Penetrating fluid

[Kenskip1]

Here is my question. What brand is the most effective at helping to lubricate say a nut that is really on tight. I really have a hard time believing that a really rusted or very tight nut will help the operator in loosing the fastener.How can a lubricant actually penetrate a fastener that is on so this securely. Not to mention if he is applying this from a vertical position. Applying it upward. I have been using CRC, Liquid wrench, PB Blaster in the past few years.I can honestly say that none of these have aided in the removal of say a lug nut for one.This is basically for coarse threads ext.
What it all boils down to is how can any of these lubricants penetrate deep enough to aid the person in the removal of the nut, bolt, ext. Ken

 

[Seppala]

Kroil.

 

[rlitman]

They penetrate through capillary action. Once in place, they act like a lubricant.
Kroil is indeed the best I've used.

 

[CobraChevelle]

astro lube jk


kroil then pb blast then liquid wrench

 

[66HertzClone]

I read about it here and have tried it myself, a 50 50 mix of ATF and Acetone.

 

[404]

Mix some ATF and acetone in a glass jar. Shake. Apply with brush.

The acetone attacks and swells the rubber seal of the jar lid, so if one tightens the jar lid normally when closing, it is very hard to open later.. So I tighten the jar lid gently.

Have paid for and used Kroil for years before I started using this.

 

[User_Name]

Not to mention if he is applying this from a vertical position. Applying it upward. Ken

Exactly. I think there's a great big placebo effect when using any of this stuff.

At some point in this thread someone will bring up acetone and ATF as being the best thing ever. Now here's thing - the article that generated this idea and tested the different penetrants - that guy soaked the nut/bolt combination for days in solution. A quick spray and 30 seconds of waiting isn't going to do much to break apart the corrosive bonds between a nut and bolt.

I'm sure there are instances where the stuff works, but trying to make it work when you don't have access to anything except the head of a fastener is probably a waste of time and money. And yet I'm as guilty as anyone about doing just that.

 

[Kenskip1]

I read about it here and have tried it myself, a 50 50 mix of ATF and Acetone.

OH yea, well here is my Mustang

 

[lakota]

Before using and penetrating fluid you should add vibration by hammering, etc to break the rust bond and giving the fluid a path to move into. Soaking over time helps.

Also may use HEAT to break the rust bond with a torch if possible or COLD by using a CO2 fire extinguisher.

 

[four.cycle]

K&W "Knock'er Loose"

http://www.crcindustries.com/ei/product_detail.aspx?id=401724

NAPA. Some parts stores.

if you were in Hawai'i, this would be "da kine".

but then, every guy turning wrenches has a different opinion on this one.

frozen blade bolts and blade adapters, galled deck-mounting bolts: sometimes I have to apply repeatedly over the course of hours (or overnight) before I'll go at it with a socket and breaker bar.

 

[maxpower_hd]

I used heat then a cold wet rag to quickly cool the bleeder screws on my truck. That works great.

I also use Kroil and it seems to work better than anything else I've tried. Time is the key. Sometimes it works better than others but it does work. Just not in every situation.

 

[Tim37]

The secret is time. If I know ahead of time that I'm gonna be working on rusted bolts I start spraying them with pb a day or two in advance if possible. It really helps.

 

[Wakefield]

The secret is time. If I know ahead of time that I'm gonna be working on rusted bolts I start spraying them with pb a day or two in advance if possible. It really helps.

^^^^^^^^
The day before works better than the minute before-even with ordinary light (sewing machine) oil

 

[ChargerRT]

Where are you all buying Kroil? I want to give it a shot but didn't know if I can buy it anywhere local

 

[AmishFury]

kroil is hard to find in stores... unicorn tears would be easier to find a local source

you can find it online

 

[organ]

Where are you all buying Kroil? I want to give it a shot but didn't know if I can buy it anywhere local

I've seen it one place around here... inside CC Dickson... an HVAC wholesaler. There's one in Richmond. I'm not sure if they sell to the public. I think they do. Call and ask. If you decide to stop by instead of calling, don't be surprised when you enter the store and there are no prices on anything... I don't know why this is, I've only ever been in there with my brother who's an HVAC Tech..

