghouse.
It has failed on EVERY job I've ever done with it. I refuse to use it anymore.
On every job where I used it for exterior applications it failed in one or two years - literally fell off.
WORST PAINT EVER MADE DO NOT BUY RUN AWAY.
It has failed on EVERY job I've ever done with it. I refuse to use it anymore.
On every job where I used it for exterior applications it failed in one or two years - literally fell off.
WORST PAINT EVER MADE DO NOT BUY RUN AWAY.
I hate Behr paint and refuse to use it. We typically have been using Valspar from Lowes. I see they now carry a line of SW. We are getting ready to do a lot of painting in a house and need to sign up for the SW specials.
pmiranda
Well-known member
SW and Benjamin Moore are like cream vs the big box store milk. With enough coats Behr will get it done but I'd rather do just one coat of the good stuff.
BleedingBlue
Well-known member
What about PPG? How does it compare to SW particularly for fence stain?
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Randy B
Member
I have used all the paints mentioned and then some more.Best I have found from the box stores is Glidden,Dunn Edwards and Ameritone.Preferred paint is Kelly Moor then Benjamin Moor.I exclusively use Kelly Moor these days as I can get it in CO.Kelly Moor does more sq. ft. than any other paint I have used,perfect one coat hiding. I refuse to use S-W,Behr.
shelteredV
Well-known member
We use BM exclusively because its the accepted standard here. My painter says it is the easiest to cross reference to brands all over the world. I have clients that have homes in other countries and will ask to match a color of their dining room here.
shelteredV
Well-known member
We use BM exclusively because its the accepted standard here. My painter says it is the easiest to cross reference to brands all over the world. I have clients that have homes in other countries and will ask to match a color of their dining room here.
Dragfluid
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Go over to the DIY forum and do a search on Behr. Your computer will probably flip upside down. It's about the equivalant of asking here if you should use PVC for air lines.
I used SW when I painted the apartment. Worked good. It's spendy.
When I did the shop area, I decided to go with the local Tru Value, and use their house brand. It was indeed a "tru value", and I was pleased with the coverage.
I used SW when I painted the apartment. Worked good. It's spendy.
When I did the shop area, I decided to go with the local Tru Value, and use their house brand. It was indeed a "tru value", and I was pleased with the coverage.
pmiranda
Well-known member
We used Behr a ton in our old house before we'd ever tried the better brands and it's fine, but we had to do 2 or 3 coats to get good coverage. Granted that was with textured walls that soaked up the paint like crazy. Now we only use the no-VOC BM and it's way easier, plus you can paint a room and sleep in it the same day.
Other lessons learned from our first house:
don't waste money on a power roller
buy good brushes and rollers and take care of them
use at least 2 trays so you don't have to clean them out in the middle of a work session (or liners if you don't mind the waste)
use cloth dropclothes so they stay put and you won't slip on them
have plenty of good portable lights
have a stable work tray/shelf on your ladder
keep your mouth shut when painting overhead
If at all possible wash stuff in a utility sink so you're not bending over in the dark outside trying to clean stuff with a garden hose while getting eaten alive by mosquitos and/or freezing to death.
Other lessons learned from our first house:
don't waste money on a power roller
buy good brushes and rollers and take care of them
use at least 2 trays so you don't have to clean them out in the middle of a work session (or liners if you don't mind the waste)
use cloth dropclothes so they stay put and you won't slip on them
have plenty of good portable lights
have a stable work tray/shelf on your ladder
keep your mouth shut when painting overhead
If at all possible wash stuff in a utility sink so you're not bending over in the dark outside trying to clean stuff with a garden hose while getting eaten alive by mosquitos and/or freezing to death.
zmotorsports
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I am far from a carpenter or painter but upon advise from a few friends who are I used Sherwin-Williams a few years ago when I repainted our home. Turned out great and great coverage. Did it in two-tone, semi-gloss walls with gloss trim and very happy with the way it turned out.
Mike.
Mike.
Falcon67
Well-known member
Kelly-Moore here, had very good luck with their paint. I've also had older unknown paint color recently matched at HD in Behr which turned out very well.
