Painting help

[jmh21586]

I'm restoring a little Craftsman toolbox. Had it all sanded down and went to prime it. I have a little bottom fed touchup gun. When I shot the primer it looked like i was spraying on felt. The box was blown off and then completely wiped down. The area I was painting in was also blown off completely.


Why is it doing this? Air pressure too high?? Too low? Volume too high or too low? The gun did this when new too.

The primer was thinned to a water like consistancy. Too much?

I'm so new to this it aint even funny. I tried looking at other threads on painting but I'm lost in the lingo and terminology and all the diferent paint kinds.
The primer was an automotive type primer from O'Reilly. The thinner or whatever you call it is made for the primer.

 

[rickairmedic]

Sounds like your air pressure is up way to high . Try lowering your pressure down to around 35-40PSI and it you have some scrap cardboard try it on that while working with your air pressure .


Rick

 

[jerseywild]

I agree with the air pressure too high. I always spray on cardboard first while I make my adjustments.

 

[weegaz22]

too far away when spraying possibly?, drying before its hitting the box?

 

[spartyon8]

I was painting my engine bay over the weekend, first time painting, and this happened to me too. I first tried to lower the pressure and then nothing would come out. Then I narrowed the fan pattern with a lower pressure and it worked like a champ. Might want to try lowering the pressure a tad and narrowing your fan pattern?

 

[jmh21586]

Now that we're on the topic of painting, where in the hell can you get etching primer?
Do they sell it in rattle cans?
No matter what I do, or what I paint, I ALWAYS have adhesion problem. ALWAYS.
I just can't get paint to stick.

Thanks for the input. Next time I'll lower the pressuer and spray pattern.

 

[rickairmedic]

Napa sells it in rattle cans I used it on my Starcraft Aluminum boat before painting it .


Rick

 

[jmh21586]

Did it adhere good?

 

[Jack Olsen]

For future readers, here's a full explanation of how self-etching primer works from the 'talking car paint' blog:

When doing major or even minor work on older cars you're going to run into rust. The steel that is your car wants to turn itself back into the puffy red iron oxide that it was when it was mined. Whether you’re sanding, sand blasting or chemical striping to get rid of the paint and getting down to the metal the first thing you need to apply to the steel is self etching primer.

Self-etching primer is composed of an acid and zinc. The acid, usually phosphoric acid, forces the zinc down into the top couple of molecules of the steel. Chemically impregnating the steel like this cannot reverse the rust but it can stop in from getting worse. So it’s important that you get all of the scaly rust off.

Wipe the surface with wax and grease remover to get it clean enough so nothing interferes i.e. fingerprints. The self-etching primer is usually gray or olive drab gray but the color is just there to show you where you’ve put it on and it is very thin and one thin coat is enough. Putting more of the primer won’t make it work better. You can apply it over paint or bondo but it is only effective on bare metal. You can apply your high build primer or body filler over the self-etching primer but be careful it is not a finished product by it self.

In other words you can’t apply it and then push the car back outside, it has to have a sealed surface over it, water will reverse the reaction and will pull the zinc back out.

Self-etching primer comes as two parts or ready to spray and also comes in aerosol.

I use it when ever I see bare metal or if I’m putting one metal against another. For instance steel screws in aluminum or on welds.

 

[rickairmedic]

Did it adhere good?

Seems to be holding pretty well ( boat was painted with foam rollers and rustoleum by the way) .

Rick

 

[jmh21586]

Is it the same thing as galvanizing spray? I see that once in a while but have never seen acid etching primer on a can anywhere I've been.

Also, is paint thinner good enough as a cleaner before spray?


And bottom line what is the best I can expect from rattle cans??

 

[rickairmedic]

Heres the boat after rattlecanning the bare aluminum with the etching primer .

No its not the same thing as galvanising spray. I should have a few cans left if you would like the number off of them for Napa.

Rick

 

[RMR&C]

You can get etch primer in a rattle can at most any auto parts store....I keep some around to coat inner panels and parts you cant see.

 

[BADSIX]

to the o/p do you know what type of paint you have is it lacquer, enamal, urathane or what i can probibly help you but i need to know what we are working with

to jmh21586 your best adhesion will be with an epoxy primer such as ppg dp 90 or many of the others they will need to be shot out of a spray gun

 

[gahrajmahal]

I recommend looking at a few YouTube videos. there are a bunch on painting your car and observing the technique will answer a lot of questions. I suggest practicing on other metal objects around the garage instead of cardboard. Prep them just like you will do the car. Good Luck!

 

[E.rodz]

yep air presure to high/ and or cap is pluged up. try adjusting your fan pattern down.make sure your vent tube is not plugged.practice on some cardboard or anything before spraying on you final product.if in doubt don't be afraid to stop let it dry sand it and start over. patience you can make it look good we have faith in you.

 

[jmh21586]

to the o/p do you know what type of paint you have is it lacquer, enamal, urathane or what i can probibly help you but i need to know what we are working with

to jmh21586 your best adhesion will be with an epoxy primer such as ppg dp 90 or many of the others they will need to be shot out of a spray gun

I think it was enamel but I'd have to look.