 

[zakmartin]

Here's some useful info from one of the many previous threads about this topic (personally, I like Liquid Wrench Penetrating Oil, but I do have a home-brewed acetone/ATF concoction that works wonders; the only problem is it leaks out of just about every container I've put it in):

-----------------------------------

Machinist Workshop magazine studied the most popular penetrating oils to see what did the best job of removing rusted bolts by measuring the pounds of torque required to loosen the bolt. I'm not sure just what flavor bolt they were using that would take 516 pounds of torque but it must have been a monster. These were the results they published:

Penetrating oil: Average load:
None...................................516 lbs.
WD-40.................................238 lbs.
PB Blaster.............................214 lbs.
Liquid Wrench........................127 lbs.
Kano Kroil..............................106 lbs.
ATF-Acetone mix......................53 lbs.

“The Auto Trans fluid- acetone mix was a "home-brew" mix of 50-50 ATF-acetone. The home brew tested better than the commercial products in this test. Note that Liquid Wrench is about as good as "Kroil" for about 20% of the price.”

 

[bobcatdan]

I've tried enough to feel kroils performs the best. Starrett M1 is proving pretty damn good too, maybe not kroil level, but still good. All I use at work since my choices are M1 or PB. As for the 50/50, I'd be willing to try it, but never remember to buy any acetone.

 

[bsaint]

Kroil for me also.

 

[rustbucket5]

i have used liquid wrench with good success, but like others have said before, its not going to help in every and all situations.

 

[sberry]

I use liq wrench. I try to find it on sale. Kroil is great but I aint chasin it down at 12 a can to do what the other does for under 4

 

[Olafur]

Here is my question. What brand is the most effective at helping to lubricate say a nut that is really on tight. I really have a hard time believing that a really rusted or very tight nut will help the operator in loosing the fastener.How can a lubricant actually penetrate a fastener that is on so this securely. Not to mention if he is applying this from a vertical position. Applying it upward. I have been using CRC, Liquid wrench, PB Blaster in the past few years.I can honestly say that none of these have aided in the removal of say a lug nut for one.This is basically for coarse threads ext.
What it all boils down to is how can any of these lubricants penetrate deep enough to aid the person in the removal of the nut, bolt, ext. Ken

Contrary to most members on this board I have had very little luck with so called penetration oil. Never seen it penetrate really rusted fastener in any reasonable time frame. When they finally come out, or the nuts moves, or the bolt breaks there are usually no signs of oil in the threads in the relevant spot. If the fastener moves, for example after hammering or heat applied it helps. But no more than ATF or motor oil.

 

[Empty Pockets]

I like to apply some heat (when possible), then vibration (when possible), if that doesn't work, Kroil. However next time the opportunity presents itself, I'm going to try the ATF/Acetone mix.

 

[dnschmidt]

Kroil. You get it from Kano Labs. End of story. Google GOOGLE DEAL.

 

[Seppala]

As I said at 1:16 pm Kroll is the way to go. However, I'll always try atf and acetone before I use Kroil. BTW Olafur did you happen to attend SUNY at Stony Brook in the late seventies?

 

[bsaint]

I think Grainger has Kroil and that's where I picked it up.

 

[Finky198]

I like to apply some heat (when possible), then vibration (when possible), if that doesn't work, Kroil. However next time the opportunity presents itself, I'm going to try the ATF/Acetone mix.

Vibration and Heat I think are the most important follow by a penetrant. I also tend to believe multiple cycles of heat and vibration are sometimes needed. Temperature / expansion of metal are measurable an infrared thermometer can come in handy for detailed work to check temps. Impacts even if there not spinning cause serious vibration helping loosen things.

We use 60/40 ATF/Acetone I find the 50/50 mix to flow to easily by adjusting the mix a little bit helps it stay better upside down and vertically

In a can kroil then pb ..... The rest

 

[M6erfan]

kroil then pb blast then liquid wrench

^^^THIS. In that order. Kroil has worked better than the others, for me...

 

[four.cycle]

Before using and penetrating fluid you should add vibration by hammering, etc to break the rust bond and giving the fluid a path to move into. Soaking over time helps.

The secret is time. If I know ahead of time that I'm gonna be working on rusted bolts I start spraying them with pb a day or two in advance if possible. It really helps.