CGT80
Well-known member
False!
If the surfaces are coated in something, such as a kitchen or bathroom, then you may need to clean them. Most surfaces do not need to be washed. Light pole sanding can knock off bumps or fuzz from a previous paint job. How many pros do you think will wash every surface before they paint?
Yes, it is similar to choosing an oil.
As far as catching experienced pros at HD or Lowes......to make that claim, you have some BS dribbling out of your mouth. You obviously don't know that for a fact and I can prove you wrong. Now, if you said many pros will not go to lowes or HD, then that is very possible and I wouldn't argue with you.
I was a pro painter for about 20 years. There were also many other trades I did as well. Out here, Behr is popular and many contractors use it. I have used , DE, sherwin, frazee, valspar, behr, devoe, sinclair, ICI, Glidden, white line, pratt and lambert, vista, spectrum, dutch boy, BM, and others. Sinclair was the best, but that was 10-15 years ago. Behr worked very well, for the most part. The clear/deep bases ****. Lighter colors were fine. It worked great right out of the bucket for brush and roller work, and I thinned it a little for spraying. Since I worked all over, and all hours of the day and night, Behr was the easiest to get. I used to use a few paint stores, but the hours **** and there are not nearly as many as there are home depots.
I didn't find any other brands that worked much better than Behr, for light to medium colors (most of what I did). Other painters (some I had worked with) used more expensive paint and had paint jobs that didn't look as good as mine. There is a huge variable in how well painters prep and paint. I was a stickler for details. On commercial jobs, it didn't pay to use expensive paint and they were not looking for ultra high end quality. My last boss used the cheap contractor paint or cheap glidden, before I started working for him. After he saw how the behr worked out and tried it himself while working with me, he was convinced to spend the money for a better paint. Zinsser primer is my go to and I primed questionable surfaces and did the prep to make the job look good.
Valspar worked ok for the interior of my house and I used behr and sinclair as well. I have used behr for higher end paint jobs as well, and the customers were happy and had me back for more work down the road.
Painters have their preferences and usually do a better job with what they like. Not all paints are equal and not all painters are equal.
CGT80
Well-known member
Behr premium plus works very well, especially if the surfaces are in good shape and you are doing interior work. Ultra is a "paint and primer in one", but it ***** as a primer. When it first came out, it did work well as a primer on weathered exterior wood, but later I had it fail on me. If the surface is painted and does not have oil based finish on it, but is beat up a bit. The Ultra is good. It seems to leave a bit better finish. I have not bothered with the $45 per gallon Marquee from behr. Primer and premium plus beats using behr ultra by it's self.
Zinsser cover stain is available in water based or oil based and is great primer. 123 primer is good as well, and has a bit of a sheen for use under semi or gloss finishes. cover stain is flat.
I don't think I have used SW Emerald, but the SW i used in the past worked fine. It was stupid expensive, 10 years ago, at about $60 per gallon for water based semi gloss. It absolutely was not worth the price, but the job was spec'd for that product.
Ultra Pure White looks very clean, and I used it at home for the ceilings, doors, and trim, but it absolutely ***** to apply. I have used a few brands in pure white (no pigment added to the base stock) and they all required three coats for great coverage. Swiss Coffee was my go to, for commercial use and residential. It looks white, but covers easily in two coats, sometimes in one if the surface is similar in color and in great shape. Swiss coffee varies in color from brand to brand. Spectrum used to be a quarter ounce of lamp black to a gallon of paint (L4 formula) and we had the paint store mix L10 for some of our jobs so it wasn't quite as brite. It was obviously a gray tone. Other brands can have a real creamy or yellow swiss coffee.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
For years I have used Behr and really liked. Nevere seemed to goes as far as I thought, but it covered well. You REALLY should use a 1/4" nap roller !
A couple of years ago I was helping paint my daughter's house and they bought SW. Not anywhere near as thick as Behr but it still covered well and you ca use a 3/8" nap roller.