But I know the reducer I used was duplicolor. I think the paint brand is also. Bought at Oreillys.


Today I found some Rustoleum bare metal primer and used it to prime a toolbox I'm redoing. Then used Rustoleum enamel paint. Both rattle can.
Fingers crossed.

 

[jmh21586]

yep air presure to high/ and or cap is pluged up. try adjusting your fan pattern down.make sure your vent tube is not plugged.practice on some cardboard or anything before spraying on you final product.if in doubt don't be afraid to stop let it dry sand it and start over. patience you can make it look good we have faith in you.

Not so much making it look good. It's making the damn stuff STICK.
Anything I've ever painted has chipped incredibly easy and during assembly of parts would rub off with the slightest touch. Like it doesn't adhere and harden.

I really want to figure it out because I love the idea of restoring things and painting things as a hobby.

 

[E.rodz]

suface prep. is the key 90% of a good paint job even if its with rattle cans is surface prep. bare min. from bare metal no finer than 240.g scuff everything down then etching primer watch for mfg. drying times.do not exceed them also watch drying temps metal cannot be to cold. even if air temp is warm enough does not mean metal part is warm enough.if areas are prone to rock chips you can put a flex agent in the clear to prevent this from happning.ps. allways use wax and grease remover before steps.

 

[BADSIX]

dupli color is normaly lacquer, if the tool box had enamel on it then it may be lifting. the enamel enamel dosn't like lacquer, in other words you never spray lacquer over enamel. but it sounds like you got it with the old tryed and true rustoleum

 

[jmh21586]

We'll see I guess. I'll know tommorrow.

What are the diferences IN LAYMANS TERMS of laquer and enamal and the others?

I was planning on using the rustoleum clear coat. Should I? Does it make it harder or more scratch proof?

 

[jmh21586]

Does brake cleaner work as wax and grease remover?

 

[RMR&C]

Does brake cleaner work as wax and grease remover?

No, but it makes a pretty good PAINT REMOVER! It's too strong. Use a real wax & grease remover.....even mineral spirits will work. Wipe on, wipe off.........

 

[Kevin54]

You can get etching primer in rattle cans, but one thing to make sure is you don't need to over use it. By that I mean it does not cover like conventional primer and doesn't need to. It will go on thin and semi-transparent but will do the job.
You can get small pints of mixed BB/CC for small jobs. Pic up a small cheap gun at TSC or even the HF purple gun that has the canister on top. Or better yet pick up three, one for your primer, one for your basecoat, and one for your clearcoat if you plan on painting quite a bit of small projects. Go to your local jobber and buy a 5 gallon can of lacquer thinner for cleanup. The reason I say a 5 gallon can is that it is around $28.00 or so for 5 gal, vs. $15 bucks for a gallon
One reason your spray may have come out looking like felt is that one, your air pressure was incorrect (too high) you only need a few lbs. at the gun, you had water in your lines, or you had the incorrect tip on the gun. Primer takes a different tip that your paint will. Normally when you get a gun you will have the different tips.

 

[gahrajmahal]

Since you already have the spray gun and compressor you can use better quality paints than what comes in a spray can. Once you work out the technique problems for smooth painting your paint will stick much better. I notice your tag mentions Minnesota, If yor are attempting good quality paint work in a cold garage you will be disappointed. Surface prep, sanding with the correct grit and using automotive grade products will assure excellent results. This does not have to cost a lot as Eastwood sells good quality paints as well as TCI Global. You will even get great results with Rustoleum you mix and spray from your gun as opposed to a rattle can version of the same stuff.

 

[jmh21586]

I gotta do what you guys say and start spraying it. That's all there is to it.

 

[jktruck150]

Pictures are worth 1000 words. Let me know what you find out. I am interested in what solutions you come up with.

 

[jmh21586]

Well right now there are no pictures of my main problem, which is adhesion and durability.

I thinking maybe those are two things that just don't come with rattle can painting.
The projects I have done have looked great, just as long as you don't touch them.

As far as the felt look was concerned when I was using a spray gun, I'm convinced now that my pressure was waaaaaaay too high. I was doing nothing to control it.
Stupid newbie mistake. I'm anxious to try it again. The other problem I have with spraying is it's cold out and while nice and warm in my garage, I can't ventilate and it makes my shop a mess. And I'm kinda a neat freak. My shop is dual purpose, serves as a getaway for me.

I am divising a paint both made of closet rod, hanging drop clothes. I'll use the track of my overhead door as a place to hang them. Then I can get a blower for venting.

 

[jmh21586]

I like a well matching shop. I like having a shop color so to speak. Having benches and cabinets and tools and such all the same color. So that's where a lot of my painting, if I ever get it down, will come in.

Go ahead and call me ****.

 

[jktruck150]

You know, I don't think the most interesting man in the world and **** should really go together buddy!!

But I like the way you think in letting your garage serving as your get away! I have a paint gun I haven't used yet, so I am learning some tricks before I try it.

PS and if you ever change your avatar, this comment will not make sense! lol