(emphasis added)

These gentlemen raise salient points above, although I would advise against the use of the proverbial "BFH" on a frozen nut or bolt. I use a little ball peen and a drift punch with a light tappity-tap-tappity-tap while applying the penetrating oil.

We sold "Liquid Wrench". Made by Radiator Specialty in Charlotte, NC. (Looks like they've moved and changed their name to "RSC".)
Also sold K&W "Knock'er Loose" retail and as a manufacturer's agent.
I can state confidently that the K&W product beats "Liquid Wrench" hands down.
As an aside, I generally ordered any brand of "penetrating oil" on any order from a chemical company because it made it easier to make freight prepaid terms (as in the case of Radiator Specialty), but I never saw one that worked as well as the K&W.

==

Best I can offer is my favorite "Knock'er Loose" testimonial:

On the counter one weekend afternoon at our Yelm store, an old boy came in and picked up a can of "K&W Knock'er Loose". We carried it in both an aerosol can and a pint liquid can then. I can't recall which one he bought.
He came in the next afternoon and bought two more cans. I had to ask him why.
Apparently he'd been fighting with a frozen track bolt on one of his pieces of equipment all morning and early afternoon the day before. He'd tried "Liquid Wrench", "WD-40", and a torch.
He told me he went home with the "Knock'er Loose", hosed that bolt good, went back into the house and had lunch, and then went back out and took the bolt out with his fingers.

It may well have been that his previous attempts with other products and heat may have had a significant effect.
That said, he was one of our regular customers, and wasn't known for telling tall tales or hyperbole; one of those guys who played his cards pretty close to his vest.

==

A personal friend of mine, who I've known for over 30 years, started working on mini-bikes when he was a kid in the early 1960s. He won't use anything else.

Some of the old timers on the mytractorforum dot com site insist the best thing is straight kerosene, but I've never tried that method.

I've never tried "Kroil" or "PB" myself, but I see "PB" in all the parts stores. I'll pick up a can and try it on the next frozen blade bolt or blade adapter I run into and return with a report.

In the meantime:

K&W Knock'er Loose #1716 16 oz. can by four.cycle, on Flickr

 

[Evilunclegrimace]

I've had good luck with Free-all.

 

[stihlntime]

Kroil or CRC 56. We just call the CRC 56 panther piss used it for years.

 

[Ramblin Man]

I love Kroil, but, in my opinion, Zep 45 gives it a run for it's money.

 

[Olafur]

As I said at 1:16 pm Kroll is the way to go. However, I'll always try aft and acetone before I use Kroil. BTW Olafur did you happen to attend SUNY at Stony Brook in the late seventies?

No, unfortunately not.

 

[AndyCBR]

I've had good luck with Free-all.

Myself also. Comparable to Kroil in my experience.

As previous posters have stated, time is the key to success with penetrating oils.

We've had some stubborn pump head fitments that required chiseling out after breaking the glands off and a week long submersion in Kroil allowed the pump head to be salvaged after removing the broken part.

If you're in a hurry the torch is the go to IMHO.

 

[G_P]

I've tried the acetone/atf and when I tried to mix it, it would just not mix at all. It just seperated into gobs of acetone and gobs of atf within seconds after shaking it. Brushing it on just resulted in drops of acetone dripping right off. Seems like straight atf would be just as effective.

 

[cajunfirehawk]

Kano Kroil.

 

[belvedere]

Conklin Rust Bomb

 

[Farmall 1066]

I like PB blaster, and Kroil, but haven't bought any since I started using the ATF/Acetone mix. Keep mine in a refillable aresol can from Menards.

 

[94_C/1500]

CNH Industrial Strength Rust Penetrant

I always tell people it makes PB Blaster look like salt water. I haven't had a chance to buy some in a few years but in my opinion its the best you can buy. Unlike most of the products out there, this stuff is foamy and clings. It doesn't run off like PB Blaster. I made a believer out of a few people. My shop teacher in high school used it, and I've used this stuff and PB Blaster back to back and the CNH is untouchable. Its the first product on their PDF catalog on page 12.

http://servicemotor.com/catalogs/PM-8560.pdf

 

[DonPowers]

Was on a hydro overhaul project a couple years ago. The unit's last major overhaul was in the mid sixties, Kroil was the penetrating oil of choice for the crew.

Have only seen it used in industrial applications and ordered by the case from places like McMaster Carr.