Spend the money on good roller covers. Purdy White Dove. If you spend the time you CAN wash them, but it will take about 15 minutes. Scrape as much paint out of the roller as possible (get a roller scraper), rinse, add some soap, lather, rinse, repeat.
A couple of years ago I was helping paint my daughter's house and they bought SW. Not anywhere near as thick as Behr but it still covered well and you ca use a 3/8" nap roller.
Spend the money on good roller covers. Purdy White Dove. If you spend the time you CAN wash them, but it will take about 15 minutes. Scrape as much paint out of the roller as possible (get a roller scraper), rinse, add some soap, lather, rinse, repeat.
Behr is the HF of paint. (ie absolutely terrible stuff)
It goes on like molasses and covers like water. The painting professionals have a saying; "it's better to have bare walls then Behr on the walls".
Go to a store that sells to professionals and buy their top shelf, or one notch down from top shelf, paint. SW and Benny Moore are good paints. My favorite is Pratt and Lambert Accolade.
You can also get some excellent quality paint at good prices by shopping the regional brands. (ex: Miller, Dunn Edwards, Parker, etc)
It goes on like molasses and covers like water. The painting professionals have a saying; "it's better to have bare walls then Behr on the walls".
Go to a store that sells to professionals and buy their top shelf, or one notch down from top shelf, paint. SW and Benny Moore are good paints. My favorite is Pratt and Lambert Accolade.
You can also get some excellent quality paint at good prices by shopping the regional brands. (ex: Miller, Dunn Edwards, Parker, etc)
Nick Danger
Well-known member
I painted the shed with Behr, and I wasn't happy. I think it's cheaper because it has less solids. Since then, I've been going to paint dealers instead of big box stores.
LS6 Tommy
Well-known member
For residential paint i have had equal results with Sherwin Williams or Benjamin Moore. We use Sherwin Williams at work and it does a good job. I tend to use Benny Moore at home because the local family owned paint store sells it. For industral stuff, Con-Lux has worked very well, especially the two part epoxy paints.
Behr is total ****. It's like trying to paint with milk.
Tommy
Behr is total ****. It's like trying to paint with milk.
Tommy
Last edited:
Kaizen
Well-known member
strange I've correctly used home depot paint....behr and glidden for 20 years redoing my house. I've never had any of it fail in any way. as far as washing before painting I always do if just going over some old mess. years of candles and cooking and just normal living really dirty a paint and not a good idea to just paint over it.
I would use primer and not just the two in one. just my preference. I tried the 2 in one once and it still took two coats so not worth the extra money imo.
Esp use primer if you are going from a dark to light or a light to dark. I have all strong colors so I wanted to get a good true color.
The only Sherwin Williams I used on my house was exterior 2010. that stuff was like painting on glue. lasted a good ten years and now just seeing spots peeling. i'll be using tsp on the whole thing before painting. contrary to others comments I've had more painters tell me part of the bid is washing it first esp outside.
I would use primer and not just the two in one. just my preference. I tried the 2 in one once and it still took two coats so not worth the extra money imo.
Esp use primer if you are going from a dark to light or a light to dark. I have all strong colors so I wanted to get a good true color.
The only Sherwin Williams I used on my house was exterior 2010. that stuff was like painting on glue. lasted a good ten years and now just seeing spots peeling. i'll be using tsp on the whole thing before painting. contrary to others comments I've had more painters tell me part of the bid is washing it first esp outside.
four.cycle
Well-known member
Hey, has anyone here mentioned yet that Behr is absolutely the worst paint ever put out on the market?
Re-painted a deck railing earlier this afternoon - used about half a gallon of some "Valspar" the homeowner had in the garage. Went on real nice.
About ten years ago I painted that same deck railing after replacing a couple of the top rails. Prep work: took the belt sander to it with a 60-grit belt, then down to 80-grit. Then hand-sanded the areas I couldn't get at with the belt sander with 80-grit. Then put a coat of exterior KILZ primer on it. Then TWO coats of BEHR exterior semi-gloss latex. Paint literally FELL OFF in less than a year.
Was re-painted by somebody else with (unless I'm mistaken) some Sherwin-Williams, which lasted several years up until I pressure-washed it the other day and then laid the Valspar on it.
Some guys will tell you "paint is 90% prep and 10% paint". Most of the time my work is 95% prep and 5% paint. Belt sander, hand sander, TSP wash, blower to get the dust off, prime, paint.
Somebody wants something painted I'll tell them "Do NOT buy BEHR paint I won't use it." If they've already purchased it I'll tell them to take it back for a refund, even if it's a custom mix.
WORST PAINT EVER PUT OUT ON THE MARKET.
I have had much better results with GLIDDEN, believe it or not.
Parker was a favorite, but they sold out to another company. Locally we also have MILLER, which is a nice product.
I wind up using a lot of Sherwin-Williams and Dutch Boy because they're sold by a couple big-box stores here.
DID I MENTION YET THAT BEHR PAINT IS THE WORST **** EVER PUT OUT ON THE MARKET?
Re-painted a deck railing earlier this afternoon - used about half a gallon of some "Valspar" the homeowner had in the garage. Went on real nice.
About ten years ago I painted that same deck railing after replacing a couple of the top rails. Prep work: took the belt sander to it with a 60-grit belt, then down to 80-grit. Then hand-sanded the areas I couldn't get at with the belt sander with 80-grit. Then put a coat of exterior KILZ primer on it. Then TWO coats of BEHR exterior semi-gloss latex. Paint literally FELL OFF in less than a year.
Was re-painted by somebody else with (unless I'm mistaken) some Sherwin-Williams, which lasted several years up until I pressure-washed it the other day and then laid the Valspar on it.
Some guys will tell you "paint is 90% prep and 10% paint". Most of the time my work is 95% prep and 5% paint. Belt sander, hand sander, TSP wash, blower to get the dust off, prime, paint.
Somebody wants something painted I'll tell them "Do NOT buy BEHR paint I won't use it." If they've already purchased it I'll tell them to take it back for a refund, even if it's a custom mix.
WORST PAINT EVER PUT OUT ON THE MARKET.
I have had much better results with GLIDDEN, believe it or not.
Parker was a favorite, but they sold out to another company. Locally we also have MILLER, which is a nice product.
I wind up using a lot of Sherwin-Williams and Dutch Boy because they're sold by a couple big-box stores here.
DID I MENTION YET THAT BEHR PAINT IS THE WORST **** EVER PUT OUT ON THE MARKET?
Luckily I was talking to the SW sales guy and he told me to hold off buying it now as they were going to have a 30% deal coming up around June 10th.
Yes, it is $65 a gallon, but at 30% off it is a little easier to swallow at $45. Still not cheap.
I plan on getting the best rollers and brushes I can. I was set on Purdy brushes, but then say some reviews on cutting lines with the Picasso. May have to try a couple.
Luckily I will be painting everything before we move in.
Plus, I will be using the Matte SW Emerald now with no color added. Just the whites white the base color can be. This will go on every wall, door, and trim piece. All one color, all one sheen. I'll do accent walls later.
My plan is to remove all light covers, outlet covers....etc. Mask everything else and then go to town.
Yes, it is $65 a gallon, but at 30% off it is a little easier to swallow at $45. Still not cheap.
I plan on getting the best rollers and brushes I can. I was set on Purdy brushes, but then say some reviews on cutting lines with the Picasso. May have to try a couple.
Luckily I will be painting everything before we move in.
Plus, I will be using the Matte SW Emerald now with no color added. Just the whites white the base color can be. This will go on every wall, door, and trim piece. All one color, all one sheen. I'll do accent walls later.
My plan is to remove all light covers, outlet covers....etc. Mask everything else and then go to town.
four.cycle
Well-known member
Beowulf said:
Purdy is a top-notch brush. I did that deck railing this afternoon with a 3-inch angle-tip. Nice. Great for cutting in an edge.
I probably have 30 or 40 "good" brushes (for house-paint stuff). The Purdys are the ones I usually grab.
(Don't ask how many watercolor/oil/acrylic brushes I own.... too many to count.)
I've never had good success with Behr and like others when I called them to the carpet on their warranty all I got was more Behr paint that didn't work the second time. I never see pro-painters lining up at HD, but every time I go to SW the parking lot is full of local pros.
Angelfire
Well-known member
I did an addition/partial remodel a couple of years ago. When it came to the paint, I did a lot of research and from all the forums etc...the consensus was BM or SW as the best overall. That being said, I priced out the preferred stuff and was floored by the cost. I used Behr back in 2001 in the same house and it has held up well so I decided to use it again. Not a bother at all. Gave good coverage and covered up the previous colors (where there was previously painted walls) with no problem. I'd use it again. I did prime all the bare drywall which I think probably helps a bit. This all being said, if I did it for a living and painted with 100's of gallons of different stuff, I'm sure I'd come up with a favorite. For the little I ever have to paint, the Behr worked well. Handy as well as you can get small samples of colors made up...helped with the indecisive pair of us! We use it in eggshell.
Cheers,
cc
Cheers,
cc
flkeysdude
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2011
- Messages
- 48
I ran a business for 25 years. During that time, I worked closely with the facilities managers of some very large corporations and hospitals (such as ESPN and Yale-New Haven Hospital). Their criteria was quality and longevity for their projects. The ONLY paints they would specify or allow in their facilities were Sherwin Williams and Benjamin Moore...
palmerdrama
Well-known member
SW the best
mmelton005
Well-known member
I'm in the middle of remodeling a home and I just bought some BM Aura paint for the first time and I will not buy it again. I have used SW for years and their coverage is much better than BM IMO.
maxpower_hd
Well-known member
I've used Behr and some other off brands and they **** in comparison to either SW or BM. I have noticed on the ones that I used there is a huge difference in the amount of square footage specified on the back of the can when you compare them. Behr states something like 225-500 square feet and BM or SW sates more like 450-550. So the maximums are similar but the minimums are more like what you will usually get out of them in my experience. So when you compare the cost of the paint consider the coverage and the number of coats. In the long run I find it works out to be about the same or only a little more for the quality paints and it takes less overall time.
Don't quote me on the coverage numbers but you get the gist of what I mean.
Don't quote me on the coverage numbers but you get the gist of what I mean.
jedeyeben
Well-known member
SW all day long. The emerald paint is crazy good. But so is the pro 200 for a budget price. And the cashmere lays on nice as well.
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z3speed4me
Member
Same opinion in regards to BM and SW for me. Shermin Williams is SUPER close to my house, but I prefer Benjamin Moore. However I can't tell a difference between their premium cans.
We have painted 2 bedrooms, 2 bathrooms, a living room (3 times bc changing our minds on color), and half the basement in the last few months. I have nothing negative to say about either. However I did use Behr at my prior home and needed 3 coats sometimes even a 4th in a room that the good stuff later needed 2 to cover the old color up. I won't ever buy it again, even on the roller you can tell its not as thick and that's an obvious sign right from the start.
We have painted 2 bedrooms, 2 bathrooms, a living room (3 times bc changing our minds on color), and half the basement in the last few months. I have nothing negative to say about either. However I did use Behr at my prior home and needed 3 coats sometimes even a 4th in a room that the good stuff later needed 2 to cover the old color up. I won't ever buy it again, even on the roller you can tell its not as thick and that's an obvious sign right from the start.
four.cycle
Well-known member
Beowulf said:
Reds and Oranges are the most difficult colors to cover over.
I would: mix a strong solution of Trisodium Phosphate and hot water (about 1-1/2 to 2 CUPS in a 5-gallon bucket) and wash it down first. Patch as necessary. Maybe a bit of sanding if necessary. Two coats of primer. Then the paint.
On the greasy kitchen walls, the TSP/hot water mix above will take care of that. Wash it down good first.
Lipstick, color crayon, grease pencil ("Listo" markers), and other greasy/waxy ****: cheap hair spray. Seriously. works like a charm. Or go fancy and use a shellac type primer.
Been using the cheap hair spray method for decades. Fast. Cheap. Works.
I will usually slop some primer over it after it dries for 10-20 minutes.